Not happy with current acceptances

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I love this mentality. If the engineers of our world thought like this, there would be far more collapsed bridges and fatal airplane crashes.

Really, genius? And what do you attribute our PRESENT collapsed bridges and fatal airplane crashes to? Engineers not graduating with degrees from top institutions? It couldn't be grade inflation, flawed admissions, or general incompetence? It's amazing the way some of you people think - probably great material for a psychiatry case study.
 
I understand your point, and I see where you are coming from, but this is the internet. It's implied that any advice you get is "buyer beware". SDN is here to share opinions and perspectives, and that's exactly what you get: viewpoints of all shapes and sizes. As the reader, it's our job to sift through the voices and opinions and decide for ourselves what will work for us and will not. I agree that it can be discouraging to read so much negativity on here, and trust me, I know what that feels like. I was posting here during my last abysmal application cycle and got my fair share of ridicule.

One thing I don't understand about your post, however, is why you think that it smacks of hubris for one poster to describe "what worked for them", and also what they've been told specifically from admissions committee members. Isn't that kind of the entire point of SDN? For us to come together and talk about our experiences so that we have some sort of reference point on which to build our applications? The tough part is to be able to wade through all of that, retain your sanity, and then to just do what you think will work for you. By definition, what you hear on this site is heresay. That's how it will always be on an anonymous internet forum. So it's up to us to read something and stop and say to ourselves, "Is this reasonable? Do I think this is a good idea? Is it possible that this can strengthen my app?"

There are no perfect processes, and of course no-one will be able to predict where you will and will not get in. And yes, I do understand that it can be mind-numbingly frustrating to hear ultimatums all the time when you post here. But it is what it is. And from my personal experience (read: not THE TRUTH, but just one man's opinion), I don't think that I would have had as much success as I did if I didn't spend a whole lot of time sifting through what people posted here and coming up with a plan. I will be forever and deeply grateful for the existence of this site...and that comes with both the good and the bad of it.

Thanks, V. But this is precisely why I wrote that last paragraph, blaming people who do not take SDN posts for what they are. I still think that some posters especially "respected" ones (too often by virtue of the number of their posts) don't make it clear that their own scope is very limited. It is their fault when they give people the impression that what they are stating applies in a broad sense - when in fact they are just as ignorant as the rest of us. What one ad-com sees in an applicant, a hundred others may not see.
 
i know what you are saying. Im grateful for the love ive received from some of the schools so far..didnt expect it, but I am still HOPING AND PRAYING that i get some love from schools that are a bit more diverse...actually, ALOT more diverse..
 
If he is truly so unhappy with going to a top 5 school or the other 7 he was accepted to he is a ***** for even applying to any school except UCLA...seriously why would you apply to schools you wouldn't want to go to. Just to be a prick?
 
To briefly touch on that small tangent that was being discussed earlier, I think SDN can be characterized sometimes as a place where the blind is leading the blind. You have to be able to discern what advice/anecdotes actually applies to your situation and what does not. Getting into medical school doesn't require following a formulaic recipe, but what it does require is the wits, patience and the perseverance to sift through the all the noise. Keep your wits about you, and don't do something just because a mod or a medical student or even an adcom member says you should. Why would you necessarily trust what a poster on SDN says, over your own premedical advisor? (and I see a lot of premedical advisor bashing sessions on SDN.. a little bit ironic) Don't be lazy to do your own research as to what is best for you.

Anyway, reading this thread made me realize that I am quite fortunate to have an acceptance already to one of my top choices, and a strong school in its own right. Even though my absolute top choice seems to be a long shot now, I had to get a little perspective. Would I love to go to my absolute top choice? Absolutely. Will it happen? Who knows. Either way, you need to see the big picture and the forest for the trees. I can't blame the guy for wanting his absolute top choice to interview him, but I do agree he needs to get some perspective.
 
i just noticed that my previous post has nothing to do with this thread...maybe i should start reading the first post of the thread b4 replying.. back to watching the dallas game now.
 
Really? I agree with some of the other stuff you said... there definitely a lot of people on here who try and bring down others hopes but an 18 on the MCAT won't get you into med school as a janitor.


Are there any osteopathic schools in the caribbean? :idea:
 
But again when people tell what adcoms say or adcom members like NJBMD says stuff, they don't reveal what school it is coming from. So what may be true of one school is not true of others yet when they post they post such that it is true of every school in the nation and not just their state schools or their particular schools.

People want to maintain their anonymity but want to share info. but you can't do both always. You need to sometimes give the info in full with regards to the school that you are hearing such from because that school might do things differently then some other shcool. You also can't say just because you heard something is done at one school one way that all schools must do things that way because that is false.

As another example of this, LizzyM always says to maintain short terse bullet points for AMCAS and that's how her school might like it but USF's adcom members told me to state what I learned and why I did it and what I did not just short terse statements of what I did.

In that respect, I love talking to REL because he has been upfront about where he was an adcom at and where he currently is an adcom at from the very beginning of his posting on here. So you know when he gives his perspectives it is as a Fl. state school adcom vs. say Harvard or a top tier university with very different ways of doing things. Cuz a school like Harvard, for instance, might not take seriously a nontrad postbac who might have had done bad in the past but now doing well but a school like Fl. state schools might overlook a person's past if they've shown that the present is better reflection of their capability.

The problem I have with almost every other adcom member on here is that they want to give their two cents but they don't even want to clarify whether they are at a top 10-20 ranked school vs. state school or what state they are in so people understand their perspective better.

Perspective of a harvard admissions officer is just not the same as some random state school. Perspective of a rural med focused school is just not the same as a school gearing more towards research. See what I mean??

