RANT HERE thread

[killerleaf]

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Ahh, all my writing classes were taught by the most chill professors who hated structure and encouraged everyone to develop their own individual style. I loved them for it because it meant as long as I followed the few requirements they had for an assignment and made sure to write in a journal everyday, I could do just about anything I wanted. To be fair, I didn't actually have to do any lit courses.

Also. The Krebs cycle is my enemy. That is all

@Amanasoul the professor was pretty chill, he was great. It is just that since I was in a "computer sciences/technical" track, I had to take the class that was slanted for business writing. He understood about style, he actually praised mine in the very first assignment, which he used to figure out where everybody's level resided. Unfortunately, business writing is just....so opposite!!

 

[Amanasoul]

@Amanasoul the professor was pretty chill, he was great. It is just that since I was in a "computer sciences/technical" track, I had to take the class that was slanted for business writing. He understood about style, he actually praised mine in the very first assignment, which he used to figure out where everybody's level resided. Unfortunately, business writing is just....so opposite!!

Fair enough. I avoided business writing like the plague so I honestly forgot the subset even existed. I can definitely see how that would be different. 🙂

 

[LetItSnow]

Ignoring all the points made above...

Yes, maybe, i guess. But they also graduate with an arts degree. So, all the debt, and... less job opportunities, perhaps. I was going to make a barista joke, but I don't actually want to be mean.

Hell, nothing wrong with being a barista. At this point, it's tempting. I'm making killer money (for a vet, and especially a non-boarded vet) and I'm still trying to figure out how/if/when to bail. After listening to the millionth client in the last 6 months scream at me about how immoral it is to charge what we're charging when people have lost jobs to covid so it's obviously impossible for them to have the money to take care of their 6-mo-old goldendoodle [that of course they got for free, right?] blah blah blah blah blah blah blah ....

Screw clinical practice. Call me in some other society where people are respectful and grateful more often than not rather than the other way 'round.

 

[DVMDream]

Hell, nothing wrong with being a barista. At this point, it's tempting. I'm making killer money (for a vet, and especially a non-boarded vet) and I'm still trying to figure out how/if/when to bail. After listening to the millionth client in the last 6 months scream at me about how immoral it is to charge what we're charging when people have lost jobs to covid so it's obviously impossible for them to have the money to take care of their 6-mo-old goldendoodle [that of course they got for free, right?] blah blah blah blah blah blah blah ....

Screw clinical practice. Call me in some other society where people are respectful and grateful more often than not rather than the other way 'round.

We're hiring again. Just saying.

 

[SARdoghandler]

We're hiring again. Just saying.

Ngl this would be a really cool job. If only they hired Canadians haha

 

[EB73674]

This is completely random, but...
Has anyone else in undergrad noticed that majors that are not science based are so much easier then what we are doing? Like my roommate is a double major that doesn't have a ton of cross over classes and she does school work 2-3 days a week, and then there's me. I could do homework all day 7 days a week and still not be ahead. Its kind of ridiculous in my opinion.

But on a good note, I am taking organic chemistry freshman year and kicking ass!

I disagree - I was an International Relations major in undergrad, and most of my classes were language and politics. Why did I take that major instead of biology or chemistry or business? Because I was ALREADY good at those things. I inherently needed to put way less work into learning Arabic - a language most people would not say is “easy” - because I was already comfortable learning a new language. I was also pretty motivated to work on and learn those things. I’ve had to study a lot harder in my science classes because they are not my natural strengths, and I don’t have the same level of comfort with them. My sister, however, has always been way better at science and math, while she cried and cried trying to get through basic French and English classes in high school and college. She worked hard at nursing school, but she would have had to work INSANELY much harder for a foreign language degree. I don’t think you can really compare the two.

 

[twelvetigers]

Hell, nothing wrong with being a barista. At this point, it's tempting. I'm making killer money (for a vet, and especially a non-boarded vet) and I'm still trying to figure out how/if/when to bail. After listening to the millionth client in the last 6 months scream at me about how immoral it is to charge what we're charging when people have lost jobs to covid so it's obviously impossible for them to have the money to take care of their 6-mo-old goldendoodle [that of course they got for free, right?] blah blah blah blah blah blah blah ....

Screw clinical practice. Call me in some other society where people are respectful and grateful more often than not rather than the other way 'round.

If you have paid off the loans, no reason to stay. Save what you can until you are so done you can’t, and then GTFO. Go work for DVM’s company, or for mine, or go back to pre-bet school options. Or do relief and charge a lot and only work 3 days a week. It’s not like anything you’d encounter at clinics would throw you off after all the ER work you’ve done.

