Random Stuffs

[DVMDream]

We legit just had some adopt two intact huskies (male and female) from a shelter with the sole purpose of planning to breed them and sell the puppies to make money. They brought the female in for like a UTI or something and couldn't afford anything. It was sickening.




But I agree on whoever's earlier comment that you can be super cheap and they'll still complain. Where I am as an ER hospital, is pretty cheap by ER standards and people complain all the time. I also remembered the complaints we'd get where I used to tech prior to vet school which was a low cost clinic in the sense that it was a non-profit, we offered a sliding scale discount, etc. Still had people trying to get out of paying for things when a sick visit was like $50.

How the hell does someone get intact dogs from a shelter. This is a problem.

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[finnickthedog]

I assumed all shelters neutered the animals before they leave. I guess because all the ones I know do. Weird.

 

[DVMDream]

I don't care where I'm working.... corporate clinic, non-corporate, or ****ing taco bell....if someone is being threatening I'm calling the cops. I'm also never seeing them again. If your boss/corporate doesn't back you up on that, it is time to leave, immediately.

 

[ajs513]

In many states, the abuse calls are the "easiest" from a decision making perspective because there are frequently laws in place that make veterinarians mandated reporters. For example, in CO vets are required to report suspected child abuse.

I also am pretty sure that legally you can’t get in trouble for calling the police for suspected abuse. It’s just that there are states, like you said, that require that you actually do something.

 

[SkiOtter]

CBC/Chem/T4/PLI/UA.... things are expensive in a big city

Okay but I don’t live in some podunk little town where everything is $2. I’m from a pretty well off area. I’ve had exactly that done on my dog at a freaking blue pearl and it wasn’t even that much.

 

[vetmedhead]

I assumed all shelters neutered the animals before they leave. I guess because all the ones I know do. Weird.

The only time we'll ever send intact animals home with adopters is if we don't think we can safely anesthetize and perform surgery on the animal with our set up. If that happens, we'll send the owner out with a citation to have the animal altered within a month or provide us with paperwork from a veterinarian outlining why it can't be done within a month and when they expect to be able to schedule the surgery. We send officers out to follow up on these and I think it's a >$1000 fine if they don't comply

 

[vetmedhead]

I also am pretty sure that legally you can’t get in trouble for calling the police for suspected abuse. It’s just that there are states, like you said, that require that you actually do something.

I think it slightly depends - the mandated reporter clauses all generally include a provision that makes the reporter immune from civil liability in addition to plain legal liability, which I think is a fair protection given how litigious some people are

 

[DVMDream]

Okay but I don’t live in some podunk little town where everything is $2. I’m from a pretty well off area. I’ve had exactly that done on my dog at a freaking blue pearl and it wasn’t even that much.

Sorryz, but not really. I dunno what response you're looking for here? That's what a senior screen to the lab is out here (not in house which is mostly what blue pearl runs, plus in house thyroid is very unreliable in my experience). I don't make the prices, I just give them. I've worked in many clinics in this region and they're all within that range. Hence, $140 for a senor screen is low cost. That's a basic adult Chem/cbc here....and that adult Chem is only a 10 Chem instead of a 19 Chem like the senior screen.

 

[SkiOtter]

Sorryz, but not really. I dunno what response you're looking for here? That's what a senior screen to the lab is out here (not in house which is mostly what blue pearl runs, plus in house thyroid is very unreliable in my experience). I don't make the prices, I just give them. I've worked in many clinics in this region and they're all within that range. Hence, $140 for a senor screen is low cost. That's a basic adult Chem/cbc here....and that adult Chem is only a 10 Chem instead of a 19 Chem like the senior screen.

I know you’re not the one making prices because you’re not the owner. It’s just insane to me that you guys charge that.
Blue pearl sent it out to antech because it was preanesthesia bloodwork for the following day. So wasn’t in house for this.
My vet does a chem 27 CBC and it’s $85. I think it was $95 if you’re doing it with t4.

 

[ajs513]

I know you’re not the one making prices because you’re not the owner. It’s just insane to me that you guys charge that.
Blue pearl sent it out to antech because it was preanesthesia bloodwork for the following day. So wasn’t in house for this.
My vet does a chem 27 CBC and it’s $85. I think it was $95 if you’re doing it with t4.

