PCOM PsyD????

[dynamicpsyd]

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Has anyone heard from PCOM PsyD? I haven't been invited for an interview or rejected, but I called and they said they "interview until the cohort is filled, up until July". What's up with that? Anybody decline/waitlist/rejected from PCOM?

Thanks so much!

 

[psychgirl86]

I am wondering the same thing. I haven't been invited for an interview and no rejection letter yet. Glad to know i'm not the only one...but it's pretty late in the application cycle already...??

 

[Psychgirl757]

The school is rolling admission. They're still in the process of interviewing candidates. I interviewed back in Jan. They told me that they would re-evaluate the waitlist end of May. Not holding my breathe on them.

 

[psychMOC]

i received an interview invite via email just yesterday. it is a one-day event on May 11th. i am going to decline as i have already committed to a different program.

 

[Hopeful884]

I haven't heard either way, rejection or interview yet! So odd!

 

[MBD]

I haven't heard anything, I called a couple months ago just to confirm that they had received all materials and that there was not a problem and was informed simply that interviews would be held until June, and that I would be emailed if I was chosen. Obviously at this point I have been rejected but it would be nice to get some sort of letter or email rather than just letting me guess. I don't think that is too much to ask. I hope you got in.

 

[hellophilly]

I was wondering if there are any updates on this for this year? I just submitted my application to the PCOM psyd clinical psychology program. Any insights from people who have already been except or insights on the process?

 

[hellophilly]

Hello,

Was wondering if there are any current/past students at PCOM who have good advice for a prospective psyd clinical psychology student. Also if anyone had submitted all of their materials and heard back yet for next year I would love to hear more about the process. Any info about the program or admissions process greatly appreciated.

 

[ClinPsychEnthus]

Has anyone heard from PCOM PsyD? I haven't been invited for an interview or rejected, but I called and they said they "interview until the cohort is filled, up until July". What's up with that? Anybody decline/waitlist/rejected from PCOM?

Thanks so much!

PCOM does a rolling admissions process that begins early and runs until the applications are all reviewed and/or they decide that the cohort is "full", typically 20-25 students to a cohort.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

Mod Note: Merged the PCOM PsyD threads

 

[NotAnElephant]

Hello, I found this thread very helpful, thank you! However, I wonder if anyone from the last one to two years has any input. Such, if they were accepted, how they like the program? How was your interview process? Anything memorable stand out from this? Thanks in advance!

 

[psych.meout]

I've never heard of this program before, so I took a look at their website.

Based on their info, tuition alone (i.e. without interest, living expenses, etc.) is over $100,000 and while their match rates were good for the past two years (97% & 89%, respectively), their rates for the five years before that were unacceptably low (<70%).
http://www.pcom.edu/academics/progr...sychology/admissions-outcomes-other-data.html
http://www.pcom.edu/academics/programs-and-degrees/clinical-psychology/course-sequence.html

 

[forcefive17]

Not necessarily about the interview process, but most of the PCOM folks I've come into contact with are working in community mental health. Something to keep in mind is that this program is VERY CBT oriented.

 

[NotAnElephant]

Yes, I've looked at their statistics on their website - and I prefer their program out of all the ones in Philadelphia. Unfortunately, I cannot afford to move out of the area, so I am limited in programs.

I do like their CBT -focus. I have worked a lot with the Beck Institute and have been trained by them. I want to do Behavioral Medicine, too, so it's definitely a good fit in terms of that, too.

 

[WisNeuro]

You can't afford to move out of the area, but you can afford that tuition?

 

[NotAnElephant]

In the area, their tuition is the cheapest. (Widener's is $35k a year, making it $175k for the whole program; CHC is $33k a year, making it $165k for the whole program; Immaculata is $23,4k a year, making it $117k for the whole program. PCOM's is the only program where you pay per credit.) They have a great reputation in the greater Philadelphia area, as well. I have worked in the field for many years, and have been recommended to this program by professionals at the Children's Hospital of Philadelphia and National Institute of Mental Health. I have family in the FBI in their behavioral analysis unit and had them recommend PCOM. I suppose without living here, it's hard for others to recognize this. Just like other programs in other states may have great reputations, but I may not be aware.

I own a house, my husband has a great job, and I have dying relatives that I would prefer not to move away from. I do not think it's appropriate to judge my intentions about not moving out of state to attend another PsyD program. Tuition isn't something I am really focused on since that is not a factor for me. (My employer is offering tuition remission.) Since my goals are to work with the Beck Institute, and many of their employees went to PCOM, I believe it is a great match for me.

As my original post inquired, I was just interested in other's experience in the interview process. As well, if they have or did attend then what their thoughts are on the program?

 

[ariagirlno1]

PCOM's is the only program where you pay per credit.) They have a great reputation in the greater Philadelphia area, as well.