 

[battie]

Or do relief and charge a lot and only work 3 days a week. It’s not like anything you’d encounter at clinics would throw you off after all the ER work you’ve done.

How long would you say a new grad should wait before doing relief work? 5 years? 10? Not that I'm giving up on clinical work before I even graduate. But I'm also aware of reality

 

[DVMDream]

How long would you say a new grad should wait before doing relief work? 5 years? 10? Not that I'm giving up on clinical work before I even graduate. But I'm also aware of reality

Meh I started doing relief work 2 years post graduation. I mean, I was stuck mostly alone within a couple months after graduation so wasn't a big jump into relief.

 

[Lupin21]

Yeah, I started relief ER work in addition to my GP less than a year out. haha

 

[LetItSnow]

If you have paid off the loans, no reason to stay. Save what you can until you are so done you can’t, and then GTFO. Go work for DVM’s company, or for mine, or go back to pre-bet school options. Or do relief and charge a lot and only work 3 days a week. It’s not like anything you’d encounter at clinics would throw you off after all the ER work you’ve done.

Man, if only it were that easy!

 

[Trilt]

How long would you say a new grad should wait before doing relief work? 5 years? 10? Not that I'm giving up on clinical work before I even graduate. But I'm also aware of reality

I also started picking up relief shifts (just because I was a bit bored/wanted to do something different + money!) about 2-3y out. Definitely could have done it sooner.

I really value having a home base to work in, though, where I know people and the equipment and clientele.

 

[that redhead]

@Trilt what happened to your job hunt?

@LetItSnow Since my career shift, I’ve found that there are definitely things I miss about clinical practice. Not among those things: clients, money-based conversations, hours, management and a number of others. It would be hard to walk away from good money but at the end of the day, you’ve got to figure out a way to be at least not-miserable and maybe even a little happy? (Don’t mind taking these conversations to PM if people prefer, butI think there’s value in it being out there for future generations to see.)

 

[Trilt]

@Trilt what happened to your job hunt?

Actually just got home from my first shift at the new ER! Ended up taking a month and some change off between jobs to relax.

 

[that redhead]

Actually just got home from my first shift at the new ER! Ended up taking a month and some change off between jobs to relax.

Sweet! I took a week off between jobs and even just that time was amazing.

Will you be able to get your exotics fix through ER?

 

[Trilt]

Sweet! I took a week off between jobs and even just that time was amazing.

Will you be able to get your exotics fix through ER?

Probably not. They're okay with me seeing them if I want to, but realistically they just don't have a lot of the drugs and equipment that I feel I'd need to do an OK job and the ER that routinely sees exotics locally is only ~35min away.

I'm still working occasionally at my former GP, though, and they are definitely piling "my" exotics people on my days there. So I'm not detached completely from it. With time we'll see if the fun of ER wins me over or I return to my guinea pigs, hehe.

 

[Caiter92]

Nothing like starting your day euthanizing a five week old puppy 😢

 

[battie]

I want to know what happened to make it so those are more educated in a field are not trusted and are "elitist" as a relative put it when you point out that the people with the advanced degrees do know the most in that particular subject. It's starting to irritate the hell out of me when talking to family who ask specific questions, then disregard 10 years of higher education. But they pull up WebMD as their source of facts.

 

[alissa14]

I just want to rant that my clinic is ridiculously understaffed and as a result I’m scheduled to work 39 hours in one week which is way too much when I also have a full school schedule. Not to mention I’m only making a dollar more than when I started more than 2 years ago and it’s barely above minimum wage.

 

[EB73674]

I just want to rant that my clinic is ridiculously understaffed and as a result I’m scheduled to work 39 hours in one week which is way too much when I also have a full school schedule. Not to mention I’m only making a dollar more than when I started more than 2 years ago and it’s barely above minimum wage.

So sorry Alissa, understaffing only leads to burnout and frustration. Hopefully you guys can do some more hiring soon! 🙁

 

[calliesmom2014]

I just want to rant that my clinic is ridiculously understaffed and as a result I’m scheduled to work 39 hours in one week which is way too much when I also have a full school schedule. Not to mention I’m only making a dollar more than when I started more than 2 years ago and it’s barely above minimum wage.

This!!! I have been working at the same clinic over 2 years and just recently got a raise of like $1. I know for a FACT everyone else in the clinic makes more than I do and it is incredibly frustrating. I also work in the ER on weekends and make significantly more there, so I know I am being underpaid.

 

[alissa14]

This!!! I have been working at the same clinic over 2 years and just recently got a raise of like $1. I know for a FACT everyone else in the clinic makes more than I do and it is incredibly frustrating. I also work in the ER on weekends and make significantly more there, so I know I am being underpaid.

