Money should be your main consideration

[jacksonheel]

---

Members don't see this ad.

There are a number of threads on this board discussing the pros and cons between different schools. In these posts, money is always mentioned, but is rarely the predominate reason given by people to explain where they are going to school. I want to provide a little perspective that some of you may not have, and let you know why I think money is the most important factor in choosing a school.

I'm a lawyer, and went to law school right out of college. I went through a lot of the same considerations people on this board are discussing: reputation, how clients will consider a degree, job opportunities available from each school, location, facilities, people, etc. After going through all this, I decided to turn down a scholarship to attend UNC (my home state) to attend Vanderbilt, a top 15 law school. While I received a partial scholarship to Vandy, the price difference was still substantial. I left law school with over $70,000 of debt. Every month, I write a $900 check. While I loved my three years at Vandy, in hind sight, this was the worst decision I have ever made, simply because of the cost.

Most of you who are right out of school don't understand what it means to really be in debt. I know I didn't. It is a serious matter to have to write a $900 check every month for 10 years. And many on this board are looking at spending upwards of $200,000 for dental school. I don't even want to think about how much that check would be. The difference between $100,000 and $200,000 worth of debt is very significant. It is the difference between retiring at 55 or 60, or owning a vacation house, or living in a modest house or a dream house. Because dentistry is a profession where patients aren't as concerned about where you went to school, just that you graduated, someone coming out of a state school will likely make the same amount (in the same market) as someone from a high priced school. But the person from the state school will live a much better life style, as they will have roughly $1,000 or more each month to spend.

I can't say it enough, but when you are actually repaying this money, and not simply thinking about the possibility of repaying it in 3 or 4 years, it is a much different matter.

I am going to dental school now to start a second career. I applied to UNC, and a couple of other schools. While I would have gone somewhere else if I had to, I sent in my deposit to Carolina the day my acceptance came. The cost is simply too big a factor.

I'm sure that some people will disagree with my take on this, but until you have written that check each month, I just don't think you have the perspective to know what I mean. Trust me, go to the cheaper school. And people like Juan who are making the decision between a state school and private school, choose the state school. Especially, one with the reputation of UCLA.

So, I'm sure there will be people that will tell me it is more important to go somewhere that you are comfortable, or that made you feel good during an interview. That's all nice and good when cost is no object. But when real dollars are being spent (and they are yours and not your parents), you need to consider the cost of you education as the number one factor in your decision.

Just my advice.

jacksonheel

 

[ItsGavinC]

I completely agree with you. Especially since I have a wife and child that are in the equation.

In fact, I'm going to be paying some deposits and then holding out for cheaper schools, because money is such a factor for me.

Writing a $2,000 check each month for the next 10-15 years is not something I'm looking forward to.

Reducing that amount in any way, shape, or form, will be of huge benefit to me. Reducing the initial amount I borrow has a signifigant impact on the amount which I will have to repay.

Like you said, when it is YOUR money and YOUR life and you've graduated from dental school, you aren't really going to care what type of social life you had while in dental school, or what the weather was like.

 

[djsux]

I couldn't agree with jacksonheel more - I recently graduated three years ago from prestigious undergrad school, and had to fund most of my way via loans that were unsubsidized (ouch).

Having been working for three years, and writing a big fat check every month has been a huge burden on me. I've been extremely fortunate to have a girlfriend who has helped me get my budget together. With her help, I've paid down about 50k in debt and hope to be free of it by the time I enter dental school. However, that was by driving an old car, living with my parents, and spending very frugally, which may not be an option for some ppl when they graduate from d-school.

It's also interesting to note that many students in school have no idea about their loans and their future impact. Most do not even know the interest rate on their loans or their loan type. As such, money was my primary decision to apply in state - if things don't work out this year, then I will continue my other career for another year and pay off any remaining debt. It doesn't hurt that I live in Tx and the dental schools here are fantastic. And if you're in general dentsitry, ppl come to you by referrals for a job well done, not by the name of school you graduated from.

Ultimately, you should try to strike a good balance between cost and comfort/reputation when deciding on your school. Best of luck to you all on your upcoming choices...