Just wanted to address this piece of it--La Salle also has you pay per credit.

 

[forcefive17]

I'm currently in greater Philadelphia area and have worked in a variety of settings with folks from PCOM. My impression has always been that they are definitely skilled with the more cognitive therapies, especially manualized treatments. If your goal is to work for the Beck Institute that may be something that serves you well. Though the CBT training is intensive at this institution, the reputation over the past few years from supervisors and colleagues in the field is that folks from this program tend not to be well-rounded clinicians and there is difficulty with flexibility when patients present with severe and persistent mental illness due to not having exposure to other modalities. Keep in mind that practica and internships in the area tend to be more based in community mental health clinics, where SPMI is pervasive. I think this is an important aspect to consider when investing your time/money in training, especially if you plan to stay in the Philadelphia area.

If you're open to exploring your options, many of the other programs you have listed have great reputations. Many prominent psychologists in the area have attended Immaculata and Widener.

 

[forcefive17]

[Double post

 

[NotAnElephant]

I'm currently in greater Philadelphia area and have worked in a variety of settings with folks from PCOM. My impression has always been that they are definitely skilled with the more cognitive therapies, especially manualized treatments. If your goal is to work for the Beck Institute that may be something that serves you well. Though the CBT training is intensive at this institution, the reputation over the past few years from supervisors and colleagues in the field is that folks from this program tend not to be well-rounded clinicians and there is difficulty with flexibility when patients present with severe and persistent mental illness due to not having exposure to other modalities. Keep in mind that practica and internships in the area tend to be more based in community mental health clinics, where SPMI is pervasive. I think this is an important aspect to consider when investing your time/money in training, especially if you plan to stay in the Philadelphia area.

If you're open to exploring your options, many of the other programs you have listed have great reputations. Many prominent psychologists in the area have attended Immaculata and Widener.

Thanks for your input! I definitely appreciate it. Your view points are definitely informative. Immaculata is another top choice of mine. I interview there 2/20, so I'm very excited. Unfortunately, I cannot go to Widener because I have a conflict of interest of knowing someone who teaches there.

 

[psych.meout]

Thanks for your input! I definitely appreciate it. Your view points are definitely informative. Immaculata is another top choice of mine. I interview there 2/20, so I'm very excited. Unfortunately, I cannot go to Widener because I have a conflict of interest of knowing someone who teaches there.

Uh, what? Since when does knowing a faculty member prohibit someone from attending a clinical program? There are clinical programs with students who attended the same university's undergrad program and worked in their grad mentor's lab or attended classes with them as undergrads.

 

[WisNeuro]

Uh, what? Since when does knowing a faculty member prohibit someone from attending a clinical program? There are clinical programs with students who attended the same university's undergrad program and worked in their grad mentor's lab or attended classes with them as undergrads.

I worked for two of the faculty of my grad program before becoming a grad student there. This happens all the time.

 

[psych.meout]

I worked for two of the faculty of my grad program before becoming a grad student there. This happens all the time.

Perfect example of what I was talking about.

I'm not sure where NotAnElephant got that from, but it makes me wonder what else all these terrible programs are telling prospective students.

 

[WisNeuro]

Well, it's more of a deep misunderstanding of how conflict of interest works in this setting. If it's perpetuated by the programs, shame on them, but I imagine it's just ignorance of the admissions process in general, which is understandable to an extent.

 

[MAClinician]

Well, it's more of a deep misunderstanding of how conflict of interest works in this setting. If it's perpetuated by the programs, shame on them, but I imagine it's just ignorance of the admissions process in general, which is understandable to an extent.

Considering the OP mentions her employer offers tuition remission it sounds like OP plans to still work (full time?) while trying to earn a PsyD. Possible ignorance indeed. Wonder how that works when practica start.

 

[Ollie123]

If a core faculty member had previously served as your personal therapist or something like that, I could see why one would want to look elsewhere. Same if you had dated (or are currently dating) someone on faculty.

If it's just a family friend, former employer, etc. it is a non-issue.

 

[forcefive17]

Perfect example of what I was talking about.

I'm not sure where NotAnElephant got that from, but it makes me wonder what else all these terrible programs are telling prospective students.

Considering the OP mentions her employer offers tuition remission it sounds like OP plans to still work (full time?) while trying to earn a PsyD. Possible ignorance indeed. Wonder how that works when practica start.

I'm curious to hear how either one of your comments could remotely be perceived as constructive. The point of this forum, and the responsibility of professionals in the field who use this forum, is to assist students who may have questions in a civil and respectful manner. You are not here to brashly cut others down by taking quotes out of context and derailing threads because he or she doesn't ascribe to your model. This type of behavior only further perpetuates "ignorance".

 

[psych.meout]

I'm curious to hear how either one of your comments could remotely be perceived as constructive. The point of this forum, and the responsibility of professionals in the field who use this forum, is to assist students who may have questions in a civil and respectful manner.

