NBDE rank

[ems5184]

Does anyone have a link for a site listing all the dental schools and average NBDE I and II scores? I tried searching on my own and couldn't come up with anything.

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[ItsGavinC]

No such site exists. Most schools won't even tell applicants what their NBDE average rank is. For that matter, many schools won't even tell their own students where the school falls on the rank list of NBDE averages. The top couple of schools are always quick to brag about it, but the communication from other schools regarding this drops off sharply after that.

 

[ems5184]

What are the top couple schools? Are they like the obvious UConn, Harvard, etc?

 

[Fullosseousflap]

No such site exists. Most schools won't even tell applicants what their NBDE average rank is. For that matter, many schools won't even tell their own students where the school falls on the rank list of NBDE averages. The top couple of schools are always quick to brag about it, but the communication from other schools regarding this drops off sharply after that.

Yes, this is even true for the California Licensing Board results. The Deans of the California Dental Schools hold their results very close to the vest and absolutley do not release the results.

Me thinks the results should be public and published timely!

 

[ItsGavinC]

What are the top couple schools? Are they like the obvious UConn, Harvard, etc?

Hmmm, UConn usually as strong results, as does UNC and the University of Washington. Iowa has strong results traditionally as well. All of this is quite nit-picky though, and doesn't matter much.

It gets to a point where you are ranking a 93.4 average vs. a 93.1 average, which doesn't mean anything at all.

My above answers are speculative at best.

 

[GatorDMD]

our dean said we were ranked 4th or 5th in the nation with a class average of 89...

 

[slysnoodles]

Harvard has been #1 on Part 1 for at least the past decade...The average score is usually in the 93-94 range...

UConn has been #1 on Part 2 consistently for at least the last 3 years, and is #2 on Part 1, at least for the past 5...

 

[boboli_chef]

UConn has been #1 on Part 2 consistently for at least the last 3 years, and is #2 on Part 1, at least for the past 5...

Better check your facts again, Noodles. Last year University of Washington was #1 on Part II.

UW's near the top on Part I, as well, but I'm not certain specifically where in the rankings.

Not that I'm biased or anything.

 

[Fullosseousflap]

Better check your facts again, Noodles. Last year University of Washington was #1 on Part II.

UW's near the top on Part I, as well, but I'm not certain specifically where in the rankings.

Not that I'm biased or anything.

Hey do you or did you have Professor Gandara at Washington?

I went to dental school with her at USC.

A real nice person!

 

[slysnoodles]

Hi BoboChef,

Sorry - my mistake about the part II scores. I guarantee you that I am right about the part I scores.

 

[45540]

UT is in the top 50 for part 1 and 2 board scores ...

who cares about the rest. A person could go anywhere and still make a 99 on the boards. It's about the person, not the school I say.

 

[MEM3]

UT is in the top 50 for part 1 and 2 board scores ...

who cares about the rest. A person could go anywhere and still make a 99 on the boards. It's about the person, not the school I say.

i agree

 

[boboli_chef]

Hey do you or did you have Professor Gandara at Washington?

I went to dental school with her at USC.

A real nice person!

She's my instructor for Physical Examination I currently, and PE II next quarter. I've had only a couple of lectures with her, but I'd agree with you, she seems to have a friendly personality.

 

[delicious]

Better check your facts again, Noodles. Last year University of Washington was #1 on Part II.

UW's near the top on Part I, as well, but I'm not certain specifically where in the rankings.

Not that I'm biased or anything.

Hey boboli, at the end of your article there it says: "In addition, all dentistry students who applied to graduate programs last year got into their first choice."

I find that really, really, really hard to believe. Unless only the top 5 students in that class applied. Or a lot of them applied to less competetive specialties like prostho. How on earth could they even make a statement like that in the first place: did the students submit their Match rank list to the school or what?

 

[boboli_chef]

Hey boboli, at the end of your article there it says: "In addition, all dentistry students who applied to graduate programs last year got into their first choice."

did the students submit their Match rank list to the school or what?

Maybe.

We're a comparatively small school (55 students per class), so it would not surprise me at all if someone in the dean's office asked everyone to submit their post-graduation plans, or if they held 1 on 1 conferences with the students. I know that every year some students pursue high end specialties like ortho, OMFS, etc. but am not aware of any exact figures.

