Possible cheating scandal at MUSC

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Warderino92

Warderino92

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I was curious what your guys opinions were about this article. A short summary is that there was supposed cheating by two medical students tied to high profile public officials. The honor committee recommended that the students be expelled but one of the deans of the medical school overruled the decision. The school is also refusing to grant a information request into what happened during the proceedings of the honor committee without first being paid 250k to look the information up.

http://www.thestate.com/latest-news/article101068937.html
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Typical back-slapping good old boy corruption that unfortunately is still quite common in SC.
 
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Señor S said:
Typical back-slapping good old boy corruption that unfortunately is still quite common in SC.
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Yep. Apparently the board of trustees is pretty shady as well.
 
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What did the students even do?
 
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"Drachman's warning also comes on the heels of a Post and Courier report that MUSC's Board of Trustees racked up hundreds of thousands of dollars in hotel, dining and liquor bills in recent years."

This is what I picture the NBME doing with my Step II CS fees
 
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sliceofbread136 said:
"Drachman's warning also comes on the heels of a Post and Courier report that MUSC's Board of Trustees racked up hundreds of thousands of dollars in hotel, dining and liquor bills in recent years."

This is what I picture the NBME doing with my Step II CS fees
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Cant wait til I'm at that level. No wonder tuition is so high
 
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cbrons said:
FTFY
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South Carolina is in a class all its own when it comes to corruption. Trust me. And don't take this stuff for granted either: in most countries getting into med school is a totally fair and objective process. Some bigshot greasing the wheels for his brainless offpsring wouldn't be tolerated in any first-world nation.
 
Señor S said:
South Carolina is in a class all its own when it comes to corruption. Trust me. And don't take this stuff for granted either: in most countries getting into med school is a totally fair and objective process. Some bigshot greasing the wheels for his brainless offpsring wouldn't be tolerated in any first-world nation.
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Ya it's not like legacy matters or anything. The process is hardly objective
 
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cbrons said:
Lmao you're kidding right?
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No, I'm not. In almost all countries university admissions (including med school) are just based on exam results; highest score gets in, no room for graft. When Tony Blair was Prime Minister his son Euan had to settle for the University of Bristol after he was rejected by Oxford. The Brits were incredulous that Yale later accepted him into their graduate program despite his mediocre record. And the UK is if anything less meritocratic than most.

Explain how things work in the US to your typical Japanese or French and they'll be dumbfounded. Admitting students to university (even to study medicine, of all things?) just because they are well connected politically? It's something you expect from a third-world country, Zimbabwe or Honduras or some place like that.
 
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Señor S said:
No, I'm not. In almost all countries university admissions (including med school) are just based on exam results; highest score gets in, no room for graft. When Tony Blair was Prime Minister his son Euan had to settle for the University of Bristol after he was rejected by Oxford. The Brits were incredulous that Yale later accepted him into their graduate program despite his mediocre record. And the UK is if anything less meritocratic than most.

Explain how things work in the US to your typical Japanese or French and they'll be dumbfounded. Admitting students to university (even to study medicine, of all things?) just because they are well connected politically? It's something you expect from a third-world country, Zimbabwe or Honduras or some place like that.
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Disagree, as someone who has family and friends who have worked in large universities, this happens all the time. Same thing with residency folks, who you know does and always will make a big difference. To think otherwise is naive. Connections mean you are a known commodity, albeit with low scores or not. You can end up with a mediocre student that has a reputation with family and society or you can risk it on a polished guy that might be a cocaine addict in the closet. The kids of friends and coworkers are always going to have a slight edge because there's someone to keep tabs on them, and it's an easy way to fill a spot.
 
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Señor S said:
South Carolina is in a class all its own when it comes to corruption. Trust me. And don't take this stuff for granted either: in most countries getting into med school is a totally fair and objective process. Some bigshot greasing the wheels for his brainless offpsring wouldn't be tolerated in any first-world nation.
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Yeah, there's a nasty pattern of this sort of thing...

http://www.postandcourier.com/article/20071110/PC1602/311109973
 
Señor S said:
No, I'm not. In almost all countries university admissions (including med school) are just based on exam results; highest score gets in, no room for graft. When Tony Blair was Prime Minister his son Euan had to settle for the University of Bristol after he was rejected by Oxford. The Brits were incredulous that Yale later accepted him into their graduate program despite his mediocre record. And the UK is if anything less meritocratic than most.