I agree with everything you say, except you're making it seem like this is stuff that should be mentioned in every advice post as opposed to something that every reader, as (as Vihsadas so eloquently put it) "a smart buyer" should be aware of. I'm sure that Florida schools have a different perspective from Harvard, but that seems to be a given to me. At the same time, a Florida school wouldn't reject a 3.9/40 kid because he/she didn't struggle, right? So as a rule, it's better to be the 3.9/40 kid. If you're more of a 3.0/28 kid, you shouldn't be applying to Harvard unless you have some pretty ridiculously compelling story to tell, and even then you shouldn't be expecting to get in. This is a fair generalization to make, right? I'm not in med school yet, and I'm certainly not a member of an adcom, but I feel relatively certain that a 3.0/28 kid I would not have a decent chance at Harvard.

No one should rely on SDN to be the be-all and end-all. Applicants need to do some real research on their own (MSAR and such) and be pretty honest with themselves about their strengths and weaknesses- SDN isn't supposed to make up for that. For that matter, adcoms are made of individual people, so even an adcom member saying he "values" something in an applicant says more about that member's priorities than "the school's". Generalizations must be made, because while it's not unheard of for people with low gpas and low mcat scores to have gotten into harvard, nor is it certainly unheard of for people with stellar stats to have gotten rejected everywhere, they are the EXCEPTION. Uncertainty is implied, and doesn't need to be repeated every single time someone posts advice or opinions.

Say someone with a 2.5 and a 19 says "I really want to go to Hopkins". Should my answer be "well, I am still premed and have recently been accepted to medical school (name of med schools here), so my opinion is that of someone who is not an adcom member nor a medical student, and who has only gone through this process once. I do not know the life you led or the choices that led you to this gpa and MCAT score, I do not know how your essays are and your EC's may very well be stellar enough to make up for your lower-than-average numbers. There are people who have gotten in with your numbers and I am not aware of their specific circumstances. However, it is my personal, humble, and uneducated opinion that you might not get into Hopkins- you might! But you might not".

I'm clearly exaggerating here, but you see what I mean?
 
Honestly, this is an internet forum. No matter how qualified the opinions we may receive and no matter how logical the theories may be presented, they are (for the most part) being given by anonymous people whom we know very little about. Anyone who approaches an environment like this with the expectation of receiving nothing but perfect, tried and tested advice is foolish. Put your BS boots on and sort through the crap like the rest of us.
 
two words: identity theft.
murder him, his family, friends, and anyone close to him, dispose of the bodies. You are him now, choose a school. Good luck with med school.
 
But again when people tell what adcoms say or adcom members like NJBMD says stuff, they don't reveal what school it is coming from. So what may be true of one school is not true of others yet when they post they post such that it is true of every school in the nation and not just their state schools or their particular schools.

People want to maintain their anonymity but want to share info. but you can't do both always. You need to sometimes give the info in full with regards to the school that you are hearing such from because that school might do things differently then some other shcool. You also can't say just because you heard something is done at one school one way that all schools must do things that way because that is false.

As another example of this, LizzyM always says to maintain short terse bullet points for AMCAS and that's how her school might like it but USF's adcom members told me to state what I learned and why I did it and what I did not just short terse statements of what I did.

In that respect, I love talking to REL because he has been upfront about where he was an adcom at and where he currently is an adcom at from the very beginning of his posting on here. So you know when he gives his perspectives it is as a Fl. state school adcom vs. say Harvard or a top tier university with very different ways of doing things. Cuz a school like Harvard, for instance, might not take seriously a nontrad postbac who might have had done bad in the past but now doing well but a school like Fl. state schools might overlook a person's past if they've shown that the present is better reflection of their capability.

The problem I have with almost every other adcom member on here is that they want to give their two cents but they don't even want to clarify whether they are at a top 10-20 ranked school vs. state school or what state they are in so people understand their perspective better.

Perspective of a harvard admissions officer is just not the same as some random state school. Perspective of a rural med focused school is just not the same as a school gearing more towards research. See what I mean??

Well that's the thing though...everyone on here is an individual and even the adcom members are only giving "their" opinion. I would take it one step further and say that LizzyM's opinion about how to approach the activities section probably can't even be generalized to her school. It's her preference, and her opinion. To me, it seems that should be obvious.

I mean, my main point is that: yes, I agree that people can sometimes give advice that seems absolute (but is probably unqualified like most of us are), but that's exactly it. I don't think it needs to be stated that an opinion is qualified or not, because no matter who you are listening to, it's still just an opinion. Just from my own research and the number of adcom members I 've harrassed (lol, read: talked to), I know without a doubt that admissions processes can be extremely different from school to school, and even from adcom member to adcome member. There are some schools that only have one member read one app and that person's decision is the final decision (pre-interview). So it could even be as unlucky as "you got the wrong adcom member to read your app." There is no objective way that students are rated when under review by a school, and it should be obvious that this is the case (IMHO). By extension, it means that the advice we get on here is largely generalization, speculation, and the opinions that we hear will never be applicable to every situation. This applies not only to opinions about an applicant's chances, but also to any other opinion you might hear on the internet. I mean, take this thread for example:

The OP posted 4 sentences about someone who is completely anonymous and who none of us have ever met, talked to, know anything about, or even by association have any ties to. Heck, the person in question doesn't even post on SDN itself! Yet, so many members have come to harsh and definitive conclusions about this unknown person. Conclusions ranging from how disrespectful he/she is, to their fitness as a physician. I mean, it's absolutely insane to even think that one could make a claim about somone's professionalism or their competence as a physician through reading 4 sentences written by yet another anonymous person about that person. But hey, these types of responses are completely expected from the internet, and in fact, I would go so far to say that it is people's right to have whatever opinion they wish. So adcom members who post on SDN, or medical students, or whatever fall to the same flaws. They are on an Adcom, sure, so yes they have somewhat of better perspective. But that's just it: it's still a perspective, only one person's perspective; nothing more, nothing less.

We're all intelligent people. Therefore, I hold noone else responsible for the problems with SDN than the people that blindly follow the advice. A good case in point: LizzyM said it was better to use bullet point for Activities. I disagreed with that, and did not take that advice. I kept everything concise, and I actually wrote some of my activities in different styles depending on the activity. I mean, what matters is being mindful enough not to be one of the sheep. Make your own choices, take SDN for what it is, and realize that while it has it's problems, it clearly has its advantages. It's our job to take the absolutism for what it is...