 

[DcS]

I believe UNC had the 2nd highest Part II scores this past year. Part I was not as highly ranked but cannot recall where it fell.

 

[ItsGavinC]

I guarantee you that I am right about the part I scores.

I don't think so. UNC has had higher average scores than Harvard for some of those years.

 

[bspeedy00]

I don't think so. UNC has had higher average scores than Harvard for some of those years.

Gavin really dislikes harvard. This is like negative post 88443, so I am skeptical of any statement like this (no offense to UNC).

 

[45540]

Gavin really dislikes harvard. This is like negative post 88443, so I am skeptical of any statement like this (no offense to UNC).

Be that as it may, UNC is generally slightly higher. It's all heresay though.

 

[delicious]

Be that as it may, UNC is generally slightly higher. It's all heresay though.

Ahhh....this is hurting my ears!! UNC has nothin' on Harvard.

 

[ItsGavinC]

Gavin really dislikes harvard. This is like negative post 88443, so I am skeptical of any statement like this (no offense to UNC).

Actually, I love Harvard and have nothing against them at all. If the guy's stats are wrong, then they are wrong.

As an aside, I looked at all my posts regarding Harvard over the last year, and there weren't any disrespectful comments. The ONLY comments I've made are that 1) lots of research funding doesn't equate to a good dental school, and 2) Harvard is top-notch in the world of medicine, law, etc., but it's prestige doesn't matter much in our profession.

 

[slysnoodles]

Gavin,
Let's do a side by side comparison. I have the average NBDE Part 1 scores for Harvard for the last decade (they were published in a Harvard study in J Dent Ed). You provide the UNC numbers - I guarantee that you are wrong.

And yes, even though I don't go to Harvard, I do think that you really do have an "attitude" regarding the school, moreso than any other school. The thing I love about your attitude is the fact that you so often remark that the best dental school is the one that a student is attending, but then you turn around and give Harvard a bad rap any chance you get. Isn't Harvard the best school for people who attend it?

Every now and then, a little arrogance seeps through in your comments. Pardon me if I don't bow down to a guy who claimed last summer that he was doing so well on the practice part I exams, but couldn't even break a 90 on the actual thing...

 

[delicious]

Pardon me if I don't bow down to a guy who claimed last summer that he was doing so well on the practice part I exams, but couldn't even break a 90 on the actual thing...

ooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! boyakasha!! what a dis!!

Gavin, are you gonna take that?!!!!

 

[Da ObtURator]

Gavin,
Pardon me if I don't bow down to a guy who claimed last summer that he was doing so well on the practice part I exams, but couldn't even break a 90 on the actual thing...

OUCH!! That hurts!!!

 

[delicious]

Harvard is top-notch in the world of medicine, law, etc., but it's prestige doesn't matter much in our profession.

Does prestige really matter in medicine or law?! ..... no. I think you have issues.

 

[The Godfather]

Gavin,
Let's do a side by side comparison. I have the average NBDE Part 1 scores for Harvard for the last decade (they were published in a Harvard study in J Dent Ed). You provide the UNC numbers - I guarantee that you are wrong.

And yes, even though I don't go to Harvard, I do think that you really do have an "attitude" regarding the school, moreso than any other school. The thing I love about your attitude is the fact that you so often remark that the best dental school is the one that a student is attending, but then you turn around and give Harvard a bad rap any chance you get. Isn't Harvard the best school for people who attend it?

Every now and then, a little arrogance seeps through in your comments. Pardon me if I don't bow down to a guy who claimed last summer that he was doing so well on the practice part I exams, but couldn't even break a 90 on the actual thing...

I think my "dork alarm" just went off. If some random person was viewing this thread, I would be ashamed for them to see that a future health care professional was resorting to personal attacks over a difference of opinion about some test scores (which are a lot less important than being able to relate to people in my book). Let's take a breather folks, and remember it's okay to disagree. And that when we do disagree, let's keep it civil.

 

[DcS]

Being that I go to UNC and would be biased towards UNC, it's pretty safe to say that for Part I UNC's boards are and have been middle of the pack. This year was an improvement but only after they gave us time off to study (1 week), where in the past the students were given no time off to prepare.


As far as slywhatever calling gavin out and bringing up board scores, you pretty much ruined whatever credibility you *may* have had. Nothing like resorting to personally attacking someone in the most childish way to disagree on something. Get a life man.

