*~*~*~*Official AMCAS "Work/Activities" Tips Thread 2012-2013*~*~*~*
Started by sector9
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Having your abstract published in a conference booklet does not constitute "Publication" for AMCAS purposes. If the abstract had been published in the supplement of a national journal (which would also make it PubMed searchable) then it would have been considered Publications-worthy.
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See my response in the post above this one.
You hit the nail on the head. You can't cite it if it's not Searchable.
Campus publications are generally mentioned in the narrative of the associated Research or Other listing (Other is used for special projects that are not hypothesis-driven research), rather than being given a space of their own in Publications.
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I wrote about a tutoring program I participate in for one of my most meaningful activities. It is a free program funded by the state of California and I wrote about how I helped disadvantaged elementary/middle school students, but I didn't make it clear that the program was free. I should have added that but I already submitted. 🙁 Would this hurt me?
No. If you included all the information you just told me, except that the tutoring was free of charge, I think most adcomms would intuit that the students didn't have to pay for yor services. Hopefully, it was apparent whether you volunteered your time or got a salary from the state.
Hi, I'm asking about the exp length. I know it says 700 characters max but all 15 of my EC's were generally around 680-698 characters, all in paragraph form. Am I overdoing it? I heard reading 15 long paragraphs will bore the reader also... Thanks in advance.
PS also same goes for the PS. I have just below 5300 characters (5291 char)... would adcoms see this as overeager? because I also heard that adcoms only spend like a short amt of time looking at your app and PS.
PS also same goes for the PS. I have just below 5300 characters (5291 char)... would adcoms see this as overeager? because I also heard that adcoms only spend like a short amt of time looking at your app and PS.
I just checked my description of it and it isn't apparent if I was paid or if it was volunteer. It is purely volunteer work, so now I don't know what to do. 🙁
Well, at least I can change info on my AACOMAS application.
Question: would adcoms know that it is volunteer work if I categorized it as "teaching/tutoring" and not "paid - nonmilitary", or should I have written about it being volunteer work?
You can use that category whether the Teaching is paid or volunteer (though most would use Employment if it's paid), so adcomms won't know for sure.
In a future update letter, you might clarify. Not by saying "I forgot to mention . . .," but by saying, "I continued my volunteer position with the . . . . " (if it will be an ongoing activity).
1) Variable narrative lengths do help prevent reader fatigue. But if you need the extra characters, then use them. Just don't be adding fluffy stuff to fill up space. Learn to express yourself succinctly, and then stop.
2) Same answer.
I'm sure adcomms have widely variable attention spans. Most, however, will (at least try to) give meticulous attention to what you have to say. But they do tend to have a day job that needs their time too.
Would it also be okay to mention it in a secondary essay? And when would I send an update letter? Would that be after getting an interview and being waitlisted?
Thanks for being so helpful!
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http://forums.sdn.net/showpost.php?p=12054419&postcount=27
Seems there's some consensus coming from him and Nicknaylor pertaining to listing tutoring on activities. I made a post at the end of the thread http://forums.sdn.net/showpost.php?p=12655538&postcount=57
Is the teaching/tutoring category meant to include all derivatives, unpaid or paid? Or does the paid version go under paid employment?
Seems there's some consensus coming from him and Nicknaylor pertaining to listing tutoring on activities. I made a post at the end of the thread http://forums.sdn.net/showpost.php?p=12655538&postcount=57
Is the teaching/tutoring category meant to include all derivatives, unpaid or paid? Or does the paid version go under paid employment?
Hey guys,
Two questions for now:
1) I took part in three mission trips with my church during HS (WV, NY, Mexico) and one trip last summer (PA). Would it be beneficial to list these in one slot all together, even though they are not directly medical? They range from VBS to house-building and remodeling. These were not significant to my direct decision to pursue medicine but I believe they opened my eyes to the needs.
2) Should I use a whole slot to describe my one research experience (one semester with faculty) even if it wasn't a significant experience? The big thing I took away was that I don't want to be involved with research for the rest of my life!
Thanks so much in advance!