Fair enough. I think it's going to be impossible though, given what the OP was about.

My main point ties into a broader problem that physicians have always struggled with, from my limited perspective. When you believe so strongly in a system as some people on this forum do...you make those absolute statements that I was referring to earlier. In other words - you are absolutely sure that plan X will work and absolutely sure that plan Y won't work. In my opinion, such a person is shouldering immense responsibility and undeserved authority. This is exactly the sort of thing doctors are supposed to stay AWAY from.

It's like the cancer patient who has 3 weeks to live and ends up living for another 10 years. Atypical? Yes. A miracle? Probably. Predictable? No. The fact is that science never had all the answers, and is at best only a rough guide to what can be understood and predicted. Thus is the science of admissions - and I think people should take it as such. To this end - people should always do everything they can on their part. To those of you who are planning on applying - do not leave any room for regret. Get the best MCAT score you can, get the best GPA you can. I will tell you from experience that there is no worse experience than regretting laziness on your part. BUT - to those of you who are applying and feeling worried - never lose hope (especially on account of what some of these 'experts' might tell you). Hope will get you farther than you can imagine (but make sure you did everything on your part. If you had all the time in the world, but were lazy, and ended up with a 18 MCAT or a 25 MCAT - hope will do nothing for you).

You and I actually think very similarly on this point, and probably approached the application process with a startingly similar mantra. One thing I have always held extremely close since I've gone down this path is: "There are only so many things in your life that you have some level of control over. If you do not do everything in your power to ensure that you have affected those factors to give yourself the best chance possible, you will end up being filled with regret. This is because, at the end of the day, someone else is going to be making the decision about you. So, from this exact point forward, do not give those people even the smallest reason to doubt you. If you do, then it's on you."

Thanks, V. But this is precisely why I wrote that last paragraph, blaming people who do not take SDN posts for what they are. I still think that some posters especially "respected" ones (too often by virtue of the number of their posts) don't make it clear that their own scope is very limited. It is their fault when they give people the impression that what they are stating applies in a broad sense - when in fact they are just as ignorant as the rest of us. What one ad-com sees in an applicant, a hundred others may not see.

Well, there are some things that do apply in a broad sense, and the blanket statements (say about GPA or low MCAT or whatever) largely do hold true. I mean, there are objective ways of verifying that (MSAR). On this particular point, sure it's pompous to say, "You will never get into medical school with a sub-3.0", but it's equally inane to take that advice word for word and to believe that it's completely true. We should all be aware enough to realize that's not the case. You're frustrated with some of the posts, I get that, and I agree...but there it is, it's in your power to listen to the posts you want to, and to try and ignore the ones that aren't. There's a level of control that you have there as well.
 
Really, genius? And what do you attribute our PRESENT collapsed bridges and fatal airplane crashes to? Engineers not graduating with degrees from top institutions? It couldn't be grade inflation, flawed admissions, or general incompetence? It's amazing the way some of you people think - probably great material for a psychiatry case study.
Your post makes no sense at all. You don't need a psychiatry case study to figure out that you're pretty arrogant and egotistical. I never said there never would be anymore accidents if people thought contrary to that "mentality". There would be fewer accidents with better engineers. Is that such a hard concept to grasp?

"You have 4 acceptances and you get to be a doctor no matter what school you go to. That fact should be more than enough to make you happy and I don't really understand why some people are only hung up on one school and can't appreciate what they already have. You could easily only have 1 acceptance or even none."
What does this mean to you? Some people seek happiness in the form of the pursuit of perfection. The pursuit of perfection also leads to pretty good results in the real world. It's not about how many acceptances you have but the right acceptance you need/want. So in the case of engineering, an engineer shouldn't be happy that he or she finished a tough math class with a C. He or she should try to understand perfectly or at least attempt to. You graduate with straight Cs and you still get to be an engineer, at least at most 4 years.

It's almost the same idea as the MD/DO "you're going to be a physician either way." This then forces DO schools to have outrageous down payments for seats because people love to use them as means to their own ends.
 
Your post makes no sense at all. You don't need a psychiatry case study to figure out that you're pretty arrogant and egotistical. I never said there never would be anymore accidents if people thought contrary to that "mentality". There would be fewer accidents with better engineers. Is that such a hard concept to grasp?

"You have 4 acceptances and you get to be a doctor no matter what school you go to. That fact should be more than enough to make you happy and I don't really understand why some people are only hung up on one school and can't appreciate what they already have. You could easily only have 1 acceptance or even none."
What does this mean to you? Some people seek happiness in the form of the pursuit of perfection. The pursuit of perfection also leads to pretty good results in the real world. It's not about how many acceptances you have but the right acceptance you need/want. So in the case of engineering, an engineer shouldn't be happy that he or she finished a tough math class with a C. He or she should try to understand perfectly or at least attempt to. You graduate with straight Cs and you still get to be an engineer, at least at most 4 years.

It's almost the same idea as the MD/DO "you're going to be a physician either way." This then forces DO schools to have outrageous down payments for seats because people love to use them as means to their own ends.

Actually, the only person coming off as arrogant and egotistical is you. Your posts make no sense here and you're just twisting the points that I'm making. No one is talking about low tier schools that are not up to some people's standards. These people have been accepted to top tier schools so I'd hardly compare that to an engineer being happy that they're getting C's. 🙄

Oh yeah, I also love how you think a thread is garbage, yet you continue to post in it.

Things that make you go hmmm...hypocritical much? http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=515571

You're going back on my ignore list because it's obvious you are just arguing for the sake of arguing and have nothing of substance to say.
 
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It's almost the same idea as the MD/DO "you're going to be a physician either way." This then forces DO schools to have outrageous down payments for seats because people love to use them as means to their own ends.

What do you mean by this? I'm a little confused...
 
What do you mean by this? I'm a little confused...

