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[doctor in da makin]

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Hi everyone,

Here are my stats:

3.28 GPA overall
3.1 science GPA

MCAT: 498 123 BIO, 125 for every other section

In my last 61 credits, I have maintained a 3.53 overall and 3.36 science GPA.

I have 100+ research hours. I had the opportunity to spend time in the ER and talk to and survey patients here.

I was an English tutor for the past year , where I helped both undergrad and grad students with their papers.

I was an assistant to the head coach for a youth high school basketball league, where we reached the Final Four.

I am currently shadowing a doctor.

5 LORs, 2 of which who are English professors who knew me very well.

I have a very short list right now (maybe you'll disagree). I know I am not the best applicant by any means, but I would really appreciate it if you could add onto or comment on my list. Schools that would value my upward trend, for example.

LECOM FL
WILLIAM CAREY
A.T STILL AZ
NYIT
ROWAN (I'M AN NJ rez)
NOVA
PACIFIC NORTHWEST U

 

[Shotapp]

Where is your clinical experience/volunteering? Low science GPA and low MCAT...are you trying to make some donations ($$) to schools or are you trying to get in? You need to raise your stats (GPA and MCAT) and you definitely need a lot more clinical/non-clinical volunteering unless you never mentioned them in your post...so far you don't look like a solid applicant that will get love from any schools.

 

[mathnerd88]

You'll need GPA and MCAT repair. You won't get any love anywhere. You shouldn't be thinking about a school list now. You should be thinking about retaking that MCAT and retaking some courses.

 

[doctor in da makin]

You'll need GPA and MCAT repair. You won't get any love anywhere. You shouldn't be thinking about a school list now. You should be thinking about retaking that MCAT and retaking some courses.

I know the MCAT is low, but really no love even for the upward trend anywhere?

 

[PossibleDOC?]

No you won't get any love anywhere. Piece of advice, study for the MCAT hard, get above a 505, then retake some prereqs and add some clinical volunteering at your local hospital. Then reapply.

 

[mathnerd88]

I know the MCAT is low, but really no love even for the upward trend anywhere?

Your MCAT is definitely a much bigger concern than just your upward trend of your GPA...if you had scored a 508+, it would let adcoms believe that you have the capability of handling medical school.

With a very low MCAT score and below average GPA, it's not going to instill any confidence.

Also, your "upward trend" is very small. Adcoms want to see sGPA of 3.5+ or in your case, even higher than that because of your lowish sGPA. If your sGPA is 3.1, but you maintained a 3.8 sGPA for the past couple of semesters, then it will help. However, your MCAT is a bigger concern now. You scored lower than 43% of all pre-meds who took the MCAT.

 

[doctor in da makin]

SDN and their harsh truths again... I could definitely work on the MCAT and increase my volunteering hours as well. I'll do whatever it takes but I think my GPA maybe as good as it gets. Everything else can be worked on though

 

[KP2AZ]

SDN and their harsh truths again... I could definitely work on the MCAT and increase my volunteering hours as well. I'll do whatever it takes but I think my GPA maybe as good as it gets. Everything else can be worked on though

Even retaking 2-3 basic sciences would be a good idea. Helps boost science GPA most. Get that 3.1 to above a 3.2 (aim around 3.3-3.4). I don't know what the new MCATs are like, so can't help you there. Also apply to as many schools as you can. Think of adding some of the newer schools (besides the one in Washington state). Nothing wrong with being in a small pond, it just helps you look like a bigger fish.


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[mathnerd88]

SDN and their harsh truths again... I could definitely work on the MCAT and increase my volunteering hours as well. I'll do whatever it takes but I think my GPA maybe as good as it gets. Everything else can be worked on though

CUSOM won't even look at your application unless your MCAT is above a 500 and your sGPA and cGPA are both above a 3.2...and it is a new school. I would try to get stats at a little above that for a chance at DO.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Concur with the above, maybe take a gap year and retake the MCAT, aiming for a 505+ amd retake like 2-3 basic science classes. Aim for a stat range of 3.4/3.2/505 and you should have better luck

 

[yeasureyoubetcha]

3.28 GPA overall
3.1 science GPA

MCAT: 498 123 BIO, 125 for every other section

The bio score combined with both GPAs is concerning as well as the fact you're below a 500. There are many schools that screen out below 500.

In my last 61 credits, I have maintained a 3.53 overall and 3.36 science GPA.

