PA to MD/DO?

[8744]

I found some of the post here so immature....it's funny how some PA just don't have no clue of MD training hence try to make comparison...it's also funny how some MD resident or what not who just have no clue of PA training (for example..how rigorous it is...) or who maybe are following their dad's foot steps or family tradition...like i read in some post a resident saying my dad is a doctor..blah..blah...blahhhhhhhhh who cares.
J Bone: You're making so much noise. If I were you (just like I'm currently doing), I will keep my mouth shot...study hard for the MCAT then apply...
Panta Bear: I would strongly recommend that you focus on your residency training. Don't comment on what you don't know much about.

My fiance is a pediatrician (resident)...and I'm a fourth yr PA and we both have a lot of respect for each others training....this is all b/c she saw how hard I study just as she did while in medical sch...mind you, I'm not trying to make any freaking comparison....

enough is enough!

Why should I concentrate on residency training? I mean, since "Two Equals Eight," even allowing for the lack of rigor of my now seven years of medical training (four in medical school and three in residency), I figure everything I have learned for the last four years is just "useless stuff" of no clinical benefit. My dream, obviously, at this point in my career is to be allowed to practice as PA.

Do you think I'm qualified? Do you think I could get any credit for some of those community-college level courses I took in medical school if I apply to PA school? I mean, I still have one year left of residency but maybe if I got credit for gross anatomy and some of the other courses I could instead finish PA school in a year and come out way ahead.

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[J Bone]

princekc, thanks for the link, should help a lot. Not let me ask you. If I got a 20 on the MCAT, how do you think I did on VR??? Thanks for the info on med schools not concerned about me being an orthopedic PA earning over 100K. I am so amazed at how smart you are.
In reference to the above post, I quote, My biggest fear with all of this is the MCAT. I have no worries about med school itself because PA school gave me a wonderful background. PA school gives you a WONDERFUL background in medicine. Although I only graduated from PA school with a 3.8, since the B in genetics killed me, I sort of thought that maybe medical school would be a little easier for me than say a 21 year old liberal arts major with no medical background. Did I say it would be a piece of cake, NOOO! Just to let YOU know, medical school doesn't care about what happened to you in Africa either. It would be great if you minded your own business and left this thread to people that are trying to better themselves. I don't really care if some resident opens his mouth about me or PA's. SO WHAT! That person has too much time on his or her hands also. They obviously have a pretty easy residency. Of course, I guess I have a lot of time on my hands too, replying to these stupid comments.

 

[8744]

princekc, thanks for the link, should help a lot. Not let me ask you. If I got a 20 on the MCAT, how do you think I did on VR??? Thanks for the info on med schools not concerned about me being an orthopedic PA earning over 100K. I am so amazed at how smart you are.
In reference to the above post, I quote, My biggest fear with all of this is the MCAT. I have no worries about med school itself because PA school gave me a wonderful background. PA school gives you a WONDERFUL background in medicine. Although I only graduated from PA school with a 3.8, since the B in genetics killed me, I sort of thought that maybe medical school would be a little easier for me than say a 21 year old liberal arts major with no medical background. Did I say it would be a piece of cake, NOOO! Just to let YOU know, medical school doesn't care about what happened to you in Africa either. It would be great if you minded your own business and left this thread to people that are trying to better themselves. I don't really care if some resident opens his mouth about me or PA's. SO WHAT! That person has too much time on his or her hands also. They obviously have a pretty easy residency. Of course, I guess I have a lot of time on my hands too, replying to these stupid comments.

Come on now. Statements were made. People come to SDN to hear opinions on various topics. Comments are made on the statements. Debate ensues People are edified and entertained. No need to get snarky. If you don't want to hear opinions on your opinions don't post 'em.

For the record, my residency, while not easy, now that I am almost done, has pretty decent hours.

 

[J Bone]

I found some of the post here so immature....it's funny how some PA just don't have no clue of MD training hence try to make comparison...it's also funny how some MD resident or what not who just have no clue of PA training (for example..how rigorous it is...) or who maybe are following their dad's foot steps or family tradition...like i read in some post a resident saying my dad is a doctor..blah..blah...blahhhhhhhhh who cares.
J Bone: You're making so much noise. If I were you (just like I'm currently doing), I will keep my mouth shot...study hard for the MCAT then apply...
Panta Bear: I would strongly recommend that you focus on your residency training. Don't comment on what you don't know much about.

enough is enough!

