My view...2 cents

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2win said:
'
It is not about elections - it is about right vs wrong.
If you believe that saying what people want to hear in order to win an election -is the reason that Obama won - you are right.
Doesn't mean that this way is correct. Or good. Or honest.
I am out of this stuff. I have my land, my guns and above all, MY GOD!
You America ( progressive voters) can have the rest.
Atlas Shrugged.
2win
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the one thing we do know of Obama (which may also be reassuring to hard line conservatives) is that on the immigration issue, he's not soft.
It amuses me that illegal immigrants and their voting relatives bought into his demagoguery given that he has deported more illegal immigrants than any president in this country's history has done in 4 yrs, inspite of his many promises to the contrary on the 2008 campaign trail.

He says what his audience wants to hear to get the vote. Whether or not he intends to follow through on his promises is left to chance.


see,
"The American Civil Liberties Union has gone even further, with legislative counsel Joanne Lin saying that Obama's enforcement policies overall have left a "wake of devastation in Latino communities across the nation," according to the Los Angeles Times."


:luck:
 
GypsySongman said:
No my point is that he didn't win based on the educated vote, he won based on the minority vote.
39% of whites and 42% of college educated whites voted for Obama. Including educated minorities' voting based on race makes it appear that educated people prefer Obama which isn't true. Educated people preferred Romney but race trumped education for minorities on the whole.

(I know you could say race trumped education for white people, but I don't think that is the case.)
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Somnus Tuto said:
the one thing we do know of Obama (which may also be reassuring to hard line conservatives) is that on the immigration issue, he's not soft.
It amuses me that illegal immigrants and their voting relatives bought into his demagoguery given that he has deported more illegal immigrants than any president in this country's history has done in 4 yrs, inspite of his many promises to the contrary on the 2008 campaign trail.

He says what his audience wants to hear to get the vote. Whether or not he intends to follow through on his promises is left to chance.


see,
"The American Civil Liberties Union has gone even further, with legislative counsel Joanne Lin saying that Obama’s enforcement policies overall have left a "wake of devastation in Latino communities across the nation," according to the Los Angeles Times."


:luck:
Click to expand...

Immigration has disproportionately harmed black people's employment and salaries. It's amazing that the dems can attract hispanics and blacks, and it is no surprise that Obama isn't as weak on immigration as some might like.
 
GypsySongman said:
Immigration has disproportionately harmed black people's employment and salaries. It's amazing that the dems can attract hispanics and blacks, and it is no surprise that Obama isn't as weak on immigration as some might like.
Click to expand...


How is this?
 
2win said:
- a lot of them are "gardeners" - or they call themselves like that. As a gardener I found this a joke, because they mostly clean up leaves and cut grass.

2win
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Where did you get your PhD in gardening?
 
GypsySongman said:
Really? It seems too obvious to require explanation, but I'll find a couple of links from a google search. There is a lot of discussion of this out there.

http://www.theroot.com/views/how-illegal-immigration-hurts-black-america

https://www.numbersusa.com/content/learn/illegal-immigration/unemployment-among-black-americans.html
Click to expand...

That has nothing to do with immigration, and all to do with greedy unscrupulous business owners who hire illegals to pay them less.

Don't mix your yin with your yang.
 
Somnus Tuto said:
the one thing we do know of Obama (which may also be reassuring to hard line conservatives) is that on the immigration issue, he's not soft.
It amuses me that illegal immigrants and their voting relatives bought into his demagoguery given that he has deported more illegal immigrants than any president in this country's history has done in 4 yrs, inspite of his many promises to the contrary on the 2008 campaign trail.

He says what his audience wants to hear to get the vote. Whether or not he intends to follow through on his promises is left to chance.


see,
"The American Civil Liberties Union has gone even further, with legislative counsel Joanne Lin saying that Obama's enforcement policies overall have left a "wake of devastation in Latino communities across the nation," according to the Los Angeles Times."


:luck:
Click to expand...

He's combined a policy that's friendly towards longstanding illegal immigrants with one that's tough at the border. On the pro immigration side he has unilaterally refused to allow deportation of dream act candidates, and his justice department has aggressively challenges Hispanic harassing laws like those in Arizona. On the other hand he put more border patrol agents on the border than any president in history and aggressively deported those who they caught, leading the the first net efflux in immigrants in recent American history.