I think he meant that the 'means' are attending a DO school and the 'ends' is becoming a physician. strangely similar to students who go to MD schools to become physicians....🙄
 
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Everyone, please remember that insulting other members is a violation of our TOS. We encourage open discussion, but when opinions start to get heated, please state your opinion on the topic subject, and avoid attacking other members.

Remember to use the handy dandy
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Report Post button to let the forum moderators know when there is a problem post so that they may address any problems as early as possible, and if anyone's posts are particularly irritating to you. make use of the Ignore Function (instructions are in the "How to Beat a Troll Senseless" sticky) and avoid allowing them to bait you into violating our TOS.

Sorry, I just got irritated by the persistent personal attacks on me, but I've now made use of that function for good.
 
Well that's the thing though...everyone on here is an individual and even the adcom members are only giving "their" opinion. I would take it one step further and say that LizzyM's opinion about how to approach the activities section probably can't even be generalized to her school. It's her preference, and her opinion. To me, it seems that should be obvious.

I mean, my main point is that: yes, I agree that people can sometimes give advice that seems absolute (but is probably unqualified like most of us are), but that's exactly it. I don't think it needs to be stated that an opinion is qualified or not, because no matter who you are listening to, it's still just an opinion. Just from my own research and the number of adcom members I 've harrassed (lol, read: talked to), I know without a doubt that admissions processes can be extremely different from school to school, and even from adcom member to adcome member. There are some schools that only have one member read one app and that person's decision is the final decision (pre-interview). So it could even be as unlucky as "you got the wrong adcom member to read your app." There is no objective way that students are rated when under review by a school, and it should be obvious that this is the case (IMHO). By extension, it means that the advice we get on here is largely generalization, speculation, and the opinions that we hear will never be applicable to every situation. This applies not only to opinions about an applicant's chances, but also to any other opinion you might hear on the internet. I mean, take this thread for example:

The OP posted 4 sentences about someone who is completely anonymous and who none of us have ever met, talked to, know anything about, or even by association have any ties to. Heck, the person in question doesn't even post on SDN itself! Yet, so many members have come to harsh and definitive conclusions about this unknown person. Conclusions ranging from how disrespectful he/she is, to their fitness as a physician. I mean, it's absolutely insane to even think that one could make a claim about somone's professionalism or their competence as a physician through reading 4 sentences written by yet another anonymous person about that person. But hey, these types of responses are completely expected from the internet, and in fact, I would go so far to say that it is people's right to have whatever opinion they wish. So adcom members who post on SDN, or medical students, or whatever fall to the same flaws. They are on an Adcom, sure, so yes they have somewhat of better perspective. But that's just it: it's still a perspective, only one person's perspective; nothing more, nothing less.

We're all intelligent people. Therefore, I hold noone else responsible for the problems with SDN than the people that blindly follow the advice. A good case in point: LizzyM said it was better to use bullet point for Activities. I disagreed with that, and did not take that advice. I kept everything concise, and I actually wrote some of my activities in different styles depending on the activity. I mean, what matters is being mindful enough not to be one of the sheep. Make your own choices, take SDN for what it is, and realize that while it has it's problems, it clearly has its advantages. It's our job to take the absolutism for what it is...



You and I actually think very similarly on this point, and probably approached the application process with a startingly similar mantra. One thing I have always held extremely close since I've gone down this path is: "There are only so many things in your life that you have some level of control over. If you do not do everything in your power to ensure that you have affected those factors to give yourself the best chance possible, you will end up being filled with regret. This is because, at the end of the day, someone else is going to be making the decision about you. So, from this exact point forward, do not give those people even the smallest reason to doubt you. If you do, then it's on you."



Well, there are some things that do apply in a broad sense, and the blanket statements (say about GPA or low MCAT or whatever) largely do hold true. I mean, there are objective ways of verifying that (MSAR). On this particular point, sure it's pompous to say, "You will never get into medical school with a sub-3.0", but it's equally inane to take that advice word for word and to believe that it's completely true. We should all be aware enough to realize that's not the case. You're frustrated with some of the posts, I get that, and I agree...but there it is, it's in your power to listen to the posts you want to, and to try and ignore the ones that aren't. There's a level of control that you have there as well.


Ok I see your point now. Good post. 🙂
 
I agree with everything you say, except you're making it seem like this is stuff that should be mentioned in every advice post as opposed to something that every reader, as (as Vihsadas so eloquently put it) "a smart buyer" should be aware of. I'm sure that Florida schools have a different perspective from Harvard, but that seems to be a given to me. At the same time, a Florida school wouldn't reject a 3.9/40 kid because he/she didn't struggle, right? So as a rule, it's better to be the 3.9/40 kid. If you're more of a 3.0/28 kid, you shouldn't be applying to Harvard unless you have some pretty ridiculously compelling story to tell, and even then you shouldn't be expecting to get in. This is a fair generalization to make, right? I'm not in med school yet, and I'm certainly not a member of an adcom, but I feel relatively certain that a 3.0/28 kid I would not have a decent chance at Harvard.

No one should rely on SDN to be the be-all and end-all. Applicants need to do some real research on their own (MSAR and such) and be pretty honest with themselves about their strengths and weaknesses- SDN isn't supposed to make up for that. For that matter, adcoms are made of individual people, so even an adcom member saying he "values" something in an applicant says more about that member's priorities than "the school's". Generalizations must be made, because while it's not unheard of for people with low gpas and low mcat scores to have gotten into harvard, nor is it certainly unheard of for people with stellar stats to have gotten rejected everywhere, they are the EXCEPTION. Uncertainty is implied, and doesn't need to be repeated every single time someone posts advice or opinions.

Say someone with a 2.5 and a 19 says "I really want to go to Hopkins". Should my answer be "well, I am still premed and have recently been accepted to medical school (name of med schools here), so my opinion is that of someone who is not an adcom member nor a medical student, and who has only gone through this process once. I do not know the life you led or the choices that led you to this gpa and MCAT score, I do not know how your essays are and your EC's may very well be stellar enough to make up for your lower-than-average numbers. There are people who have gotten in with your numbers and I am not aware of their specific circumstances. However, it is my personal, humble, and uneducated opinion that you might not get into Hopkins- you might! But you might not".