Explain how things work in the US to your typical Japanese or French and they'll be dumbfounded. Admitting students to university (even to study medicine, of all things?) just because they are well connected politically? It's something you expect from a third-world country, Zimbabwe or Honduras or some place like that.
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I know multiple students who were accepted to US medical schools because of connections whose scores were far below average and a few who were far below the 10th percentile. One of them was even told point blank in an interview that she had already been accepted and the interview was just a formality. None of these people were from SC, and you might be surprised by some of the schools where this occurred.

Also, agree with Justin. It may be less prevalent in the medical world of first world countries, but if you think cronyism and corruption doesn't exist you're not looking for it very hard.
 
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Señor S said:
No, I'm not. In almost all countries university admissions (including med school) are just based on exam results; highest score gets in, no room for graft. When Tony Blair was Prime Minister his son Euan had to settle for the University of Bristol after he was rejected by Oxford. The Brits were incredulous that Yale later accepted him into their graduate program despite his mediocre record. And the UK is if anything less meritocratic than most.

Explain how things work in the US to your typical Japanese or French and they'll be dumbfounded. Admitting students to university (even to study medicine, of all things?) just because they are well connected politically? It's something you expect from a third-world country, Zimbabwe or Honduras or some place like that.
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Wasn't there a big to do about the UK's admissions process for professionals schools? Something like 80% of their medical students were coming from the highest social class...
 
skiier54 said:
Bro you need to check out the admissions sytem in India. The IIT system (considered the country's best engineering/tech schools) has a certain number of allotted spots for students of certain minorities. These spots are reserved for them by the government to keep them happy for a number of reasons (securing votes, etc.). Essentially you have some complete idiots getting into the most prestigious schools and some really high scoring students being rejected. There's a **** ton of corruption.
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So not too different than here in the US!
 
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As a student at MUSC, we all think it's bull**** that the two students got to stay. It not only makes the other students look bad, but it also is completely unfair to other students who have worked their asses off to get good grades.
 
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GDMD said:
As a student at MUSC, we all think it's bull**** that the two students got to stay. It not only makes the other students look bad, but it also is completely unfair to other students who have worked their asses off to get good grades.
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Is there weird tension in your class now?
 
piii said:
Is there weird tension in your class now?
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No, honestly, it has brought us together not only as a class, but between the classes. The people who were involved are not in my class, so I'm not sure how much of a difference that makes.
 
There is no tension. The two students who cheated are Kayla and Kellie Bingham, and all the frustration is directed at them. Their father is Kenny Bingham who was has long served in the state house of representatives and is a Nikki Haley ally (SC governor). Their grandfather William Bingham was appointed to the Board of Trustees. This likely allowed them to be admitted in the same class. The students and faculty involved in the honor council voted to expel them, as there were irregularities with all 1st and 2nd year exams., and the dean stepped in to save them. Their records were wiped clean, and they were allowed to progress into the clinic for 3rd year. This could have been at the bequest of Haley, the grandfather, or the father. Regardless, the dean was a pawn in this case, and it is likely his reputation that will suffer most. Rumor is that one failed her boards and the other has now withdrawn from school temporarily due to a "family emergency." This is probably a fair characterization as the father has previously sued newspapers for libel when his shady dealings have been exposed, and this incident certainly hurts his clout among the political class.
 
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doorholder said:
Their father is Kenny Bingham who was has long served in the state house of representatives and is a Nikki Haley ally (SC governor). Their grandfather William Bingham was appointed to the Board of Trustees.
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Not surprised.
 