Does this have anything to do with this post???? It is like some 4th grade kid got on the forum and shot their mouth off. Everyone is allowed an opinion, however, that is not what this thread was about. Overall, besides the last few days, it has served a purpose for me and many others. If I wanted to debate on PA School vs. Medical School, PA Salary, DO schools, etc, I would have started a NEW thread on that. I guess I don't see how "some of the post here so immature." Maybe this person posted in the wrong area. Judging by the english, which I am by no means an ace, I would say YES!
As for Panda Bear, you can have your opinion about PA's.

 

[MaximusD]

I found some of the post here so immature....it's funny how some PA just don't have no clue of MD training hence try to make comparison...it's also funny how some MD resident or what not who just have no clue of PA training (for example..how rigorous it is...) or who maybe are following their dad's foot steps or family tradition...like i read in some post a resident saying my dad is a doctor..blah..blah...blahhhhhhhhh who cares.
J Bone: You're making so much noise. If I were you (just like I'm currently doing), I will keep my mouth shot...study hard for the MCAT then apply...
Panta Bear: I would strongly recommend that you focus on your residency training. Don't comment on what you don't know much about.

My fiance is a pediatrician (resident)...and I'm a fourth yr PA and we both have a lot of respect for each others training....this is all b/c she saw how hard I study just as she did while in medical sch...mind you, I'm not trying to make any freaking comparison....

enough is enough!

go back to college and take english composition. after that, memorize a dictionary. then, hang up and try your post again.

 

[princekc]

princekc, thanks for the link, should help a lot. Not let me ask you. If I got a 20 on the MCAT, how do you think I did on VR??? Thanks for the info on med schools not concerned about me being an orthopedic PA earning over 100K. I am so amazed at how smart you are.
In reference to the above post, I quote, My biggest fear with all of this is the MCAT. I have no worries about med school itself because PA school gave me a wonderful background. PA school gives you a WONDERFUL background in medicine. Although I only graduated from PA school with a 3.8, since the B in genetics killed me, I sort of thought that maybe medical school would be a little easier for me than say a 21 year old liberal arts major with no medical background. Did I say it would be a piece of cake, NOOO! Just to let YOU know, medical school doesn't care about what happened to you in Africa either. It would be great if you minded your own business and left this thread to people that are trying to better themselves. I don't really care if some resident opens his mouth about me or PA's. SO WHAT! That person has too much time on his or her hands also. They obviously have a pretty easy residency. Of course, I guess I have a lot of time on my hands too, replying to these stupid comments.

A perfect MCAT score is a 30 (10PS, 10BS, 10VR), but you scored 20. With regards to your question, you probably scored a 6 on VR.

If you're very intelligent, then why would MCAT be your greatest fear?

To states that you have no worries about medical sch itself because PA sch gave you a wonderful background shows a strong indication of your lack of knowledge about medical sch curriculum. Be aware that the first two years of medical sch curriculum are more in depth, more than what's thought in PA sch, hence you would need to study as hard as everyone else. PA sch training and your years of clinical experience as an orthopedic PA would surely come in handy during third & fourth year of medical sch (clerkship yr).

A graduating GPA of 3.8 from PA sch achieved during your last clinical year (Medicine,ortho,family med, Emergency med, pediatric, & geriatric rotation e.t.c...) can not be equated with a science GPA of 3.8, so your GPA would be looked at differently by most med sch and this is a fact! The genetic class might look good on your med sch application.

The notion that medical sch would be a little easier for you as suppose to a 21y.o liberal art major with no medical background may not be true. I do think that this comparison holds during clinical years.

Yes I am an African by origin, but I have never and would never use my nationality as a condition or as a reason I am applying to med sch. But you know what, I've came a long way and wasn't feed by a golden spoon like you. I strongly believed that my life experience and the obstacle that I have faced would surely make me a better & compassionate medical provided.

JBone: I'm a PA-s (4thyrstudent) in similar situation like you. I responded to your post after reading few and found your write-up to be too immature. Base on this note; I would strongly recommend that you spend most of your time prepping for the MCAT and stop your propaganda. You've shown that MCAT is your biggest fear as evidence by your MCAT score dated 2000; hence, the reason I am stressing that it's important that you focus on doing well on the MCAT, score higher to be competitive and the rest would follows.

