nursing vs medical school

[not so calm now]

Spend some time investigating the field you're interested in before you devote your time, money, and energy pursuing it.

Seems to me that's just what he/she's doing here....

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[Kaustikos]

If one is deciding between becoming a primary care doctor and becoming a nurse there are many things in favor of being an RN. The gap in salaries between RNs and PCP is not that huge (especially critical care). When you take into account that most RNs work three 12 hour shifts a week vs a primary care doc working at least 50 hours with little flexibility in the schedule the nurse has a big advantage.

Too true. And nursing school is loads cheaper

 

[SireSpanky]

There is no "prestige" associated with being a physician. If the prestige factor is your motivation for a career in medicine, you are going to be pretty disappointed.

Nursing and medicine are two totally different entities. It's like asking would you rather be an airplane fueler or an airline pilot? They both work at the airport around planes but these are two totally different professions. I had absolutely NO interest in nursing and thus did not want to become a nurse. I had tons of interest in medicine and thus, I became a surgeon.

I disagree. In rural towns where hospitals don't have anesth. MDs, CRNAs will completely run the show. Show me an airplane fueler who can hop in an fly the plane if there is no pilot.

 

[Rabbit36]

Keep in mind that a lot of medicine past med school is lather, rinse, repeat. Not necessarily endless intellectual challenge. That said, the opportunities to light up your little brain are endless if you make an effort to do so.

I agree that nursing and medical school are two completely different paths. I think PA vs. med school might be more appropriate for people in a pre-allo forum. It would probably yield some more thoughtful responses than 'I never wanted to be a nurse so I didn't go into nursing'.

 

[ChemEngMD]

Wrong. No nursing program I have ever heard of requires organic chemistry, only a year of general chemistry.

At my University they are required one semester of Gen Chem and one semester of Organic Chem...

 

[teddybear]

At my University they are required one semester of Gen Chem and one semester of Organic Chem...

Interesting.

 

[fahimaz7]

Here's a BSN core requirement list at MCG in Georgia.

School of Nursing Core Curriculum

Courses to Take the First Two Years
The courses required to graduate from MCG comprise a core curriculum divided into six categories (Areas A-F). The options for completing these prerequisites for transfer to MCG are listed below.
A. Essential Skills*

9 semester hours

* English Composition I (3 hours)
* English Composition II-Literature based (3 hours)
* College Algebra, Mathematical Modeling, Trigonometry, Pre-calculus or Calculus (3 hours)

B. Institutional Options**

4 - 5 semester hours

* Introduction to Computers
* Critical Thinking
* Creative Writing
* Ethics
* Health and Wellness
* Statistics
* Economics
* Speech
* Medical Terminology
* Any approved guided elective from Area F

C. Humanities and Fine Arts**

6 semester hours

* Ethics
* Foreign Language
* Speech, Oral Communications
* Literature
* Philosophy
* Drama, Art or Music Appreciation
* Logic
* Electives in Humanities and Fine Arts
* Religion

D. Science, Mathematics and Technology*

10 - 11 semester hours
One eight-hour laboratory course sequence in biology, chemistry or physics and an additional course in science, mathematics or technology.

E. Social Sciences**

12 semester hours

* United States History
* United States Government
* Other History
* Economics
* Psychology
* Sociology
* Anthropology
* Racial and Ethnic Minority Groups
* Lower division electives in Psychology and Sociology

F. Courses Appropriate to the Major*

18 semester hours

* Anatomy and Physiology I and II w/labs, 8 hours
* Microbiology, 4 hours
* Statistics*, 3 hours
* Human Growth & Development*, 3 Hours
* Guided electives from sociology, psychology, 0-6 Hours

* If this is taken in another area of the core, the hours would be taken in additional guided electives.

** If a student planning to transfer to MCG from another school in the University System of Georgia has completed this area with courses taken at that institution or at another institution from which MCG accepts transfer credit, MCG will accept the area as satisfied. A student planning to transfer from a school not in the University System of Georgia should choose from the list of courses.