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doorholder said:
There is no tension. The two students who cheated are Kayla and Kellie Bingham, and all the frustration is directed at them. Their father is Kenny Bingham who was has long served in the state house of representatives and is a Nikki Haley ally (SC governor). Their grandfather William Bingham was appointed to the Board of Trustees. This likely allowed them to be admitted in the same class. The students and faculty involved in the honor council voted to expel them, as there were irregularities with all 1st and 2nd year exams., and the dean stepped in to save them. Their records were wiped clean, and they were allowed to progress into the clinic for 3rd year. This could have been at the bequest of Haley, the grandfather, or the father. Regardless, the dean was a pawn in this case, and it is likely his reputation that will suffer most. Rumor is that one failed her boards and the other has now withdrawn from school temporarily due to a "family emergency." This is probably a fair characterization as the father has previously sued newspapers for libel when his shady dealings have been exposed, and this incident certainly hurts his clout among the political class.
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The Dean isn't a pawn. If you take a job like that, you own your decisions regardless of the circumstances. The demand for $275,000 shows incredible audacity if accurate.
 
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amo0Skp.png


Strong
 
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Port and courier and the state newspapers have taken all the detailed articles down.

This Quorum article seems to side with the Bingham family, suggesting that twins typically score the same academically... it paints an entirely different picture than that from other stories. It says the papers 'defamed' the twins, who now have to 'transfer schools.' It claims that the Dean stepped in on goodwill, and denies any possible favors or nepotism. Who to believe??

http://quorumcolumbia.org/2016/10/03/source-post-courier-defamed-legislators-daughters/
 
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doctorbunny said:
Port and courier and the state newspapers have taken all the detailed articles down.

This Quorum article seems to side with the Bingham family, suggesting that twins typically score the same academically... it paints an entirely different picture than that from other stories. It says the papers 'defamed' the twins, who now have to 'transfer schools.' It claims that the Dean stepped in on goodwill, and denies any possible favors or nepotism. Who to believe??

http://quorumcolumbia.org/2016/10/03/source-post-courier-defamed-legislators-daughters/
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Interesting, especially this part:

The question of why the Binghams were brought before the council when they were remains open, though a source at the school not affiliated with the case tells Quorum the girls may have been victims of internal politics at MUSC where a former interim dean who campaigned for the top job, Deborah Deas, was passed-over by the board of which the girls’ grandfather is vice chair.

Two of the Deas’ top supporters on faculty were Debra Hazen-Martin and Laura Kasman. Sources with direct knowledge of that situation tell Quorum both women campaigned openly for Deas to get the job.

The source with knowledge of the hearing said it was Hazen-Martin who oversaw the final exam and ordered proctors to monitor the Binghams for possible cheating and Kasman, who is over all second-year students, who wrote a damning letter to the Honor Council that helped sway it against the Binghams in which she said the girls had been caught at the exam passing notes and signalling to each other, allegations that the proctors present at the exam refuted at the hearing and even acknowledged during it that they had no idea where Kasman got that information from.
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doctorbunny said:
Port and courier and the state newspapers have taken all the detailed articles down.

This Quorum article seems to side with the Bingham family, suggesting that twins typically score the same academically... it paints an entirely different picture than that from other stories. It says the papers 'defamed' the twins, who now have to 'transfer schools.' It claims that the Dean stepped in on goodwill, and denies any possible favors or nepotism. Who to believe??

http://quorumcolumbia.org/2016/10/03/source-post-courier-defamed-legislators-daughters/
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It's almost as if, you know, they should release the minutes of the honor council meeting so we can see what actually happened instead of "anonymous sources" making statements about what happened.
 
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doctorbunny said:
Port and courier and the state newspapers have taken all the detailed articles down.

This Quorum article seems to side with the Bingham family, suggesting that twins typically score the same academically... it paints an entirely different picture than that from other stories. It says the papers 'defamed' the twins, who now have to 'transfer schools.' It claims that the Dean stepped in on goodwill, and denies any possible favors or nepotism. Who to believe??

http://quorumcolumbia.org/2016/10/03/source-post-courier-defamed-legislators-daughters/
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MUSC is notorious for playing favorites with admissions. Plus, it does look fishy - both girls get in with granddaddy being on the Board. If that new article is true, it seems like the other side to that possible advantage.
 
