PCOM Students?

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MADD!!!

MADD!!!

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Hey Everyone,

Any active users here who are current MS1 or MS2's at PCOM-Pa?
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Camaxtli said:
Bunch of us are on here. What up?
Click to expand...

Carbon090 said:
In. Ayyyy
Click to expand...

I read this comment regarding PCOM's pros and cons from 2014, and was wondering if you guys can comment as to how true this sounds, have there been any changes made, and your personal impressions of the pro's and con's of PCOM.







Needless to say, the school has changed a lot. It made me sad reading his review. I left some of his things in that didn't change (italicized).

Curriculum: I can only speak for my year, but they completely butchered our schedule. Our first true break wasn’t until March. Not a single weekend off without something (including coursework) looming over our heads. For example, they gave us all of biochemistry in 7 days before Christmas break; we had a test a few days after New Years. Later that term,they ran out of time due to their ineptitude at proper scheduling, and crammed 40 hours of Heme/Onc in 1 week, and gave us the weekend to learn all of it including 30 hours of immunology from the weeks prior. As a result, almost no-one in my class knows anything about leukemias/lymphomas. 2nd year has been worse. They outright refuse to tell us what our 3rd term looks like leading up to boards. The past few years, we’ve gotten no dedicated study time. They just put easy P/F courses during 3rd term that people don’t really have to study for. This year, they moved one of those easy courses to the Fall to lighten up the workload. They didn’t plan properly, and so now Neuroanatomy is pushed into 3rd term. They also added a few new “Pain in the ass courses”.


Location: Philadelphia... pretty much a haven for medical education. This is one of the main redeeming factors about the school.

Cost: Around $45,000, which is pretty high considering there aren’t enough seats in our lecture halls for students. It’s about 70 students too short. They have 2 overflow rooms which live-stream the lectures, but then berate all of the students in those rooms during the lectures; not saying information into the mics then suggesting “they should have been here”. The financial aid department holds on to your money for the maximum time (2 weeks). This past term they received our money on November 17, and held it past Dec 4th; people couldn’t pay their CCs, rent, insurance, etc for December without advances or pay-day loans.


Faculty: HORRENDOUS. They do not teach us physiology almost at all. You’re going to need to use Dr. Najeeb or FA or SOMETHING for physiology, because you won’t learn how the human body works at PCOM. Many of our renown clinicians no longer teach, as the school tries to cut resources. Research funding has run dry on a national level. Our best professors are guest lecturers from our neighboring MD counterparts. Other than our immunology and surgery professors, the rest are lacking. The “best pathology professor” spoke in the earlier review left. We are now left with powerpoints filled with buzz words and Pathoma.

Reputation: Rock solid. Arguably the best DO school in the country and holds its own against the 4 MD schools here in Philly. We rotate with them and get nothing but high marks. Our students and residents rotate with some of the best MD students on the east coast and not only do we match up, sometimes we outshine. No worry that someone wont know PCOM, at least not from Maine to Florida to Chicago. Also, one stat shows that nearly 25% of all current physicians have done some or all of their medical training in Philadelphia. We are known ubiquitously. None of this changed, but this is only because PCOM can select from the best DO students.

Clinical Rotations:This is changing so ½ of people are going to spend time in one hospital. They manually select people that they know and put them in those sites; do a Biomed degree or student council, otherwise you’re screwed. The sites are Danville, Scranton, Reading, Pittsburgh, and Philadelphia. Unfortunately, the other ½ cannot do rotations at those sites (Geisinger, Lankenau) because of the permenant students. The remaining students are randomly put into groups (there is a match algorithm they use, but it’s still a lottery-based system) – these groups determine how many electives you get before match; the most is 6-7, the fewest is 2-3. After they put us into groups, the students then fight amongst themselves to determine who gets to go where. They tell us this is good because it improves “interpersonal communication skills”. They actually said that to us. They got rid of the 3rd term elective.

Study areas: Not so great. Too many students for too few desks. PCOM has a collaborative agreement with dozens of colleges in the area to use their libraries so this helps immensely. But if you are the type who likes to study on campus, stake your claim early. Although I always studied at home, many people study in the cafeteria or local coffee shops (plenty of those).

Social Scene: 70% of the students are really awesome. Probably the best thing the school has going for it. Just a great group of people. The biomed grads are kind of cliquey. A few of them got professionalism violations for sharing old exams among themselves. I'm pretty sure this is how they are at any school with a biomed program (inferiority complex?). The faculty knows all of them and gives them inside information about how to get a rotation they want, etc.