Some places will look at your last 90 credits or last 120 credits. Not your last 61 credits.

I have 100+ research hours.

Washing dishes or doing experiments? You'll need to be able to talk about what you did in your app and during interviews.

I am currently shadowing a doctor.

Good, try to shadow a couple. Especially DOs

5 LORs, 2 of which who are English professors who knew me very well.

Just use one English professor. 2 is unnecessary. Get a bio prof and another science prof. Then the DOs you shadow to write. AACOMAS only lets you have 6 letter writers and you don't get to choose which letters go to which schools. It just sends all of them.

I have a very short list right now (maybe you'll disagree). I know I am not the best applicant by any means, but I would really appreciate it if you could add onto or comment on my list. Schools that would value my upward trend, for example.

LECOM FL
WILLIAM CAREY
A.T STILL AZ
NYIT
ROWAN (I'M AN NJ rez)
NOVA
PACIFIC NORTHWEST U

I wouldn't start a list until you retake the MCAT and get your GPAs up over the next year or 2. I think most schools will see an upward trend, but the bio score could sway the decision. I believe Rowan cuts the MCAT off at 500. You'd have to look on their site. NYCOM accepts 70% of students from in state which is why I didn't apply there. Also their admissions office was nasty to me. WCU definitely had a 500 cutoff. I believe NOVA does as well.

 

[doctor in da makin]

Not sure why you had to say the part about washing dishes when I clearly said what my duties were there lol. I also do have 3 letters from science professors, 2 of which are bio. The problem is, this was my gap year. What if I did this? Retake a class or two this summer at a local CC. Retake the MCAT by August. Apply in Early september. That wouldnt be too late would it?

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Not sure why you had to say the part about washing dishes when I clearly said what my duties were there lol. I also do have 3 letters from science professors, 2 of which are bio. The problem is, this was my gap year. What if I did this? Retake a class or two this summer at a local CC. Retake the MCAT by August. Apply in Early september. That wouldnt be too late would it?

It wouldn't be too late but you would probably be better off taking 3-4 classes and applying next year. Honestly I think it would come down to your MCAT retake, if you do well (like 508+) then you could apply in September, but any lower than that I would wait and apply 6/1/17.

Also having that many letters is overkill, keep two from the science profs you think wrote you the best letters and one of your English professors, there is no reason to have 5 letters from profs. Them get a letter from a DO

 

[coffee-doc]

You sound very similar to me a few years ago. And I am pretty sure I have way more research hours and publications than you. You won't get love anywhere. Retake some classes (C or below / even B- if you can afford it). Retake the MCAT and go balls to the wall on it. Don't waste your monies

 

[StormRising]

Without >3.4 cGPA and >504 MCAT, you'd be simply wasting money.

 

[drkube]

You should retake the MCAT and/or do some grade replacement. It would be a waste to apply this cycle. Strengthen your app for next year

 

[doctor in da makin]

.

 

[doctor in da makin]

I hear everyone loud and clear. I respect and value all your opinions-even the brutally honest ones.

I am about to start volunteering within the next few weeks. Also found 1 more doctor to shadow. Also got a part-time job. Still going to continue researching as well.

I also should have mentioned that I'm still waiting on 2 grades to come in. I expect A's in them, which would take my overall to a 3.294 (so close to a 3.3 ) and science to 3.11. A small difference, but at least I'm over the 3.1 "threshold."

Also, would med schools value the fact that I did well in 300 level courses? My problem is that I screwed up in the basic classes early on. I have a 3.586 overall and a 3.46 science in these 300 level classes. And before you say they were all easy classes, 32 out of these 44 credits were 300 level science credits.

Everyone always says that we need to show medical schools that we can handle the coursework and wouldn't this help show that? Yes, my MCAT is low and I will most likely have to retake it. But won't this and my upward trend make me at least a little more attractive? Even a little?

 

[GypsyHummus]

I'm coming to go against the grain here and say you are fine. There were a lot of people accepted to DO school with a sub 500 +\- 2-1 points.

 

[sc7dr]

You have to understand that the reason why everyone is being blunt here is not to maliciously put you down. They just don't want you to have to spend hundreds of dollars in the applications process just to have to do the same thing over again. With that being said, it is up to you whether or not you choose to listen to their advice or not. You seem very intent on applying this cycle so if these people aren't going to convince you otherwise, then go ahead and add ACOM, BCOM, VCOMs, CUCOM, LECOM-E and B, LMU, MUCOM.

