opalfirefly
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Oh boy, here I go opening this thread back up...
For anyone who wants to learn more about LIU or are considering attending/applying to this school, please read this.
Just thought I'd write here as someone who dug deeper into LIU. I really hoped that this school was set up for success as it is close to where I live, but the more I learn about it, the more doubt I feel about the school. Let me know your thoughts or if you have anything else to add on. I tried to make this opinion as neutral as possible, but as you read on, I'm sure you can get the hint what my overall feelings are about the school... and I tried really hard to get excited for it, too. A lot of this information, I'm sure are repeats from what other people have mentioned.
Cost: Tuition is insane. $55,000/year in tuition is insanely high for a vet school with no infrastructure such as dedicated classrooms or a teaching hospital. I don't exactly understand where all that money is going to. That cost is the same whether you are instate or out of state. At least well established schools can justify it by citing costs to keep their facilities up and running for the students, but the vet school literally have no facilities dedicated for vet students (I will get more into this later). Not to mention, Long Island in general is very expensive to live in and that part of Long Island specifically is known as one of the richest areas of Long Island. Want to try to offset that cost by living in on-campus housing? I'll get to that later, too, and why it seems not much better for different reasons. The total cost of attendance for this school is projected at nearly $85,000/year, not including any compounded interest. This poor vet students are going to graduate with nearly $400,000 of medical school debt. I'm flabbergasted at this especially since the school was saying how it recognizes the high veterinary medical school debt as an issue for doctors today, but are doing nothing to actually help with this issue. (There are also currently no scholarships offered because the bottom line is that the school is in financial trouble (more on this later, too) and in a lot of ways, the opening of the vet school during their current institutional climate seems like a last ditch effort for funds.)
Infrastructure: LIU literally has no dedicated buildings for the vet school. They have no dedicated classrooms and no teaching hospital for clinical rotations. Their augural class starting up in August will have classrooms held in the undergraduate life sciences building. Normally, this may not be a big deal as sometimes there just is not enough space, except that they said there will be a new facility/building built for the vet school and they haven't even started building it yet. Someone visited the campus and tried to get a tour of the school in February and was told by the school that they cannot offer a tour because there is nothing to show because they haven't built anything yet. It is now almost April. Classes are scheduled to start in five months. If they can somehow build a new building and have it functional by August, I will be shocked. I mean, for the sake of their students, I hope they can accomplish that, but it is highly doubtful. An article I just read today said that they have not scheduled to start construction until June... so... they are going to completely build a new infrastructure in two months? With all the pandemic craziness and aftermath that will happen (Long Island is hit pretty hard with COVID-19 right now), I don't think they will be able to make that deadline. They also bought/leased property from a town about 25 minutes away to use as space for large animal housing. Okay, great. But that also would need infrastructure to house the livestock and I just have a bad feeling about their ability to erect an entire new facility in time. Maybe not a big deal if working with live animals aren't part of the curriculum during didactics, but may also be a detriment to the student if they are not receiving hands on learning early on. The new facility they have planned for the vet school is estimated to cost $40 million. They received $12 million from New York State and say that they also received a few million in private donations. Okay, great. Except, it is rumored that they spent the $12 million grant on their undergraduate schools. So... I don't really understand where they are going to get the money for the new building.
Housing: Long Island is expensive. The part of Long Island that LIU Post is located is even more expensive. Is it as expensive as Manhattan? No. But that doesn't mean it's affordable, either. If you're going to go to school here, you might have a long commute just to get more reasonable housing. Good luck during rush hour traffic with all the commuters trying to go to New York City all at once starting from 5am - 8am and again when they are all trying to commute back to Long Island where they actually live from 5pm - 8pm. Want to look into on-campus room/board? There is literally an instagram account dedicated to all the broken buildings/infrastructure that the undergraduates are experiencing right now in the dorm rooms, classrooms, communal spaces. The common theme I've picked up is they have a giant problem with black mold, mice, flooding, poorly maintained buildings, etc. Sure, not all dorm rooms are perfect or immaculate, and I understand that, but the living conditions seem particularly subpar in their on-campus housings. The dining services seem to sometimes serve raw chicken. Oh, and there was a Norovirus outbreak at the school last year.