I think you're understimating Hispanics if you think they're getting fooled. I think this is just a policy they can support: The migrants and new illegals get sent home, which is fair, and I think even the children of illegal immigrants understand why Americans need to secure their border. The people who have been here for decades, who have built their lives here and raised American children and grandchildren get to stay. Most of all the adults who came here as children and have never known any other country get to stay. Its a good blend of practicality and compassion, and now that they've been routed in the election its the policy every Republican is scrambling to embrace.
 
urge said:
That has nothing to do with immigration, and all to do with greedy unscrupulous business owners who hire illegals to pay them less.

Don't mix your yin with your yang.
Click to expand...

What? It has everything to do with illegal immigrants. Ideally, immigrants would fill jobs as americans quit for better jobs. What happens in the real world is, illegals take jobs by offering lower costs and low skilled workers of all races but disproportionately black take a lower salary too or become unemployed. The lack of English speaking compounds matters by making american workers not only more expensive, but the workplace more difficult when workers can communicate with each other. You want to work contruction with people who can't speak English? So remaining american workers get squeezed out as the illegal workforce becomes the local majority. Black people are tremendously harmed by illegal immigration and should be fighting for workplace enforcement from within the democrat party or god forbid within the republican party.

Aside from work issues, growing numbers of latinos will seriously diminish the political importance of the black vote. As I've said before, it would be nice if there was no black white asian or hispanic vote, but for now race remains a strong predictor of voting patterns. There's a lot of talk about the effect of latinos on white control of the government but little discussion of eroding black political strength.

It will be interesting to see what Obama really tries to do on the immigration issue.
 
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GypsySongman said:
What? It has everything to do with illegal immigrants. Ideally, illegal immigrants would fill jobs as americans quit for better jobs. What happens in the real world is, illegals take jobs, offered by greedy unscrupulous law braking cheap business owner who give 3 flying f...ks about the American workers, by offering lower costs and low skilled workers of all races but disproportionately black take a lower salary too or become unemployed. The lack of English speaking compounds matters by making american workers not only more expensive, but the workplace more difficult when workers can communicate with each other. You want to work contruction with people who can't speak English? So remaining american workers get squeezed out as the illegal workforce becomes the local majority.
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Fixed that for you

So, you agree with business owners braking the law hiring illegal immigrants?

That's ok with you?
 
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urge said:
Fixed that for you

So, you agree with business owners braking the law hiring illegal immigrants?

That's ok with you?
Click to expand...

I agree about the business owners but was trying to point out the impact on black people in particular and how that must shape the views of the community organizer in chief.
 
GypsySongman said:
I agree about the business owners but was trying to point out the impact on black people in particular and how that must shape the views of the community organizer in chief.
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This is not a black people problem. It's low wage people who suffer from greedy businessmen.
 
Illegal immigrants need to leave the country. They broke the law. No sob stories needed. They broke the law. They need to be deported. The. End.
 
jpark1800 said:
Illegal immigrants need to leave the country. They broke the law. No sob stories needed. They broke the law. They need to be deported. The. End.
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Every law except for rape and murder has a statue of limitations
If you do something stupid at 18 no one can prosecute you when you're 50. If the law is too incompetent to find you for 20 years sooner or later we, as a society, agree that if you've been good since we are going to let you live your life.

I don't think immigration should be the third exception along with murder and rape. Guard the borders. Deport recent immigrants. But if we enforced immigration so badly that your American children are putting your American grandchildren through college and you are still here its time to recognize that however you got here you are part of our country now.
 
Perrotfish said:
Every law except for rape and murder has a statue of limitations
If you do something stupid at 18 no one can prosecute you when you're 50. If the law is too incompetent to find you for 20 years sooner or later we, as a society, agree that if you've been good since we are going to let you live your life.

I don't think immigration should be the third exception along with murder and rape. Guard the borders. Deport recent immigrants. But if we enforced immigration so badly that your American children are putting your American grandchildren through college and you are still here its time to recognize that however you got here you are part of our country now.
Click to expand...

Illegal immigration isn't a single crime as they cross the border. It's an ongoing crime every second of every day. Statute of limitations is meaningless. That said, we probably shouldn't deport grandma away from her kids and grandkids.
 
GypsySongman said:
Illegal immigration isn't a single crime as they cross the border. It's an ongoing crime every second of every day. Statute of limitations is meaningless. That said, we probably shouldn't deport grandma away from her kids and grandkids.
Click to expand...