 

[doctor in da makin]

I do understand that, that is why I said I appreciate anyone's input.

I just figured I'd share those extra pieces of info to see if that changes their minds.

 

[Doctor_Strange]

Here is my take and I hope the more knowledgeable people can comment on it as well:

• If you had a cGPA and sGPA of over 3.3 at a minimum w/ your current MCAT score, then I would feel like you have improved chances. But those chances hinge upon having an otherwise standing application, i.e. stellar LORs, PS, and strong interview skills.
• Personally, I think it is easier to raise a sGPA than improve dramatically on the MCAT. That being said, if it were me, I would plan to retake the MCAT. My sGPA is above a 3.3 and my cGPA is a 3.4 and I attended a top 10 LAC, so I am in a different path than you. There is an outside chance I get a 499 on my 5/6 MCAT but I would feel somewhat confident I could get interviews. If I had a 3.2 sGPA and cGPA then I would not be applying at all, and that is where you currently hover around.
• It does not sound reasonable or a good idea to try to study and apply in the next 3 months. The chances that works out to your favor are--in my opinion--extremely unlikely. Take another gap year, and you will be in a much better position to apply.

edit: how many Cs Ds or Fs do you have? Sounds like there must be at least 3 or 4 C+ or B-s even scattered about. Retake those first!

 

[doctor in da makin]

10 C's or C+ grades in total. 2 of them have been retaken and turned into A's

But none in the past 2 years.

 

[Doctor_Strange]

10 C's or C+ grades in total. 2 of them have been retaken and turned into A's

But none in the past 2 years.

Damn. Well you gotta retake like half of those. It will do wonders for your app. Again I don't know what that would ultimately yield as far as your sGPA but if it gets above a 3.3 then I think you have a low to slightly below moderate chance of getting some interviews. A 498 is like a 24 which is certainly at the 10th percentile of probably a dozen or slightly less DO schools (@Goro is such data published anywhere? I am just making an educated guess based off what I know from MSAR) ; the thing is though those students likely have strong ECs which may nudge them towards an interview...

 

[doctor in da makin]

Lets see what Goro's input is. He seems like a guy who knows what he's talking about. Or a gal. I honestly don't know what gender Goro is. Anyone know?

 

[yeasureyoubetcha]

I'm coming to go against the grain here and say you are fine. There were a lot of people accepted to DO school with a sub 500 +\- 2-1 points.

If it were just OP's MCAT, it might be a different story. c & sGPA's are weak. A lot of schools want a letter from a DO, which he does not currently have it sounds like.

@doctor in da makin I'm not sure if the taking patient surveys in the ER would count as research. Did you design the study? Are you crunching the data and publishing it in a medical journal, or did someone else do it and you're just collecting patient answers? I literally have no idea if this would count or not.

As for the 300 level classes. I think they will see an uptrend yes, but are they going to look at upper level classes and cherry pick? Probably not. Too many applicants to sift through. I think LizzyM made a comment on here one time like she looks for reasons to throw people in the reject pile to thin out the volume of apps.

I believe all schools will value metrics before ECs. I think the only schools that don't care about metrics are the Caribbean schools, but don't apply there.

Your situation sounds salvageable. Do it once and do it right, because as a reapplicant you will need to reinvent yourself again. Then you'll have wasted all the time and money with the end result being nothing. Money can be earned again, time cannot be. It's your most precious resource.




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[doctor in da makin]

.

 

[yeasureyoubetcha]

Lets see what Goro's input is. He seems like a guy who knows what he's talking about. Or a gal. I honestly don't know what gender Goro is. Anyone know?

@Goro is a cat that gives good advice


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[Wjldenver]

.

Dr. Goro = Mr. Goro = Cat Person

 

[doctor in da makin]

If it were just OP's MCAT, it might be a different story. c & sGPA's are weak. A lot of schools want a letter from a DO, which he does not currently have it sounds like.

@doctor in da makin I'm not sure if the taking patient surveys in the ER would count as research. Did you design the study? Are you crunching the data and publishing it in a medical journal, or did someone else do it and you're just collecting patient answers? I literally have no idea if this would count or not.

