OK I seriously wanted to know this....

[aprilshyla]

i would have thought so too until I saw a snide anti-Christian comment on another thread

Just FYI, "liberal" and "accepting of homosexuals" does not automatically equate to "anti-Christian." If I remember my "anti-Christian comment" clearly, I think said something along the lines of that Duke has a really strong Divinity school, which happens to have a branch in the LGBT Center, because yes, some Christians and theologens actually do believe that homosexuality is okay according to the Bible.

That's all I have left to say about that, because that thread has already been shut down and is over.

On the other hand, to answer your question, like I said, Duke has a very strong Divinity school with a Methodist affiliation (Duke itself is no longer affiliated, but the history remains.). The Duke Chapel, which is a breathtaking piece of architecture, is the main centerpiece on campus and if viewed from above, forms a gigantic Christian cross. Thus, I would definitely hesitate to list Duke as "anti-Christian" as Campus Crusade For Christ and IVY are two hugely populated clubs by both graduate and undergraduate students.

---

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[GuyLaroche]

Vanderbilt is very Christian-friendly. Not to say it's not friendly to other people, but there is a very active Medical Christian Outreach, a large portion of the class who attends church regularly, and open discussion of religion among students (and even mention of God quite often in lecture). Shocks some Northeasterners, but is home to most of the class.

Nice to know. I'm crossing it right off my list of possible schools.

 

[Law2Doc]

Here is one area where people really could benefit from having the "widsom to know the difference:"

The "Midwest"!

Now maybe Missouri is really gung-ho conservative Christian--I wouldn't know since I've never lived there--but up here in Minnesota we are a LOT more moderate. This may be the mini-van belt of America, and the Home Depot-Red Lobster belt and all that, but it is NOT the bible belt. And maybe we don't have the cultural diversity of the East coast but we have a liberal tradition of our own that goes back as far as Walter Mondale and beyond. Probably the same can be said somewhat of Wisconsin and Iowa and the Dakotas (which are more wild west than bible belt). Each state is its own place--we're not just one big undifferentiated lump. Please people, if you are going to stereotype an entire swath of the USA, define your borders accurately. If what you mean is Kansas, then say it.

Edited part:
P.S. I read my post and it sounds out of the blue, but I was responding to someone on page one who said to look into schools in the "midwest." Also, no offense to anyone in Kansas or Missouri!

My bad -- I meant the midwest except Minnesota . FYI I was echoing another poster's view on the OP's prior post.

 

[SocialistMD]

It would be interesting to include these scientists' birth and death dates in the list to see how many of them got a chance to absorb Origin of Species.

Seriously. I'll admit my history knowledge is a little rusty, but I know daVinci predated the theory of evolution by at least one hundred years.

 

[GuyLaroche]

...I wanted people ...not consider Christians to be "in a dream world", "unable to reason", "*****s", etc, etc

I should tell you that you're not really helping this cause, are you?

 

[NEATOMD]

It's extremely funny to me that PD's original post was closed when he wasn't "pushing" his beliefs on anyone while other contraversial threads remain open. Funny, how people who work so hard for tolerance and open mindedness choose not to be tolerant or open minded about Christian beliefs. It's funny how so many people just want for others to listen to their point of view but rarely take the time to listen to others. It's funny how many times scientific views have changed over the course of the last 3,000 years and even more so over the most recent 100, while the Bible hasn't ever changed or been amended for nearly 2000 years and millions still believe it to be accurate to the last word. Funny how easy it is to be mean to Christians when you're not sitting face to face with them. That's all funny right??? I'm not laughing.

 

[Law2Doc]

Seriously. I'll admit my history knowledge is a little rusty, but I know daVinci predated the theory of evolution by at least one hundred years.

I agree -- you can't say that a lot of scientists currently/still believe in creationism and then give a list padded with long since dead people. And wasn't steve austin the six million dollar man???