I don’t know how you guys can afford to charge that. Where I work and used to work, that would be like a $10 profit. IDEXX gives promotions for certain things but even with our promotion for the senior profile we were only making around $30 of profit charging $140. That’s including a Chem 27, CBC, T4, and UA.

 

[SkiOtter]

I don’t know how you guys can afford to charge that. Where I work and used to work, that would be like a $10 profit. IDEXX gives promotions for certain things but even with our promotion for the senior profile we were only making around $30 of profit charging $140. That’s including a Chem 27, CBC, T4, and UA.

I believe we do 150% upcharge on pretty much anything. So we still make a good profit.

 

[Cephal0pod]

Sorryz, but not really. I dunno what response you're looking for here? That's what a senior screen to the lab is out here (not in house which is mostly what blue pearl runs, plus in house thyroid is very unreliable in my experience). I don't make the prices, I just give them. I've worked in many clinics in this region and they're all within that range. Hence, $140 for a senor screen is low cost. That's a basic adult Chem/cbc here....and that adult Chem is only a 10 Chem instead of a 19 Chem like the senior screen.

Genuinely curious here -- what general area of the country do you practice in, if you don't mind sharing? I also work at a clinic in a significantly sized city (not like NYC big city, but also far from a podunk middle of nowhere type place), and that same panel for us is about $170, sent out to Antech. I've only ever worked in the area I'm currently in, though.

 

[ajs513]

I believe we do 150% upcharge on pretty much anything. So we still make a good profit.

I’m just looking at what our cost is for IDEXX, and that’s a $10 profit. Obviously where you live and using antech could be the difference though. I think where you’re getting mixed up then is the fact that labs charge drastically different prices depending on where the hospital is located. So what may only cost your clinic $50 might cost mine $100. So in order to make any profit at all, we’d have to charge well over your prices and still make less profit. A low cost clinic in much area (philly metropolitan area) might cost $140 and make $20 whereas your clinic can charge $100 and make $40 profit.

 

[DVMDream]

I know you’re not the one making prices because you’re not the owner. It’s just insane to me that you guys charge that.
Blue pearl sent it out to antech because it was preanesthesia bloodwork for the following day. So wasn’t in house for this.
My vet does a chem 27 CBC and it’s $85. I think it was $95 if you’re doing it with t4.

Your vet isn't making any money off that, especially if they are sending it out. Unless you are personally getting a discount that you don't know about. Plus preanesthesia bloodwork is different than a senior screen.

 

[DVMDream]

Genuinely curious here -- what general area of the country do you practice in, if you don't mind sharing? I also work at a clinic in a significantly sized city (not like NYC big city, but also far from a podunk middle of nowhere type place), and that same panel for us is about $170, sent out to Antech. I've only ever worked in the area I'm currently in, though.

West coast--- specifically fifth largest city in the US.

 

[SkiOtter]

I’m just looking at what our cost is for IDEXX, and that’s a $10 profit. Obviously where you live and using antech could be the difference though. I think where you’re getting mixed up then is the fact that labs charge drastically different prices depending on where the hospital is located. So what may only cost your clinic $50 might cost mine $100. So in order to make any profit at all, we’d have to charge well over your prices and still make less profit. A low cost clinic in much area (philly metropolitan area) might cost $140 and make $20 whereas your clinic can charge $100 and make $40 profit.

I’m not using antech. It’s idexx.

Your vet isn't making any money off that, especially if they are sending it out. Unless you are personally getting a discount that you don't know about. Plus preanesthesia bloodwork is different than a senior screen.

It literally was a full panel Dvmd. It wasn’t even a chem 19. It was a superchem. With CBC. With t4. With ua. From blue pearl. Who upcharges insane amounts to start.
It just happened to be getting used for going under anesthesia for an mri.
My regular vet also always does a full CBC chem before anesthesia.

 

[Caiter92]

Genuinely curious here -- what general area of the country do you practice in, if you don't mind sharing? I also work at a clinic in a significantly sized city (not like NYC big city, but also far from a podunk middle of nowhere type place), and that same panel for us is about $170, sent out to Antech. I've only ever worked in the area I'm currently in, though.

I worked in one of the most expensive cities to live in the US, and we used Antech or Phoenix for all send out, and that’s about what we charged for our senior feline panels (CBC, chem 15 or 19 depending on the lab, and T4). If we sent out the UA, it was another $40-50. Maybe other areas labs charge clinics more, or IDEXX is really that much more expensive than Antech or Phoenix

 

[Cephal0pod]

West coast--- specifically fifth largest city in the US.