 

[cbrons]

what if you wanted to become a CRNA? They can work without the supervision of a doctor.

I know... its a giant step in the right direction for health care access. I mean, I'm a pharmacy technician. I have a fancy little text book and flash cards and I took a test and they gave me this thing called a CPhT (CERTIFIED PHARMACY TECh, hear me ROARRRRRRR). So... like nurses are filling the voids where doctors are needed, I feel like I am qualified to run a pharmacy, take prescriptions over the phone, dispese and counsel. There is a shortage of doctors and a shortage of pharmacists. I think its time for me to form a lobby and pressure the idiots at the state capital that this is good for health care. Anyway... its not like the job is THAT hard. Hydralazine vs. Hydroxyzine??? Lamictal vs. Lamasil??? Same DIFF.

 

[njbmd]

I disagree. In rural towns where hospitals don't have anesth. MDs, CRNAs will completely run the show. Show me an airplane fueler who can hop in an fly the plane if there is no pilot.

Not another CRNA versus MD debate but CRNAs don't ever "run the show". If you believe that, you are misinformed. Some of their duties overlap with an anesthesiologist but they are nurse anesthetists which is not the same as an anesthesiologist in the same manner that nurses are not a substitute for a physician. Duty overlap does not mean "the same" rural or urban location.

If you want to become a physician, then you go to medical school. If you wish to become a nurse, you go to nursing school. Yes, they both work in hospitals but they are different professions and do different jobs. For that matter, CRNA is not the same as being a nurse but is a nurse who gives anesthesia.

There are laws in every state that limit the practice of every healthcare professional. Again, to the OP, you figure out what you actually want to do in terms of scope and manner of practice and you pursue that profession. Not because of some perceived "prestige" or even "money factor" but because you enjoy what you do on a daily basis.

 

[cbrons]

I disagree. In rural towns where hospitals don't have anesth. MDs, CRNAs will completely run the show. Show me an airplane fueler who can hop in an fly the plane if there is no pilot.

Really? CRNAs don't run the show at our rural hospital. None of the NPs in our town are respected. In fact, if you go to any of the pharmacies here in town, they will specifically tell you not to see any of the NPs in town, including the ones at our university.

 

[cbrons]

I personally chose MD over nursing because I wanted the education, not only of chem (because nurses have to take ochem too) but the vast knowledge of med school! A Dr. can help someone in the highest degree. There is no larger gift or reward than that (at least for me personally).

I do, however, want to the bedside manner of a nurse. Nobody wants a cold MD.

If you want to have good bedside manner, then be a kind and compassionate person. Getting a certain degree doesn't have anything to do with it.

 

[SireSpanky]

Not another CRNA versus MD debate but CRNAs don't ever "run the show". If you believe that, you are misinformed. Some of their duties overlap with an anesthesiologist but they are nurse anesthetists which is not the same as an anesthesiologist in the same manner that nurses are not a substitute for a physician. Duty overlap does not mean "the same" rural or urban location.

"There are approximately 36,000 practicing nurse

anesthetists. They safely administer approximately 27 million
anesthetics to patients each year in the United States. CRNAs
are the primary anesthesia providers in rural America. In some
states, CRNAs are the sole providers in nearly 100% of rural​

hospitals."

and

"CRNAs are educated and trained to work

with or without anesthesiologist supervision. CRNAs are also
educated and trained to exercise independent judgment and to​

respond quickly to anesthetic emergencies."

~http://everhadgas.com/CRNA-AA_Comparison_Table_update_208.pdf

 

[fahimaz7]

removed by user

 

[jumpingjax]

I think the OP was making a joke. People dont "choose" between nursing and medicine. Either you can or you can't. Its not like choosing btw dental and med school.

You're either in the tech/nurse/social work/dietician track or the dent/vet/pharm/med track based on your innate intelligence/discipline.

By the way, our freshman/sophomore undergrad volunteers have significantly more science knowledge than our nurses - I mean, come on, stop being so PC on this stupid site.

 

[URHere]

wow, this thread has veered crazily off course. Oh well.