As for the 300 level classes. I think they will see an uptrend yes, but are they going to look at upper level classes and cherry pick? Probably not. Too many applicants to sift through. I think LizzyM made a comment on here one time like she looks for reasons to throw people in the reject pile to thin out the volume of apps.

I believe all schools will value metrics before ECs. I think the only schools that don't care about metrics are the Caribbean schools, but don't apply there.

Your situation sounds salvageable. Do it once and do it right, because as a reapplicant you will need to reinvent yourself again. Then you'll have wasted all the time and money with the end result being nothing. Money can be earned again, time cannot be. It's your most precious resource.




Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

Lets let the schools determine what is research and what isn't. But regardless of what they call it, I had a wonderful opportunity to spend time in the ER and meet heavy marijuana users to breast cancer survivors. It wasn't easy going up to patients in the ER, as the last thing they want to see is a Researcher asking them a bunch of questions. It definitely helped my speaking and interpersonal skills at the least

 

[sharpstickie]

10 C's or C+ grades in total. 2 of them have been retaken and turned into A's

But none in the past 2 years.

That's going to have to be the priority here.

 

[Doctor_Strange]

Lets let the schools determine what is research and what isn't. But regardless of what they call it, I had a wonderful opportunity to spend time in the ER and meet heavy marijuana users to breast cancer survivors. It wasn't easy going up to patients in the ER, as the last thing they want to see is a Researcher asking them a bunch of questions. It definitely helped my speaking and interpersonal skills at the least

Sounds like it qualifies under the domain of research. I got my name on a paper and all I did was number crunching on a computer for like 2 weeks straight 8 hours a day. You did the other side of research--patient interaction.

 

[Doctor_Strange]

Anyways, I think this thread is nearing its end-life because the consensus is that applying this cycle will not be the smart move. It sucks to hear I am sure, but it is one year in the grand scheme of things.

Work on the classes first. That should at least improve your confidence and comfort with the sciences. It may even translate to your eventual prep for a retake on the MCAT. Plan to retake next spring. In the interim, grade repair is your priority for the next six months w/ a large side of DO shadowing (+ LOR) and some patient interaction. When I shadowed my ER doc who was a DO, he even let me do a basic history of a patient! Do not be afraid to be direct with your shadower.

Again I am just a pre-med student, but if I were in your shoes this would be my plan of attack. Based off your history it seems your parents have some influence on your decision making and I totally empathize as I live at home and they pay for virtually all my expenses (thankfully our finances are very strong). I bring this up because you need to tell them to back off (politely that is lol). If anything show them this thread and show them why you are doing what you are doing.

Good Luck!

edit: also this goes against the majority, but if your sGPA and cGPA can be brought up to 3.3 to 3.4 land--at a minimum--then you could apply next year with a 498, but I think by that time if you have improved to a 3.4 sGPA and cGPA, my thought process would be: well, he has a better mastery of the material, give the MCAT another shot (I personally believe there is at least a moderate correlation between one's GPAs and MCAT performance save for the outliers on SDN).

 

[Goro]

Goro is a guy, thank you very much.

Lets see what Goro's input is. He seems like a guy who knows what he's talking about. Or a gal. I honestly don't know what gender Goro is. Anyone know?

With that MCAT score, I can't recommend applying into you retake and do better. Your rising trend is very good, but you're still in a major risk group for failing out of med school, and/or failing Boards.

Hi everyone,

Here are my stats:

3.28 GPA overall
3.1 science GPA

MCAT: 498 123 BIO, 125 for every other section

In my last 61 credits, I have maintained a 3.53 overall and 3.36 science GPA.

I have 100+ research hours. I had the opportunity to spend time in the ER and talk to and survey patients here.

I was an English tutor for the past year , where I helped both undergrad and grad students with their papers.

I was an assistant to the head coach for a youth high school basketball league, where we reached the Final Four.

I am currently shadowing a doctor.

5 LORs, 2 of which who are English professors who knew me very well.

I have a very short list right now (maybe you'll disagree). I know I am not the best applicant by any means, but I would really appreciate it if you could add onto or comment on my list. Schools that would value my upward trend, for example.

LECOM FL
WILLIAM CAREY
A.T STILL AZ
NYIT
ROWAN (I'M AN NJ rez)
NOVA
PACIFIC NORTHWEST U

 

[doctor in da makin]

Goro is a guy, thank you very much.





With that MCAT score, I can't recommend applying into you retake and do better. Your rising trend is very good, but you're still in a major risk group for failing out of med school, and/or failing Boards.