I plan on talking to my boss on Tuesday... I think they’re hiring someone without any experience and if they’ll hire her making the same as me I’ll be very upset

 

[awesomenessity]

So I have to give a case presentation next Wednesday on an interesting case I have seen... only problem is I have had literally the most boring cases EVER. Like... ever. So hoping to get something interesting this week or...

 

[SkiOtter]

So I have to give a case presentation next Wednesday on an interesting case I have seen... only problem is I have had literally the most boring cases EVER. Like... ever. So hoping to get something interesting this week or...

Too bad it can’t be a living animal
You could steal sevens case 🤣

 

[SkiOtter]

I figure you don’t want to have him as one of your animals in your residency and would rather keep him alive

 

[awesomenessity]

I figure you don’t want to have him as one of your animals in your residency and would rather keep him alive

Hahaha when I dropped him off at the college for his follow-up I told him they could do anything to him as long as I didn't see him in my "office"

 

[Aprilthearab]

A few days ago, someone drove in to pick up her pet's medication.
Parked directly in front of the door instead of in a spot.
Stepped out of the car with her credit card IN HER MOUTH. (We had a change to our credit card terminals and now have to bring cards in to manually swipe them.)
Tried and failed to open the locked door.
Tried to peer in through the signs (the ones that say DO NOT ENTER - PLEASE CALL), moving all up and down and sideways to see us and try to wave us over.
I stepped out and she handed me her slobber card, unmasked.
I asked her last name and, while she was texting, said "You should know." Well, you never called in, so no, I don't. Do you want your pet's meds or not?

How dumb and rude can people be? 🙄

 

[CoffeeQuestionMark]

A few days ago, someone drove in to pick up her pet's medication.
Parked directly in front of the door instead of in a spot.
Stepped out of the car with her credit card IN HER MOUTH. (We had a change to our credit card terminals and now have to bring cards in to manually swipe them.)
Tried and failed to open the locked door.
Tried to peer in through the signs (the ones that say DO NOT ENTER - PLEASE CALL), moving all up and down and sideways to see us and try to wave us over.
I stepped out and she handed me her slobber card, unmasked.
I asked her last name and, while she was texting, said "You should know." Well, you never called in, so no, I don't. Do you want your pet's meds or not?

How dumb and rude can people be? 🙄

I presume she was referencing that it should be on her credit card, but it certainly takes no time to say your last name so agree, that comment wasn't necessary at all

 

[Aprilthearab]

I presume she was referencing that it should be on her credit card, but it certainly takes no time to say your last name so agree, that comment wasn't necessary at all

We have a surprising number of people who pick up meds for their SO's/parent's/child's pet so we don't assume the name on the card will match the correct file. It takes less time to say your last name than it does to pick an argument with someone.

 

[battie]

Well, ya girl Bats is under modified quarantine until November 5. I guess I have no excuse to *not* study for the NAVLE now.

 

[alissa14]

A few days ago, someone drove in to pick up her pet's medication.
Parked directly in front of the door instead of in a spot.
Stepped out of the car with her credit card IN HER MOUTH. (We had a change to our credit card terminals and now have to bring cards in to manually swipe them.)
Tried and failed to open the locked door.
Tried to peer in through the signs (the ones that say DO NOT ENTER - PLEASE CALL), moving all up and down and sideways to see us and try to wave us over.
I stepped out and she handed me her slobber card, unmasked.
I asked her last name and, while she was texting, said "You should know." Well, you never called in, so no, I don't. Do you want your pet's meds or not?

How dumb and rude can people be? 🙄

wow I can relate to this so much.

 

[Caiter92]

Well, ya girl Bats is under modified quarantine until November 5. I guess I have no excuse to *not* study for the NAVLE now.

See more time on my hands just makes me procrastinate more

hope you’re feeling okay!

 

[SkiOtter]

See more time on my hands just makes me procrastinate more

hope you’re feeling okay!

SAME DUDE.

 

[battie]

See more time on my hands just makes me procrastinate more

hope you’re feeling okay!

So far all negative tests with no symptoms! Exposure was Thursday, so just getting comfy in my townhouse. @SkiOtter was kind enough to pick up groceries for me tomorrow so I dont starve.

 

[finnickthedog]

Probably going to delete this so please don't quote but...

Some rotations it feels like no matter what I do it's going to be the wrong thing. Apparently I was supposed to stand around and wait for patient's (not scheduled at a specific time) CT because giving the clinicians my phone number isn't actually for them to contact me and I'm just supposed to make sure I'm constantly standing around? Sounds like a fantastic use of my time.