Board Prep: A basic scientist is in charge of our boards, and she compares it to her PhD candidacy exam. Needless to say, they have unrealistic views of boards. They give us Combank and force us to do question sets to identify our weakness. Combank is one of the worst question banks. They won’t tell us what our 3rd term looks like despite it changing drastically from the year prior. As a result, we have no idea how to plan to study. Our exams are extraordinarily easy and very one dimensional. They usually give us the questions before the exam, so you have no way to judge.


Clinical Prep: They make us do a lot of pain in the ass things, interviewing comatose patients or patients refusing to talk, etc. Realistically, it will let us hit the ground running.

Specialty: PCOM sends more people into specialty fields than most other DO schools, but they're trying to increase their presence in primary care, so if you're definitely interested in something other than Primary Care, it may be a bit of an uphill battle by the time you get here.

So here are my grades:

Curriculum: F
Location: A+
Cost: C+
Financial Aid: B-
Faculty: C
Reputation: A+
Technology: B+
Study Space/Library: C-
Library technology/Resources: B-
Rotations: B+
Social: A
Hospitals: B+
Post Grad: A+
Cafeteria Food: A-
Cafeteria Prices: B+

Overall Grade: B-

"
 
MADD!!! said:
I read this comment regarding PCOM's pros and cons from 2014, and was wondering if you guys can comment as to how true this sounds, have there been any changes made, and your personal impressions of the pro's and con's of PCOM.







Needless to say, the school has changed a lot. It made me sad reading his review. I left some of his things in that didn't change (italicized).

Curriculum: I can only speak for my year, but they completely butchered our schedule. Our first true break wasn’t until March. Not a single weekend off without something (including coursework) looming over our heads. For example, they gave us all of biochemistry in 7 days before Christmas break; we had a test a few days after New Years. Later that term,they ran out of time due to their ineptitude at proper scheduling, and crammed 40 hours of Heme/Onc in 1 week, and gave us the weekend to learn all of it including 30 hours of immunology from the weeks prior. As a result, almost no-one in my class knows anything about leukemias/lymphomas. 2nd year has been worse. They outright refuse to tell us what our 3rd term looks like leading up to boards. The past few years, we’ve gotten no dedicated study time. They just put easy P/F courses during 3rd term that people don’t really have to study for. This year, they moved one of those easy courses to the Fall to lighten up the workload. They didn’t plan properly, and so now Neuroanatomy is pushed into 3rd term. They also added a few new “Pain in the ass courses”.


Location: Philadelphia... pretty much a haven for medical education. This is one of the main redeeming factors about the school.

Cost: Around $45,000, which is pretty high considering there aren’t enough seats in our lecture halls for students. It’s about 70 students too short. They have 2 overflow rooms which live-stream the lectures, but then berate all of the students in those rooms during the lectures; not saying information into the mics then suggesting “they should have been here”. The financial aid department holds on to your money for the maximum time (2 weeks). This past term they received our money on November 17, and held it past Dec 4th; people couldn’t pay their CCs, rent, insurance, etc for December without advances or pay-day loans.


Faculty: HORRENDOUS. They do not teach us physiology almost at all. You’re going to need to use Dr. Najeeb or FA or SOMETHING for physiology, because you won’t learn how the human body works at PCOM. Many of our renown clinicians no longer teach, as the school tries to cut resources. Research funding has run dry on a national level. Our best professors are guest lecturers from our neighboring MD counterparts. Other than our immunology and surgery professors, the rest are lacking. The “best pathology professor” spoke in the earlier review left. We are now left with powerpoints filled with buzz words and Pathoma.

Reputation: Rock solid. Arguably the best DO school in the country and holds its own against the 4 MD schools here in Philly. We rotate with them and get nothing but high marks. Our students and residents rotate with some of the best MD students on the east coast and not only do we match up, sometimes we outshine. No worry that someone wont know PCOM, at least not from Maine to Florida to Chicago. Also, one stat shows that nearly 25% of all current physicians have done some or all of their medical training in Philadelphia. We are known ubiquitously. None of this changed, but this is only because PCOM can select from the best DO students.

Clinical Rotations:This is changing so ½ of people are going to spend time in one hospital. They manually select people that they know and put them in those sites; do a Biomed degree or student council, otherwise you’re screwed. The sites are Danville, Scranton, Reading, Pittsburgh, and Philadelphia. Unfortunately, the other ½ cannot do rotations at those sites (Geisinger, Lankenau) because of the permenant students. The remaining students are randomly put into groups (there is a match algorithm they use, but it’s still a lottery-based system) – these groups determine how many electives you get before match; the most is 6-7, the fewest is 2-3. After they put us into groups, the students then fight amongst themselves to determine who gets to go where. They tell us this is good because it improves “interpersonal communication skills”. They actually said that to us. They got rid of the 3rd term elective.