Two questions for now:
1) I took part in three mission trips with my church during HS (WV, NY, Mexico) and one trip last summer (PA). Would it be beneficial to list these in one slot all together, even though they are not directly medical? They range from VBS to house-building and remodeling. These were not significant to my direct decision to pursue medicine but I believe they opened my eyes to the needs.
2) Should I use a whole slot to describe my one research experience (one semester with faculty) even if it wasn't a significant experience? The big thing I took away was that I don't want to be involved with research for the rest of my life!
Thanks so much in advance!
1) Yes, if the prompt seems appropriate for it.
2) Some good times for an update letter might be: after something significant and new has happened, after improving an EC that was borderline for a few months, after fall grades come out, when one has been waitlisted.
Sometimes an activity qualifies for 2-3 categories, in which case, you get the choice of how to designate it depending on what balances your application best, so you cover more categories. I think that most list a tutoring job under Employment, but that is not obligatory. If it is a volunteer position, it could be placed under Community Service. Sometimes a teaching gig is done due to curricular requirement, so Other could be chosen. But any of these could just as well be designated as Teaching/Tutoring.
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1) HS activities are usually not listed unless they continued into the college years. Since one of the missions happened during college, listing the rest is legit; designating them as Community Service/Volunteer-not Medical/Clinical seems most appropriate. Put them all in one space, giving the info for the most recent in the header, and then mentioning the others with their dates in the description.
2) Yes, list it in its own slot. About 73% of those accepted did list a research experience. Try not to be negative about it.
My description goes like this:
Tutored college and high school students in Organic Chemistry, General Chemistry, Algebra II, Calculus, and Physics
Do I need to designate paid? Like at the end "tutored college... to help pay for rent"?
Also I asked this earlier, and I think someone said put their credentials "PhD"
But the AMCAS clearly says->
Contact's Title:
(ex. Project Director) *
For research my PI's title is principal investigator, but of course at the end of his name is a PhD... What's the consensus on this?
1) If you entered it under Employment, it's understood that you were paid. If you entered it under Teaching, and were paid, make that clear. Maybe you could put a cue word in the title you give the activity, like "Science and Math Tutoring Jobs."
2) I don't know of a "consensus." You could put both if you wish.
Thanks!
My title is Self-employed Tutor, but I guess I should make it more generic: I worked with both on campus learning center and privately.
So something like Part Time Self-employed and Learning Center Tutor?
In general do I have to say "why" I worked, or is listing something under "Paid employment" or listing I was a tutor for hire is enough to imply I worked to earn some income?
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In that case, is it okay then that I put down a volunteering as a tutor for disadvantaged kids as "teaching/tutoring". I didn't specifically mention that it was volunteering, and I didn't say anything about getting paid either. I just assumed that if it is paid it would go under employment...🙁. But I think the description sounds does sound like it is volunteer work, although it doesn't say anything like "volunteer" or "not paid" so I guess it could be inferred both ways. I just described what I did and how it made me feel good to help the community which I grew up in.
I also make it clear from my other entries that are employment that I got paid and what I used the money for (contributing to financial aid package, paying for summer classes, and so on), so maybe adcoms can infer that it is volunteer work from this? This is so upsetting to me. 🙁
How does the person reviewing my application see my work/activities description? I spent a lot of time entering all of my activity descriptions in list form, but when I printed out my application, all of the bullet points were mushed together in paragraph form and it is very confusing to read. Should I just rewrite everything in paragraphs, or is there some way to make sure it stays as a list?
I have a question regarding the verification process. Can I get my grades verifyed without officially submitting? or can i add my personal statement after verifying grades? I was planning on working on my personal statement after my mact on july6th but I though my grades would already have been verifyed.. now I dont know if i should risk submitting my app late or my personal statement not being as great as it could have been..
I have volunteered with a support group for children of cancer patients. We discuss the nature of cancer/treatment/etc. in a fun, disarming environment. Is this clinical volunteering or non clinical? I was thinking of non-clinical, but wasn't entirely sure.
Thank you
Thank you
1) That's fine.
2) You don't need to say "why" you worked, but at times one might have an interesting reason for taking on a specific job. In your case, eg, you might have gotten such rave reviews from private clients that the Learning Center approached you with an offer. Or somesuch.