Application Process: I only have one word to describe it: confusing. I tried to give the benefit of the doubt that they are just trying to smooth out kinks as this is their first year except... they aren't brand spanking new and the University of Arizona had a MUCH more clear and structured process and timeline to give to their applicants. LIU did not. They are part of a university that has been able to handle admissions for a very long time for thousands of undergraduate and graduate students so I don't understand why their vet school admissions process is just so convoluting. Maybe it'll be better next year, hopefully. The guidelines and requirements to apply to the school are not clear at all. At one point the website said admissions was on a rolling basis. This is okay to do and encourages applicants to apply early to get a better chance. Except, later on in the application cycle, they completely removed that from their website and now it says decisions will be released by a certain date. Before, they said March 20th then they pushed it back to this week. Okay, again the pushing back the decisions date doesn't seem like a big deal because lots of schools did that due to COVID-19 turmoil. I will give them a pass on that, but changing admissions from rolling to non-rolling in the middle of the application cycle seems... weird? I guess this would be okay if they made it so that all decisions were released by their March date, except some applicants were invited for the online interview in February and March and were admitted a week after while some just didn't hear at all. After the first wave of acceptances, LIU again changed their admissions requirement so that some were invited for the interview and were told that they were required to take the CASPer test. There was no mention for the already admitted students that they also needed to take the CASPer test. Some were told to send in a final transcript in May before admissions makes a decision on them. Well, decisions came out yesterday and today for those who haven't heard back yet since, and some who didn't even interview got waitlisted. No rejection letters so far. Also, there are still a good chunk of people who still haven't heard back at all. I don't understand their admissions timeline or requirements at all.
LIU in general: Oh boy... so the university in general seems to be on a decline. Their undergraduate enrollment has also severely declined. A couple of years ago, they laid off a large amount of faculty members due to funding strains. During COVID-19, they laid off a good number of maintenance staff. A month ago, they announced they are going to discontinue some of their undergraduate programs due to funding. I don't get the vibe that the school is supportive of their students or will be able to provide scholarship money to help offset the student debt. I don't know what resources there will be for students and I worry that those who are going for whatever reason are not going to get the quality of education or life that other schools have offered.
Well, that was my long, winded analysis of the school. I personally found way too many red flags with the school to feel hopeful. If there are any green flags with this school, please feel free to chime in, but as is, they are very few and far in between. Maybe in the next couple of years, the school will sort itself out, but for now, I think their first class of students will face the brunt of these issues. I write this in hopes that people who are looking into applying or attending this school can prepare themselves. Take it however you want, but I hope you make the best decision for yourself.
For anyone who wants to learn more about LIU or are considering attending/applying to this school, please read this.
Just thought I'd write here as someone who dug deeper into LIU. I really hoped that this school was set up for success as it is close to where I live, but the more I learn about it, the more doubt I feel about the school. Let me know your thoughts or if you have anything else to add on. I tried to make this opinion as neutral as possible, but as you read on, I'm sure you can get the hint what my overall feelings are about the school... and I tried really hard to get excited for it, too. A lot of this information, I'm sure are repeats from what other people have mentioned.
Cost: Tuition is insane. $55,000/year in tuition is insanely high for a vet school with no infrastructure such as dedicated classrooms or a teaching hospital. I don't exactly understand where all that money is going to. That cost is the same whether you are instate or out of state. At least well established schools can justify it by citing costs to keep their facilities up and running for the students, but the vet school literally have no facilities dedicated for vet students (I will get more into this later). Not to mention, Long Island in general is very expensive to live in and that part of Long Island specifically is known as one of the richest areas of Long Island. Want to try to offset that cost by living in on-campus housing? I'll get to that later, too, and why it seems not much better for different reasons. The total cost of attendance for this school is projected at nearly $85,000/year, not including any compounded interest. This poor vet students are going to graduate with nearly $400,000 of medical school debt. I'm flabbergasted at this especially since the school was saying how it recognizes the high veterinary medical school debt as an issue for doctors today, but are doing nothing to actually help with this issue. (There are also currently no scholarships offered because the bottom line is that the school is in financial trouble (more on this later, too) and in a lot of ways, the opening of the vet school during their current institutional climate seems like a last ditch effort for funds.)