Anyway, I never personally considered nursing, but I would say that the biggest draw of the MD degree is the amount of career flexibility it provides. True, MDs have to work insane and often completely inflexible hours as residents, but at the end of that haul, they'll be free to choose many paths that a nurse just couldn't choose. If they want to, MDs can open their own clinics, work in other countries (and be recognized as legitimate healthcare providers), and find positions with protected time for research. They can take positions that allow them to teach, and attain additional fellowship training fairly easily to tailor their field of practice. Sure, nurses can do some of these things, but they just don't have the same freedom to do all of them.

 

[katarina90]

wow, this thread has veered crazily off course. Oh well.

Anyway, I never personally considered nursing, but I would say that the biggest draw of the MD degree is the amount of career flexibility it provides. True, MDs have to work insane and often completely inflexible hours as residents, but at the end of that haul, they'll be free to choose many paths that a nurse just couldn't choose. If they want to, MDs can open their own clinics, work in other countries (and be recognized as legitimate healthcare providers), and find positions with protected time for research. They can take positions that allow them to teach, and attain additional fellowship training fairly easily to tailor their field of practice. Sure, nurses can do some of these things, but they just don't have the same freedom to do all of them.

Agreed. There are certain doors that having an MD or DO degree will open for you, that you can't get by becoming a nurse practioner/physician assistant/etc. I would like to be a psychiatrist and have my own practice someday; there's no other path to that career than medical school plus residency.

Not to dismiss those careers, though. Nurses are incredibly important, and in my opinion so often underappreciated. My mom is a charge nurse, and helps not only the patients but also has helped train (precept) recent graduates and works in an administrative-type position. I think it is significant to note that the options available for furthering a nursing career or education are constantly expanding, for example APRNs (advanced practice registered nurses) can even prescribe psychiatric medication in some states, according to apna.org. Also the nurse anesthestist option that someone else mentioned.

I don't think that the majority of nurses choose nursing because they can't get into medical school. I think people choose nursing for their own reasons, ie. flexible hours, career stability, personal fulfillment, helping people, opportunities for advancement, etc. A nursing license takes much less time to attain than a physician's education does, and that is attractive to many people who don't want to spend several years in school.

 

[DrYoda]

What the hell would a nurse do in a bar? Drop the RN bomb?

Careers are all about the perks...

 

[DrYoda]

Don't be ******ed.

They wear the hat and white dress (two sizes too small) and drink free all night.

Duh.

Good point, scenario amended.

What the hell would a male nurse do in a bar? Drop the RN bomb?

Careers are all about the perks...

 

[Chemdude]

Agreed. There are certain doors that having an MD or DO degree will open for you, that you can't get by becoming a nurse practioner/physician assistant/etc. I would like to be a psychiatrist and have my own practice someday; there's no other path to that career than medical school plus residency.

Not to dismiss those careers, though. Nurses are incredibly important, and in my opinion so often underappreciated. My mom is a charge nurse, and helps not only the patients but also has helped train (precept) recent graduates and works in an administrative-type position. I think it is significant to note that the options available for furthering a nursing career or education are constantly expanding, for example APRNs (advanced practice registered nurses) can even prescribe psychiatric medication in some states, according to apna.org. Also the nurse anesthestist option that someone else mentioned.

I don't think that the majority of nurses choose nursing because they can't get into medical school. I think people choose nursing for their own reasons, ie. flexible hours, career stability, personal fulfillment, helping people, opportunities for advancement, etc. A nursing license takes much less time to attain than a physician's education does, and that is attractive to many people who don't want to spend several years in school.

Silly Girl...Medicine is for men...

Edit: And nursing is for women

(JK)

 

[meister]

My cousin graduated from nursing school a couple years ago and is now making around $80k/year with zero debt, and just bought herself a Mini Cooper S which is a blast to drive. She's going to become a travelling nurse soon and make $100k+/year. She is 25.