Study areas: Not so great. Too many students for too few desks. PCOM has a collaborative agreement with dozens of colleges in the area to use their libraries so this helps immensely. But if you are the type who likes to study on campus, stake your claim early. Although I always studied at home, many people study in the cafeteria or local coffee shops (plenty of those).

Social Scene: 70% of the students are really awesome. Probably the best thing the school has going for it. Just a great group of people. The biomed grads are kind of cliquey. A few of them got professionalism violations for sharing old exams among themselves. I'm pretty sure this is how they are at any school with a biomed program (inferiority complex?). The faculty knows all of them and gives them inside information about how to get a rotation they want, etc.

Board Prep: A basic scientist is in charge of our boards, and she compares it to her PhD candidacy exam. Needless to say, they have unrealistic views of boards. They give us Combank and force us to do question sets to identify our weakness. Combank is one of the worst question banks. They won’t tell us what our 3rd term looks like despite it changing drastically from the year prior. As a result, we have no idea how to plan to study. Our exams are extraordinarily easy and very one dimensional. They usually give us the questions before the exam, so you have no way to judge.


Clinical Prep: They make us do a lot of pain in the ass things, interviewing comatose patients or patients refusing to talk, etc. Realistically, it will let us hit the ground running.

Specialty: PCOM sends more people into specialty fields than most other DO schools, but they're trying to increase their presence in primary care, so if you're definitely interested in something other than Primary Care, it may be a bit of an uphill battle by the time you get here.

So here are my grades:

Curriculum: F
Location: A+
Cost: C+
Financial Aid: B-
Faculty: C
Reputation: A+
Technology: B+
Study Space/Library: C-
Library technology/Resources: B-
Rotations: B+
Social: A
Hospitals: B+
Post Grad: A+
Cafeteria Food: A-
Cafeteria Prices: B+

Overall Grade: B-

"
Click to expand...

I disagree with alot on here. Maybe it's just outdated. Those curriculum issues have been fixed. The pathology is mostly taught by dr. McDonald DO definitely not just buzzwords.

Study spaces: never not got a study space. We have a big library and study areas throughout Evans hall.

Ginsburg (first year lecture) hall is a couple seats short. Not a big deal. Zedek there is more of a shortage but not enough people go to class for that to matter unless it's mandatory(rare) and in that case get there early.

The forcing you do to Combank is true. Lots of issues about board prep have been resolved.

The rotations have completely changed ignore that.

So ignore most of that negative stuff it's outdated for the most part. Highly recommend coming here. Great school!
 
Last edited:
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Camaxtli said:
I disagree with alot on here. Maybe it's just outdated. Those curriculum have been fixed. The pathology is mostly taught by dr. McDonald DO definitely not just buzzwords.

Study spaces: never not got a study space. We have a big library and study areas throughout Evans hall.

Ginsburg (first year lecture) hall is a couple seats short. Not a big deal. Zedek there is more of a shortage but not enough people go to class for that to matter unless it's mandatory(rare) and in that case get there early.

The forcing you do to Combank is true. Lots of issues about board prep have been resolved.

The rotations have completely changed ignore that.

So ignore most of that negative stuff it's outdated for the most part. Highly recommend coming here. Great school!
Click to expand...

This ^. Granted I'm a first year, but so far the curriculum seems organized and totally fine. Was just taught by Dr. McDonald last week.

I never study in the library (always at home), but there seems to be plenty of places to study.
 
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Camaxtli said:
I disagree with alot on here. Maybe it's just outdated. Those curriculum issues have been fixed. The pathology is mostly taught by dr. McDonald DO definitely not just buzzwords.

Study spaces: never not got a study space. We have a big library and study areas throughout Evans hall.

Ginsburg (first year lecture) hall is a couple seats short. Not a big deal. Zedek there is more of a shortage but not enough people go to class for that to matter unless it's mandatory(rare) and in that case get there early.

The forcing you do to Combank is true. Lots of issues about board prep have been resolved.

The rotations have completely changed ignore that.

So ignore most of that negative stuff it's outdated for the most part. Highly recommend coming here. Great school!
Click to expand...

What a relief!!!!! Thank You and Thank You @Carbon090!!