1) Yes.
2) I think that it is logical that adcomms would infer that it was volunteer as it varies so much from what you said about your paid positions.
Hopefully you followed the instructions and didn't copy and paste your descriptions from Word or some other heavily formatted program. Either type it into the space directly, or use something like Wordpad to copy it from.
Adcomms view the application in PDF format. Don't look at the HTML format.
1) AMCAS will not do any work on your behalf until you Submit the application and pay your fee.
2) Once you submit, you cannot change the PS or activity descriptions.
This is Community Service/Volunteer- not Medical/Clinical.
Research related question.
In order to study a different population, I travelled to McGill over the summer to set up my project and have been coordinating data collection for about a year. This is technically at a different lab, but it's with my PI's collaborator and it's a continuation of my main research project. Should I just include both labs under one research experience (which is going to be my most meaningful so I have room to talk about it) because it is all the same project, or separate them because the data is being collected at two different sites?
In order to study a different population, I travelled to McGill over the summer to set up my project and have been coordinating data collection for about a year. This is technically at a different lab, but it's with my PI's collaborator and it's a continuation of my main research project. Should I just include both labs under one research experience (which is going to be my most meaningful so I have room to talk about it) because it is all the same project, or separate them because the data is being collected at two different sites?
It sounds like including them both in the same entry would work fine in your case.
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I've been seeing on this thread that it's a good idea to have a clinical experience as one of your most meaningful experiences.
I am listing my research, which had a clinical component, but was not 100% clinical, as one of my most meaningful experiences. In my explanation, I am emphasizing the clinical component as to one of the reasons that this experience was so important to me (taught me how research and medicine interact, and that I need to have a clinical perspective that can only be obtained by practicing medicine in order to perform the type of research I want to). My question is this: I have only this experience and one other research-related experience that stand out to me as "most meaningful"...would it be a good idea to list one of my other clinical experiences (either hospital volunteering or shadowing) as one of my "most meaningful" experiences?
(In case you might have suspected, I am applying MD/PhD)
I am listing my research, which had a clinical component, but was not 100% clinical, as one of my most meaningful experiences. In my explanation, I am emphasizing the clinical component as to one of the reasons that this experience was so important to me (taught me how research and medicine interact, and that I need to have a clinical perspective that can only be obtained by practicing medicine in order to perform the type of research I want to). My question is this: I have only this experience and one other research-related experience that stand out to me as "most meaningful"...would it be a good idea to list one of my other clinical experiences (either hospital volunteering or shadowing) as one of my "most meaningful" experiences?
(In case you might have suspected, I am applying MD/PhD)
It is not obligatory to designate three "Most Meaningful" experiences. Only one is required. As you've already had the opportunity to reflect on an experience with clinical overtones, it might be overkill to list a second in that category, unless you have more to say on its transformative nature and impact.
Alright, so I have been obsessing over my work/activities for days, finally felt the descriptions were perfected, and submitted this afternoon.
BUUT.. I looked over my app once more tonight and realized that I had neglected to mention the average hours per week for one of my activities; specifically, volunteering in a free clinic. I also neglected to mention my time commitment in the description box so the adcoms will have no idea of my level of involvement (which wasn't much, maybe 4 hours/month for 5 months). I'm just distressing over this one glitch in an otherwise solid (and I believe, polished, application). Any input on how adcoms might perceive this error would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks folks
BUUT.. I looked over my app once more tonight and realized that I had neglected to mention the average hours per week for one of my activities; specifically, volunteering in a free clinic. I also neglected to mention my time commitment in the description box so the adcoms will have no idea of my level of involvement (which wasn't much, maybe 4 hours/month for 5 months). I'm just distressing over this one glitch in an otherwise solid (and I believe, polished, application). Any input on how adcoms might perceive this error would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks folks
Since this activity was not the sole source of either clinical experience or of volunteerism on your application, and since you started the free clinic gig relatively recently, I doubt this will have a negative impact on how your application is perceived. If the activity is ongoing, you can comment on total accumulated hours in a future update letter (where they are allowed). If it's not ongoing, then IMHO, I don't think that your 20+ or so hours are worth bringing to attention.
