Rejection after interview for poor MCAT?

[NoPMHx]

Can schools reject you after an interview because they didn't like your MCAT? If so, what's the point of sending the II in the first place? I thought if they give you an II, that means they liked your GPA, MCAT, EC, and essays.

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[kamakazi5]

It may just be an easy excuse without needing to go into great detail. I honestly don't know. What is your score?

 

[Peach Newport]

Yes, but it's extremely rare. Only heard of this happening at LUCOM.

 

[Goro]

Can schools reject you after an interview because they didn't like your MCAT? If so, what's the point of sending the II in the first place? I thought if they give you an II, that means they liked your GPA, MCAT, EC, and essays.

Yes, it does happen. The point of the II is to see if you're worth gambling on.

 

[PossibleDOC?]

Yes, it does happen. The point of the II is to see if you're worth gambling on.

Would I be correct in saying though that if an II is granted most likely the decision has been made to take a chance (stat wise) as long as the person isn't like an idiot or interviews poorly?

 

[Goro]

Would I be correct in saying though that if an II is granted most likely the decision has been made to take a chance (stat wise) as long as the person isn't like an idiot or interviews poorly?

Correct, but I have to add I've seen plenty of situations where the Adcom reviews a marginal candidate, and an interviewer says "Nice guy/gal, but I'm worried about that MCAT score". Normally this leads to a wait list position, and so getting an outright rejection might mean that the candidate really had a bad interview, and it's more polite to say "Your MCAT is an issue". There are also times where the rejection is made to give someone the message that "it's time for Plan B".

 

[ReapPremed]

Correct, but I have to add I've seen plenty of situations where the Adcom reviews a marginal candidate, and an interviewer says "Nice guy/gal, but I'm worried about that MCAT score". Normally this leads to a wait list position, and so getting an outright rejection might mean that the candidate really had a bad interview, and it's more polite to say "Your MCAT is an issue". There are also times where the rejection is made to give someone the message that "it's time for Plan B".

So what you're saying is a marginal candidate might be interviewed, but may not sparkle enough for their flaws to be overcome

Not to go off topic but why would an admissions committee be concerned with post-interview "politeness?" It seems like those sorts of coy messages might lead a lot of well-intentioned people astray. How common is this?

 

[Goro]

So what you're saying is a marginal candidate might be interviewed, but may not sparkle enough for their flaws to be overcome
Yes, exactly.

Not to go off topic but why would an admissions committee be concerned with post-interview "politeness?" It seems like those sorts of coy messages might lead a lot of well-intentioned people astray. How common is this?

Do you really want us to come out and tell someone "your interview sucked and I wouldn't let you touch my dog, much less another human being????"

It also prevents the lawyers from getting involved. I'm sure the wise @gyngyn has some lawyer stories from disgruntled candidates.

 

[gyngyn]

Not to go off topic but why would an admissions committee be concerned with post-interview "politeness?" It seems like those sorts of coy messages might lead a lot of well-intentioned people astray. How common is this?

Maybe 25 a year should just be rejected outright. I wish we could be more transparent, but often the interview itself was a "courtesy."
You'd be surprised how many suits are filed by disgruntled parents.
Even without a suit, the endless threats and phone calls are so unpleasant.

 

[ReapPremed]

Do you really want us to come out and tell someone "your interview sucked and I wouldn't let you touch my dog, much less another human being????"

I'm surprised more people DON'T want this. As someone who had 3 interviews and 2 waitlists last year... I'd certainly want to know if it's something I could change like a bad PS or stumbling over an interview question, or something I'd need to put in years of work to fix like 5 year old prerequisites.

Is there any way to read between the lines to determine if a school is saying "We don't want you ever" or "Shadow some more doctors, make eye contact, and try again?" Without going into specifics?

 

[GypsyHummus]

Happened to me.

Would a strong SMP at a medical school (3.8+ GPA) overcome a low MCAT score (490-495), or would the applicant have to take it again? I would imagine at that particular school it would, but what about from outside ADCOM?

Correct, but I have to add I've seen plenty of situations where the Adcom reviews a marginal candidate, and an interviewer says "Nice guy/gal, but I'm worried about that MCAT score". Normally this leads to a wait list position, and so getting an outright rejection might mean that the candidate really had a bad interview, and it's more polite to say "Your MCAT is an issue". There are also times where the rejection is made to give someone the message that "it's time for Plan B".