Also is there dedicated board study time?
 
Camaxtli said:
I disagree with alot on here. Maybe it's just outdated. Those curriculum issues have been fixed. The pathology is mostly taught by dr. McDonald DO definitely not just buzzwords.

Study spaces: never not got a study space. We have a big library and study areas throughout Evans hall.

Ginsburg (first year lecture) hall is a couple seats short. Not a big deal. Zedek there is more of a shortage but not enough people go to class for that to matter unless it's mandatory(rare) and in that case get there early.

The forcing you do to Combank is true. Lots of issues about board prep have been resolved.

The rotations have completely changed ignore that.

So ignore most of that negative stuff it's outdated for the most part. Highly recommend coming here. Great school!
Click to expand...
Forcing students who will for sure be in the 2020 match where there will be no AOA match to do comlex questions? Medical school administrations are seriously so stupid.
 
jw3600 said:
Forcing students who will for sure be in the 2020 match where there will be no AOA match to do comlex questions? Medical school administrations are seriously so stupid.
Click to expand...

You will need to take the comlex to become a DO in the meanwhile. So need to prepare for that test.
 
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Camaxtli said:
You will need to take the comlex to become a DO in the meanwhile. So need to prepare for that test.
Click to expand...
Passing the comlex is a freaking joke. And it wouldn't matter because any student in the 2020 match will be preparing for USMLE which is more than enough to ace comlex.
 
jw3600 said:
Passing the comlex is a freaking joke. And it wouldn't matter because any student in the 2020 match will be preparing for USMLE which is more than enough to ace comlex.
Click to expand...

Haven't taken the comlex yet
 
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jw3600 said:
If you are in the 2020 match (proably 2019) there is no conceivable reason not to take USMLE.
Click to expand...

Maybe because all the former AOA programs will still accept COMLEX and in addition to that more and more ACGME residencies are beginning to accept COMLEX scores and stating that it's not necessary to take both exams? ... Maybe :p
 
Camaxtli said:
I disagree with alot on here. Maybe it's just outdated. Those curriculum issues have been fixed. The pathology is mostly taught by dr. McDonald DO definitely not just buzzwords.

Study spaces: never not got a study space. We have a big library and study areas throughout Evans hall.

Ginsburg (first year lecture) hall is a couple seats short. Not a big deal. Zedek there is more of a shortage but not enough people go to class for that to matter unless it's mandatory(rare) and in that case get there early.

The forcing you do to Combank is true. Lots of issues about board prep have been resolved.

The rotations have completely changed ignore that.

So ignore most of that negative stuff it's outdated for the most part. Highly recommend coming here. Great school!
Click to expand...

@BoroPreMed92
 
MADD!!! said:
Maybe because all the former AOA programs will still accept COMLEX and in addition to that more and more ACGME residencies are beginning to accept COMLEX scores and stating that it's not necessary to take both exams? ... Maybe :p
Click to expand...
And maybe a company might hire someone with a GED. Does that mean it's ever wise to drop out of high school and just get the GED? Why close doors? And if anything all aspects of the DO education/training are being removed from the match so I would say with the merger the COMLEX will become even more obsolete. There is no way to know this for sure and it will surely vary by PD.
 
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Not to mention that the COMLEX is required for graduation for every DO school. And isn't it necessary to even become licensed by the osteopathic boards? Not really an option, although I do agree that we should take both tests.
 
jw3600 said:
And maybe a company might hire someone with a GED. Does that mean it's ever wise to drop out of high school and just get the GED? Why close doors? And if anything all aspects of the DO education/training are being removed from the match so I would say with the merger the COMLEX will become even more obsolete. There is no way to know this for sure and it will surely vary by PD.
Click to expand...

After talking with someone else, I think you're right and there's more to the story that I don't know yet. But also agree that it will probably vary by PD. But the consensus I'm getting is if someone just wants to match, but doesn't care where, COMLEX suffices. If people want more doors open (how significant is still undetermined), then USMLE scores are needed.
 
Came to PCOM with full intentions of taking both board exams. From what I've gathered it seems majority of the people I associate with in my class have the same goal.
 
MADD!!! said:
After talking with someone else, I think you're right and there's more to the story that I don't know yet. But also agree that it will probably vary by PD. But the consensus I'm getting is if someone just wants to match, but doesn't care where, COMLEX suffices. If people want more doors open (how significant is still undetermined), then USMLE scores are needed.
Click to expand...
Thanks for being open and thinking critically. Breath of fresh air on these forums. Anyone telling you not to take the USMLE is either uniformed and does not have your best interests at heart. Either way don't listen to them.
 