Thanks Cat, I don't consider the activity important enough to warrant an update letter. I just hope it doesn't cause too much confusion for those who read it. I would hope that they assume from the activity's brief description, relative to my more important and time consuming activities, that I didn't devote a huge number of hours to it. Likewise, I would hope that they assume that it was more than a one day activity (i.e. filler). I just don't want this small mistake to cast a negative light on the rest of my application. Time will tell I suppose, maybe I'm worrying needlessly over such a small thing. It's just hard to think that even small mistakes in this process can be inconsequential sometimes.
I am really debating whether I should list myself as being disadvantaged. What factors should be taken into account? Are there any risks associated with this? What legitimizes listing yourself as being disadvantaged? free/reduced meals during early education or need based scholarships to attend college?
Your question falls outside the scope of this thread. If you do an Advanced Search in PreMedAllo for responses posted by LizzyM with search term "disadvantaged", you'll find that she has commented on this many times.
It is arguable whether involvement from before HS graduation will make you a more appealing candidate, but, yes, you can list them together, perhaps titling the activity High School Recognitions, or somesuch. If you remained involved in scouts, or engaged in any political activities more recently, I would instead mention these recognitions in the same space as the more recent experience.
So I'm getting the vibe that all of our activities should either mention the hours/week mentioned in the box, or in the description if it's not a normal thing?
IE club i help start did activities 1-2 a month, but the hours varied. I also had many duties being an officer and we had meetings twice a month.
Same club's parent organization holds free clinics where I was involved (12 clinics, 8 hour days), but this is over a 1.5 year period. The location of the clinics are repeat places (one place has been served for over 10 years), but we don't go every month, more like 3-6 months a year. Is it necessary at this point to count up the number of actual hours, define "over a 1.5 year period" (even though the dates are listed), or even enumerate the number of clinics I attended? I feel that doing this makes it seem that I want them to know exactly how many hours I was involved --> looks superficial =/. But if I don't then they can't see how involved I really was...
IE club i help start did activities 1-2 a month, but the hours varied. I also had many duties being an officer and we had meetings twice a month.
Same club's parent organization holds free clinics where I was involved (12 clinics, 8 hour days), but this is over a 1.5 year period. The location of the clinics are repeat places (one place has been served for over 10 years), but we don't go every month, more like 3-6 months a year. Is it necessary at this point to count up the number of actual hours, define "over a 1.5 year period" (even though the dates are listed), or even enumerate the number of clinics I attended? I feel that doing this makes it seem that I want them to know exactly how many hours I was involved --> looks superficial =/. But if I don't then they can't see how involved I really was...
What do you think of the personal "I" in Work/Activities section? I know the PS it is okay, but with W/A is it also appropriate? Such as "I worked on..."
1) Instead of filling in the hours per week in the header since they were so variable, in the narrative you could give the average hours per month over the academic year (which excludes summer and breaks, so you don't have to dilute them down by averaging). Adcomms want to get a sense of how much time was taken by the activity.
2) This part of the activity should be carved out and listed under Community Service/Volunteer-Medical/Clinical (assuming you had patient interaction). Put the inclusive dates, but name the activity something that makes clear the clinics occurred irregularly, like, "Intermittent Free Clinic Involvement." Don't put hours per week in the header. You don't need to count the total hours, but I would say the number of clinics attended and usual hours per day you participated. Adcomms like to know these things. If you aren't specific, they might assume you did the activity twice: on the first and last day listed.
This is fine if you're using narrative style. If you use bullet format, then omit the pronoun.
Thanks, I have separated them. Though patient contact was... limited because I wasn't aggressive enough to interact with them more, but there was some.
Dang, one more question on this topic. My description is a bit long (I gave a 1 sentence background information on the organization I joined). Is that necessary or will the Adcom's look it up on google. Is that something I cannot assume they will do so just provide the info there? I did of course write that I co-founded the local chapter on campus and listed some activities we did.