I'm clearly exaggerating here, but you see what I mean?


I'm not disagreeing with you. And luckily I'm not naive that I take everything on here seriously. The only reason for my posts were to try to illustrate the point that Food was making. I felt that people were missing the point. But we are not in fact off the same page with this. I don't deny the truth you speak. But no I don't disagree and I see what you are saying and what Vihasadas is saying in saying that even if they present it as absolute it is just their opinion. I just find it sad that there are people out there who read these things and don't see the point you are making so clearly as you and I, and I think Food was trying to write from the point of view of those people.

Luckily I know who to contact when I want a second opinion. 🙂


That said on to the original topic of this thread. I feel that no matter how many acceptences a person has, there will always be something to complain about unless you did EDP to your first choice school.

Why? Simple example. You get a 32 on the MCAT and a friend gets a 39, but that friend is one point from a 40. You feel they are ridiculous. But fact is it is still not a perfect score so they are going to feel they could've done better. That's just life.

Well the same thing with acceptances. People feel they worked so hard and put hopes on their dream schools be it a low/mid tier state school or an ivy league school or a top tier state school somewhere. So even if they get in one school they may still not be satisfied.

Also once you start getting multiple acceptances but haven't got 100% acceptances you always feel that if you got multiple acceptances from these other schools why didn't you get from yet other schools you applied to.

Keep in mind that whether you have struggling grades/MCAT or a 4.0 and 45T MCAT, and whether you are a true superstar of this process or average applicant, you will all get nervous and what not through this process. I've seen it often on this website and think its foolish that people call these people jerks or show offs for feeling nervous just because they have higher numbers or higher in something that those calling them out don't have. I mean even a fam. friend that got 4 acceptances on the first day of acceptances told me he had nightmares about the process and used to get super nervous when checking his email. This process gets the best of all of us. Just accept it for what it is and deal.
 
Vishades provided a good response but I'd like to elaborate on a couple of points. First, remember that faculty members are not used to starting every sentence with IMHO or even "At my school". On ward rounds, I don't tell the team {completely made up example coming up here....😛} "In my opinion, based on my med school training at Hopkins and my residency and fellowship at Harvard, we should treat irritable bowel syndrome with daily enemas." It doesn't seem reasonable to believe that readers here do not understand that our opinion is our opinion without saying those words every time. Nor does it mean, as in this example, that we are not totally clueless.🙄

The example of the bullet point activities however, brings up, {in my humble opinion, based on my experiences and only my experiences,} another point. That is, SDNers need to recognize that the answers to questions changes with time. Initially, when the activity description length was changed, I would have advised very short responses. However, {from what I've seen and note that only my own experience is reflected in this comment} it appears this year that applicants are increasingly writing mini-essays and using some of these to add useful supporting information. Therefore {I recommend, but this could be very different for every other adcom member both at my school and elsewhere}, to balance both respect for the adcom members time and ability to sort through a long application, use bullet points for some activities but a mini-essay for one or two {some of my colleagues might say more, but I have a short attention span} of the most important activities.

The point here is that the standard has changed over the last year or two and what was solid advice may have changed as the process changes. Advice is not static and needs to be considered in that regard.
 
Vishades provided a good response but I'd like to elaborate on a couple of points. First, remember that faculty members are not used to starting every sentence with IMHO or even "At my school". On ward rounds, I don't tell the team {completely made up example coming up here....😛} "In my opinion, based on my med school training at Hopkins and my residency and fellowship at Harvard, we should treat irritable bowel syndrome with daily enemas." It doesn't seem reasonable to believe that readers here do not understand that our opinion is our opinion without saying those words every time. Nor does it mean, as in this example, that we are not totally clueless.🙄

The example of the bullet point activities however, brings up, {in my humble opinion, based on my experiences and only my experiences,} another point. That is, SDNers need to recognize that the answers to questions changes with time. Initially, when the activity description length was changed, I would have advised very short responses. However, {from what I've seen and note that only my own experience is reflected in this comment} it appears this year that applicants are increasingly writing mini-essays and using some of these to add useful supporting information. Therefore {I recommend, but this could be very different for every other adcom member both at my school and elsewhere}, to balance both respect for the adcom members time and ability to sort through a long application, use bullet points for some activities but a mini-essay for one or two {some of my colleagues might say more, but I have a short attention span} of the most important activities.

The point here is that the standard has changed over the last year or two and what was solid advice may have changed as the process changes. Advice is not static and needs to be considered in that regard.

You know - what's funny about this is that this cycle I actually wrote 2-3 sentences for each of my activities on AMCAS. I was in an enormous rush to finish the primary ASAP, before the end of June. I'm starting to think that a lack of elaboration on my part is causing the adcoms to think that I was incredibly brief because the activities were not meaningful. Kind of sucks because I'm not getting interviews.
 
You know - what's funny about this is that this cycle I actually wrote 2-3 sentences for each of my activities on AMCAS. I was in an enormous rush to finish the primary ASAP, before the end of June. I'm starting to think that a lack of elaboration on my part is causing the adcoms to think that I was incredibly brief because the activities were not meaningful. Kind of sucks because I'm not getting interviews.

Again, I'll reiterate. I was just using the LizzyM example or the Law2doc and NJBMD examples as examples to illustrate a larger point. Perhaps we can forget the specific examples at hand remember that they are just examples I was using to show a point that people's opinions on adcoms and off adcoms very from person to person and not all is absolute as many on these boards will do every effort to present themselves and their opinions. Again, for those like me if you don't start with IMHO or IMO I know its just an opinion. Newbies and people who are not seasoned SDN posters or lurkers often however sometimes take such words to be absolute and that's where SDN sometimes causes problems for people. You cannot use the example of wards cuz that is a different situation and is like comparing apples and oranges.


But why we are still continuing this conversation when one of the mods have already stated that we need to get back on topic is beyond me. I was just trying to point out what Food was trying to say in my initial posts and not start debates about specific posts. Those specific posts were just examples to illustrate a larger point and if we can leave it at that and get back on topic that would be fabulous.
 