 

[SocialistMD]

It's extremely funny to me that PD's original post was closed when he wasn't "pushing" his beliefs on anyone while other contraversial threads remain open. Funny, how people who work so hard for tolerance and open mindedness choose not to be tolerant or open minded about Christian beliefs. It's funny how so many people just want for others to listen to their point of view but rarely take the time to listen to others. It's funny how many times scientific views have changed over the course of the last 3,000 years and even more so over the most recent 100, while the Bible hasn't ever changed or been amended for nearly 2000 years and millions still believe it to be accurate to the last word. Funny how easy it is to be mean to Christians when your not sitting face to face with them. That's all funny right??? I'm not laughing.

 

[NEATOMD]

Seriously. I'll admit my history knowledge is a little rusty, but I know daVinci predated the theory of evolution by at least one hundred years.

Oh, so apparently, you think people have only opposed Christianity since evolution. Or are you implying that science has only been around since evolution?

 

[stinkycheese]

Just FYI, "liberal" and "accepting of homosexuals" does not automatically equate to "anti-Christian." If I remember my "anti-Christian comment" clearly, I think said something along the lines of that Duke has a really strong Divinity school, which happens to have a branch in the LGBT Center, because yes, some Christians and theologens actually do believe that homosexuality is okay according to the Bible.

That's all I have left to say about that, because that thread has already been shut down and is over.

On the other hand, to answer your question, like I said, Duke has a very strong Divinity school with a Methodist affiliation (Duke itself is no longer affiliated, but the history remains.). The Duke Chapel, which is a breathtaking piece of architecture, is the main centerpiece on campus and if viewed from above, forms a gigantic Christian cross. Thus, I would definitely hesitate to list Duke as "anti-Christian" as Campus Crusade For Christ and IVY are two hugely populated clubs by both graduate and undergraduate students.

I can't believe I bought Psycho's claim that someone had made an anti-Christian remark... I went and read the thread and it is clearly not remotely about that. His sense of what is going on in the world is so warped!!! I recant any supportive statements I made to him about Duke... sheesh.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

It's extremely funny to me that PD's original post was closed when he wasn't "pushing" his beliefs on anyone while other contraversial threads remain open. Funny, how people who work so hard for tolerance and open mindedness choose not to be tolerant or open minded about Christian beliefs. It's funny how so many people just want for others to listen to their point of view but rarely take the time to listen to others. It's funny how many times scientific views have changed over the course of the last 3,000 years and even more so over the most recent 100, while the Bible hasn't ever changed or been amended for nearly 2000 years and millions still believe it to be accurate to the last word. Funny how easy it is to be mean to Christians when you're not sitting face to face with them. That's all funny right??? I'm not laughing.

great post, too bad all those intolerant people aren't listening

 

[liverotcod]

Oh, so apparently, you think people have only opposed Christianity since evolution. Or are you implying that science has only been around since evolution?

I think the point was that a majority of scientists have accepted macroevolution as the most viable explanation for the diversity of species on the earth since Darwin published the epiphanic Origin of Species.

 

[SocialistMD]

Oh, so apparently, you think people have only opposed Christianity since evolution. Or are you implying that science has only been around since evolution?

The list is supposedly a list of scientists who believe in creationism. The only real alternative is evolution. Thus, I think it is kind of silly to post the names of "creationists" who died before the theory of evolution (namely, Darwin's work) was proposed.

But here's to your religious fervor.

 

[Centrum]

Just come on down to Tejas. We tend to really dig your kind here. Bush sickers and Jesus fish are joined on the back of huge trucks and SUV's. Here is to the future!

 

[Reckoning]

The list is supposedly a list of scientists who believe in creationism. The only real alternative is evolution. Thus, I think it is kind of silly to post the names of "creationists" who died before the theory of evolution (namely, Darwin's work) was proposed.

But here's to your religious fervor.

Wait, are you an objectivist, a la Ayn Rand, AND a socialist?

 

[SocialistMD]

Wait, are you an objectivist, a la Ayn Rand, AND a socialist?

Crazy, isn't it?!?

And no, I'm not what you would consider a socialist.

 

[Acherona]

which is most Christian friendly? Which ostracizes them?

Cornell

MSSM

NYMC

Columbia

NYU

Vandy

Wake

Duke (probably not from what I read on other threads)

They might ostracize you if you try to hug everyone during orientation.