How are we assisting anyone by not being honest and not pointing out how these programs are predatory and rely on the ignorance and desperation of applicants and students to attend their programs? I think being "uncivil" is a good price to pay for saving literally hundreds of thousands of dollars and earning degree that won't make finding good jobs problematic.

You are not here to brashly cut others down by taking quotes out of context and derailing threads because he or she doesn't ascribe to your model.

What quotes were taken out of context?

And which model are they ascribing to that we aren't? The one with hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt and poor outcome statistics? The one that doesn't realize the realities of proper graduate training require full-time effort?

This type of behavior only further perpetuates "ignorance".

How so?

 

[psydhopeful36]

is anyone planning on declining their offer to PCOM psyd? I am waitlisted and this is my top choice!

 

[DCDMB]

I was accepted to PCOM, really like their program, but am curious as they are unfunded -- do we consider them on the same tier as schools like Argosy? They have a great reputation and their graduates are doing amazing work. I saw they had 100% of internships APA accredited in 16-17.

 

[WisNeuro]

I was accepted to PCOM, really like their program, but am curious as they are unfunded -- do we consider them on the same tier as schools like Argosy? They have a great reputation and their graduates are doing amazing work. I saw they had 100% of internships APA accredited in 16-17.

A step above the Argosy type mills, but several steps below fully funded places. Last I saw, tuition alone was like 40k/year. That's crazy balls when you project that out for 5+ years and add on rent and living expenses.

 

[dynamicdog]

I wonder if there is anyway to discuss merits of a program and the success of its graduates without getting into a whole debate over funding. I imagine those who talk about it don't intend it to come out this way, but it often borders on infantilizing. Obviously funded programs are better in a lot of ways than unfunded or partially funded programs. No one is denying this as it is essentially a truism. I'm also not saying it isn't important for an applicant to consider, but for many, and for a variety of reasons, it is not a factor, or at least not the most important factor, and that is ok and up to them. Jumping down anyone's throat who dare consider an unfunded program is getting old and can feel more protective of the decisions made by the writers than an earnest concern for the applicant.

 

[WisNeuro]

I wonder if there is anyway to discuss merits of a program and the success of its graduates without getting into a whole debate over funding. I imagine those who talk about it don't intend it to come out this way, but it often borders on infantilizing. Obviously funded programs are better in a lot of ways than unfunded or partially funded programs. No one is denying this as it is essentially a truism. I'm also not saying it isn't important for an applicant to consider, but for many, and for a variety of reasons, it is not a factor, or at least not the most important factor, and that is ok and up to them. Jumping down anyone's throat who dare consider an unfunded program is getting old and can feel more protective of the decisions made by the writers than an earnest concern for the applicant.

We can for sure talk about the success of the graduates and such. People are free to bring those factors up. But, if one can be just as successful without 200k+ in loans, why not advocate for that? Additionally, I imagine many of us bring out the funded/unfunded thing for several reasons. One being the wellbeing of the applicant. I know many people who hate their jobs, but won't leave because they rely on repayment programs. Also, these people are putting off things like serious retirement planning and house buying due to their debt. Secondly, many of us see this as damaging to the field as a whole. When diploma mills pump out mass numbers of people willing to work for almost anything, it leads to an oversupply of individuals and drives down our salaries. There is no supply shortage of psychologists, and in the majority of markets, there is a significant surplus. So no, my only reason for the argument is not merely concern for the applicant. I am allowed to be concerned for the applicant and the field.

 

[artsyann]

We can for sure talk about the success of the graduates and such. People are free to bring those factors up. But, if one can be just as successful without 200k+ in loans, why not advocate for that? Additionally, I imagine many of us bring out the funded/unfunded thing for several reasons. One being the wellbeing of the applicant. I know many people who hate their jobs, but won't leave because they rely on repayment programs. Also, these people are putting off things like serious retirement planning and house buying due to their debt. Secondly, many of us see this as damaging to the field as a whole. When diploma mills pump out mass numbers of people willing to work for almost anything, it leads to an oversupply of individuals and drives down our salaries. There is no supply shortage of psychologists, and in the majority of markets, there is a significant surplus. So no, my only reason for the argument is not merely concern for the applicant. I am allowed to be concerned for the applicant and the field.

Supply of psychologists vary greatly by geographic region. Where I live it is extremely difficult to find a psychologist who sees patients under 18 and when you do find one, they often have a wait of 3-5 months for an appointment.

Is it shown that those who graduate from these schools are willing to accept lower pay? I am genuinely curious. It isn't something I have heard of before.

I do understand the previous poster's comment regarding infantilizing. It can come across condescending to those who have carefully considered their options and chosen one of these programs for any myriad number of reasons.