 

[814965]

Maybe 25 a year should just be rejected outright. I wish we could be more transparent, but often the interview itself was a "courtesy."
You'd be surprised how many suits are filed by disgruntled parents.
Even without a suit, the endless threats and phone calls are so unpleasant.

Lol what grounds could parents possibly have for suing you? Their little pumpkin didn't get in so they want their $100 secondary fee back...?

 

[gyngyn]

Lol what grounds could parents possibly have for suing you? Their little pumpkin didn't get in so they want their $100 secondary fee back...?

That's basically what it amounts to ...plus "damages."

 

[Goro]

I'm surprised more people DON'T want this. As someone who had 3 interviews and 2 waitlists last year... I'd certainly want to know if it's something I could change like a bad PS or stumbling over an interview question, or something I'd need to put in years of work to fix like 5 year old prerequisites.

Is there any way to read between the lines to determine if a school is saying "We don't want you ever" or "Shadow some more doctors, make eye contact, and try again?" Without going into specifics?

It seems to be nearly impossible to do so, but one can always ask the Admissions dean after rejection for feedback (NOT advice or counseling).

With confidentiality being what it is for LORs, no one will ever be told that they had a bad LOR. It's incumbent for applicants to have good relationships with thier LOR writers and to choose those people wisely in the first place.

Happened to me.
Would a strong SMP at a medical school (3.8+ GPA) overcome a low MCAT score (490-495), or would the applicant have to take it again? I would imagine at that particular school it would, but what about from outside ADCOM?

I can see this only happening at the parent school that hosts the SMP. Our program has admitted our superstars from the SMP, despite low MCAT scores. We don't do it for people from other schools though. Why not? Well, we've seen those people in action, handling our own material We know that they can make it. We can't say that about someone else from outside our program.

 

[Goro]

That's basically what it amounts to ...plus "damages."

I would love to see these people go before a judge and be asked "How have you been damaged?'"
And when they give their lame "hurt feelings/emotional distress" answer, the judge should lean over his bench and smack them on their heads with his/her gavel!

 

[GypsyHummus]

Given the current political correct climate, the applicant would probably win that court case.

I would love to see these people go before a judge and be asked "How have you been damaged?'"
And when they give their lame "hurt feelings/emotional distress" answer, the judge should lean over his bench and smack them on their heads with his/her gavel!

 

[peds2bee]

...

 

[prettyNURSEtoMD]

Yes, but it's extremely rare. Only heard of this happening at LUCOM.

And PCOM GA. Especially, if you're a masters student with a 3.0, you get an automatic II, but if your MCAT is too low, they can reject you.


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[dial1010usa]

Given the current political correct climate, the applicant would probably win that court case.

I would love to see these people go before a judge and be asked "How have you been damaged?'"
And when they give their lame "hurt feelings/emotional distress" answer, the judge should lean over his bench and smack them on their heads with his/her gavel!

Goro and gyngyn, we all know that majority of schools send secondary to rip people $50-$100 off even though they know that the candidate is not eligible/borderline to get in. Its all money making business for schools.
$50*5000=$250,000
$100*$5000=$500,000
This is how schools make money just from secondary.
Is it ethical?

 

[Goro]

Goro and gyngyn, we all know that majority of schools send secondary to rip people $50-$100 off even though they know that the candidate is not eligible/borderline to get in. Its all money making business for schools.
$50*5000=$250,000
$100*$5000=$500,000
This is how schools make money just from secondary.
Is it ethical?

Kindly show me the gun that was put to your head that made you apply to medical school.

 

[Cardboard101]

Goro and gyngyn, we all know that majority of schools send secondary to rip people $50-$100 off even though they know that the candidate is not eligible/borderline to get in. Its all money making business for schools.
$50*5000=$250,000
$100*$5000=$500,000
This is how schools make money just from secondary.
Is it ethical?

A secondary =/= II.

 

[Goro]

A secondary =/= II.

As I point out frequently, secondaries are often a tax on the hopelessly naïve, if not pathologically optimistic.

 

[SpoiledMilk]

Lol what grounds could parents possibly have for suing you? Their little pumpkin didn't get in so they want their $100 secondary fee back...?

