Research and transfer in Californian CC

[Neurosa]

Hi cool forum people,

This is my first post and first of all thank you so much for all the amazing information that has been gathered at this forum. It has been helping me a lot.

So my situation is the following: This is my first year attending education in the U.S. even though I am a U.S. citizen. Since it is a completely different school system than were I am from (Europe) I chose to attend a community college in California taking my GE for two years before transferring to a 4 year university. My CC advisor told me to take all my pre med reqs at the CC before transferring to the university. I am worried about a few things with regards to that: How it may look on the application for Med school and also if I am prepared enough to take the MCAT if I take it all at a CC? Would you recommend taking ochem the first two years of your education or taking it after transferring? Also the only research opportunity that my CC currently offers is after a year of ochem. I would love to get more research opportunities and I think this one sounds good but I am just afraid of missing out opportunities I might get at a 4 year uni.

Some more information: I am a freshman currently enrolled in the second semester. Working around 30-35 hours a week in a non medical field to pay way through college (at least the CC part) and started volunteering (4 hours a week) at the hospital.

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[aalamruad]

I was in a similar position. I don't think you should listen to your advisor; you want to show med schools that you can handle the pre-reqs at a university level, so take some of them after you transfer. What I did was gen chem and English pre-reqs freshman year, o-chem and calc/stats pre-reqs sophomore year, then transferred and took my bio and physics and biochem pre-reqs during my junior year at my 4-year school, studied for the MCAT during the second semester of my junior year and took it in early summer, and submitted my med school application about a week later. If you don't want to take a gap year, I'd suggest following the same path I did. If you want to take a gap year, I'd suggest doing everything the same except instead of studying for the MCAT during junior year you should study for it the whole summer after junior year and take it at the end of summer.

As far as research goes at a CC, here are two options: 1) look for research that you can get involved in at nearby 4-year schools. I did over a year of research while at my CC at a 4-year school located 20 minutes away that offered research assistant opportunities to students from my CC and a few others. 2) look into starting your own research project. CC professors don't typically have any research going on and they're typically incredibly supportive of students, so you could probably find a professor at your school to support/mentor you in carrying out a small and very manageable independent research project. One of my friends did this and I believe she got a 2nd author pub out of it.

 

[Neurosa]

Thank you Walloobi. May I ask what your major was? In order to transfer to a 4 year university, as a science major, I need at least a year of biology. The research options sound great though, I'll definitely look into that.

 

[aalamruad]

Thank you Walloobi. May I ask what your major was? In order to transfer to a 4 year university, as a science major, I need at least a year of biology. The research options sound great though, I'll definitely look into that.

I majored in psych, so I didn't need to take many science classes before transferring. I'd strongly recommend looking into majoring in a non-science unless you're particularly passionate about sticking with biology. Math majors do the best on the MCAT, humanities majors do the second best on the MCAT (last time I checked the data, at least), music majors/language majors/other rare majors stand out to adcoms as unique and interesting, and social science majors - at least in my opinion - are able to get high GPAs with the least effort and time commitment, leaving a lot of time to boost their med school apps with strong ECs. I think you should at least consider those options, if you haven't already.

 

[DoctHouse]

Wow that advice is the opposite of what you should do. Idk why premed advisers have so little knowledge on what they're telling their students. You should take your pre-reqs at the four year university no doubt. One or two pre-reqs at CC won't hurt, but don't do all of them or adcoms will question why you made this decision. Some med schools flat out reject pre-reqs at CC's. I wouldn't risk it. Good luck!

 

[aalamruad]

Wow that advice is the opposite of what you should do. Idk why premed advisers have so little knowledge on what they're telling their students. You should take your pre-reqs at the four year university no doubt. One or two pre-reqs at CC won't hurt, but don't do all of them or adcoms will question why you made this decision. Some med schools flat out reject pre-reqs at CC's. I wouldn't risk it. Good luck!

Still? Which schools?

 

[DoctHouse]

Still? Which schools?

Most schools don't exactly specify CC information on their websites, but I've read other posts on how specific schools don't accept CC pre-req credit at all. One of them I believe was UCLA Med School. It all depends on the school.

Even if this were not to be true, nowadays it would be really risky to try the system, you never know.

 

[Code_Red]

I have a different viewpoint. I took all of my pre-req classes except biochemistry at a CC. I did take several more upper level science classes at a UC once I transferred to show I could handle work though. I feel that my CC classes were the same level as any class I have taken at a UC and honestly my UC science classes have been easier than CC science classes the majority of the time.