It's a good thing I don't care about grades because I literally feel like my grade is entirely based on whether the clinicians on that service like my personality. It's been very hit or miss with my rotations and I don't think I've performed that differently from one rotation to the next.

 

[twelvetigers]

I’m still convinced I made an A in SA surgery because I made the main grader a pretty bomb-ass grilled cheese sandwich and tomato basil soup. (It was the end of rotation Friday so potluck was common but I made everyone grilled cheeses to go with my giant crock pop of tomato basil soup.)

 

[genny]

It's a good thing

I can sympathize. I struggled with this on rotations, as I’m a really shy person and never the first one to speak up. I had a hard time with the clinicians that favored extroverts; it was difficult for me to speak up and make sure I got enough of their attention to make a good impression.
The good news is that none of that affected my ability to be a good doctor after graduating. I think you’ll make an amazing doctor. 🙂

 

[vetmedhead]

I feel like so much of fourth year is centered around identifying the best ways to waste our time. It sucks

 

[WildZoo]

@finnickthedog grading in clinics is so so subjective. It's why we transitioned to modified pass/fail for clinics. And one of the things you're experiencing was one of the cited reasons for it - personality mismatches between student and clinician leading to lower grades, rather than anything about the student's competency. All that to say you're not alone in that experience, I'm sorry you're having it, and it has no bearing on how good of a doctor you're gonna be.

 

[KCgophervet]

Agreed with all of the above. I got A's on rotations I didn't feel the most competent in but really jived well with the clinicians and then B's on rotations I put a lot of effort into and thought I'd done well with but was overwhelmed by more extroverted personalities on the rotation. It felt a lot like a crapshoot and made me super jelly of the schools who had switched to P/F for rotations (which IMO is what it should be). The rotations I really excelled on were also externships which, wouldn't you know it, were graded P/F. It sucked. Especially since I was applying for the match and grades (while they didn't really matter to me) actually mattered for my applications.

It all worked out in the end but I remember the frustration of never really knowing how I was doing on rotations.

 

[that redhead]

@finnickthedog Not to mention that being able to multitask is a key doctor skill. My patient's CT isn't lined up yet? Cool, I'mma go repair that laceration while I wait. Fluffy is late for their appointment? Fine, I'mma work on my records from this morning.

I feel like it all ties into the overarching hierarchy of academic medicine. Because your clinician had to wait around for a CT every day during their internship/residency/whatever, now they must make others who follow suffer like they did. And that if you aren't waiting to pounce the very second the critter is getting it's imaging/testing/whatever, you're not invested in the case or not interested in the specialty. I know not all clinicians are like this; @WhtsThFrequency has provided some good insight into the other side of things before. That all being said, you are NOT alone in feeling that way. Just keep plugging along doing your thing to the best of your ability.

 

[LetItSnow]

I feel like it all ties into the overarching hierarchy of academic medicine. Because your clinician had to wait around for a CT every day during their internship/residency/whatever, now they must make others who follow suffer like they did. And that if you aren't waiting to pounce the very second the critter is getting it's imaging/testing/whatever, you're not invested in the case or not interested in the specialty. I know not all clinicians are like this; @WhtsThFrequency has provided some good insight into the other side of things before. That all being said, you are NOT alone in feeling that way. Just keep plugging along doing your thing to the best of your ability.

I think there's also an element of extravagant laziness. "Cool, so I'm a resident now, and I really want to know exactly when my patient's CT starts, but I'm far too important and busy to stand there, so I'll just make a student do it because I can."

Back on the grades thing, though .... I really can't remember what grade I got in any specific rotation. At all. I recognize that grades matter somewhat for people angling for internships and/or residencies, but in the great big grand scheme of life, you'll forget your grades. Try to just do your best and let the grades fall where they fall. Try to remember why you're there - to learn medicine. Grades are ancillary, not primary. They aren't as important as they feel.

 

[vetmedhead]

I remember a resident found me waiting on a patient's meds at pharmacy, which I was missing afternoon rounds for because pharmacy was closing soon and I knew she would yell at me for not getting meds before it closed. She had originally come over to yell at me for not having meds yet (pharmacy was down like three people that day and super backed up), so instead she yelled at me for missing rounds to get meds. Only after making me take the patient out to the car after the meds came in though.

The mentality and dumb and I'm like, lol at least this is proof that I can't win I guess

 

[genny]

The mentality and dumb and I'm like, lol at least this is proof that I can't win I guess

They're just trying to prepare you for the reality of interacting with the general public when you get a real job. It's not always like that. But when it is, you'll thank your residents for helping you develop the ability to ngaf and let it roll off your back.