That's basically what it amounts to ...plus "damages."

I would love to see these people go before a judge and be asked "How have you been damaged?'"
And when they give their lame "hurt feelings/emotional distress" answer, the judge should lean over his bench and smack them on their heads with his/her gavel!

Here's the thing about lawsuits. Since most suits are settled before ever reaching the point of actually standing before a judge or jury, lawyers know that even a threat to sue (even if the case was without merit) will probably cause defendants to offer to settle for a variety of reasons e.g. bad press, cost of litigation, etc.

And there are times when lawyers know that the suit is without merit, but either out of fear of losing a client or other factors, the lawyer will make a half hearted attempt to appease the client by agreeing to bring the threat of a suit just to shut them up.

It is what it is.

 

[gyngyn]

Goro and gyngyn, we all know that majority of schools send secondary to rip people $50-$100 off even though they know that the candidate is not eligible/borderline to get in. Its all money making business for schools.
$50*5000=$250,000
$100*$5000=$500,000
This is how schools make money just from secondary.
Is it ethical?

This fee is the only thing thing that prevents every applicant from applying everywhere.
The medical school may not ever see a cent of it.
We would happily charge zero for secondaries if the number of schools to which one could apply were limited.

 

[dial1010usa]

Kindly show me the gun that was put to your head that made you apply to medical school.

These kinds of word does not suit adcom, not very professional at all.

 

[Goro]

These kinds of word does not suit adcom, not very professional at all.

SDNers are advised to remember that they chose this path, whatever the financials.

 

[edgerock24]

These kinds of word does not suit adcom, not very professional at all.

Stop getting offended so easily.

 

[GypsyHummus]

I'm triggered. I demand a safe space with playdoh and crayons.

SDNers are advised to remember that they chose this path, whatever the financials.

 

[Doc_Ock]

Stop getting offended so easily.

It's a fair point. I've received formal warnings from moderators for a lot less. They're a bunch of hypocrites. And when you question why they don't treat others like they treat you, it's "focus on yourself not others." The go-to excuse of someone who knows they're a hypocrite.

 

[Doc_Ock]

As I point out frequently, secondaries are often a tax on the hopelessly naïve, if not pathologically optimistic.

If I'm correct this is a uniquely american thing (pretty sure you don't have to do this in Europe for example) and somehow other countries function just fine.

 

[Goro]

If I'm correct this is a uniquely american thing (pretty sure you don't have to do this in Europe for example) and somehow other countries function just fine.

OK, what does this all have to do with the OP?

 

[Doc_Ock]

OK, what does this all have to do with the OP?

You justified secondary fees saying there were necessary.
Virtually no one else charges fees and manages to avoid chaos breaking loose.
Ergo, your justification is not supported by data.

 

[BombsAway]

This fee is the only thing thing that prevents every applicant from applying everywhere.
The medical school may not ever see a cent of it.
We would happily charge zero for secondaries if the number of schools to which one could apply were limited.

Where does it go?!

 

[Terror Billy]

I know a couple of individuals who were told this when interviewing at different schools where their MCAT was in the ~ <25%ile, both ended up being accepted at other places though.

 

[Terror Billy]

Why 5000? is this average amounts of

Why

Why 5000? is it average amount of secondaries sent out per school? I thought some schools do not even receive 5000 apps.

I think it is fair. it probably costs more than $200,000 to have an admissions department. I always think of application fees as time for someone to process my application. I think $50 is not that much to take a look at my whole applocation package, read letters, review grades, read PS and spend time to interview me.

To be fair there's no guarantee your app is going to be vetted as much as you like if your "stats" don't match the school, a large number send "courtesy" secondaries to applicants who have no chance...

 

[gyngyn]

Where does it go?!

It goes to the university where it is used as discretionary funds.
For all I know, it goes to support the badminton team!

 

[Goro]

You justified secondary fees saying there were necessary.
Virtually no one else charges fees and manages to avoid chaos breaking loose.
Ergo, your justification is not supported by data.

Please point out where I wrote that.
In addition, European medical education is different than in the US, in terms of timing and curricula format.

 

[Doc_Ock]

Please point out where I wrote that.
In addition, European medical education is different than in the US, in terms of timing and curricula format.

My bad, that was another user not you.