Realistically - people with MCAT scores of 18 make it in - one way or another.

"Realistically"???

I'm guessing that that was a typo, and you meant a 28. You can't get in to a US allopathic school with an 18, and you probably can't get into a top-tier US osteopathic school with an 18.

At least for the allopathic schools, most (if not all) have a cutoff MCAT score. For my school, I know that the cutoff is a 24 - a minimum of 8 in each section.

While I agree with you that SDN is sometimes like watching the blind leading the blind, I don't believe that SDNers are wrong about EVERYTHING.

Wow some of you people are riddled with jealousy and spite.

🙄 The person whose comment you responded to (dragonfly) is a FELLOW - that means that he/she is done with residency. I doubt that dragonfly is "riddled with jealousy and spite" at this stage. :laugh:

First, remember that faculty members are not used to starting every sentence with IMHO or even "At my school". On ward rounds, I don't tell the team {completely made up example coming up here....😛} "In my opinion, based on my med school training at Hopkins and my residency and fellowship at Harvard, we should treat irritable bowel syndrome with daily enemas." It doesn't seem reasonable to believe that readers here do not understand that our opinion is our opinion without saying those words every time. Nor does it mean, as in this example, that we are not totally clueless.🙄

The example of the bullet point activities however, brings up, {in my humble opinion, based on my experiences and only my experiences,} another point. That is, SDNers need to recognize that the answers to questions changes with time. Initially, when the activity description length was changed, I would have advised very short responses. However, {from what I've seen and note that only my own experience is reflected in this comment} it appears this year that applicants are increasingly writing mini-essays and using some of these to add useful supporting information. Therefore {I recommend, but this could be very different for every other adcom member both at my school and elsewhere}, to balance both respect for the adcom members time and ability to sort through a long application, use bullet points for some activities but a mini-essay for one or two {some of my colleagues might say more, but I have a short attention span} of the most important activities.

The point here is that the standard has changed over the last year or two and what was solid advice may have changed as the process changes. Advice is not static and needs to be considered in that regard.

👍👍👍
 
"Realistically"???

I'm guessing that that was a typo, and you meant a 28. You can't get in to a US allopathic school with an 18, and you probably can't get into a top-tier US osteopathic school with an 18.

At least for the allopathic schools, most (if not all) have a cutoff MCAT score. For my school, I know that the cutoff is a 24 - a minimum of 8 in each section.

While I agree with you that SDN is sometimes like watching the blind leading the blind, I don't believe that SDNers are wrong about EVERYTHING.



🙄 The person whose comment you responded to (dragonfly) is a FELLOW - that means that he/she is done with residency. I doubt that dragonfly is "riddled with jealousy and spite" at this stage. :laugh:



👍👍👍


I caught that typo. I think actually what they meant to say was Realistically someone with an 18 can't get into an MD school. But I just assumed it was a typo. I agree with you that the comment towards Dragonfly was out of line for someone who is done with undergrad, medical school, and residency, and far closer to reaching their ultimate goal then most of the rest of us posting on this thread.
 
Your friend's attitude disgusts me. Everyone here has worked hard and some of us, including myself, can't even get one acceptance despite being highly qualified.

"I'm the best and UCLA doesn't want meeeee! Whaaaaaa!"

Your friend needs to grow up, and perhaps chalk it up to randomness in the process.

Sounds like you have your head on straight though, CafeMed, so that's good.
 
Your friend's attitude disgusts me. Everyone here has worked hard and some of us, including myself, can't even get one acceptance despite being highly qualified.

"I'm the best and UCLA doesn't want meeeee! Whaaaaaa!"

Your friend needs to grow up, and perhaps chalk it up to randomness in the process.

Sounds like you have your head on straight though, CafeMed, so that's good.

Again, like you said everyone has worked hard. And that feeling that you've worked hard always makes you feel that you could have gotten in somewhere you didn't even if you've gotten acceptances elsewhere. We don't know this guy so why are we picking on him??

Its not his fault that you haven't gotten accepted yet anywhere. So why allow his success to make you sick?? I don't believe in being jealous because it doesn't do much to change your situation. It just makes you bitter.
 
Again, like you said everyone has worked hard. And that feeling that you've worked hard always makes you feel that you could have gotten in somewhere you didn't even if you've gotten acceptances elsewhere. We don't know this guy so why are we picking on him??

Its not his fault that you haven't gotten accepted yet anywhere. So why allow his success to make you sick?? I don't believe in being jealous because it doesn't do much to change your situation. It just makes you bitter.

All I'm saying is that it is reasonable for me to be aggravated about getting zero acceptances. It is unreasonable for this guy, whoever he is, to think that he is good enough to get in EVERYWHERE when people who are similarly qualified are not getting in ANYWHERE. He should be happy with what he has, which is a chance to CHOOSE from several medical schools. Many people, perhaps myself included, are not even going to get an opportunity to go to medical school next year.
 
I think there is nothing wrong with the OP's friend being disappointed, even if it does indicate that some additional maturation is needed (we are all human, after all). Failures and let-downs are sometimes no less painful, even when there are successes that seemingly "counter" them.

What I do believe to be unreasonable, however, is how he has handled his feelings regarding said disappointment. He should never have openly complained to the OP, and at least shown him some respect by using tact in his presentation. Hopefully, as he goes through medical school and meets a wide variety of different people (in particular, his patients), he'll begin to realize that - in climbing the ladder of life - there are more places to look than just up at the feet of those who are higher. A strong dose of context is sometimes all that is needed to elucidate someone's incredibly fortunate position.
 
I hope you've received the venting that you needed CafeMed, there are a very large number of ungrateful people out there, you should just ignore them. Life will knock them on their ass, they'll learn how to be appreciative soon enough.
 
I think there is nothing wrong with the OP's friend being disappointed, even if it does indicate that some additional maturation is needed (we are all human, after all). Failures and let-downs are sometimes no less painful, even when there are successes that seemingly "counter" them.