I'm 24 and am nose-deep in debt and don't know anything about how to take care of patients yet. To be more precise, I have 3.5 years of school ahead of me, I have about $200k more in debt to accumulate, and I won't make anything to put in my bank account until I'm around 32. To top it off, I have to convince my wife not to leave me every time one more of our college buddies tells us how he just bought a car/house/yacht/whatever (I'm kidding on that last part, but it does get annoying real quick).

If you read this and think nursing sounds awesome, then there's your answer.

 

[njbmd]

"There are approximately 36,000 practicing nurse

anesthetists. They safely administer approximately 27 million
anesthetics to patients each year in the United States. CRNAs
are the primary anesthesia providers in rural America. In some
states, CRNAs are the sole providers in nearly 100% of rural​

hospitals."

and

"CRNAs are educated and trained to work

with or without anesthesiologist supervision. CRNAs are also
educated and trained to exercise independent judgment and to​

respond quickly to anesthetic emergencies."

~http://everhadgas.com/CRNA-AA_Comparison_Table_update_208.pdf

Like I said, mis-informed. I rest my case. As others have said, this is a joke thread.

 

[brianmartin]

Take a large boat for example. There is the captain, ensuring the safety of the crew, deciding the course, making the decisions, weight the risks of whichever path they take. Then there are the deckhands who implement everything, take up the anchors, maintain the engine, check that all the lights are working, take care of the guests. They are still on the boat, still vital to its function, and they can even suggest possible actions to the captain, but they are not the decision-makers.

If you put me on a boat, I will walk directly to the bridge and ask where the controls are.

 

[SireSpanky]

Like I said, mis-informed. I rest my case. As others have said, this is a joke thread.

That is a fact sheet from the AANA; if you have a more reliable source discrediting that fact sheet, I will gladly admit to being misinformed.


Additional Proof:

"The new Medicare rule changes the physician supervision requirement for CRNAs furnishing anesthesia services in hospitals. The rule removes a federal requirement that a physician supervise every case of anesthesia administration by a nurse anesthetist and allows states to determine whether such supervision is needed. The rule would allow CRNAs to practice in hospitals without physician supervision where state law and hospital policy permits."
http://www.cms.hhs.gov/apps/media/press/factsheet.asp?Counter=391



"A final rule that would have removed the federal requirement of physician supervision of nurse anesthetists was published on Jan. 18, 2001, but the effective date was delayed to allow additional study of implementation issues and ensure that safety issues had been fully addressed. This new rule rescinds the Jan. 18 rule."
http://www.cms.hhs.gov/apps/media/press/release.asp?Counter=319

• Iowa opted out of the federal supervision requirement in December 2001.​
• Nebraska opted out in February 2002.​
• Idaho opted out in March 2002.​
• Minnesota opted out in April 2002.​
• New Hampshire opted out in June 2002.​
• New Mexico opted out in November 2002.​
• Kansas opted out in March 2003.​
• North Dakota opted out in October 2003.​
• Washington opted out in October 2003.​
• Alaska opted out in October 2003.​
• Oregon opted out in December 2003.​
• Montana opted out in January 2004.
  (Gov. Judy Martz opted-out; Gov. Brian Schweitzer reversed the opt-out in May 2005, without citing any evidence to justify the decision. Subsequently, after the governor and his staff became more familiar with the reasons justifying the January 2004 opt-out, Gov. Schweitzer restored the opt-out in June 2005. Montana's opt-out, therefore, is currently in effect.)​
• South Dakota opted out in March 2005.​
• Wisconsin opted out in June 2005.​

http://www.aana.com/Advocacy.aspx?u...Type=4&ucNavMenu_TSMenuID=6&id=2573&terms=opt

 

[cbrons]

Maybe I should fire my lawyer and hire his paralegal to replace him. Or maybe I'll insist the hygienist do my next root canal. Why pay the bums with the education? 12 years of schooling doesn't make you qualified... having a powerful lobby does.

 

[SireSpanky]

Maybe I should fire my lawyer and hire his paralegal to replace him. Or maybe I'll insist the hygienist do my next root canal. Why pay the bums with the education? 12 years of schooling doesn't make you qualified... having a powerful lobby does.