 

[princekc]

Does this have anything to do with this post???? It is like some 4th grade kid got on the forum and shot their mouth off. Everyone is allowed an opinion, however, that is not what this thread was about. Overall, besides the last few days, it has served a purpose for me and many others. If I wanted to debate on PA School vs. Medical School, PA Salary, DO schools, etc, I would have started a NEW thread on that. I guess I don't see how "some of the post here so immature." Maybe this person posted in the wrong area. Judging by the english, which I am by no means an ace, I would say YES!
As for Panda Bear, you can have your opinion about PA's.

I honestly did not think it worth taking the time to edit my post when all you were saying was rubbish! Mind you, you made a lot of grammatical error in your previous post.

 

[jcampbell]

Perhaps we can all take a break from this banter and continue to actually discuss the process of a PA/PA Student in his/her attempts at medical school acceptance...

How is everyone doing, registered and studying for the MCAT?

 

[princekc]

Perhaps we can all take a break from this banter and continue to actually discuss the process of a PA/PA Student in his/her attempts at medical school acceptance...

How is everyone doing, registered and studying for the MCAT?

Thanks for the post jcampbell.

Yes, I've register and studying for the MCAT(schedule in September). I was just recently offer an ER job (ER-PA to be) and would not start the job not until after the MCAT exam.

 

[J Bone]

A perfect MCAT score is a 30 (10PS, 10BS, 10VR), but you scored 20. With regards to your question, you probably scored a 6 on VR.

If you're very intelligent, then why would MCAT be your greatest fear?

Could someone explain to me how a 30 is a perfect score? Is there a different MCAT that I am not aware of? Because it is my understanding that a perfect MCAT score is 45!

I am not sure what kind of PA school you are in or if it is really a Physician Assistant school. Most PA's are required to have an undergrad degree before entering PA school. So, how you are a 4th year PA does not make any sense to me. Maybe you were held back a couple of years. Of course my PA GPA doesn't correlate to a science GPA, that is what my science GPA is for. For your information, and please excuse the grammer because I am too lazy to run a spell check, I graduated with a Double major in Kinesology and Physicial Education and minors in chemistry and biology. Oh, magna cum laude BTW! After that, I then went on to recieve a B.S. in PA studies with a Masters in Medical Science. So, 3 B.S. degrees and 1 Masters. Does anyone care? No. My point? I don't know. The MCAT scares me for obvoius reasons...a 20!!! I think that would piss anyone off. This was 8 years ago. I am not the best with standarized tests.

jcampbell, you are correct. I am sorry for the immature post. Certain things tend to get under my skin. People like princekc, who obviously have no clue what they are talking about, get to me. Sorry guys!!

 

[Blade28]

Thanks for the post jcampbell.

Yes, I've register and studying for the MCAT(schedule in September). I was just recently offer an ER job (ER-PA to be) and would not start the job not until after the MCAT exam.

Will you have a Bachelor's Degree (or be close to completing one) by the time you apply to med school?

IIRC, you completed an Associate's before going to PA school?

 

[Dr 14220]

obviously, physicians have longer, more in depth training than PAs. anyone who argues this point is kidding themselves.

that said, i think already having gone through PA school would definately help during medical school! how could it not?? you're taking many classes that you are already familiar with the material. sure med school classes are more in depth than PA classes, but a PA likely has a great science foundation. same goes for clinical skills. i would think that having completed a PA curriculum would be very advantageous while in medical school.

good luck with it....

 

[J Bone]

obviously, physicians have longer, more in depth training than PAs. anyone who argues this point is kidding themselves.

that said, i think already having gone through PA school would definately help during medical school! how could it not?? you're taking many classes that you are already familiar with the material. sure med school classes are more in depth than PA classes, but a PA likely has a great science foundation. same goes for clinical skills. i would think that having completed a PA curriculum would be very advantageous while in medical school.

good luck with it....

FINALLY, someone that knows what they are talking about!!
That was my WHOLE point with this post. I couldn't have said it any better Dr. 14220.

 

[princekc]

Will you have a Bachelor's Degree (or be close to completing one) by the time you apply to med school?