What I do believe to be unreasonable, however, is how he has handled his feelings regarding said disappointment. He should never have openly complained to the OP, and at least shown him some respect by using tact in his presentation. Hopefully, as he goes through medical school and meets a wide variety of different people (in particular, his patients), he'll begin to realize that - in climbing the ladder of life - there are more places to look than just up at the feet of those who are higher. A strong dose of context is sometimes all that is needed to elucidate someone's incredibly fortunate position.


Fact is there will always be people in medical school like the perso the OP described. I think it is all of us who need to learn how to deal with it.

In fact, I'd say if anything the complaining only gets worse as people grow older. i've seen this from personal experiences around several.
 
Look - that's just one of the types of people in this world...and on this forum. People who get acceptances but keep badgering anyone who will hear them about how their favorite school won't accept them.
We always want what we can't have
The worst part is - a few of the mods on here which...curiously include current medical students...serve no function other than to speculate, and then present it as though it is some sort of definitive verdict, even if that is not their intention.
This is so funny, and so true. . . it's like mini Judge Judy's running aroun d in blog-land.




Now to the OP, you said your friend contacted UCLA multiple times to see what's going on with his app. What have they told him?? Just curious.
 
I never understood people crying over their 'dream schools' in medicine. A medical school is a medical school is a medical school. You learn everything relevant to a specialty in residency programs. The medical school you attend has very little affect on which residency you can match into. Someone crying about being accepted to seven schools and not his 'dream school' should be slapped in the face and forced to work in a factory 60 hours a week so he can see what it's like working in the real world, and not being a crybaby. I would happy to be accepted to any medical school at all!
 
I hope you've received the venting that you needed CafeMed, there are a very large number of ungrateful people out there, you should just ignore them. Life will knock them on their ass, they'll learn how to be appreciative soon enough.

Yep, got it out of my system now. 😀 Sometimes this whole damn process just gets extremely overwhelming and stressful that you just gotta let some steam off.

Now to the OP, you said your friend contacted UCLA multiple times to see what's going on with his app. What have they told him?? Just curious.

The first few times, they said that no decision had been reached on his file yet and the last time he called, they said he should hear back in early Jan. But then, UCLA, hasn't been known to be too accurate with their info.
 
I never understood people crying over their 'dream schools' in medicine. A medical school is a medical school is a medical school. You learn everything relevant to a specialty in residency programs. The medical school you attend has very little affect on which residency you can match into. Someone crying about being accepted to seven schools and not his 'dream school' should be slapped in the face and forced to work in a factory 60 hours a week so he can see what it's like working in the real world, and not being a crybaby. I would happy to be accepted to any medical school at all!

To a degree I disagree with this. If you want to go into research and academia, then a bigger research powerhouse school might be a better fit. And if you are more interested in rural medicine and only primary care then a school that focuses more on rural health might be a bigger deal.

Or in another example people sometimes say being in a school in a city where you want to do residency sometimes helps you forge connections.

And yet for others I tend to think it is family or other reasons that keep people wanting to go to a given school.

Also, keep in mind the curricula style, location, class size differences, etc. make a big difference for some people.

But to another degree I agree with you in terms of the fact that all will get to the ultimate goal of becoming a physician or surgeon.
 
You know - what's funny about this is that this cycle I actually wrote 2-3 sentences for each of my activities on AMCAS. I was in an enormous rush to finish the primary ASAP, before the end of June. I'm starting to think that a lack of elaboration on my part is causing the adcoms to think that I was incredibly brief because the activities were not meaningful. Kind of sucks because I'm not getting interviews.

(Going totally off topic here), I erred on the side of saying too much rather than too little. I think the object of each little blurb is to 'paint a picture' in as few words as possible. So, don't ignore the details, just write them in succinctly and don't give them any more weight than they appear to deserve.

I think you just have to use your own judgment about what you decide to put on your AMCAS app.

Good luck, Food!
 
(Going totally off topic here), I erred on the side of saying too much rather than too little. I think the object of each little blurb is to 'paint a picture' in as few words as possible. So, don't ignore the details, just write them in succinctly and don't give them any more weight than they appear to deserve.

I think you just have to use your own judgment about what you decide to put on your AMCAS app.

Good luck, Food!

Off-topic again: I did the exact same thing as Food (2-3 bullet points, not even sentences) on my AMCAS ECs section and I am interviewing all over the place. I just want to point out what has been stressed by food et al in this thread and other places: everybody's experience is different and what one person thinks is gospel could very well turn out to be trash for you.

PS: my thought process for filling those boys out was that if I am brief and only giving "enticing" info then they will be intrigued and want to sit me down in an interview to talk more about my activities. Seems like it worked.
 
Off-topic again: I did the exact same thing as Food (2-3 bullet points, not even sentences) on my AMCAS ECs section and I am interviewing all over the place. I just want to point out what has been stressed by food et al in this thread and other places: everybody's experience is different and what one person thinks is gospel could very well turn out to be trash for you.

PS: my thought process for filling those boys out was that if I am brief and only giving "enticing" info then they will be intrigued and want to sit me down in an interview to talk more about my activities. Seems like it worked.

That was my approach last year. I did bullet points for each activity.

I can't even read a paragraph long post on here. I can't imagine trying to make it through a million apps with manuscripts about organic chemistry TA experience or shadowing.
 
Off-topic again: I did the exact same thing as Food (2-3 bullet points, not even sentences) on my AMCAS ECs section and I am interviewing all over the place. I just want to point out what has been stressed by food et al in this thread and other places: everybody's experience is different and what one person thinks is gospel could very well turn out to be trash for you.

PS: my thought process for filling those boys out was that if I am brief and only giving "enticing" info then they will be intrigued and want to sit me down in an interview to talk more about my activities. Seems like it worked.

That was my approach last year. I did bullet points for each activity.

I can't even read a paragraph long post on here. I can't imagine trying to make it through a million apps with manuscripts about organic chemistry TA experience or shadowing.
👍 I did the same and it worked just fine for me...
 