That's fine, but these analogies do NOT reflect any of the facts I have shown. CRNAs ARE handling the responsibilities and ultimate decisions of MDAs in many states.

 

[fahimaz7]

That's fine, but these analogies do NOT reflect any of the facts I have shown. CRNAs ARE handling the responsibilities and ultimate decisions of MDAs in many states.

Could you please switch from the pre-med group to the pre-nursing?

 

[SireSpanky]

Find me a nurse that will say her background in basic science is as strong as a MD's and I'll eat my words.

As a PhD candidate in inorganic chemistry, its almost worth switching to to pre-nursing....

 

[fahimaz7]

As a PhD candidate in inorganic chemistry, its almost worth switching to to pre-nursing....

At 24 years of age, you're either Doogie Howser or you still have a long way to go to finish your PhD. I was a PhD candidate in Molecular Biology... Instead of writing one more chapter (I had 3 in my thesis), I took the Master's degree and I'm matriculating into medical school in August.

You're profile says...

Other Institution: Rice University
Area of Study: Physical Sciences
Degree Obtained: MA

Not a MS?

So does that mean you didn't finish the PhD?

I guess you're "better" than a RN/NP then since you passed prelims? Is that 8 in PS your score? I have an RN friend that went back to school, took her pre-reqs for medical school, and busted out a 10, 12, 12 (34) on the MCAT.

 

[Kaustikos]

My cousin graduated from nursing school a couple years ago and is now making around $80k/year with zero debt, and just bought herself a Mini Cooper S which is a blast to drive. She's going to become a travelling nurse soon and make $100k+/year. She is 25.

I'm 24 and am nose-deep in debt and don't know anything about how to take care of patients yet. To be more precise, I have 3.5 years of school ahead of me, I have about $200k more in debt to accumulate, and I won't make anything to put in my bank account until I'm around 32. To top it off, I have to convince my wife not to leave me every time one more of our college buddies tells us how he just bought a car/house/yacht/whatever (I'm kidding on that last part, but it does get annoying real quick).

If you read this and think nursing sounds awesome, then there's your answer.

Yep. Nurses can make money, no doubt. They can work a night shift at the VA here in indy making over 30/hr easily for 3 12 hour shifts, hope on over to a hospital that's "out of her district" and be employed as a traveling nurse and net over 30/hr there parttime. That's one good thing, though, it's that nurses are in demand, always. I cannot tell you the amount of times I have had to call nurses at home to see if they will come in for double-time (read - double pay rate).

 

[atomi]

apart from the prestige associated with being a physician, what has made you all decide against nursing and to pursue becoming an MD?

The professions are so entirely different, it is almost the same as asking why did you become an oceanographer instead of a liquor store owner?

It's a silly question designed by interviewing committees to test applicants.

 

[JRJ26]

as someone that took courses with nursing students, as well as working with nurses as part of the nursing staff (tech), I thought I'd comment.

Nursing vs. medicine really isn't a good comparison, at least if you're comparing being an RN to being an MD/DO, and not using NP/CRNA as an example. The goals of the professions are different though sometimes overlapping.

As far as science knowledge goes, obviously the MD has a vastly larger source of basic science knowledge than the RN. The RN simply doesn't need this knowledge to perform their job! Understanding the molecular mechanisms behind a disease at an in depth level really is unnecessary to be an RN, which is why it isn't taught in the first place. Nurses do know basic pharmacology, but it is not at the level taught in medical school. They know what drug is what, what it does, and basic pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics.

As far as education, again it really doesn't make sense to compare the education for a nursing degree to that of pre-med courses and then to medical school. Nursing students do not take the same classes as pre-meds, nor do pre-meds have more basic science than nursing students, if by basic science you're talking about related to medicine. At Georgetown for example, the nursing science curriculum includes Human Biology I and II (Anatomy and Physiology I and II), Pathophysiology, Pharmacology, Chemistry of Human Functioning (2 credit seminar), Biochemistry of Human Functioning (3 credit survey), and Microbiology. Pre-med students do not take any of these courses, unless they're pre-med in the nursing and health studies school, and medical schools count Human Biology as the General Biology requirement. The pre-med knowledge from the pre-reqs is basically irrelevant to understanding medical sciences, if only to get you thinking in a certain way.