IIRC, you completed an Associate's before going to PA school?

I'm in a BS track PA program and would be graduating in May.

 

[princekc]

FINALLY, someone that knows what they are talking about!!
That was my WHOLE point with this post. I couldn't have said it any better Dr. 14220.

You just need to stop making fool of yourself!

 

[Blade28]

I'm in a BS track PA program and would be graduating in May.

I guess I'm confused...you're earning a PA degree AND a Bachelor's degree at the same time? At the same program?

I thought you needed a Bachelor's to go to PA school?

 

[jcampbell]

I guess I'm confused...you're earning a PA degree AND a Bachelor's degree at the same time? At the same program?

I thought you needed a Bachelor's to go to PA school?

You can graduate PA school with an associates, certificate, bachelor's, or master's degree. About 80% of PA programs are currently Master's degrees.

Some schools have a "fast track-direct acceptance" program where you are not required to have a bachelor's degree, ex.:

yr 1--undergrad
yr 2--undergrad
yr 3--undergrad
yr 4--PA didactic (will earn a bachelor of science at completion)
yr 5--PA clinical (will earn a master of PA at completion)

Others operate on a slightly different program--a bachelor only. Typically these programs recruit individuals who have extensive medical experience and are coming from another healthcare related profession.

The overall trend continues toward development of a Master's degree field with those grandfathered in who have already completed their education. Ex.--it is fairly easy to find job openings advertising "Master's in PA"

 

[Blade28]

Ah, thanks for the info!

 

[princekc]

You can graduate PA school with an associates, certificate, bachelor's, or master's degree. About 80% of PA programs are currently Master's degrees.

Some schools have a "fast track-direct acceptance" program where you are not required to have a bachelor's degree, ex.:

yr 1--undergrad
yr 2--undergrad
yr 3--undergrad
yr 4--PA didactic (will earn a bachelor of science at completion)
yr 5--PA clinical (will earn a master of PA at completion)

Others operate on a slightly different program--a bachelor only. Typically these programs recruit individuals who have extensive medical experience and are coming from another healthcare related profession.

The overall trend continues toward development of a Master's degree field with those grandfathered in who have already completed their education. Ex.--it is fairly easy to find job openings advertising "Master's in PA"

agreed!

For BS only track:
yr 1--undergrad
yr 2--undergrad
yr 3--PA didactic (this is when you learn real medicine)
yr 4--Clinical rotations- (BS in PA studies)

My sch recently switch to a BS/MS track

 

[deleted6669]

or the roundabout route.....
high school/ emt course
year 1-4 bs #1 ( while working 24 hrs/week as an er tech+ full time summers)
yr 5 paramedic school
insert yrs as a paramedic here
yr 6-8 pa school (bs #2)
start 1st pa job
yr 9 postgrad masters in pa(em focus)
insert yrs of em pa work here
yr 10 postmasters cert. in adv. clinical studies in family and emergency medicine
still thinking about more school...I get bored easily...MPH? DHSc?.....

 

[princekc]

or the roundabout route.....
high school/ emt course
year 1-4 bs #1 ( while working 24 hrs/week as an er tech+ full time summers)
yr 5 paramedic school
insert yrs as a paramedic here
yr 6-8 pa school (bs #2)
start 1st pa job
yr 9 postgrad masters in pa(em focus)
insert yrs of em pa work here
yr 10 postmasters cert. in adv. clinical studies in family and emergency medicine
still thinking about more school...I get bored easily...MPH? DHSc?.....

I would go for the DHSc. What do you think of Nova online MHSc? http://www.nova.edu/mhs/

 

[deleted6669]

I would go for the DHSc. What do you think of Nova online MHSc? http://www.nova.edu/mhs/

good program.
arizona school of health sciences has one as well and is is starting a dhsc this yr also.

 

[jcampbell]

New progress anyone? Took the MCAT today, boy wasn't that fun!

 

[FourMoreYears]

Taking MCAT on the 27th.
good times.
I've wanted to have a thread for midlevels applying to med school. I'm a PA myself.
How do you feel about the MCAT Jcampbell?

 

[jcampbell]

Taking MCAT on the 27th.
good times.
I've wanted to have a thread for midlevels applying to med school. I'm a PA myself.
How do you feel about the MCAT Jcampbell?