Ah, okay.

My mind is still blown, but I suppose most things out that way are going to cost a bit more than in the Midwest.

 

[SkiOtter]

I worked in one of the most expensive cities to live in the US, and we used Antech or Phoenix for all send out, and that’s about what we charged for our senior feline panels (CBC, chem 15 or 19 depending on the lab, and T4). If we sent out the UA, it was another $40-50. Maybe other areas labs charge clinics more, or IDEXX is really that much more expensive than Antech or Phoenix

Nope it’s not that idexx is. That’s what we use.

 

[DVMDream]

I worked in one of the most expensive cities to live in the US, and we used Antech or Phoenix for all send out, and that’s about what we charged for our senior feline panels (CBC, chem 15 or 19 depending on the lab, and T4). If we sent out the UA, it was another $40-50. Maybe other areas labs charge clinics more, or IDEXX is really that much more expensive than Antech or Phoenix

Antech is more expensive than Idexx

 

[DVMDream]

It literally was a full panel Dvmd. It wasn’t even a chem 19. It was a superchem. With CBC. With t4. With ua. From blue pearl. Who upcharges insane amounts to start.
It just happened to be getting used for going under anesthesia for an mri.
My regular vet also always does a full CBC chem before anesthesia.

You really are upset that clinics are charging $300 for bloodwork when I have no control over it.. again, sorry, but really seeing $140 for a full panel IS cheap in comparison to some places.

Blue Pearl actually doesn't "upcharge an insane amount", please don't perpetuate that myth. They charge appropriately for their services and the hours they are open.

 

[Caiter92]

Antech is more expensive than Idexx

Then either your clinics are up charging more than we did (2x cost to clinic if I remember correctly), or the labs are charging more to clinics in that area. Phoenix was $140 for the same panel that was $170 from Antech, so we usually did Phoenix.

 

[SkiOtter]

You really are upset that clinics are charging $300 for bloodwork when I have no control over it.. again, sorry, but really seeing $140 for a full panel IS cheap in comparison to some places.

Blue Pearl actually doesn't "upcharge an insane amount", please don't perpetuate that myth. They charge appropriately for their services and the hours they are open.

Curious. Are you private practice or corporate?
It wasn’t through emergency. They do upcharge a lot more than other clinics. That’s what I was getting at. I never said it wasn’t a fair price, it’s still cheaper than what you are charging.

 

[DVMDream]

I'll double check prices Monday when I get to work, but last I recall I told techs I wanted a senior panel and when the plopped it into the estimate it was just shy of $350, which really isn't unheard of around here. It might be a bit more than some places, this one clinic does run a tad here, but like $50-60 not $100+ more.

 

[DVMDream]

Curious. Are you private practice or corporate?
It wasn’t through emergency. They do upcharge a lot more than other clinics. That’s what I was getting at. I never said it wasn’t a fair price, it’s still cheaper than what you are charging.

I'm relief... mostly hitting corporate clinic because that is all that is around here. But even the couple private practices I have been in are charging close to the same.

There is a Blue Pearl that isn't an ER or specialty clinic?

 

[DVMDream]

Curious. Are you private practice or corporate?
It wasn’t through emergency. They do upcharge a lot more than other clinics. That’s what I was getting at. I never said it wasn’t a fair price, it’s still cheaper than what you are charging.

I am not charging anything. I know you know that, but has to be cleared up especially if talking with clients. Vets don't charge anything. So saying Dr. so and so is more expensive isn't true. It is x clinic charges more. Not the specific Dr.

 

[SkiOtter]

I'm relief... mostly hitting corporate clinic because that is all that is around here. But even the couple private practices I have been in are charging close to the same.

There is a Blue Pearl that isn't an ER or specialty clinic?

It is specialty. But I never said it was not a fair price for them to be charging. It is still upcharged a lot. But it is STILL cheaper than your panel. And for a larger chem. I said my dog wasn’t coming through emergency.

 

[DVMDream]

Then either your clinics are up charging more than we did (2x cost to clinic if I remember correctly), or the labs are charging more to clinics in that area. Phoenix was $140 for the same panel that was $170 from Antech, so we usually did Phoenix.

Most clinics in this area take what the lab charges and multiply by 2.5... that is fairly across the board and I know this to be true because not every lab that you can submit is saved into the computer system. So if we want to submit, say a GI panel, we have to figure out cost ourselves.