 

[s.mutans]

Yes. It's hard to budget with a family. I can not imagine how I will live during dental school! Cost is my priority also. MOst of the applicants are probably single and have not fully experienced paying back loans. I have a 20,000 undergrad student loan( I hope I can defer), car payment, health insurance, and etcetera and etcetera.

If you have support from your parents and maybe a college fund given by your great great grandma, Kudos to you! Go to the school that is for you.

 

[tinker bell]

People may think that I'm cheap. But I'll do anything to go to my state school. Which are great schools, actually. And if you stay in state, you don't have to spend money on moving and flying back and forth. Or you can even live with your parents for free.
I hate borrowing money. And I never have any student loan, but I do know what it is. Just do a few calculations and you will find out. Even if I have to go out of state, I'll choose the cheapest one and be happy with it.
Choose the school base on your pocket.
😛 😱

 

[dragonfly9]

I'm not sure if this is good advice for everyone. I have been paying student loans for undergrad for a little over a year now and it is worth every penny of it. In fact, you could not pay me my monthly student loan payment now to go back and make a choice to go to my state school instead of my private liberal arts alma mater.

I loved my four years of school. I applied to undergrad before I toured the campus and did not visit until accepted, but I knew as soon as I set foot on the campus that it was for me. I was completely comfortable with the campus, the professors, the students, and the location of the school. I would have felt that I cheated myself out of something had I not followed my heart and instead followed my wallet.

Money certainly is a factor for me. However, if I did not feel comfortable at a less expensive option, personally, I would strongly consider choosing otherwise.

Don't get me wrong, money should certainly have a place on the list of pros or cons when making decisions between schools, but think of other factors as well. You know yourself better than anyone on this board. 😀

 

[Joshua Tree]

I might want to expose some light on the other side of this issue.
You can't dispute the difference in money between a state and a private school, but I went to a private school, and had I not done it, I might not be in the situation I am in now.

Yes, the extra scratch per month would have been nice, but getting into a school that got me into a specialty program has been worth every penny. If I had gone to a school with a larger class size and not as "prestigious" of a name, I would probably not have been able to get into my post-doc program. Maybe I am part of the minority, on this, but if you choose a program solely on money then you may not be considering every facet of dental education.

I wasn't married, and didn't have any attachments, so when I started working, I had the extra money to spend towards my loans, and I got them paid off. Looking back years after this, I don't really know any of my colleagues that say "I wish I had gone to my state school". They say that a few years after they graduate, but in the end it all evens out.

I think state schools are for most, but not all. Every person should choose whats best for them. The earlier you get through dental school, the more you can work. I will add that I went to my state school for undergrad which afforded more freedom in making my choice of dental school. Therefore, i cannot comment from the standpoint of someone who has done private undergrad and private dental school.

 

[agutier3]

Goes to show that people are different and that you can't generalize for everyone......just a thought.

 

[jacksonheel]

To clarify, I am certainly not one to advocate attending an inferior school. After all, I am a lawyer, and my current profession is probably the worst for caring what school you attended. But while I'll admit I haven't done as much research as some on this board, I just don't think there is a HUGE difference between most dental schools. Of course, there are some outliers on the bell curve on the bottom side, but personally, I haven't been able to differentiate what the "top tier" schools are. Lots of people here discuss Penn, NYU and Columbia, and refer to these as "Ivy League," and top schools. While they are technically Ivy League schools, I don't think that distinction applies as much with Dental School. From all appearances, these schools seem easier to get into for dental school than many state schools. Let me assure you, that is not the case with the law or business school at these Ivy Leaguers. This is in no way disparaging these schools, and I may be wrong, but they don't seem like they attract better students, just those searching for a name.

Of course, my advise is not for everyone. But I think many people get caught up in a name, and forget that the name may, in the long run, mean nothing. If you intend to specialize, you need to do well wherever you attend. Going to a school that is expensive, but has a high rate of acceptances to post doc programs, is a way of "buying" a better chance to get accepted. I'm not saying this is the wrong thing to do - I did this for law school; I just want people to think very hard before they shell out that extra money. Work hard and you can get into a post doc program from almost any school.