In the clinical setting, you obviously see the differences between nursing and medicine. Also, nurses don't just blindly follow what the physician says to do, just because they have more medical knowledge. Especially related to pharm, nurses are trained to recognize whether a dosage is wrong, if a pt. is allergic, if another drug might be better, etc. This doesn't take an MD to do, but it shows the collaborative nature of health care, and that nurses don't just bow down to the doc.

fahimaz, you seem to be confused as to what nursing really is about, even if you do work with nurses. Obviously nurses will go to a doctor for a medical problem, not another nurse (unless of course it's an NP). Nurses are not trained to diagnose. They understand basic pathophysiology, and obviously with extensive work experience come to a deeper understanding, but they are not trained to diagnose and treat. So your statement that if you had a serious illness you wouldn't go to a nurse is irrelevant, b/c they wouldn't expect you to go to them! Nurses are not the sole providers in any of the areas that you listed, so again, you're making statements that are pretty irrelevant. The lines get blurred when NPs come into the picture, but again, they are typically trained to work in collaboration with physicians, though there are a few that probably want to be completely independent. Why would you go to a surgical nurse for surgery, when they aren't trained to do surgery?! There are registered nurse first assistants, but wait, their very title says "first assistant". Why would you go to an ER NP for trauma? In fact, why would you go to an ER MD for trauma treatment? That's why trauma surgery exists. Oh and CRNAs are able to provide anesthetics independently in a number of states. That doesn't make them anesthesiologists. Anesthesiologists are full perioperative physicians that also provide anesthesia services.

The reason why I chose medicine over nursing was that I too wanted the basic science knowledge, as well as the desire to be involved in the diagnosis and treatment of medical issues. Being a tech showed me that I simply don't have the personality to do nursing, and many would say vice versa. The majority of nurses didn't think about medicine as a career when they chose nursing, and I'm sure the same is true for physicians. The goals of nursing and medicine are different but overlapping. This "who has more knowledge about receptors" argument really is irrelevant, and frankly, nurses could care less, b/c it isn't necessary for their job.

 

[fahimaz7]

Would you pick a nurse to be the sole provider of care for...

1. Cancer (Oncology nurse)
2. Diabetes (NP)
3. Stroke (NP)
4. Trauma (NP ER certification)
5. Major Infection (NP)
6. Surgery (Surgical nurse)
7. etc?

In rural areas, NP's might be the first and only line of care for people with these types of illnesses. I have friend that just graduated from Emory's NP program (ER certification) and she is practicing in rural Colorado. In her multi-purpose clinic, she sees people with infection, stroke, diabetes and I would suspect that she sees patients that could have cancer (although she would not be treating most types of cancer).

The reason I put this was to highlight that most people would rather see an MD than a NP. But, in select markets, you may or may not have a choice as to what type of provider they get.

Surgery was thrown in there for laughs.

fahimaz, you seem to be confused as to what nursing really is about, even if you do work with nurses.

Obviously nurses will go to a doctor for a medical problem, not another nurse (unless of course it's an NP). Which is the type of nurse I was referring to.

So your statement that if you had a serious illness you wouldn't go to a nurse is irrelevant, b/c they wouldn't expect you to go to them! Nurses are not the sole providers in any of the areas that you listed, so again, you're making statements that are pretty irrelevant. NP's sure are.. you said it yourself.

The lines get blurred when NPs come into the picture, but again, they are typically trained to work in collaboration with physicians, though there are a few that probably want to be completely independent. As mentioned above...