 

[SkiOtter]

I am not charging anything. I know you know that, but has to be cleared up especially if talking with clients. Vets don't charge anything. So saying Dr. so and so is more expensive isn't true. It is x clinic charges more. Not the specific Dr.

Fine, THE CLINIC you’re doing relief for. I was going with the general you as in your clinic.

 

[DVMDream]

It is specialty. But I never said it was not a fair price for them to be charging. It is still upcharged a lot. But it is STILL cheaper than your panel. And for a larger chem. I said my dog wasn’t coming through emergency.

I get that your dog wasn't coming through emergency but if the Blue Pearl has an ER and just being specialty they do charge more. And, yes, I get it still isn't as much as what I posted. It is why I tell people in this area to go to ER, because the GP clinics aren't much cheaper, if they are cheaper at all.

 

[Caiter92]

Most clinics in this area take what the lab charges and multiply by 2.5... that is fairly across the board and I know this to be true because not every lab that you can submit is saved into the computer system. So if we want to submit, say a GI panel, we have to figure out cost ourselves.

Curious, were the PLI and T4 add ons? Cause if they aren’t standard in the panel, I can definitely see it adding on enough to get to $350

 

[DVMDream]

Curious, were the PLI and T4 add ons? Cause if they aren’t standard in the panel, I can definitely see it adding on enough to get to $350

It depends on the panel you submit. Certain packages include PLI and T4... Senior Screen includes these as far as I remember. You also have to remember I am bouncing from clinic to clinic. Antech bloodwork packages are overall **** in comparison to Idexx and much more expensive.

I can get a CBC/Chem/T4/PLI/Valley Fever test and Tick Fever test via Idexx for similar cost to an Antech senior panel alone. The "upcharge" (I hate this term because it devalues what is really being charged here) is 2.5x our cost via the lab. If you have Antech as your lab, you will be charging your client more. Just generally speaking from what I have seen. However, this is all super dependent on other factors that are just difficult to parse out via an SDN thread. Many clinics have contracts with these labs and based on your contract that can make labs more or less expensive to the clinic.

I wasn't intending to get into some argument about how $350 is too much or absurd of a charge. I was trying to show that depending on where you live/work... $140 can be considered low cost. To me, that is low cost. If you lived in California, that would be low cost. New York that would be low cost. Podunk Iowa, probably not low cost. But there are way too many factors to sit there and tell a poster that $140 isn't "low cost" depending on their clinic, their lab contract, how much they pay the lab, where the clinic is located, etc... $140 may be very low cost.

 

[JaynaAli]

For the record, I take Winston to a Blue Pearl and an IDEXX senior screen (CBC/Chem/UA/T4) with urine culture and UPC in December was $485. $250 for the senior screen and $185 for the UPC/culture. Not every clinic pays the same for lab tests. If you have enough buying power you can negotiate based on case load, volume you promise them, how much they want your business or what other perks they give you (in-clinic analyzers, radiology equipment, etc). Courier vs direct overnighting through the mail, frequency of pickup times if couriered, negotiations for prioritizing samples over other clinics...there are a lot of factors that go into costs charged to clinics. Then the clinics markup the lab testing however they see fit. Some labs may markup lab testing more to minimize loss from loss-leaders like HW/Flea meds. Others may have other priorities...you really can't compare one directly to another.

 

[genny]

I know you’re not the one making prices because you’re not the owner. It’s just insane to me that you guys charge that.
Blue pearl sent it out to antech because it was preanesthesia bloodwork for the following day. So wasn’t in house for this.
My vet does a chem 27 CBC and it’s $85. I think it was $95 if you’re doing it with t4.

It's insane to me that your vet only charges $95 for a cbc/chem/T4. With 150% markup, she is only paying $38 for those 3 tests???

 

[Trilt]

Our cbc/chem (including pPSL) is right around 110$. Same cost to do a big panel (not just presurg) in house but less stuff on it obvs.

Add on UA another $80ish (with cysto fee; cheaper if free catch) and t4 about another forty bucks.

UPC is like $130? Culture is like $150.

My clinic is in a buying group and this is all with 2x plus a bit markup. I think we are super duper reasonably priced.

 

[CoffeeQuestionMark]

Then either your clinics are up charging more than we did (2x cost to clinic if I remember correctly), or the labs are charging more to clinics in that area. Phoenix was $140 for the same panel that was $170 from Antech, so we usually did Phoenix.