I'm not tolerant of future doctors who believe in creationism (god help us) and I'm probably going to a school in NYC.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

Just FYI, "liberal" and "accepting of homosexuals" does not automatically equate to "anti-Christian." If I remember my "anti-Christian comment" clearly, I think said something along the lines of that Duke has a really strong Divinity school, which happens to have a branch in the LGBT Center, because yes, some Christians and theologens actually do believe that homosexuality is okay according to the Bible.

That's all I have left to say about that, because that thread has already been shut down and is over.

On the other hand, to answer your question, like I said, Duke has a very strong Divinity school with a Methodist affiliation (Duke itself is no longer affiliated, but the history remains.). The Duke Chapel, which is a breathtaking piece of architecture, is the main centerpiece on campus and if viewed from above, forms a gigantic Christian cross. Thus, I would definitely hesitate to list Duke as "anti-Christian" as Campus Crusade For Christ and IVY are two hugely populated clubs by both graduate and undergraduate students.

oh my gosh..why don't you inclue the insulting comment you made. It's nice to see you conveniently left it out

I like how the next program coming soon is "Steps to Recovery from Bible Abuse." Before anyone bites my head off, I'd like to remind them that Duke has an incredibley renowned Divinity School (which has a branch in the LGBT center), and these are academic theologens who've studied the Bible longer than you've been alive...so keep an open mind, guys.

and we're supposed to view you as credible????

 

[Psycho Doctor]

I can't believe I bought Psycho's claim that someone had made an anti-Christian remark... I went and read the thread and it is clearly not remotely about that. His sense of what is going on in the world is so warped!!! I recant any supportive statements I made to him about Duke... sheesh.

read it all

I like how the next program coming soon is "Steps to Recovery from Bible Abuse." Before anyone bites my head off, I'd like to remind them that Duke has an incredibley renowned Divinity School (which has a branch in the LGBT center), and these are academic theologens who've studied the Bible longer than you've been alive...so keep an open mind, guys.

 

[midwesternguy]

Just FYI, "liberal" and "accepting of homosexuals" does not automatically equate to "anti-Christian."

I totally agree, and think that we need to define Christian. I was brought up as a Unitarian (I consider myself to be Christian), a denomination that has long accepted gays both in the congregation and the ministry. Before we lump all Christians in together, lets figure out who goes to church where.

 

[Psycho Doctor]

I totally agree, and think that we need to define Christian. I was brought up as a Unitarian (I consider myself to be Christian), a denomination that has long accepted gays both in the congregation and the ministry. Before we lump all Christians in together, lets figure out who goes to church where.

huh? Last I knew going to church does not make one a Christian. A church can call itself Christian and teach everything against the Bible and it would not be a true Christian church. maybe we better just leave it to God....

 

[CarleneM]

hey psychodoc,
i believe you'll have tolerant and intolerant people wherever you end up for medical school. such is life. also, going into a scientific discipline such as medicine, you are always going to run into people (myself included) who are very skeptical of many religions. i'd like to think that most of us in med school can be respectful of others beliefs though so as long as you are respectful of our beliefs I think you won't run into too much trouble. maybe some good debates but that makes life interesting. i'm very surprised you did not apply to schools with christian affiliations like georgetown since it seems like you want to make christianity a big part of your medical education. i would definitely look to see if the schools you have applied to have strong on campus christian groups for other medical students and maybe contact the chairperson of each group to get a better sense of the atmosphere.

-Carlene

 

[Psycho Doctor]

hey psychodoc,
i believe you'll have tolerant and intolerant people wherever you end up for medical school. such is life. also, going into a scientific discipline such as medicine, you are always going to run into people (myself included) who are very skeptical of many religions. i'd like to think that most of us in med school can be respectful of others beliefs though so as long as you are respectful of our beliefs I think you won't run into too much trouble. maybe some good debates but that makes life interesting. i'm very surprised you did not apply to schools with christian affiliations like georgetown since it seems like you want to make christianity a big part of your medical education. i would definitely look to see if the schools you have applied to have strong on campus christian groups for other medical students and maybe contact the chairperson of each group to get a better sense of the atmosphere.