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I was hoping you might be able to give me some advice. I was looking over my submitted AMCAS application and noticed that for one of the Work/Activities entries (for a summer internship in Chile) the dates I listed on the app were 7/2001-8/2002, whereas they should have been 7/2001-8/2001. I started to get really worried because it will look like I was in Chile for a year, when it should also be clear I was a student at my American undergraduate institution during the 2001-2 academic year. I'm really worried it will look like I was being dishonest, but this was a pure mistake. Unfortunately, I titled the activity "Environmental Education Internship" rather than something like "Summer internship" and don't refer to it explicitly as a summer internship in the paragraph description. I think I can address this in my secondaries as a mistake, but I'm worried about schools that screen pre-secondary (the CA schools). Any advice? I'm feeling pretty terrible about this. Thanks.
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First, an activity from that long ago is unlikely to have a significant impact on your application. Second, the mistake will be apparent from your transcript dates. Third, if you decide to address the error, refer to it as briefly as possible and don't make a big fuss about it. Something like: "Please note edit of Experience on Primary Application: Environmental Internship lasted 6 weeks." Or somesuch.
Even if it's a well-known national organization, you can't assume every adcomm is seasoned enough to have heard of it or will have the time to look it up. I think a basic explanation is a good idea. You can decide how much to trim it based on available space.
Cat...Thanks so much for your help!
However,
1. Still kind of confused on how to approach listing shadowing.
I have 5 experiences with different amount of times for each specialty.
However, the Amcas format requires one contact person when listing all experiences in one box under the "other" section.
Would the best approach be to pick a general duration for when ALL experiences took place, and then add details about each experience in the narrative. (ex. 2008-2011) then specify each experience?
2. What about Teaching/Tutoring? Should those be listed in one box as well? Or, if the opportunities were through different university programs, it would be best to list them in separate boxes? How does one decide?
3. What is your over-arching advice on how to best organize the information for this section? Is it worth it to type up detailed explanations for the narratives with personal statement strategies, or is it best to just keep it simple and more descriptive, so these things can be expanded in secondaries/ interviews?
4. How detailed should one be when using Bullet format?
However,
1. Still kind of confused on how to approach listing shadowing.
I have 5 experiences with different amount of times for each specialty.
However, the Amcas format requires one contact person when listing all experiences in one box under the "other" section.
Would the best approach be to pick a general duration for when ALL experiences took place, and then add details about each experience in the narrative. (ex. 2008-2011) then specify each experience?
2. What about Teaching/Tutoring? Should those be listed in one box as well? Or, if the opportunities were through different university programs, it would be best to list them in separate boxes? How does one decide?
3. What is your over-arching advice on how to best organize the information for this section? Is it worth it to type up detailed explanations for the narratives with personal statement strategies, or is it best to just keep it simple and more descriptive, so these things can be expanded in secondaries/ interviews?
4. How detailed should one be when using Bullet format?
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1) List the main contact for the most recent or most significant doc in the header. Add contact info for the others with the description. List an inclusive time span for all the shadowing. Title the experience, "Intermittent Physician Shadowing." Don't fill in the hours per week, rather list the total hours for each doc and give a grand total at the end. I typed out an example earlier in this thread. maybe you could locate it with a Search.
2) If the experiences are substantive (say, at least a semester) and you have the space, it's best to list each on its own.
3) You don't have a lot of space, which will limit your flowery oratory. best to keep each entry succinct. Don't feel obliged to use all the characters if you've already said what's important. Hopefully you can fit in your duties and what you took away from the experience.
4) When using bullets, don't use complete sentences. I believe sector9 gave an example in post #2. His version of listing shadowing is there as well.
Hi,
I've been helping with my family's business to help stabilize family's income through the business for the past year. I don't get paychecks because what the business brings in is our family income. What experience type would this go under? Other as unpaid employment? Volunteer?
Also, what is considered artistic endeavor?
Thank you in advance!
I've been helping with my family's business to help stabilize family's income through the business for the past year. I don't get paychecks because what the business brings in is our family income. What experience type would this go under? Other as unpaid employment? Volunteer?
Also, what is considered artistic endeavor?
Thank you in advance!
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