Lol for a second I forgot you live in my state.

I interviewed at Phoenix but they pay pretty poorly so turned down the offer. Now I know They don't get along with my lab.

 

[Caiter92]

Lol for a second I forgot you live in my state.

I interviewed at Phoenix but they pay pretty poorly so turned down the offer. Now I know They don't get along with my lab.

Ha, that’s funny they don’t get along. I just know calling the PCL customer service they were always much nicer and more helpful than calling antech

 

[ajs513]

Ha, that’s funny they don’t get along. I just know calling the PCL customer service they were always much nicer and more helpful than calling antech

I have to say, IDEXX customer service is the best hands down. My practice has IDEXX Integration for most things (cornerstone practice management, vetmedstat telemedicine, vetconnect labwork) and we have to call all the time for help with things. Mainly because when Comcast craps out it messes everything up. They can remote in and do everything for us. It’s awesome.

 

[PrincessButterCup]

All this blood work talk reminds me that I haven't scheduled Millie's recheck yet.

 

[ajs513]

All this blood work talk reminds me that I haven't scheduled Millie's recheck yet.

At least when you’re a vet you get free bloodwork!

 

[DVMDream]

At least when you’re a vet you get free bloodwork!

Not necessarily.

 

[Caiter92]

At least when you’re a vet you get free bloodwork!

She decided to go the PhD route instead

 

[Caiter92]

I'm gonna be real sad when I don't have as good of a discount as I had as a VA as a vet lol

Free exams, 50% off all surgeries and services, at cost + 10% for all lab work and meds. Worked out to anywhere from a 50-70% discount on things. It was beautiful lol

 

[WildZoo]

I'm gonna be real sad when I don't have as good of a discount as I had as a VA as a vet lol

Free exams, 50% off all surgeries and services, at cost + 10% for all lab work and meds. Worked out to anywhere from a 50-70% discount on things. It was beautiful lol

Banfield was free for most things because they gave us up to 3 free wellness plans, and you could do the highest level of you wanted. Anything not included in the plan was 20% off. I guess that was worth selling my soul for a little while

 

[Caiter92]

Banfield was free for most things because they gave us up to 3 free wellness plans, and you could do the highest level of you wanted. Anything not included in the plan was 20% off. I guess that was worth selling my soul for a little while

I never want to work for a banfield for various reasons, but if I ever end up at one, at least I get almost free Vet care

 

[WildZoo]

I never want to work for a banfield for various reasons, but if I ever end up at one, at least I get almost free Vet care

The highest level plan was 2 physical exams, one in house CBC/Chem, two fecals, all vaccines, tonometry, and a dental which includes another set of bloodwork. Then a set of rads for dogs and a T4 for cats. Free ear swab on your first plan. All things were supposed to be used preventatively but we would definitely game the system to use them if the pet was sick or had a problem (like we would hang onto the rads until their second visit in case something came up). Sometimes got in trouble for it but meh.

I hate that I still remember all of that lol
Some things may have changed by now since I worked for them 3 years ago.

 

[ajs513]

Not necessarily.

Through IDEXX you do.

 

[DVMDream]

Through IDEXX you do.

Not necessarily, just as we were mentioning that every clinic is charged differently based upon their contract with the lab. This is also part of the contract. If the clinic doesn't have enough business sent through Idexx, they do not receive this discount.

 

[DVMDream]

The highest level plan was 2 physical exams, one in house CBC/Chem, two fecals, all vaccines, tonometry, and a dental which includes another set of bloodwork. Then a set of rads for dogs and a T4 for cats. Free ear swab on your first plan. All things were supposed to be used preventatively but we would definitely game the system to use them if the pet was sick or had a problem (like we would hang onto the rads until their second visit in case something came up). Sometimes got in trouble for it but meh.

I hate that I still remember all of that lol
Some things may have changed by now since I worked for them 3 years ago.

And all their in-house machines read blood wrong. Every single one and they have known it is a problem for a while, but meh, after years, they are just now slowly replacing the machines. Don't get me started on all the issues I have seen in clinics, corporate or otherwise.

 

[DVMDream]

Through IDEXX you do.

Oh and can't forget that not every vet works for a clinic that has Idexx available. Industry vets, lab vets, relief vets, vets who work at clinics contracted with Antech or another lab instead, etc.... they can't just send blood to Idexx for free.