 

[WisNeuro]

Supply of psychologists vary greatly by geographic region. Where I live it is extremely difficult to find a psychologist who sees patients under 18 and when you do find one, they often have a wait of 3-5 months for an appointment.

Is it shown that those who graduate from these schools are willing to accept lower pay? I am genuinely curious. It isn't something I have heard of before.

I do understand the previous poster's comment regarding infantilizing. It can come across condescending to those who have carefully considered their options and chosen one of these programs for any myriad number of reasons.

In the past three hospitals I've worked in, whenever we posted for a psychologist job, we got at least double digits. As for lowered compensation. Ask someone in the VA the last time they saw a relocation incentive in a job posting. As for accepting lower pay, check out the last comprehensive salary survey, there is significant discrepancy in pay. As for infantilizing, depends on your perception. I have yet to see an applicant who has actually looked at the estimated cost of loans and an amortization schedule to see how it will actually play out. Most people are woefully misinformed about things such as financials and match rates. If they have carefully weighed the options they are free to discard any advice they see as irrelevant.

 

[erg923]

I wonder if there is anyway to discuss merits of a program and the success of its graduates without getting into a whole debate over funding. I imagine those who talk about it don't intend it to come out this way, but it often borders on infantilizing. Obviously funded programs are better in a lot of ways than unfunded or partially funded programs. No one is denying this as it is essentially a truism. I'm also not saying it isn't important for an applicant to consider, but for many, and for a variety of reasons, it is not a factor, or at least not the most important factor, and that is ok and up to them. Jumping down anyone's throat who dare consider an unfunded program is getting old and can feel more protective of the decisions made by the writers than an earnest concern for the applicant.

I think its sage advice. People are free to take it or leave it, and I don't feel we need to get emo about sage, albeit blunt, message board advice. This is what message boards are for, afterall.

The doctorate in psychology, for the vast majority of people, will not produce an income that financially justifies 6 figure debt. From a financial perceptive this is quite factual and not debatable. Given that the base of the questions is usually a financial one, this is how it is interpreted and answered. If you are independently wealthy, its a different story. Although it needs to be kept in mind that some the most expensive programs are also some of the worst programs from a quality perspective. Coincidence? I think not.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

In many cases these discussions devolve into a “facts v feelings” scenario. The financial impact of high tuition/cost of living is typically much greater than potential students realize. Add in compound interest, tuition increases, fees, etc...and $100k-$150k in tuition is quickly $200k-$250k. The financial facts don’t support pursuing those programs, but then feelings come in and it gets messy. It’s too simplistic to completely separate the financial cost from the discussion because it’ll be there for 10-30yr for just. Even if a person can pay it off, considering the cost/benefit side is still worth addressing because the cost is still there.

Most posters here want to make sure factual information is understood, whether it be the financial cost, lower APA-acred match rates, licensure rates, etc. There is likely bias mixed into the posts, but that should be expected.

 

[DCDMB]

I guess my point was more about what seems like a reputable program, specifically in regards to PCOM in looking at their outcomes, APA accredited internships, albeit middle of the pack license rate. I know the financial implications of an unfunded program, and I'm heavily weighing it, believe me, but was more just curious about the reputation of this particular school given what seems like a strong program regionally. It's a professional school, so of course it will not be a fully funded program as there isn't the same research expectations as a PhD

But I appreciate all of your valid discussion points

 

[dynamicdog]

I guess my point was more about what seems like a reputable program, specifically in regards to PCOM in looking at their outcomes, APA accredited internships, albeit middle of the pack license rate. I know the financial implications of an unfunded program, and I'm heavily weighing it, believe me, but was more just curious about the reputation of this particular school given what seems like a strong program regionally. It's a professional school, so of course it will not be a fully funded program as there isn't the same research expectations as a PhD

But I appreciate all of your valid discussion points

And this was my point- the OP had a specific question about aspects of a program that did not include the financial. I agree with everything people have said about the burden of six figure debt, the connections between many expensive/unfunded programs and their overall quality, the issues with taking low paid jobs as psychologists just to stay afloat, etc. I am not debating them and agree they are extremely problematic and worth discussing- but not in every thread or post that simply mentions an unfunded program.

 

[WisNeuro]

Here you go. Reputation wise, latest reported EPPP rates (2016) are pretty bad. Looking at the faculty, I don't recognize any of the names, so I treat the LORs as fairly neutral. So, it would pretty much come down to letters from prac sites as to how I rank the applicants if I am looking at internship/postdoc placement. The high cohort number moves them down my list as these students generally struggle to get individual mentorship. I would consider these students for intern/postdoc spots, but they would need to wow me with the peripherals to move the needle ranking-wise.

 

[mypointlesspov]

I don't know much about PCOM, but a few of my cohort members work with a PCOM student at their practicum site. Obviously this only applies to this specific student, but they said she just about threw a fit when told that she couldn't rely solely on CBT for therapy.