Certainly, everybody has different priorities. But, being someone who made the wrong decision regarding an expensive school once, I want to pass along my experiences in the hopes it might be helpful to someone else. I wish someone had given me a stearn lecture before I dropped big cash for professional school.

jacksonheel

 

[ItsGavinC]

You did make an interesting point in your last post: the two Ivy dental schools (Penn and Columbia) are FAR easier to get into than any other Ivy professional schools (med, law, business) or undergraduate schools.

Remember, just because they play sports in a crappy division (the Ivy League), doesn't mean the education is great. It just means they can't win football games, so they are pitted against other teams that can't win football games.

 

[acrunner]

i agree with jacksonheel. i posted a response to a similar thread a while back. however, i did it in fewer words. 🙂

 

[jacksonheel]

I have trouble with short sentences. I guess I just enjoy hearing myself speak (or watching myself type, as the case may be).

 

[Ranman]

I'm sorry, but you cannot easily dismiss the reputation of schools. When you are applying to do post-graduate work and the decision is between someone from Ivy or state school - Ivy will get the nod. I don't think rep. of school will get you in alone, but it's obvious that if you go to schools with great reps they will have great faculty, offering you a chance to work with people who are renowned in their field.

I've looked at the current residents from OMS programs from schools all over the states and there always is at least one person from Columbia or UPENN. That's no coincidence.

Money is definitely important and I'm still wrestling with the decision to go private or state, but you can't put a price on opportunity.

 

[leafhound16]

Ranman,

Just curious.... where did you find the information about which dental schools current residents are from? Did you find the background from other residency programs besides OMS? Some of us might find that useful information... thanks!

 

[gryffindor]

Originally posted by Ranman
I'm sorry, but you cannot easily dismiss the reputation of schools. When you are applying to do post-graduate work and the decision is between someone from Ivy or state school - Ivy will get the nod. I don't think rep. of school will get you in alone, but it's obvious that if you go to schools with great reps they will have great faculty, offering you a chance to work with people who are renowned in their field.

I've looked at the current residents from OMS programs from schools all over the states and there always is at least one person from Columbia or UPENN. That's no coincidence.

Money is definitely important and I'm still wrestling with the decision to go private or state, but you can't put a price on opportunity.

Ranman, I'm going to assume you are still a pre-dent because once you start dental school, you will realize for yourself if there is a difference between state vs private. State schools offer GREAT dental educations. The students from my school who are qualified to apply for specialties WILL get looked at over a student from an IVY school only because in dentistry, REPUTATION MEANS NOTHING! Columbia isn't going to offer any special opportunities that Buffalo or Stony Brook can't offer.

If IVY was so important, then how do you explaing the following 4 graduates of my state school? Last year one of our graduates went to the orthodontics program at Columbia. If Ivy was going "to get the nod", wouldn't Columbia have chosen one of their own rather than a Buffalo graduate, especially for something as competitive as ortho? Oh wait, we also had one of last year's grads get into the pedo program at Harvard. Believe me, our ortho and pedo faculty aren't renowned in anything. We're lucky they even teach us and haven't ditched us for private practice. So you can't say it has to do with the opportunity with "working with the best." And it didn't have to do with the "name of the school." Then what was it? I would be positive it had to do with the graduate's experience, genuine interest in ortho/pedo, board scores, GPA/rank, excellent letters of rec, etc.

Among this year's seniors, one is going to Endo at Penn, and another one will be doing Perio at Columbia. Endo straight out of school! And at Penn (oh my gosh, it's an IVY)! Most endo program won't even look at you unless you do a GPR. Yet we have a state school student getting into one.

Most of our graduates will be general dentists. However, students who want to specialize at my school make sure they get the experience they need to make themselves competitive applicants (assuming they already have the board scores, rank, letters of rec, and extra-curric activites under their belt). We have plenty of opportunities available to us to get extra experience in whatever specialty you want, you just have to take initiative for yourself.

The original poster had some really good advice. Listen to it, three years from now you'll be glad you did.

BTW, I did choose my state school over Penn. I am also planning to apply to specialty programs next year. I admit, I wasn't sure at first - but now I know that I haven't missed out on any opportunities by passing over Penn. And I sleep easier at night know that I will only be $100,000 in debt as opposed to the $250,000 Penn had proposed. In fact, I can take that extra $150,000 I saved and apply it toward my specialty education if I need to.