 

[delicious]

I think my "dork alarm" just went off.

Are you sure your dork-detector wasn't sensing yourself?

 

[DcS]

Are you sure your dork-o-meter wasn't sensing yourself?

That might have been funny...when i was in 5th grade. Is that even necessary?

 

[delicious]

That might have been funny...when i was in 5th grade. Is that even necessary?

Who's trying to be funny? I just want to be sure that Godfather's not getting a false positive read. It's well known that dork-detectors (or dork-o-meters) are so sensitive that they can respond to the dorkiness of the person using the aforementioned device.

 

[The Godfather]

Who's trying to be funny? I just want to be sure that Godfather's not getting a false positive read. It's well known that dork-detectors (or dork-o-meters) are so sensitive that they can respond to the dorkiness of the person using the aforementioned device.

Well there is a label on it that says that it was built and calibrated at Harvard (they have a lot of source material for testing), so I guess it's accuracy should be without question!

 

[delicious]

Well there is a label on it that says that it was built and calibrated at Harvard (they have a lot of source material for testing), so I guess it's accuracy should be without question!

Yeah, no doubt it's accurate. I'm talking sensitivity my friend.

 

[The Godfather]

Yeah, no doubt it's accurate. I'm talking sensitivity my friend.

Oh! There it went again! So far it seems to be working properly. I think any sensitivity problem on this thread has little to do with any machine. Sorry if I hurt anyone's feelings. Let's move on. Isn't it time for recess?

 

[LSR1979]

Every now and then, a little arrogance seeps through in your comments. Pardon me if I don't bow down to a guy who claimed last summer that he was doing so well on the practice part I exams, but couldn't even break a 90 on the actual thing...

Wow what an immature a s s h o l e. Bashing somebody's part I score just because you disagree on a given dental school. That's like me bashing you for having terrible acne and kankles because you drive a ford instead of a chevy. Sweet life.

 

[bspeedy00]

Being that I go to UNC and would be biased towards UNC, it's pretty safe to say that for Part I UNC's boards are and have been middle of the pack. This year was an improvement but only after they gave us time off to study (1 week), where in the past the students were given no time off to prepare.


As far as slywhatever calling gavin out and bringing up board scores, you pretty much ruined whatever credibility you *may* have had. Nothing like resorting to personally attacking someone in the most childish way to disagree on something. Get a life man.

Thanks for the info DcS. Gavin seems to think he is this mighty authority on all things dental, and this just shows that this knowledge is sketchy at best. The reason I even made the earlier comment regarding Gavins dislike of harvard is that this passive aggressive crap irritates me. He subtly trys to discredit Harvard (very specifically I might add), then pretends that he has done nothing of the sort, and is really praising harvard. Anytime I have seen a post praising Harvard, Gavin chimes in with something like..."well it isnt THAT good", or "they arent THAT selective", etc. Harvard is a good school, so are many others. I have said this before, and I will say it again, stop criticizing harvard, especially since some of your facts are not accurate.

 

[delicious]

Thanks for the info DcS. Gavin seems to think he is this mighty authority on all things dental, and this just shows that this knowledge is sketchy at best. The reason I even made the earlier comment regarding Gavins dislike of harvard is that this passive aggressive crap irritates me. He subtly trys to discredit Harvard (very specifically I might add), then pretends that he has done nothing of the sort, and is really praising harvard. Anytime I have seen a post praising Harvard, Gavin chimes in with something like..."well it isnt THAT good", or "they arent THAT selective", etc. Harvard is a good school, so are many others. I have said this before, and I will say it again, stop criticizing harvard, especially since some of your facts are not accurate.

Agreed. Didn't quite know how to say it before. It's funny that his UNC stats were obviously based on shaky info, yet he always talks about "heresy" when other people bring up questionable facts. Guess if its shaky info related to Harvard's performance its okay.

And Godfather, I thought there might be an issue with your dork-detection when I saw your signature was UNC 2009. In the context of this argument, it aroused my suspicion.

 

[InMyCrossHairs]

This is just another example of Gavin making unfounded claims. Dont forget his disdain for UOP, at one time saying they only produce average clinicians. All of this from a guy who attends a school that does not even have a dental clinic.

 

[The Godfather]

You folks with nothing better to do than run somebody down are pathetic. As DcS so eloquently put it, "Get a Life." Props to Gavin for not dignifying these statements with a response.