Why would you go to an ER NP for trauma? In fact, why would you go to an ER MD for trauma treatment? That's why trauma surgery exists. See above. There are quite a few places where if you get hurt, you are going to a NP and not a trauma center with a MD

http://www.nursing.emory.edu/nursing/admissions/msn/enpa.shtml

I wasn't talking about seeing an RN.. I was talking about seeing a NP for these illnesses. If you are within 100 miles of that woman's clinic when you get hurt, you'll be seeing her as your first care giver.

 

[JRJ26]

fahimaz i understand what you're saying. When I refer to "nursing" I'm referring to RN level, not NP/CRNA, unless specifically mentioned as such. As far as NP care, yes in rural areas many times you'll be seen and treated by an NP/PA. NPs/PAs are trained to diagnose and treat the majority of illnesses in their scope of practice. Acute Care NPs will be able to work in many of the areas that you listed, however NPs are trained to work in collaboration with MDs and to refer out if the medical issue becomes more complicated than they can handle. The difference between an ER PA/NP and an ER MD/DO is that the MD/DO is more extensive training specifically in emergency medicine after their extensive medical education. Thus ER PA/NPs may be able to handle many or most of the cases seen in the ER, but when it gets complicated, they should consult with the MD. Obviously with an extensive amount of experience the ER PA/NP can provide solo coverage, but again, they are not specifically trained to handle the very complicated cases. In many hospitals that use PAs/NPs in the ER, they'll typically staff the Fast Track area. As far as trauma, you do realize the difference between trauma and ER? An ER NP cannot provide trauma treatment (aka trauma surgery), as they are not trained in surgery or trauma surgery. Similarly, the ER MD in a level 1 trauma center is not providing trauma services, but in a trauma alert, they'll typically manage the area and that's it. So if you've got penetrating trauma and end up at an ER with only an NP, you can bet that you'll be stabilized (aka ABCs, etc.) then transferred to the appropriate facility. There is a difference between working as an NP/PA and as an MD/DO in the same specialty, though there is a lot of overlap.

 

[fahimaz7]

JRJ,

You're preaching to the choir. I'm one of the strong supportors of keeping MD/DO's in charge in all of the specialized fields. I appreciate the background information on RN, NP, PA, DO, and MD's...

Obviously a level 1 trauma center isn't going to be staffed by RN's on bottom and NP/PA's on top. There's also an obvious inability of any person (MD or NP) to treat a true "trauma" in the absence of a trauma room and the subsequent staffing that would be needed.

I'm not sure what you're trying to get at here. If you're in Rural Alaska and you cut off both of your legs, you're going to be screwed and I'm not arguing about that. However, if you have an MI out there you might get sent to a NP, at a rural clinic, and he or she might do something more invasive than CPR.

In rural America, you get what you can get...when you need to get it. There's a large population of people that live >100 miles from the nearest trauma center...

 

[JRJ26]

no worries, I was just trying to show that yes, MDs/DOs will have a much broader basic science background than the RNs b/c they don't need that knowledge to do their job, and their is no point in asking them what binds to what receptor, etc., b/c they just don't need to know that. If you ask the question to an NP, they might know, but again, they aren't trained to the same level as MDs.

Yes if you get sent to an NP in a rural clinic with an MI, they will definitely do something more than CPR, as (again depending on if were talking about a Family Nurse Practitioner, Acute Care Nurse Practitioner, Emergency NP, etc.) they will be trained to diagnose and treat. However the Family NP, like the Family MD, will not perform bypass surgery or cardiac catheterization, no matter how isolated they are. You can't perform what you don't know how to perform, what you aren't licensed to perform, and what you aren't credentialed (by the hospital/clinic/etc) to perform. Remember that there are flight EMS systems in place for these very reasons, to take a person to the facility that they need.

So my long winded point was that no matter how isolated someone is, that NP will not provide all of the same knowledge and services that an MD might. The NP will do what they are able to do, then that patient with an acute MI that needs more advanced treatment than what the NP can provide will have to be transferred out. The NP (and the family MD, etc.) cannot treat what they can't treat.

 

[NTF]

Seems to me that's just what he/she's doing here....

You're absolutely right. Sorry OP, I was a bit cranky that day.