As fas as medical schools caring about CC classes I do not think it is as common as you think (in the situation you described of transferring). I have had interviews at a number of top 20 schools and I have an acceptance from UCLA so they must not care much.

I do agree research can be limited at a CC and hard to find though.

 

[aalamruad]

Most schools don't exactly specify CC information on their websites, but I've read other posts on how specific schools don't accept CC pre-req credit at all. One of them I believe was UCLA Med School. It all depends on the school.

Even if this were not to be true, nowadays it would be really risky to try the system, you never know.

Pretty sure this isn't true at all, with all due respect. I don't think you'll find any med schools that don't accept CC credit (maybe 1 or 2 at most, I think JHU didn't accept CC credit a year or two ago but I heard that's changed now). UCLA definitely accepts CC credits.

I just interviewed at a top-10 school and my interviewer absolutely loved that I went to a CC. She said "we get tons of applicants from Harvard/Stanford/Yale/etc., but we never get any from [name of the CC I went to]. I think it'll add a valuable new perspective to the incoming class." I definitely wouldn't consider it "risky" to go to a CC given her enthusiasm about it.

 

[Geo16]

Assist.org is your friend, use it to compare your school's courses to UCs. Every UC has different major requirement for the same major. It's weird; some require less of something meanwhile some require more of something (i.e. stats, 1-2 more course in math; generally linear algebra or differential equations) ... and UCLA/UCB require only Physics with Caculus, so if you took physics with algebra then it might not transfer to fulfill that requirement.

Gonnif posted this awhile ago.

A few thoughts:

1) There still may be a few medical schools that do not formally accept CC courses or some specific subset of them, but that is a small minority now.
2) As several as said, it depends on context of your coursework and background. If you go from a CC directly to 4 year where you take upper level science, it has less issue.
3) Just because you can do it, doesnt mean that it will make you as competitive as possible. (see list below)
4) This has to be put in your context of overall application

There are some medical schools that directly speak to this idea of community college courses. This may give a little better insight in how the underlying “culture” or “attitude” of admission committee members, whether a formal policy or not, may perceive applicants who choose summer or community college coursework. While this list is not exhaustive, it is representative enough to help advise students who are considering such a step.

SUNY Upstate College of Medicine
http://www.upstate.edu/com/admissions/faqs.php
“Applicants should avoid taking more than one or two prerequisite science courses during the summer and avoid taking them at community colleges.”

Ichan School of Medicine at Mount Sinai
http://icahn.mssm.edu/education/medical/admissions/regular-track/requirements
Q: Can I take my courses at a community college, or must I take them at a four-year college or university?
A: We have no requirement about where you take courses, though the Committee on Admissions does take that into consideration in evaluating your application.

Johns Hopkins Medical School
http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/som/admissions/md/application_process/prerequisites_requirements.html
The School of Medicine accepts prerequisites completed at the community college level. In order to be competitive in the selection process, we encourage prospective applicants with community college prerequisites to supplement these courses by taking advanced courses in related subjects at their four year institution.

University of Florida College of Medicine
http://admissions.med.ufl.edu/faq/#community_college
Q: Can I take the prerequisite courses at my local community/junior college?
A: In order to create the most academically competitive application you should take all prerequisite courses at the most competitive bachelor’s degree granting institution where you can gain entrance. You should try to complete your pre-requisite courses at a four-year institution

Albert Einstein College of Medicine
https://www.einstein.yu.edu/educati...pplication-procedure/course-requirements.aspx
Whereas course work at a four-year college or university is our benchmark, if a student chooses to meet a competency component via an alternate route such as through laboratory experience, through an advanced placement course, a course taken at a community college, a course taken abroad (during a semester abroad for which the undergraduate U.S. degree-granting institution gives credit, or for which AMCAS will verify and report the grade), or an online course, he or she should seek guidance from his or her advisor to ensure that the option meets the above guidelines as well as the rigorous academic standard required by the Albert Einstein College of Medicine.

George Washington University
http://smhs.gwu.edu/academics/md-program/admissions/faqs#communitycollege
Do you accept community college credits?
Yes. The Committee on Admissions does accept coursework taken at a community college; however, it is preferable to have the pre-medical coursework taken at a four-year college or university.