VA Hopeful Dr said:
MUSC is notorious for playing favorites with admissions. Plus, it does look fishy - both girls get in with granddaddy being on the Board. If that new article is true, it seems like the other side to that possible advantage.
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That article is so biased, yikes. They look like they would be the kids in the class that cheat. Not going to lie.
 
EspressoDrip42 said:
That article is so biased, yikes. They look like they would be the kids in the class that cheat. Not going to lie.
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Your first line is a cognitive dissonance from your second (bolded) line.

I think there should be irrefutable evidence (not, omg they got the same score on their tests) of the two girls cheating before we damn them all to eternal hell for having the same last name as somebody on the board.

I guess as more and more information comes out, the less and less the original argument seems salient?
 
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evilbooyaa said:
Your first line is a cognitive dissonance from your second (bolded) line.

I think there should be irrefutable evidence (not, omg they got the same score on their tests) of the two girls cheating before we damn them all to eternal hell for having the same last name as somebody on the board.

I guess as more and more information comes out, the less and less the original argument seems salient?
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The whole school knows about it and the honor council moved to expel her. Based on hearing from committees on my council, they are usually quite generous. It would really take something like exactly what the twins are being accused of to have the honor council for vote for expulsion.

Just my opinion.


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evilbooyaa said:
Your first line is a cognitive dissonance from your second (bolded) line.

I think there should be irrefutable evidence (not, omg they got the same score on their tests) of the two girls cheating before we damn them all to eternal hell for having the same last name as somebody on the board.

I guess as more and more information comes out, the less and less the original argument seems salient?
Click to expand...

Backtothebasics8 said:
The whole school knows about it and the honor council moved to expel her. Based on hearing from committees on my council, they are usually quite generous. It would really take something like exactly what the twins are being accused of to have the honor council for vote for expulsion.

Just my opinion.


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It sounds like they did not move to expel them, and their decision may have been based on false testimony. School acting plenty suspicious though
 
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According to the article, the sum total of the evidence against them is 1) they were nodding at the same-ish time during an exam (how would this help them cheat?), 2) one of the twins moved a piece of paper (was an answer even written on it?), and 3) their grades were similar...am I missing something?
 
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Billiam95 said:
According to the article, the sum total of the evidence against them is 1) they were nodding at the same-ish time during an exam (how would this help them cheat?), 2) one of the twins moved a piece of paper (was an answer even written on it?), and 3) their grades were similar...am I missing something?
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Theoretically I guess that the cadence of the nods could be adjusted such that different frequencies correspond to A B C D. When both nod, they move on to the next one. Seems highly unlikely

I think it depends on how similar though. Are we talking like 1-2 point difference on each exam. If so it becomes pretty suspect depending on if the same ones were correct/incorrect
 
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Billiam95 said:
According to the article, the sum total of the evidence against them is 1) they were nodding at the same-ish time during an exam (how would this help them cheat?), 2) one of the twins moved a piece of paper (was an answer even written on it?), and 3) their grades were similar...am I missing something?
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All the filings for this case were public and I remember reading through some of them in the past. There have been years of filings and I’m not sure exactly what evidence was actually allowed to go before the jury. I do recall some fairly compelling evidence about how their grades on exams where higher and nearly identical for all exams where they were in the same testing room, and lower and disparate when separated. There were also reports about how nearly all right and wrong answer choices nearly matched over multiple exams.

Again, not sure how much of those reports made it into evidence as they were obviously challenged along the way. And while very compelling, they’re also all circumstantial.

I think MUSC really screwed the pooch here by leaking the info at all. It’s a good reminder why schools always shut up whenever stories about students hit the media. They also had the issue that the girls were exonerated by the internal process even if it was ultimately the dean alone who decided it. Hard to go from “our internal process declared them innocent” to school officials saying they really did it.

Personally I’d really want to see what evidence was actually allowed to go before the jury. If much of the school’s case were suppressed, then it might explain such an unexpected verdict.
 
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things like this pop up every few years!
 
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