-Carlene

I was not looking to go to a Christian school per se; I actually enjoy diversity. I also know most of the schools I applied to have Christian organizations and Iknow I would find a well grounded church. i was trying to ascertain acceptance by those who may not believe in the same things as i do. The intolerance of Christians on sdn made me more aware how they could easily be ostracized in med school.

 

[Brain]

great post, too bad all those intolerant people aren't listening

And you consider yourself tolerant??

 

[SocialistMD]

huh? Last I knew going to church does not make one a Christian. A church can call itself Christian and teach everything against the Bible and it would not be a true Christian church. maybe we better just leave it to God....

You remind me of a former member of SDN, Col 4:14. He was a great guy who was very smart and very devout in his faith. He also had trouble seeing where his defense of his religion made him as bad as the people flaming him. We used to go around and around on issues back in the golden age of SDN and he would end up posting quips based on one line of a message and work himself up over nothing. What reminded me of him is that when he ran out of clever things to say, he would end is posts with something like "maybe we better just leave it to God..." just like you My point here isn't to antagonize you, but to remember a long-lost SDN favorite.

Here's to you, Col... (three thumb salute)

 

[tinkerbelle]

You are new on this site ?

i was being serious. a lot of sdners are really sweet and helpful.

 

[SocialistMD]

The intolerance of Christians on sdn made me more aware how they could easily be ostracized in med school.

Seriously, you are basing how intolerant people in med school will be of Christians on the postings of faceless pre-meds? Wow. Wow.

Religion is not a big deal in class, and people in medical school are tolerant of other views. I am in the same boat as you, except reversed; I am an agnostic at a medical school in Texas. It isn't a big deal until you begin to preach your ideas to others. The antagonism comes more as a result of not wanting to be told how to live one's life than a hatred of religion or one's religious beliefs (unless you get into the whole "my religion says I should spread it's word, etc...). The truth is, there are much more important things about which to worry in medical school than someone else's religious beliefs.

Edit: Oh, I forgot...

 

[Reckoning]

Crazy, isn't it?!?

And no, I'm not what you would consider a socialist.

Good, because I told Ayn and she was PISSED.

 

[midwesternguy]

huh? Last I knew going to church does not make one a Christian. A church can call itself Christian and teach everything against the Bible and it would not be a true Christian church. maybe we better just leave it to God....

I undersand your point, but by that measure what are "true Christian churches?" Catholic? Mormon? Eastern Orthodox? Unitarian? Who decides?

 

[SocialistMD]

Good, because I told Ayn and she was PISSED.

Whatever, she knows what's up.

 

[tinkerbelle]

i'm very surprised you did not apply to schools with christian affiliations like georgetown since it seems like you want to make christianity a big part of your medical education.

You know, i was actually really surprised at how gtown tried to play down its Catholic roots. They almost seemed ashamed of being Catholic. I sat through the presentation thinking whhhhhhat??? But anyways.... maybe i just interviewed on a wierd day or maybe i misinterpreted stuff.

 

[funshine]

which is most Christian friendly? Which ostracizes them?

Cornell

MSSM

NYMC

Columbia

NYU

Vandy

Wake

Duke (probably not from what I read on other threads)

I think it's pretty easy to find a hardcore Xtian group on any of those campuses, if that's what you're looking for. You'll always find ppl who disagree with you, no matter where you go though
And profs tend to be more liberal, but I don't know if that's true for med schools.

 

[tinkerbelle]

Me neither! It seems dumber to me when people say, "because evolution happened, that negates creationism." Nothing really negates G-d. He's not a scientific theory, he's a belief, and it's called faith because we just don't know. Those who choose to believe that G-d created the world don't neglect the theory of evolution at all -- at least, I don't -- G-d is all-powerful and his seven "days" of creation could have lasted millions and millions of years! He was the only one in the world around to see it, after all. And why wouldn't He make an intelligent design? He is all-knowing. I have always believed that evolution is absolutely true, but that it was guided by the Lord.

well said stinkycheese

 

[CarleneM]

yeah seriously, people will say a lot on an anonymous forum that they won't say in real life. i mean there have been a lot of sexist, racist, homophobic posts up on here since i've been here but i don't think med school is going to be a particularly intolerant and offensive place. i think this is just like any other anonymous message board on the web. from craigslist to fan sites, people use these things to say really ugly things. i bet if you met most of these people in real life you wouldn't even know their beliefs on creationism, women in medicine, etc unless you specifically asked and even then you'd probably get a way more watered down and respectful response then they post on here.