It depends how you look at it. When you steal something, you could argue its not just one crime, but a crime every second you remain in possession of what you stole. But the statutes of limitations for theft still apply. I personally think the crime happens when you cross the border and establish residency, one time deal.
 
The republican party would do well to tap into the goldmine that is the Asian-American community: Chinese-Americans, Korean-Americans, Japanese-Americans, Filipino-Americans, Vietnamese-Americas, Indian-Americans, Pakistani-Americans and a number I may be forgetting.

The country's best-educated, highest-earning and fastest-growing racial group has largely been ignored and for many reasons has been scooped up by the democratic party when the values that are espoused and exemplified by Asian-Americans: industry, academic achievement, marriage/family, active/participatory (perhaps overly so 😉) child-rearing, self-reliance, welfare-independence and fierce ambition are precisely a reiteration of the foundational principles that define the Republican party.

To do this the Republican party has got to be inclusive of all faiths and significantly strengthen its ground game to find out what appeals to this admirable group.

It has to re-prioritize its character as the Party of Work. The party that believes that hard work and sacrifice can be rewarded with success in a land of opportunity not one that emphasizes handouts or the denigration of the wealthy/successful.

I do not believe that simply extending amnesty to everyone who makes a mockery of our immigration laws is what it will take. Every nation has a right to control the flow of traffic across its borders- to determine who it will or will not admit.
 
neuropathic said:
This statistic is kind of meaningless. Having a college degree doesn't automatically mean that you are smart enough to understand politics or economy.

Most people voted for Obama/Democrat because they buy-in to the propaganda that there is something to gain for them personally and it has nothing to do with your education. Most Americans making less than 200k think Obama won't raise their income taxes because Obama is going to tax the rich. Wait till 2014, and everyone will pay higher income taxes, book it.

Under Obama, Hispanics think illegal immigrants will have a path to citizenships. Gays think they will be accepted just like everyone else. People without health insurance think once they get Obamacaid and they will have the same access as everyone else to healthcare.

Obama wants people to think he is the hero for the middle class and the "poor" (98% of the population). His agenda is to bring the country to the left, promote class warfare, divide the country, encourage moral destruction and more government control is the solution to most problems. He doesn't understand or care about the economy, or keeping the country strong internationally. Well, if the fiscal cliff does not get resolve, we are heading to recession.
Click to expand...

Wut.
 
Somnus Tuto said:
The republican party would do well to tap into the goldmine that is the Asian-American community: Chinese-Americans, Korean-Americans, Japanese-Americans, Filipino-Americans, Vietnamese-Americas, Indian-Americans, Pakistani-Americans and a number I may be forgetting.

The country's best-educated, highest-earning and fastest-growing racial group has largely been ignored and for many reasons has been scooped up by the democratic party when the values that are espoused and exemplified by Asian-Americans: industry, academic achievement, marriage/family, active/participatory (perhaps overly so 😉) child-rearing, self-reliance, welfare-independence and fierce ambition are precisely a reiteration of the foundational principles that define the Republican party.

To do this the Republican party has got to be inclusive of all faiths and significantly strengthen its ground game to find out what appeals to this admirable group.

It has to re-prioritize its character as the Party of Work. The party that believes that hard work and sacrifice can be rewarded with success in a land of opportunity not one that emphasizes handouts or the denigration of the wealthy/successful.

I do not believe that simply extending amnesty to everyone who makes a mockery of our immigration laws is what it will take. Every nation has a right to control the flow of traffic across its borders- to determine who it will or will not admit.
Click to expand...

agreed asians should be the republicans top priority
 
jpark1800 said:
agreed asians should be the republicans top priority
Click to expand...

A lot of them are illegal. I wouldn't cater to any specific group. Just need to crack down on the people giving them jobs and stop automatic citizenship when born here.

Urge for president 2016
 
jpark1800 said:
Just came across this amazing Ron Paul video. He has been right all along, AND HE KNEW HE WOULD BE RIGHT. He NAILED how this country would shape up for the next 10 years.
We are all doomed:

Ron Paul Predicts 2002-2012 perfectly
Click to expand...
This video does not make my hairs standup. What he is predicting is the worst case scenario for each of the current issues of that time. The iraq war, the Afghanastan war, the economic downturn. Not so prophetic in my eyes just active political cynicism. Give me a timetable then the hairs will stand up.
 
narcusprince said:
This video does not make my hairs standup. What he is predicting is the worst case scenario for each of the current issues of that time. The iraq war, the Afghanastan war, the economic downturn. Not so prophetic in my eyes just active political cynicism. Give me a timetable then the hairs will stand up.
Click to expand...