Florida State University College of Medicine
http://med.fsu.edu/?page=mdAdmissions.admissionRequirement
Listed below is the pre-requisite coursework required for all matriculates to the FSU COM. Advanced Placement, CLEP, and dual enrollment credits fulfill the course requirements. However, courses taken in a traditional classroom at a four-year institution are considered to be more academically competitive.

Lewis Katz School of Medicine at Temple University
https://medicine.temple.edu/education/md-program/admissions/requirements
Two pre-requisite science courses can be fulfilled with AP credits, community college courses or through a study abroad program.

Texas A&M Health Sciences Center College of Medicine
http://medicine.tamhsc.edu/admissions/apply/index.html
Policy on AP Credits, Credits by Exam, and Dual Credit
We generally prefer that applicants take the prerequisite courses at 4-year accredited colleges and universities rather than utilize advanced placement credits, credits by exam, dual-credit, pass/fail course work or community college courses. We do not dismiss these credits; and, if they have been taken, we will accept them toward meeting the prerequisites. In fact, if an applicant has placed out of a required level course, we will also accept another course in that discipline at the same or higher level. Again, our preference is that applicants take graded courses at 4-year institutions, particularly the prerequisites in the biological sciences and the chemistry series.

Virginia Commonwealth University School of Medicine
http://www.medschool.vcu.edu/admissions/md/faq/#q43
Are community college classes accepted as prerequisite course credit?
They may be, but the Admissions Committee generally expects students to complete all prerequisite courses at a four-year undergraduate institution.

Yale
https://medicine.yale.edu/education/admissions/apply/premed.aspx
Pre-medical courses must be completed in a U.S., U.K., or Canadian college or university. U.S. Community College courses are acceptable, provided that the courses include laboratory work and are comparable in content to courses at four-year colleges, universities, or institutes of technology.

Weill Cornell
http://weill.cornell.edu/education/admissions/app_faq.html
Can I take my prerequisite courses at a Community College?
It is not recommended.

Not a lot of schools recommend CC courses. However:

I would be a bit more nuanced than the grand dame of SDN @LizzyM on this. As I said before if you are a very "classic" premed bio major who goes to CC followed by university with ample upper level BCPM courses, I think is less of a negative impact.

Also:

I have had plenty of students who did their first two years at a CC. It's an acceptable pathway.

The bias against CC coursework is over-rated by SDN. It is looked down upon if it appears that you are trying to avoid your UG school's weeding courses.

I'd say invest into MSAR because not only does it have an interface to know if the school accepts CC credit, but also gives you direct link to their website. So you can see what they actually say and what they actually listed on MSAR (I've seen some of them differ).

 

[Geo16]

Research availability is up to professors and schools. So I can't speak for that, but research is available if they are up for it.
But I'd say do it at UC/CSU: I'm just gonna do it at UC.
We are in similar situation. I'm doing 2-3 hours a week at the hospital + 4-6 hours of elementary school volunteering.

I think CC is pretty amazing. Especially CCC since we can transfer to Cal or UCLA or USC with ease. All UCs are exceptional and all CSUs are exceptional.
We are so lucky to have them
Also check this one out : https://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/comparison-between-ucla-usc-cal-for-pre-med.1217265/
If you wish to fulfill portion of your requirement at Cal/LA/USC, look here. I'll up date to all UC's in the future. No new students are in-bound so I'm putting it off for awhile.

Lastly, choose your major wisely. Don't go for the one like Chem,Biochem, etc. but something you enjoy. I love Earth Science and Geography: I'd die for it lol to study it.

 

[DoctHouse]

Pretty sure this isn't true at all, with all due respect. I don't think you'll find any med schools that don't accept CC credit (maybe 1 or 2 at most, I think JHU didn't accept CC credit a year or two ago but I heard that's changed now). UCLA definitely accepts CC credits.

I just interviewed at a top-10 school and my interviewer absolutely loved that I went to a CC. She said "we get tons of applicants from Harvard/Stanford/Yale/etc., but we never get any from [name of the CC I went to]. I think it'll add a valuable new perspective to the incoming class." I definitely wouldn't consider it "risky" to go to a CC given her enthusiasm about it.

I think you misunderstood my answer? I never said there is any risk going to a CC whatsoever, I'm even doing that. I said there is a risk doing your premed pre-reqs AT the CC instead of the 4 year institution. Of course they accept CC credit itself, but you may want to be sure about the 'fact' that they accept you doing your prereqs at the CC.