 

[battie]

The clinicians I actually really dont like are the ones that actually make people upset to the point of tears. And not even my more sensitive classmates. I've heard of people that I wouldn't expect eventually hitting a breaking point.

I dont understand the point. Especially when multiple people on multiple rotations through multiple classes have said something on evaluation forms.

 

[WildZoo]

The clinicians I actually really dont like are the ones that actually make people upset to the point of tears. And not even my more sensitive classmates. I've heard of people that I wouldn't expect eventually hitting a breaking point.

I dont understand the point. Especially when multiple people on multiple rotations through multiple classes have said something on evaluation forms.

This is one thing I am extremely grateful that my school seems to take very seriously. I can't think of a single long-term faculty member who has that reputation (and a year ago I would have said a single faculty member period 😛 ). Every once in a while we have a resident or technician who consistently gets flagged for that kind of thing and to my knowledge it has always been addressed.

There are definitely some people who are just not built to teach. Or who learned from people who were unnecessarily harsh/cruel and so they think that's the way it has to be done. And it's a shame that the behavior is just allowed to continue year after year. I feel like all it does is make everyone more miserable, and it can turn people off from subjects they might otherwise have really been interested in.

 

[that redhead]

The clinicians I actually really dont like are the ones that actually make people upset to the point of tears. And not even my more sensitive classmates. I've heard of people that I wouldn't expect eventually hitting a breaking point.

I dont understand the point. Especially when multiple people on multiple rotations through multiple classes have said something on evaluation forms.

My first boss in practice used to be an a-hole to me frequently enough that other doctors noticed and said something to me, like "I'm so sorry he's treating you that way, I have no idea why he's doing that" etc. And then my second boss loved me to pieces and was a grumpy goose to everyone else to the point of making them upset. I agree - it's unnecessary to be nasty to people.

I think there's also an element of extravagant laziness. "Cool, so I'm a resident now, and I really want to know exactly when my patient's CT starts, but I'm far too important and busy to stand there, so I'll just make a student do it because I can."

The sense of entitlement that breeds laziness, yes. I think certain personalities are prone to that sort of behavior when they get any element of power over someone else and some interns/residents/clinicians will never abuse their minions while others will abuse whoever they can to feel better about themselves.

 

[battie]

This is one thing I am extremely grateful that my school seems to take very seriously. I can't think of a single long-term faculty member who has that reputation (and a year ago I would have said a single faculty member period 😛 ). Every once in a while we have a resident or technician who consistently gets flagged for that kind of thing and to my knowledge it has always been addressed.

There are definitely some people who are just not built to teach. Or who learned from people who were unnecessarily harsh/cruel and so they think that's the way it has to be done. And it's a shame that the behavior is just allowed to continue year after year. I feel like all it does is make everyone more miserable, and it can turn people off from subjects they might otherwise have really been interested in.

The most well known to me are specific residents/interns. There is only one faculty member I would consider to be on that level, though.

 

[LetItSnow]

The most well known to me are specific residents/interns. There is only one faculty member I would consider to be on that level, though.

At least in my experience, the likelihood of running into one of those types is resident > intern > faculty. Most (but not all) faculty are over it. Most (but not all) interns are still too acutely aware of how new their degree is. We don't have students (other than the occasional extern), but our interns are usually afraid to tie their shoes, much less be snooty about anything, even when you're trying to gently tell them "yes, it's ok, you really can give that hospitalized parvo dog Cerenia even though there's a 0.0001% chance it has an intussusception that you somehow weren't able to palpate."

Residents seem to be square in that spot in their career of "oooo, I'm a hot **** expert in my field" (even though they really aren't), and they just desperately want to prove themselves, and part of that is being a dick to students or interns under them because they just have to prove what hot **** experts they are, and no faculty anywhere is ever going to buy it, so who else to lord it over other than interns or students?

Some of them grow out of it when they start realizing that they might be a hot **** expert in their field, but the downside of that is that they don't know crap about other specialties and they certainly aren't a broad-based general practitioner with the tremendous broad-based knowledge that goes along with that. Some of them don't (looking at you, surgeons....).

Only partly tongue-in-cheek.

 

[supershorty]

I worked as an overnight student tech in the equine hospital here for several years and felt like generally if someone was going to be unnecessarily mean/cruel to the student techs, it was usually a resident vs interns or faculty. Not always, but most of the time.

The majority of them have been great to work with - one of my favorite vet school memories so far is the nugget of a compliment that one of the interns lobbed my way once on one of those shifts (I feel like we often get negative feedback, but positive feedback is less common and I felt like a rock star for a few minutes after that comment). But oof, sometimes people can be mean for no reason other than they're a resident and you're a lowly student.