Seriously, you are basing how intolerant people in med school will be of Christians on the postings of faceless pre-meds? Wow. Wow.

 

[aprilshyla]

oh my gosh..why don't you inclue the insulting comment you made. It's nice to see you conveniently left it out



and we're supposed to view you as credible????

PD!! Calm down! The world is not out to attack Christians!

Let's go line by line.

I like how the next program coming soon is "Steps to Recovery from Bible Abuse."
Did you check out the program? Do you realize it is not a Bible-bashing program, but rather a talk about homosexuality and the Bible, and how people interpret it different ways, and some use it to justify homophobia? Did you realize I brought this up out of irony, since it was the exact debate we were all in?


Before anyone bites my head off, I'd like to remind them that Duke has an incredibley renowned Divinity School (which has a branch in the LGBT center), and these are academic theologens who've studied the Bible longer than you've been alive...so keep an open mind, guys.
We were in a head biting off mode. This was my disclaimer. And me trying to make the argument that quoting a few Bible verses doesn't prove anything when there's people studying this stuff their entire life. That the idea to life, is to keep an open mind.

Take a deep breath, dood. I apologize if I somehow insulted you (maybe I'm a little slow, but tell me what is offensive here? I sincerely would like to know.).

and if you're going to judge Duke solely by a post I made, should I judge all Christians by the 300 posts you've made?

 

[Wiggy73]

right, neither are proven facts

feel free to google the dates, I don't have the time, nor do i feel the need to do so...

Oh, PD, tell me you did not mean what I think you mean about a theory. The popular definition of "theory" (by which most people really mean "hypothesis") is not what scientists mean by one. Theories are explanations of observable phenomena that have been so thoroughly tested that they're basically not going to "disproven," at least regarding the core points. Evolution is a theory like gravity is a theory.

 

[Dr.LeoSpaceman]

It's extremely funny to me that PD's original post was closed when he wasn't "pushing" his beliefs on anyone while other contraversial threads remain open. Funny, how people who work so hard for tolerance and open mindedness choose not to be tolerant or open minded about Christian beliefs. It's funny how so many people just want for others to listen to their point of view but rarely take the time to listen to others. It's funny how many times scientific views have changed over the course of the last 3,000 years and even more so over the most recent 100, while the Bible hasn't ever changed or been amended for nearly 2000 years and millions still believe it to be accurate to the last word. Funny how easy it is to be mean to Christians when you're not sitting face to face with them. That's all funny right??? I'm not laughing.

Science has indeed changed over the past 3000 years. But thats not the fault of science, its a result of the incorporation of new ideas when evidence merits. The Bible hasn't changed, however, because its not an evidence-based thing for those who really believe. The Bible is an article of faith, and so some people will always beleive what the Bible says, regardless of any factual informaton that may seem to contradict it. And are you saying the Bible is accurate to the last word? If so, thats kind of scary, considering the Bible seems to contradict itself in many many places.

And you mention tolerance, and how people are "mean" to christians. The reasons people lash out at Christian beliefs is because no one likes things force fed to them. Most people are very open to a dialog about an issue. With some Christains however, there isno dialog. If you don't agree, you are evil and going to hell. If a Christian can have that outlook, why can't anyone else?

And I go to a Catholic University, with many holding very convservative Christian beliefs. I get along with the vast majority of them, and many are my friends. But to those who feel the need to tell me whats right and wrong, and why what I think is evil, I will tell them they are full of horse $#&! to their face.

 

[heeter]

PsychoDoctor is a 3000+ poster who has contributed a lot to SDN. Some bad (in my opinion) and some good. It's not really possible to dismiss someone who isn't activerly attempting to disrupt the community, and I think PD is well-intentioned. You can certainly ignore him, if you want to avoid conflict.