 

[Da ObtURator]

This is just another example of Gavin making unfounded claims. Dont forget his disdain for UOP, at one time saying they only produce average clinicians. All of this from a guy who attends a school that does not even have a dental clinic.

OUCH!! THAT HURTS!!! Some of you peeps are straight up brutal... but do tell it like it is!

 

[bspeedy00]

You folks with nothing better to do than run somebody down are pathetic. As DcS so eloquently put it, "Get a Life." Props to Gavin for not dignifying these statements with a response.

Run somebody down? What are you talking about? Some of us read SDN to gather information about dental school and the dental profession. The problem is that there are individuals on this site that claim to know more than they do, for example: the case with Gavin and the UNC board scores in his attempt to discredit another school. Many of you are quick to defend Gavin to this "harsh" criticism, yet you seem to be ok with him bashing an entire school. Bottom-line....people should stop pretending they are experts when they are not.

 

[ItsGavinC]

Hmmm, UConn usually as strong results, as does UNC and the University of Washington. Iowa has strong results traditionally as well. All of this is quite nit-picky though, and doesn't matter much.

It gets to a point where you are ranking a 93.4 average vs. a 93.1 average, which doesn't mean anything at all.

My above answers are speculative at best.

Well, this was my original post, which clearly states that my answers are speculative at best. My apologies for any conflicts that were spurred because of my comments.

I didn't mean to offend anybody, and I certainly have nothing against Harvard (where my father attended school), or UOP (where my uncle attended school and where every single one of our professors has been from this semester [Dr. Wood taught our Pedo course and I loved it, Dr. Carpenter is teaching our oral path course right now, Dr. Glassman taught our special needs course, etc]).

And of course, I'm a UNC student as well as an Arizona student, so I'm probably a bit biased in that regard.

Everybody is entitled to make mistakes, but let's not descend into personal attacks. And on that topic, I'm not ashamed of my score. It wasn't what I hoped it was, but I did fine. I'm well above the national average for dental students. I wish I had done better, though, but I'm certainly not the most brilliant person out there.

Good conversation here, let's keep it up!

 

[drat]

Gavin, I think it's your later comment that UNC has higher Part I scores than Harvard that got under people's skin. Regardless if that is true or not, what strikes me -- and apparently other readers as well -- is that you say it without any supporting evidence. Since you are a moderator and "veteran" of SDN, many readers/lurkers tend to assume your opinion is factual, and you portray it as such. As another poster pointed out, Harvard makes no secret of their Part I and II scores. They have a published article that explores the success of the PBL system and within the report are average board scores for the past decade (up until 2003). I don't have the article at my fingertips at the moment, but I recall the recent average Part I scores are in the mid-90s and Part II are in the mid-to-upper 80s. (In fact, Harvard's average Part II scores from the past 5 years are ~5 points higher than another school's that has the reputation of being a "such a strong clinical school" on the SDN forum. Anyway, that's a bit off topic. . .) If UNC does, in fact, have higher Part I scores (this was what was originally being discussed) please provide these statistics for us. We would simply like to know. It is my understanding, however, from UNCdentalguy that in 2004, UNC ranked 13th overall on Part I. And as a poster in this thread said who currently attends UNC, they are typically in the middle of the pack.

But the truth be told, the underlying tone of this thread isn't about UNC vs. Harvard. I think people are frustrated and irritated that you voice your opinion, as you are rightful to do so, but pass off your opinion as factual. Truthfully, as helpful as it can be, SDN is so full of erroneous information it's confusing applicants and making admissions nauseous. Personally, I'm tired of hearing about what a terrible clinical school Harvard is from people who are basing their opinion solely on the opinion of others. I cannot stress it enough to current and future applicants to speak with people from the school directly. Do NOT solely rely on SDN to get your information about schools. I emailed and telephoned nearly every school I applied to to clear up stuff that I wasn't sure of or that I had questions about. The schools don't want false rumors circulating about them and were very willing to offer me the information that I requested.

Gavin, just as you wouldn't like people handing out false information about Arizona, people don't like their schools' reputations tarnished by (ignorant) opinions -- hence the backlash.

 

[ItsGavinC]

drat, good comments. I'm closing this thread because it's off-topic. The OP, or anybody else, may start a new one about NBDE ranks if they wish.