Lol there are always the cynics. He did not predict the worst case scenario for each of the current issues of that time. He did say that there would be peace in the middle east for a brief amount of time. How is saying that peace would be present at some point or another, a worst case scenario. A worst case scenario would be no peace at all. All intelligence experts agree that the worst case scenario for foreign policy period was nuclear weapons of Pakistan falling in the hands of the terrorists. He didn't make that prediction and it didn't happen for that time period.

He did give an estimate that all of this would happen in 5-10 years from 2002. And he turned out to be dead right. Nobody has a crystal ball and predict a specific timetable, so I guess you will never be happy. Meanwhile the little media and stupid politicians were all saying that the Arab Spring was great, the economy would recover, etc.etc.

He is not just making random predictions.
 
yappy said:
Lets just admit it...

The far right R primary killed Romney's chances before he ever got to the national election.

The catch 22 is that if he never had pandered to them he would not of been nominated to rep the R.

The foundation for this failure occurred in 2008/2009 when the Sarah Palin movement occurred and the party went full ******.
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30136393.jpg
 
jwk said:
Saw this quote today - it pretty much sums it up in a nutshell...


"The danger to America is not Barack Obama, but a citizenry capable of entrusting a man like him with the Presidency. It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of an Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have such a man for their president. The problem is much deeper and far more serious than Mr. Obama, who is a mere symptom of what ails America. Blaming the prince of the fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of fools that made him their prince. The Republic can survive a Barack Obama, who is, after all, merely a fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools, such as those who made him their president."
Click to expand...

Interesting. What would you extropalate from that quote about a party that espouses the idea of "legitimate rape"? How do you restore their "common sense and good judgement"? Republicans lost and will continue to lose because its a party of douche bags. George Bush is a tool. Mitt Romney is a bigger butt f u k then him. Seriously that's who they found to run against Barry - a Morman Gordan Gecko? The mellow drama and this country is over bull**** makes me laugh. People wait in line six hours (or longer) for iPhones. Today nearly everyone in this country will f ucking gorge themselves on disgusting food and booze and then some of you will wait in line overnight to buy a piece of **** flat screen TV so your fat kid can stare at it when he gets home from school. Perspective drama queens - perspective.
 
Hockeyguy said:
People wait in line six hours (or longer) for iPhones. Today nearly everyone in this country will f ucking gorge themselves on disgusting food and booze and then some of you will wait in line overnight to buy a piece of **** flat screen TV so your fat kid can stare at it when he gets home from school. Perspective drama queens - perspective.
Click to expand...

Absolutely. Or they'll spend countless hours watching/attending sporting events - such as hockey - hoping that "their" team will win the game or the championship when in reality, it doesn't matter one bit who the heck wins.
 
There is one big issue- the debt.
Every other issue pales in comparison.
Romney might not have made a huge improvement if he'd won, but Obama can be counted on to make matters worse.
There are some bad people on the right, but our grandkids aren't going to be affected by some fuktard talking about legitimate rape.
Gay marriage, a less ridiculous tax code, affordable education, doctorification of nurses, unions driving jobs overseas, freedom of and from religion, crippling bureaucracy, national defense, immigration, etc. are all important issues, but the one that will ruin this coutry for future generations is the debt.
We don't need representatives who just blame. We need someone who says, we are where we are, fixing it will hurt today but not fixing it will crush tomorrow.
Romney may be Gordan Gecko, but Obama is far worse. If he actually came out snd spoke (and the press would bother reporting) about his views on the west, capitalism, individual rights and initiative, distribution of wealth in the U.S. and internationally, race, and the role of government VERY few Americans would support him. There are hints throughout his life from his friends to his statements to his writing that let you know he is a terrible terrible choice for president, the press just actively avoids covering it.
Some jackass in Missouri says something nutty and it hurts Romney, who had nothing to do with it. Obama associates with America haters and card-carrying Communists and most people have no idea.
 
leaverus said:
Absolutely. Or they'll spend countless hours watching/attending sporting events - such as hockey - hoping that "their" team will win the game or the championship when in reality, it doesn't matter one bit who the heck wins.
Click to expand...

Exactly. Thanks for proving my point.
 
My friend 2win is not a racist... he is a survivor of war in eastern Europe and since then he developed a strong sensitivity to communism and to all socialist ideology.
I absolutely understand his point of view and share many of his convictions.
 
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