Ok, let's see what PsychoDoctor says -
"The intolerance of Christians on sdn made me more aware how they could easily be ostracized in med school."

So, we are to believe PD was shocked, shocked! to see the level of intolerance at SDN.

Scene: PsychoDoctor's brain. Afternoon.
PD: "My stars! Good Christians must fight the current to preach their views on an anonymous website devoted to premeds! Can I truly be happy at ANY med school? Will I be 'ostracized'?"

No, I think it went like this -
PD: "I'm sick of the gays and other undesireables bashing me for hating them! I know, I'll post a list of the most liberal schools, ask a dumb question, and troll for feebs to bite!"

Edit: I'll ignore him just fine. I'm just surprised people here are so gullible.

 

[GuyLaroche]

Why on earth are supposedly intelligent people sitting around musing about something so scientifically baseless as "faith"? Religion amounts to simply an attempt to excuse the inability of the human mind to use the remaining 95% of its brain potential. Who cares when the world started or what some age-old book of rules says. The time of reference is now, and your purpose (at least mine is anyway) is to get into a profession that aids the sick, and helps in the healing of a wounded world. Being a doctor has little to do with explaining the universe from a divine perspective or preaching from a pulpit. Quite frankly, I think all fundamentalist religions are disgusting and do a disservice to the advancement of the human race. Why is it that regardless of how much we advance, we are just incapable of moving away from the coven and the cauldron?

I believe it was Thomas Jefferson who said: "... He is less remote from the truth he who believes in nothing than he who believes in something that is wrong." For all we know, this religious, man-made institution may be entirely a fallacy.

In a different address, he added: "It is surely time for men to think for themselves, and to throw off the authority of names so artificially magnified."

So, please, please, please think people. Stop all this religious talk. This is medicine, saving lives through the application of rational science void of spirits and doves flying over waters and what ever else a listless mind (as I imagine they must have been in that era) can conjure.

 

[JDAD]

Why on earth are supposedly intelligent people sitting around musing about something so scientifically baseless as "faith"? Religion amounts to simply an attempt to excuse the inability of the human mind to use the remaining 95% of its brain potential. Who cares when the world started or what some age-old book of rules says. The time of reference is now, and your purpose (at least mine is anyway) is to get into a profession that aids the sick, and helps in the healing of a wounded world. Being a doctor has little to do with explaining the universe from a divine perspective or preaching from a pulpit. Quite frankly, I think all fundamentalist religions are disgusting and do a disservice to the advancement of the human race. Why is it that regardless of how much we advance, we are just incapable of moving away from the coven and the cauldron?

I believe it was Thomas Jefferson who said: "... He is less remote from the truth he who believes in nothing than he who believes in something that is wrong." For all we know, this religious, man-made institution may be entirely a fallacy.

In a different address, he added: "It is surely time for men to think for themselves, and to throw off the authority of names so artificially magnified."

So, please, please, please think people. Stop all this religious talk. This is medicine, saving lives through the application of rational science void of spirits and doves flying over waters and what ever else a listless mind (as I imagine they must have been in that era) can conjure.

You need to find Jesus

 

[GuyLaroche]

You need to find Jesus

This is the funniest post ever. I had no idea Jesus was lost. Perhaps he needs to find me.

 

[tinkerbelle]

So, please, please, please think people. Stop all this religious talk. This is medicine, saving lives through the application of rational science void of spirits and doves flying over waters and what ever else a listless mind (as I imagine they must have been in that era) can conjure.

i know religious talk gets on some people's nevers (mine too sometimes)... but it sounds like you're saying medicine should be completely void of religion. And that will never happen for a lot of people. Religion is a big part of who some people are... and your beliefs will play a role in how you practice medicine. And rational science isn't necessarily void of religion either.

 

[JDAD]

This is the funniest post ever. I had no idea Jesus was lost. Perhaps he needs to find me.

Jesus isn't lost, and he never will be. I predict one day, you, (yes you, the amazing Guy LaDouche) will encounter his presence. When that happens, you will understand.

 

[IAMS]

great post, too bad all those intolerant people aren't listening

And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thy say to thy brother, "Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?" Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.