I would have preferred to do bullet points, but I guess I hestitated because I didn't see that "bullet points" was an option. I know LizzyM recommends them, but...well, yeah, I'm weird about formatting directions like that.

But hey, looks like all of our methods worked, right? 👍
 
I wrote in sentence/paragraph form, sort of like mini-essays. I got a few invites, but not as many as I had hoped for... Ultimately, I'm sure the formatting isn't as important as the message. I would imagine some people have found success with each approach.
 
what i took from this is the following:

even if the OP's friend had only been accepted at ONE school, he would still be complaining about UCLA till the bitter end. This has nothing to do with seven acceptances. This has to do with one, UCLA. The rest are just insurance for his grand plan. Even if he got into every school on his list it would bug him to death.

i cant wait to see this guy deal with failure at the level of patient care.
 
I caught that typo. I think actually what they meant to say was Realistically someone with an 18 can't get into an MD school. But I just assumed it was a typo. I agree with you that the comment towards Dragonfly was out of line for someone who is done with undergrad, medical school, and residency, and far closer to reaching their ultimate goal then most of the rest of us posting on this thread.

Haha, my apologies for being so painfully ambiguous that it resulted in a pretty inaccurate statement.

What I meant to say was...In reality, somebodywith an 18 MCAT makes it into a U.S. allopathic med-school, if not every year, then once every two years. I know this is very rare, but it happens. The point here being that there are atypical cases, and sometimes they defy the most common logic. You always hear stuff about admissions every cycle that makes your head scratch...and we will continue hearing these types of stories for many years to come.
 
I wrote in sentence/paragraph form, sort of like mini-essays. I got a few invites, but not as many as I had hoped for... Ultimately, I'm sure the formatting isn't as important as the message. I would imagine some people have found success with each approach.

Honestly, with a 3.9+ and a 39 MCAT, I have no idea what these med-schools want from you. Were you missing one of the major ECs? (research, volunteering, shadowing)

I mean if these med-schools are disappointing you and you've got a 3.9+/39...what hope does a guy like me have. Also, how late in the cycle did you have to apply? Damnit, it makes no sense.
 
Honestly, with a 3.9+ and a 39 MCAT, I have no idea what these med-schools want from you. Were you missing one of the major ECs? (research, volunteering, shadowing)

I mean if these med-schools are disappointing you and you've got a 3.9+/39...what hope does a guy like me have. Also, how late in the cycle did you have to apply? Damnit, it makes no sense.

Thanks Food, your sentiments make me feel better lol. I had all my secondaries submitted by mid-July with the exception of CWRU/Cleveland Clinic and U of Michigan, which I added a few weeks ago. I was perhaps weak in shadowing/volunteering, but I was really strong in research and thought it would carry me through. Maybe my LORs weren't as strong as I expected them to be when I asked for them... All I know is that I've worked hard, as we all have, and I'm just hoping for an opportunity to go to school anywhere next year. I actually made a thread with my activities and stats, asking for advice:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=587563

Edit: BTW Food, I can't believe you aren't getting more interviews; you'd think that the academics (a high GPA, MCAT, or both) would overshadow other aspects in admissions decisions in some cases. It takes a lot of dedication to do well academically, while anyone can shadow a physician regardless of their aptitude for medicine. No offense to anyone. Just my opinion.

Good luck to everyone.

More "on topic" for this thread- I would be thrilled with one acceptance, regardless of the school.
 
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Wow some of you people are riddled with jealousy and spite. Perhaps this kid worked his nuts off in college to build a god-like application so that he could solidify his spot at UCLA, but things haven't worked out yet. His "golden opportunities" were EARNED. It's not like he stumbled ass-backwards onto seven acceptances and started crying because one of them wasn't UCLA.

I think the real problem is the OP and many of you posting in this thread. Do you guys feel jealous that you don't have seven acceptances? Seems like it. The reason I defend the kid in the OP is because I am in the EXACT same situation--I have four acceptances from solid programs but all I want is an acceptance from UCLA. Does I show a "lack of maturity" if I stil don't have an acceptance from my top spot? Of course not and you sir need to be kicked in the balls for suggesting so.
Brag-o-lot? :troll:
PS. Congrats on the acceptances

Look - that's just one of the types of people in this world...and on this forum. People who get acceptances but keep badgering anyone who will hear them about how their favorite school won't accept them.

Then there are people who are already in medical school and try to "help" pre-meds - but mainly do this by reducing everyone's hopes. Note this is not the same as being "realistic". Realistically - people with MCAT scores of 18 make it in - one way or another. Mostly though on this forum - current medical students are generally helpful and supportive.

Then there are people like you and me - who honestly don't care about competing with others for top spots - we just want to go to medical school at an accredited U.S. school, or whatever category we are aiming for. Now - people will write posts in which they flame me for saying this - but what purpose is there in obsessing about going to a particular school - if you have already interviewed, done everything you can, and already have acceptances at other top schools in the bag? Once you're in med school, you're more or less at a level field with everyone else. It's extremely short-sighted at best.

So my advice would be to not care about them or the people telling you "helpful" things about your stats that really amount to them crushing your hopes with subjective rules about admissions. If it were possible to judge a candidate's appropriateness for a medical program over the internet, there would be no need for face-to-face interviews. And always remember that there are other normal people who are also patiently waiting for whatever comes their way.

Some people really need the attention, others lack the consideration, and other have an obsessive personality and obsess over a school for no rhyme or reason.

Anyway, that is besides the point. (I have not gotten acceptances as of today) Although I would be satisfied with any acceptance, I would not necessarily settle for just any old acceptance. That's because, provided all else is equal, I would prefer to matriculate at the medical school that is closer to home. Second, if the schools where I get A's are not equal, I would prefer to go to the school that emphasizes research the most.

Cafemed's friend is annoying not because he is holding several A's and still wants another; he is annoying because he complains so much even though he is well off. The fact is, that people who do not settle after getting acceptance are doing what medical schools want you to do: ask yourself "why them".
 
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