Lets say I retake that MCAT in late August with an eye towards scoring around a 503 (which would also mean pulling back on research, volunteering, and shadowing a bit) and get my scores back in late September.

I don't think I could go any higher than that as the first time I took the MCAT, my max score was a 503 when all individual scores from my many practice exams were aggregated. So I think a 503 is probably my best bet. How would I look as an applicant then?

 

[Goro]

503 will get you IIs

 

[Shotapp]

If you are targeting primarily DO schools, why are you so focused on upper division? Upper division courses should be taken after replacing those C's. If you replace those C's, that will substantially raise your science GPA. You need to focus on those C's first...

 

[doctor in da makin]

503 will get you IIs

Do you think I would get any Interview invites as I stand right now?

 

[Goro]

Maybe a LUCOM, with that MCAT score. I can't recommend them.

Do you think I would get any Interview invites as I stand right now?

 

[doctor in da makin]

If you are targeting primarily DO schools, why are you so focused on upper division? Upper division courses should be taken after replacing those C's. If you replace those C's, that will substantially raise your science GPA. You need to focus on those C's first...

Because I want to be sure that med schools would value replacing those C's over doing well in upper level courses, which are more like classes I'll be taking in medical school. But clearly I'll need to retake the MCAT

 

[doctor in da makin]

Maybe a LUCOM, with that MCAT score. I can't recommend them.

LUCOM? Thats a bummer.

And not to get too ahead of myself...

But with my current GPA, ECs, and a MCAT of 503, where should I apply then?

 

[Goro]

Apply broadly, especially targeting the newest schools. Skip CCOM, the coastal Touros, Western, AZCOM, PacNW (unless you're from that region) and KCUMB.

 

[doctor in da makin]

Apply broadly, especially targeting the newest schools. Skip CCOM, the coastal Touros, Western, AZCOM, PacNW (unless you're from that region) and KCUMB.

Appreciate the advice, thanks. Will a candidate like me be at any disadvantage if he applied in late September?

 

[Goro]

Nope!

Appreciate the advice, thanks. Will a candidate like me be at any disadvantage if he applied in late September?

 

[edgerock24]

Lets say I retake that MCAT in late August with an eye towards scoring around a 503 (which would also mean pulling back on research, volunteering, and shadowing a bit) and get my scores back in late September.

I don't think I could go any higher than that as the first time I took the MCAT, my max score was a 503 when all individual scores from my many practice exams were aggregated. So I think a 503 is probably my best bet. How would I look as an applicant then?

This is what you should do. Focus primarily on studying for your MCAT retake and/or retaking courses.

Your EC's mean nothing because your stats are so low. Take time off of them until your metrics improve.

 

[drmeow2016]

Hi everyone,

Here are my stats:

3.28 GPA overall
3.1 science GPA

MCAT: 498 123 BIO, 125 for every other section

In my last 61 credits, I have maintained a 3.53 overall and 3.36 science GPA.

I have 100+ research hours. I had the opportunity to spend time in the ER and talk to and survey patients here.

I was an English tutor for the past year , where I helped both undergrad and grad students with their papers.

I was an assistant to the head coach for a youth high school basketball league, where we reached the Final Four.

I am currently shadowing a doctor.

5 LORs, 2 of which who are English professors who knew me very well.

I have a very short list right now (maybe you'll disagree). I know I am not the best applicant by any means, but I would really appreciate it if you could add onto or comment on my list. Schools that would value my upward trend, for example.

LECOM FL
WILLIAM CAREY
A.T STILL AZ
NYIT
ROWAN (I'M AN NJ rez)
NOVA
PACIFIC NORTHWEST U

Honestly, there's no set in stone GPA or MCAT that will guarantee an acceptance. I had a retake MCAT below 500, but had a cGPA of 3.82 and a sGPA of 3.76. I got accepted into a DO school and am currently waitlisted at two MD schools. If you're willing to lose money, I would say go for it, as you never know.

 

[CantStop_WontStop]

@drmeow2016... congrats on the acceptance. Just wondering if your first mcat was above 500 or if you were accepted with both scores being below? My GPA's are 3.82c &3.82s and I take my MCAT July 9th, but feel I've been getting wrecked by the EK practice exams so I'm trying to gauge a cutoff on where I should withdraw my app and take a gap year if I don't hit my target of 505+.