I didn't have much time to study, a few hours here and there, had to make it fit around my current PA training. I was able to review biology, chem, and o-chem. I thought the biology was very basic and straightforward. I spent a little too much time on the first few verbal reasoning passages so I had to rush the last two. I thought physical science was the most difficult--seemed to have a fair amount of physics which I hadn't reviewed. Guess I'll see what happens!

Best of luck!

 

[primadonna22274]

I'm retaking MCAT on June 13th. I took it last September and did not review nearly enough....20 S Although the "S" was far from shabby.
My weak point is definitely PS. It doesn't help that I haven't had physics since senior year HS, which was, well, 18 years ago.
I'm taking physics this summer but in general I've done everything backwards. I'm hoping to bring my score up to high 20s. I am not as concerned with 30s as I've had multiple physicians on DO adcoms tell me it's not as important in light of my whole "package".
We shall see though....

 

[princekc]

....as for me, I'm so tempted to take the MCAT in september but would rather postpone it to March or April 2009 as I need to focus on passing PANCE first. For those of you who will be taking the MCAT soon, Good luck.

jcampbell: how are you able to study for the mcat exam while in PA sch? what year are you?..

 

[jcampbell]

....as for me, I'm so tempted to take the MCAT in september but would rather postpone it to March or April 2009 as I need to focus on passing PANCE first. For those of you who will be taking the MCAT soon, Good luck.

jcampbell: how are you able to study for the mcat exam while in PA sch? what year are you?..

I just finished out my first year and start rotations on Tuesday. I studied in the morning and some evenings. I just found a balance and did what I could with keeping PA school my priority.

 

[princekc]

I just finished out my first year and start rotations on Tuesday. I studied in the morning and some evenings. I just found a balance and did what I could with keeping PA school my priority.

...you mean that you study for the MCAT during your didactic yr of PA sch? The reason why I ask is b/c the didactic is the most difficult yr. During my didactic yr, classes started at 8am-5pm and some days at 8pm and the lectures were longer; 3-4hrs w/ two 5 or 10min break. I would usually studied till 12midnight or latter...

I'm just curious, are you in a BS or BS/MS program? How long did you study for the MCAT?

thanks.

 

[FourMoreYears]

I just finished out my first year and start rotations on Tuesday. I studied in the morning and some evenings. I just found a balance and did what I could with keeping PA school my priority.

holy crap! How insane! Although I tried doing something similar during my clinical year. I can't fault you.
I hope you did well on the MCAT. It's a monster.

 

[jcampbell]

...you mean that you study for the MCAT during your didactic yr of PA sch? The reason why I ask is b/c the didactic is the most difficult yr. During my didactic yr, classes started at 8am-5pm and some days at 8pm and the lectures were longer; 3-4hrs w/ two 5 or 10min break. I would usually studied till 12midnight or latter...

I'm just curious, are you in a BS or BS/MS program? How long did you study for the MCAT?

thanks.

I'm in a Master's program with classes M-F from 8-5, sometimes longer for exams, practicals, etc. I kept up with the material from PA school as I went along and just incorporated the MCAT studying. Not sure of my overall amount of study time--I'll look at a calendar later and see if I can get an estimate. I was up every morning at 4:30 and in bed at the latest usually by 9. I'm a morning person so studying early wasn't an issue.

 

[jcampbell]

holy crap! How insane! Although I tried doing something similar during my clinical year. I can't fault you.
I hope you did well on the MCAT. It's a monster.

Thanks, I figure if I didn't do well enough on it, at least I'm familiar with the format of the exam and my strengths/weaknesses with it. If I need another shot, no worries! Did you enjoy your clinical year?

 

[princekc]

jcampbell: ...all that I can say is woooow! pls let us know how you did on the mcat.

 

[jcampbell]

jcampbell: ...all that I can say is woooow! pls let us know how you did on the mcat.

Will do, and if I need to take it again, no worries, I'll have time to work as a PA for awhile. I figure I've got a long life to live and will eventually meet my goal.

Best of luck to everyone, if it's worth anything, it's worth everything...

 

[jcampbell]

One thing that I'm finding very interesting right now is how my rotations are changing when my preceptor learns I want to go to medical school. Towards the end of the first week, I get the "you're young and smart, why PA and not medical school?" Then they get the obligatory "well, actually, I am going after med school now."