MADD!!! said:
After talking with someone else, I think you're right and there's more to the story that I don't know yet. But also agree that it will probably vary by PD. But the consensus I'm getting is if someone just wants to match, but doesn't care where, COMLEX suffices. If people want more doors open (how significant is still undetermined), then USMLE scores are needed.
Click to expand...
I don't know if you followed the whole thread but my point was that comlex is meaningless because you should be preparing for and taking the USMLE. Doing this easily ensures you will pass comlex. Even without any additional comlex specific studying. Getting a 400 on comlex barely requires functioning neurons.
 
jw3600 said:
I don't know if you followed the whole thread but my point was that comlex is meaningless because you should be preparing for and taking the USMLE. Doing this easily ensures you will pass comlex. Even without any additional comlex specific studying. Getting a 400 on comlex barely requires functioning neurons.
Click to expand...

How about a 500?!! Or 450? I hope so!!!! I'm already anxious about not passing boards, especially because it seems to be the biggest red flag for PD's.

Also are they really that similar?! Like it's not possible to do decent/great on USMLE then end up bombing COMLEX b/c you didn't study for it specifically?
 
jw3600 said:
I don't know if you followed the whole thread but my point was that comlex is meaningless because you should be preparing for and taking the USMLE. Doing this easily ensures you will pass comlex. Even without any additional comlex specific studying. Getting a 400 on comlex barely requires functioning neurons.
Click to expand...

And of course! I'm trying to learn as much as possible, and most things I say I got from a source.
 
jw3600 said:
I don't know if you followed the whole thread but my point was that comlex is meaningless because you should be preparing for and taking the USMLE. Doing this easily ensures you will pass comlex. Even without any additional comlex specific studying. Getting a 400 on comlex barely requires functioning neurons.
Click to expand...

Have you taken the comlex and uslme?
 
jw3600 said:
Yeah. 600s and 240s.
Click to expand...

Congrats! What are the cutoffs for competitive specialties like ortho and neurosurg? I've heard 650s and 250s being thrown around?
 
Camaxtli said:
Congrats
Click to expand...

MADD!!! said:
Damm! Nice
Click to expand...

Thanks. Trust me there are quite a few people in my class who scored better on both.

poloboy said:
Congrats! What are the cutoffs for competitive specialties like ortho and neurosurg? I've heard 650s and 250s being thrown around?
Click to expand...
I don't have direct experience so maybe other posters can let you know. From what I have heard there was some talk of 600 being a cutoff for ortho. So I would assume similar for other competitive specialties. However, times are a changin. With the merger I have no idea how formerly AOA programs will evaluate applicants. I assume they will want to see strong COMLEX and USMLE. And I hope you know that MD ortho is pretty much out regardless. I will say anecdotally that I know people who have matched into competitive specialties like uro, nsg, ortho with sub-600 scores but they were very talented in other areas such as research, class rank, step 2/level 2, and they seemed to really impress clinically on auditions.
 
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MADD!!! said:
How about if you didn't? Are they really strict about letting us in?
Click to expand...

You need a ID. There are other libraries to go to. There is one in Bala cynwyd etc
 
MADD!!! said:
How about if you didn't? Are they really strict about letting us in?
Click to expand...

You need a ID. There are other libraries to go to. There is one in Bala cynwyd etc
 
MADD!!! said:
@Carbon090 and @Camaxtli

Do you guys know of any students who study at Drexel, UPenn, Temple, or Jefferson libraries? Or if PCOM students have access to them?
Click to expand...

I do have a friend in my anatomy lab group who goes to a specific UPENN library based on use of her ID. I know there are libraries open to us, personally never used them!
 
Carbon090 said:
I do have a friend in my anatomy lab group who goes to a specific UPENN library based on use of her ID. I know there are libraries open to us, personally never used them!
Click to expand...

Based on her pcom Id correct? And yea, I wish they listed somewhere the additional libraries students do have access to.
 
MADD!!! said:
Based on her pcom Id correct? And yea, I wish they listed somewhere the additional libraries students do have access to.
Click to expand...

Yup! And I am sure there is one somewhere though. If you end up matriculating at PCOM it shouldn't be difficult finding that info.
 
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I've read somewhere that if you're doing the DO/MBA dual degree through SJU, you could use their library!
 
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When it came to the background check for matriculating students, how long did it take before you got the information for that? Was a health and drug test included too?
 
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