Infrastructure: LIU literally has no dedicated buildings for the vet school. They have no dedicated classrooms and no teaching hospital for clinical rotations. Their augural class starting up in August will have classrooms held in the undergraduate life sciences building. Normally, this may not be a big deal as sometimes there just is not enough space, except that they said there will be a new facility/building built for the vet school and they haven't even started building it yet. Someone visited the campus and tried to get a tour of the school in February and was told by the school that they cannot offer a tour because there is nothing to show because they haven't built anything yet. It is now almost April. Classes are scheduled to start in five months. If they can somehow build a new building and have it functional by August, I will be shocked. I mean, for the sake of their students, I hope they can accomplish that, but it is highly doubtful. An article I just read today said that they have not scheduled to start construction until June... so... they are going to completely build a new infrastructure in two months? With all the pandemic craziness and aftermath that will happen (Long Island is hit pretty hard with COVID-19 right now), I don't think they will be able to make that deadline. They also bought/leased property from a town about 25 minutes away to use as space for large animal housing. Okay, great. But that also would need infrastructure to house the livestock and I just have a bad feeling about their ability to erect an entire new facility in time. Maybe not a big deal if working with live animals aren't part of the curriculum during didactics, but may also be a detriment to the student if they are not receiving hands on learning early on. The new facility they have planned for the vet school is estimated to cost $40 million. They received $12 million from New York State and say that they also received a few million in private donations. Okay, great. Except, it is rumored that they spent the $12 million grant on their undergraduate schools. So... I don't really understand where they are going to get the money for the new building.
Housing: Long Island is expensive. The part of Long Island that LIU Post is located is even more expensive. Is it as expensive as Manhattan? No. But that doesn't mean it's affordable, either. If you're going to go to school here, you might have a long commute just to get more reasonable housing. Good luck during rush hour traffic with all the commuters trying to go to New York City all at once starting from 5am - 8am and again when they are all trying to commute back to Long Island where they actually live from 5pm - 8pm. Want to look into on-campus room/board? There is literally an instagram account dedicated to all the broken buildings/infrastructure that the undergraduates are experiencing right now in the dorm rooms, classrooms, communal spaces. The common theme I've picked up is they have a giant problem with black mold, mice, flooding, poorly maintained buildings, etc. Sure, not all dorm rooms are perfect or immaculate, and I understand that, but the living conditions seem particularly subpar in their on-campus housings. The dining services seem to sometimes serve raw chicken. Oh, and there was a Norovirus outbreak at the school last year.
Application Process: I only have one word to describe it: confusing. I tried to give the benefit of the doubt that they are just trying to smooth out kinks as this is their first year except... they aren't brand spanking new and the University of Arizona had a MUCH more clear and structured process and timeline to give to their applicants. LIU did not. They are part of a university that has been able to handle admissions for a very long time for thousands of undergraduate and graduate students so I don't understand why their vet school admissions process is just so convoluting. Maybe it'll be better next year, hopefully. The guidelines and requirements to apply to the school are not clear at all. At one point the website said admissions was on a rolling basis. This is okay to do and encourages applicants to apply early to get a better chance. Except, later on in the application cycle, they completely removed that from their website and now it says decisions will be released by a certain date. Before, they said March 20th then they pushed it back to this week. Okay, again the pushing back the decisions date doesn't seem like a big deal because lots of schools did that due to COVID-19 turmoil. I will give them a pass on that, but changing admissions from rolling to non-rolling in the middle of the application cycle seems... weird? I guess this would be okay if they made it so that all decisions were released by their March date, except some applicants were invited for the online interview in February and March and were admitted a week after while some just didn't hear at all. After the first wave of acceptances, LIU again changed their admissions requirement so that some were invited for the interview and were told that they were required to take the CASPer test. There was no mention for the already admitted students that they also needed to take the CASPer test. Some were told to send in a final transcript in May before admissions makes a decision on them. Well, decisions came out yesterday and today for those who haven't heard back yet since, and some who didn't even interview got waitlisted. No rejection letters so far. Also, there are still a good chunk of people who still haven't heard back at all. I don't understand their admissions timeline or requirements at all.
LIU in general: Oh boy... so the university in general seems to be on a decline. Their undergraduate enrollment has also severely declined. A couple of years ago, they laid off a large amount of faculty members due to funding strains. During COVID-19, they laid off a good number of maintenance staff. A month ago, they announced they are going to discontinue some of their undergraduate programs due to funding. I don't get the vibe that the school is supportive of their students or will be able to provide scholarship money to help offset the student debt. I don't know what resources there will be for students and I worry that those who are going for whatever reason are not going to get the quality of education or life that other schools have offered.
Well, that was my long, winded analysis of the school. I personally found way too many red flags with the school to feel hopeful. If there are any green flags with this school, please feel free to chime in, but as is, they are very few and far in between. Maybe in the next couple of years, the school will sort itself out, but for now, I think their first class of students will face the brunt of these issues. I write this in hopes that people who are looking into applying or attending this school can prepare themselves. Take it however you want, but I hope you make the best decision for yourself.