I'm on my fourth rotation now and after the preceptors learned this, it was time to up the ante. With the snap of fingers, I was given more responsibility than previous PA students at the rotation and "pimped" more. I'm enjoying it but don't like waiting to hear back about an interview!

Best of luck to all!

 

[Wash]

I am so glad to have found this forum. I hope this topic is still active. I am currently writing my dissertation to graduate this summer with a PhD in public health. I have clinical research experience and miss the patient interaction. I was recently accepted into a PA program to start in Jan 2010. However, I cannot decide if I want to go the PA route or the MD route. I am kinda older (39 in June), husband and 3 preteen kids. I plan to do patient care first and the some research and academia in the future.

I see lots of you here applying to MD school after PA due to hitting the 'glass ceiling'. The MD route, although satisfying is too long: 2 years postback (advisor says my Bio and Chem are too old + no good for MCATs), 4 years med school, 3 years residency = 9 years. Plus being away from my family and the debt is not too enticing.

With a PhD and PA-C, will I have better opportunities? Others have told me that doing PA now is backtracking. Should I go to PA school and then if I am dissatisfied go to MD school? I am afraid to give up my seat for next Jan and then not get into MD school.

Your thoughts are greatly appreciated.

 

[earthwalker7]

PA has always sounded like such a sweet deal to me. especially when compared to the many 'medical school/being a doctor isnt worth it anymore" opinions that seem to be common these days. its funny how you can never truly understand something until you experience it yourself......

I know there's many threads and posts on this, but I have to ask.
Especially since my struggle is deeply person (whose isn't) and while reading threads helps, I gotta ask the Forum myself.

Why are so many PAs on this thread so unhappy? What is the glass ceiling? Is it really so bad being a PA? Can't you make 100k+ as a cardiothoracic PA assisting in heart surgeries? Isn't the average around 100k for PAs? That's enough to raise a family in a decent middle class way. And you're helping people. Isn't that the goal?

I'm 31, I make 200k per year in the finance profession, which is ok, but I'm not really making a difference in the world, though the work is interesting (sometimes.)

I was an ER volunteer before, doing some simple proceedures, and loved it. But I lacked the courage and discipline to go through the pain of med school, especially since I was on a different track professionally, only to find that a dream deferred has pain all its own. And even at 25 everyone told me I was far too old to start med school.

Now I'm considering my current career up in the air and becoming a PA.
I can't spend 12 years of school, torturing my fiancee and any offspring we have eventually, and putting the whole family into financial disarray. I still have to support her monetarily. But I have saved up enough to bankroll a 2 year PA program. I still have 1 year of pre-reqs to do, but that's ok. Manageable.

I could switch careers and be helping people by the time I'm 34/35.
Maybe even specialize in cardiothoracic surgery thereafter.
That's pretty cool in itself.

so... why ARE the PAs so unhappy? Am I drinking some PA coolaid that whereby I feel 2 years training really is a lower cost to pay than 12? And yeah, I get that PAs get paid less than MDs, but I'm not in it for the $. I want to help people. Make a difference.


So, all the PAs switching to MD... why? Was it so bad as a PA? Is it all about the money? Is it a lack of respect? Patients still appreciate you. You're making a difference. What am I not seeing?

The thought of being a PA fills me with some hope... the idea that I can help heal without making my fiancee miserable and consigning my next generation to a life of never seeing daddy.

Drop some knowledge on me.

 

[dragonfly99]

earthwalker,
I think you just listed a bunch of reasons to be a PA that are good reasons.
I'm an MD, so can't give you advice specifically about being a PA, except that most people will respect you if you do your job well. Even if you are an MD/DO, don't think that everyone will respect you. There are some people (patients, some nurses, probably some other doctors, etc.) who are unpleasant in general and don't respect ANYONE, and being a MD/DO won't necessarily mean you get treated better. There are some things you can do as a MD/DO that you can't as a PA, and eventually the MD/DO will have a higher salary (but not, as you point out, for YEARS after med school) but also the trade-off is no residency, more sleep, better hours, less pressure and less medical liability risk.