 

[GuyLaroche]

I just think that the religious awakening in this country is quite baffling to me. I find solace in reading the opinions of Thomas Jefferson - my very own Messiah. I own a copy of the book "In the pursuit of reason: the life of Thomas Jefferson." It is quite a good read, and it amazingly addresses a lot of the issues that we are contending with today with the most simple, direct method: logic. In reference to the political religious movement, a quote from Jefferson seems apt: "It is error alone that needs the support of government. Truth can stand by itself".

 

[tinkerbelle]

I just think that the religious awakening in this country is quite baffling to me. I find solace in reading the opinions of Thomas Jefferson - my very own Messiah. I own a copy of the book "In the pursuit of reason: the life of Thomas Jefferson." It is quite a good read, and it amazingly addresses a lot of the issues that we are contending with today with the most simple, direct method: logic. In reference to the political religious movement, a quote from Jefferson seems apt: "It is error alone that needs the support of government. Truth can stand by itself".

well, whatever works for ya

 

[Blake]

And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Or how wilt thy say to thy brother, "Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?" Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.

Well, the entertainment makes up for the lack of serious conversation.

 

[IAMS]

Well, the entertainment makes up for the lack of serious conversation.

Umm... I am serious.

 

[tacrum43]

The time of reference is now, and your purpose (at least mine is anyway) is to get into a profession that aids the sick, and helps in the healing of a wounded world. Being a doctor has little to do with explaining the universe from a divine perspective or preaching from a pulpit.

I believe it was Thomas Jefferson who said: "... He is less remote from the truth he who believes in nothing than he who believes in something that is wrong." For all we know, this religious, man-made institution may be entirely a fallacy.

So, please, please, please think people. Stop all this religious talk. This is medicine, saving lives through the application of rational science void of spirits and doves flying over waters and what ever else a listless mind (as I imagine they must have been in that era) can conjure.

It's nice for you (apparently) that you have removed anything spiritual from your life, but I think you'll see that many of your future patients have not. Being a doctor includes dealing with issues of life and death, which are topics beyond our current scientific understanding (and may always be that way). I just hope that one day when a patient of yours dies and his/her family asks you to pray with them you won't quote Thomas Jefferson.

 

[Kazema]

I've got two things to say, one about religion in general and one comment to PsychoDoc.

First, about religion: I have absolutely no problem with religion, I think it's wonderful to be spiritually active and to really, truly believe with all your heart in something. It's something I really wish I had in my own life; I'm still looking for a religion that I really connect with, but admit that I haven't made a huge effort to find it. Universalist Unitarianism sounds pretty cool to me though .

I grew up attending a Methodist church. What drove my family away was the kind of intolerance most non-Christians associate with conservative (esp. fundamentalist) Christians - i.e. homosexuality is a sin, all other religions are wrong and people who aren't Christians are all going to Hell, etc. I remember one family "friend" remarked to my mother -- when a Buddhist group that, at their own expense, flew in to perform Buddhist funeral rites for my father (my father's family is Buddhist) -- how wrong it was to have Buddhists performing the rites because that would doom my father's soul to Hell or something to that nature. It's those kinds of experiences that sour a lot of people from Christianity.

NOT ALL CHRISTIANS ARE LIKE THIS THOUGH! I realize this, and my only problem is with the people who feel the need to save everyone from themselves. If you're talking to someone who is homosexual and is not a Christian, don't talk to them about how homosexuality is a sin. If you're attending a funeral of someone with Buddhist family members, don't talk about how Buddhists are all Satan-worshippers and are going to Hell. They don't care! They don't want to care! Keep your opinions to yourself! Have a little tact!

I don't care if you think homosexuality is a sin, PsychoDoc. Just don't go expressing that opinion to every gay person you see on SDN (and real life for that matter). I try to avoid posting replies to everything I disagree with you (or anyone else) about, but I do have a problem when you try to take over a forum and make it your own. You did that while waiting for your MCAT score and you're doing it now spouting (no better word really) your beliefs about homosexuality and your belief (somewhat justified) that you're being persecuted for your Christian beliefs. Yes, people are coming after you rather harshly, but you've brought it on yourself at least partially.