PhD as a way in??insight needed plea

[JaymezYu]

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I have a low gpa and I recently heard that you should apply to a PhD program in a medical school whose course is shared with MD students. After one year of the program u show medical shools ur grade (hopefully high A's) and apply with that to medical schools. If you get accepted you can just drop out of the PhD program. Has anyone done this and is it possible/recommended??? Please any insight will help! Thanks

 

[Nymphicus]

I have a low gpa and I recently heard that you should apply to a PhD program in a medical school whose course is shared with MD students. After one year of the program u show medical shools ur grade (hopefully high A's) and apply with that to medical schools. If you get accepted you can just drop out of the PhD program. Has anyone done this and is it possible/recommended??? Please any insight will help! Thanks

I believe you are referring to Special Masters Programs (SMP's). Some searches here or on google should be a good start to collecting information on them.

Here is a link to get you started: **The Official Guide to Special Masters Programs**

 

[Lollygag]

I haven't heard of these programs but if you have a low GPA to start with, how would you expect to get into the PhD program in the first place?

I mean.. Idk how difficult it is to get into PhD programs but I'm pretty sure their is a reasonable amount of difficulty to get into them.

 

[Barley426]

I'm a second year PhD student currently accepted to 2 MD programs this year, but I wouldn't advise it.

It's far from the best route, you'll have to do the MCAT, shadowing, applications, interviews, etc in secret because if anybody finds out too soon you'll make a lot of people angry (potentially your mentor, probably the administrators) and you'll have to explain yourself in your personal statement, essays, and interviews. The PhD program will likely be quite sore at you because they'll feel you just used them for money while you waited on med school, they'll also probably try to kick you out before they waste too much money on you.

I was forced to tip my hand on my intentions because I wanted to apply to the MD/PhD program, so naturally they asked what would happen if I was accepted MD or MD/PhD elsewhere and was rejected from my current school. They didn't like hearing that I might leave to straight MD if this scenario happened, naturally. The only reason they haven't kicked me to the curb yet is because the MD/PhD program is pretty darn interested in me.

Trust me, you're much better off going with a standard masters (1 year or 2 year) or an SMP.

 

[ben34]

I am also a Ph.D. student applying out right now. I am also a reapplicant. I think a post bac would probably be just as good if not better than a Ph.D. program. Schools do not like you leaving mid-way. Also, a Ph.D. didn't really strengthen my application much considering I have no interviews 🙁.

 

[SilverCat]

To the above poster- Barley- just out of curiosity, how did you explain to the adcoms that you were dropping out of a PhD program to attend med school? I thought that was a huge red flag. In addition, how did you get into an MD/ PhD program with a 3.21 sGPA, even with a 37 MCAT? I don't mean to attack you, it's just that these facts don't seem to add up.

Sorry to derail the thread.

 

[Catalystik]

I have a low gpa and I recently heard that you should apply to a PhD program in a medical school whose course is shared with MD students. After one year of the program u show medical shools ur grade (hopefully high A's) and apply with that to medical schools. If you get accepted you can just drop out of the PhD program. Has anyone done this and is it possible/recommended??? Please any insight will help! Thanks

Most MD schools don't regard the grades from a traditional graduate degree as they are widely assumed to be grade-inflated, so getting into a PhD program may not lead to the outcome you hope for. If you can get into an SMP, as Nymphicus suggested, that would be a preferable path, provided you can earn a GPA of 3.7+.

 

[squat]

Most MD schools don't regard the grades from a traditional graduate degree as they are widely assumed to be grade-inflated, so getting into a PhD program may not lead to the outcome you hope for. If you can get into an SMP, as Nymphicus suggested, that would be a preferable path, provided you can earn a GPA of 3.7+.

If you haven't finished your bachelor's, then do a second major. Your undergrad GPA is what counts most. (And there are so many fun double majors you could pursue that would make great stories for essays...chemistry and Russian literature, biology and music-dance-theater --or maybe a more practical double major with a behavioral science)

The PhD programs I glanced at were interspersed (year 3-4 out of 6) and the PhD did NOT make you a more attractive candidate, just gave you a second application hoop to jump through.

 

[Barley426]

To the above poster- Barley- just out of curiosity, how did you explain to the adcoms that you were dropping out of a PhD program to attend med school? I thought that was a huge red flag. In addition, how did you get into an MD/ PhD program with a 3.21 sGPA, even with a 37 MCAT? I don't mean to attack you, it's just that these facts don't seem to add up.

Sorry to derail the thread.

I figured it would be a "huge red flag" too, but I applied anyway. I even applied to (and was accepted to) schools that said outright that people in PhD programs would not be considered until they received their degree. I indicated on my AMCAS that I was in a PhD program but would leave with my masters if I got accepted to medical school. I figured it would be held against me but they invited me to interviews anyway. Afraid they had just missed that detail, I was sure to remind them of my situation but none of them were concerned, they told me they understand the change in heart and didn't see it as me abandoning research since I full well intend on pursuing research regardless of my final degree(s) being MD or MD/PhD.

For my GPA, it was a simple case of a family crisis during my sophomore year that caused a hiccup in an otherwise impeccable undergraduate. I explained it on my personal statement, and during my interviews they told me they completely understand, and have no question in my aptitude or intelligence considering my MCAT and that since my sophomore year I've had nearly 80 credits of almost 3.8GPA undergraduate coursework, all of which were upper level science courses. This was in addition to my 4.0 Graduate work, attained while studying for MCAT, shadowing, and doing my research. I was also told by my interviewers that my 5 letters of recommendation were some of the most outstanding they've received in years.