Keep in mind that you will be very unlikely to make 200k as a PA, though, so be sure you are ready to give that up. Quite a few MD/DO's make nowhere near 200k as well, so that holds for the MD/DO route as well.

 

[bigpharmD]

earthwalker...the reasons some PAs go to med school is the same reason why other people in healthcare make the switch (pharmds, rns, etc) ...they want to be the boss. They want to have more responsibility, more decision making etc. I would caution all these PAs attempting this switch to remember that the grass isnt always greener.

To the Phd'er above, I would think long and hard about going back. I know you miss patient interaction but it doesnt take long to stop missing it. Many physicians go on and get the degree that you currently have so that they can branch out from patient care. I think you can have a large impact on healthcare with a Phd in public health.

I encourage everyone to read the general residency forum (I do) for additional opinions.

 

[dragonfly99]

I am so glad to have found this forum. I hope this topic is still active. I am currently writing my dissertation to graduate this summer with a PhD in public health. I have clinical research experience and miss the patient interaction. I was recently accepted into a PA program to start in Jan 2010. However, I cannot decide if I want to go the PA route or the MD route. I am kinda older (39 in June), husband and 3 preteen kids. I plan to do patient care first and the some research and academia in the future.

I see lots of you here applying to MD school after PA due to hitting the 'glass ceiling'. The MD route, although satisfying is too long: 2 years postback (advisor says my Bio and Chem are too old + no good for MCATs), 4 years med school, 3 years residency = 9 years. Plus being away from my family and the debt is not too enticing.

With a PhD and PA-C, will I have better opportunities? Others have told me that doing PA now is backtracking. Should I go to PA school and then if I am dissatisfied go to MD school? I am afraid to give up my seat for next Jan and then not get into MD school.

Your thoughts are greatly appreciated.

Actually, after I reread this I am wondering why the person wants to go to either PA or MD school. It seems like at age 39 with 3 kids and already having a PhD in a health related field, that it wouldn't be worth it...I mean financially and in terms of personal costs. I mean by the time you are in residency the kids will be in high school and you almost won't have time to see them. And you won't be able to have any money to help them out with college, etc. It seems like you could just get a more patient-oriented job with your PhD, perhaps something with coordinating clinical trials, etc. It seems like you might have a severe case of "grass is greener on the other side of the fence" syndrome. Ultimately it is your decision (along with your family) so you don't have to listen to me. I can tell you that med school and residency was a whole different ball of wax than any other job or classes (including grad school classes) that I have experienced. Not because you have to be particularly brilliant, but just because the amount of time you have to spend studying (and/or at work) is heinous.

 

[Wash]

It seems like you could just get a more patient-oriented job with your PhD, perhaps something with coordinating clinical trials, etc.

I have done clinical trials/research for 7 years. While I enjoyed it, I always felt limited without a clinical background. I have a great yeaning for medical knowledge that I can apply in practice and in clinic. Your argument aganist medical school is taken. What are your thoughts about PA school?
Thanks

 

[bigpharmD]

I have done clinical trials/research for 7 years. While I enjoyed it, I always felt limited without a clinical background. I have a great yeaning for medical knowledge that I can apply in practice and in clinic. Your argument aganist medical school is taken. What are your thoughts about PA school?
Thanks

I think PA school will give you the clinical knowledge you are looking for

 

[dragonfly99]

I think PA school would be significantly better...but I'm not sure how PA's involve themselves in research, etc. You'd have to ask more PA's about that. I mean, I'm really not sure what you can do as a PA working in clinical trials that you couldn't do as a PhD...that's what I'm getting at. I mean, you'll be able to take blood, etc. but I'm not sure that's worth another 2-3 years of school just to be able to do a few more things like that.

I've never gone to PA school so I can't tell you how time consuming it is. I'm sure it's not a walk in the park. I have worked with some PA students on clinical rotations, and they generally did some of the same stuff we med students did, except had fewer duties (i.e. not as many patients to work up) and the grading seemed a lot more relaxed. They also didn't make them stay up all night on call. This is just the one PA school I am familiar with. The main thing would be shorter schooling, but really the lack of residency is the main thing, because being a resident is kind of like being in school and having a job at the same time, and the time commitment is just huge, and the problem is you don't have control over your schedule really. You're kind of a slave to a pre-ordained schedule that you didn't really have a hand in creating, in most cases.