For the MD/PhD, I didn't say I was accepted, rather that they are pretty interested in me; and they are. I have interviewed and the process is going well, my performance in my graduate coursework as well as my laboratory performance has earned me a great reputation here and several of my collaborators are actually MD/PhD committee members fighting for me. While chatting with the MD/PhD director she actually asked me why I didn't apply to more MD/PhD programs, explaining that GPA may be higher for the "average" accepted student but that they were much more flexible than you read on the internet, especially when they have someone that is otherwise exceptional. She said I was what they called "Damaged Goods" meaning I would be screened out of the top MSTP/MD/PHD programs but non-top-tier programs would be extremely interested in me. I don't think this makes me guaranteed to get in, but it certainly means I've got a pretty good shot.

I've been holding off on explaining this in detail because I wanted to wait until all the dust has settled. I also fully understood many would not believe me, so I'll be happy to upload my acceptance letters once I do make a thread about it. I feel many misconceptions need to be dispelled here on SDN, things that may be generally true but certainly not gospel as it is treated here.

Back to the subject at hand, my advice is still the same. It has been extremely hard to do what I'm doing and have done and wouldn't wish it on someone who was in my shoes not too long ago.

 

[eagles22]

I figured it would be a "huge red flag" too, but I applied anyway. I even applied to (and was accepted to) schools that said outright that people in PhD programs would not be considered until they received their degree. I indicated on my AMCAS that I was in a PhD program but would leave with my masters if I got accepted to medical school. I figured it would be held against me but they invited me to interviews anyway. Afraid they had just missed that detail, I was sure to remind them of my situation but none of them were concerned, they told me they understand the change in heart and didn't see it as me abandoning research since I full well intend on pursuing research regardless of my final degree(s) being MD or MD/PhD.

For my GPA, it was a simple case of a family crisis during my sophomore year that caused a hiccup in an otherwise impeccable undergraduate. I explained it on my personal statement, and during my interviews they told me they completely understand, and have no question in my aptitude or intelligence considering my MCAT and that since my sophomore year I've had nearly 80 credits of almost 3.8GPA undergraduate coursework, all of which were upper level science courses. This was in addition to my 4.0 Graduate work, attained while studying for MCAT, shadowing, and doing my research. I was also told by my interviewers that my 5 letters of recommendation were some of the most outstanding they've received in years.

For the MD/PhD, I didn't say I was accepted, rather that they are pretty interested in me; and they are. I have interviewed and the process is going well, my performance in my graduate coursework as well as my laboratory performance has earned me a great reputation here and several of my collaborators are actually MD/PhD committee members fighting for me. While chatting with the MD/PhD director she actually asked me why I didn't apply to more MD/PhD programs, explaining that GPA may be higher for the "average" accepted student but that they were much more flexible than you read on the internet, especially when they have someone that is otherwise exceptional. She said I was what they called "Damaged Goods" meaning I would be screened out of the top MSTP/MD/PHD programs but non-top-tier programs would be extremely interested in me. I don't think this makes me guaranteed to get in, but it certainly means I've got a pretty good shot.

I've been holding off on explaining this in detail because I wanted to wait until all the dust has settled. I also fully understood many would not believe me, so I'll be happy to upload my acceptance letters once I do make a thread about it. I feel many misconceptions need to be dispelled here on SDN, things that may be generally true but certainly not gospel as it is treated here.

Back to the subject at hand, my advice is still the same. It has been extremely hard to do what I'm doing and have done and wouldn't wish it on someone who was in my shoes not too long ago.

There's a difference between a change of plans and for the OP who is going to try to use it as a way in to medical school. I'm sure schools can tell the difference between those who genuinely changed their minds versus those trying to use the spot to boost a bad application.

 

[Barley426]

There's a difference between a change of plans and for the OP who is going to try to use it as a way in to medical school. I'm sure schools can tell the difference between those who genuinely changed their minds versus those trying to use the spot to boost a bad application.

I completely agree, which is why I told him not to do it. I was merely providing so much detail for SilverCat, who seemed doubtful (or at least intrigued) by my brief explanation.

 

[SilverCat]

I just found your story interesting, Barley, because I have an interest in both the MD and PhD paths. With grades not competitive enough for MD/PhD ( and now questionable for MD), I decided to give up the PhD path, but with great regret. I thought about doing a PhD, then applying for an MD, but from what I've heard, this is a bad decision. Most people I've spoken to have implied that applying as a PhD student to an MD program would essentially guarantee rejection.

I just found it surprising that applying for a PhD, then MD/PhD, seemed to work out so well for you ( not to mention I'm a little jealous). 🙂

 

[mindyopenner]

Perhaps medical schools want students who would make good doctors. Does 1-2 years of graduate school enhance that? During graduate school, we are taught to be good scientists, and we are not normally expected to shadow in a medical clinic, demonstrate community service, or develop special talents outside of graduate school.

Medical schools may enjoy seeing success in research as part of an application package. But only part.

The first 1-2 years of graduate school (in biomedical science at least) rarely result in productive research success, despite the effort. Students take on huge, multiple year projects and learn many techniques, but that would not help medical school application.

Perhaps if your science inspired you to want to work in clinic and you could show that in your application, the transition from graduate school to medical school would be easier.