Sermatologist marries an Emergency Doc what would the salary and lifestyle be like?

[Mandude]

If a derm marries an Emergency doctor what would their lifestyle be like. If they choose these specialties they probably will have kids so lets say 3. I was thinking somewhere around 500k combined. So would there lifestyle be like this?

http://www.bloomberg.com/ss/09/03/0319_how_much_can_you_afford/9.htm

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[The White Coat Investor]

You're kind of nuts. I understand, you're pre-med. Let me help you sort this out a bit.

First, an emergency doc makes about $350K. A dermatologist probably about the same. So $700K.

$200K will go to taxes. So that leaves you $500K.

Another $150K at a minimum should go toward retirement.

You're now down to $350K. Why you would want a mortgage of $140K a year is beyond me. That ought to cover a $2M home on a 15 year fixed. Maybe if you're in the Bay Area. Anywhere else you ought to be able to get a pretty nice house for $50K a year.

And I have no idea what the Porsche figure is supposed to be. Are you supposed to buy a new one every year? Weird.

At any rate, your lifestyle would be very busy with two married full-time docs with 3 kids. They'd probably have a nanny. So budget that in. Plus college savings. Maybe $50K a year for the three kids, but could probably do significantly less if you start early.

 

[Mandude]

You're kind of nuts. I understand, you're pre-med. Let me help you sort this out a bit.

First, an emergency doc makes about $350K. A dermatologist probably about the same. So $700K.

$200K will go to taxes. So that leaves you $500K.

Another $150K at a minimum should go toward retirement.


At any rate, your lifestyle would be very busy with two married full-time docs with 3 kids. They'd probably have a nanny. So budget that in. Plus college savings. Maybe $50K a year for the three kids, but could probably do significantly less if you start early.

I thought you wouldn't need a nanny as people say dermatologist and Emergency doctors work less hours. Also 150k a year for retirement seems insane!

 

[The White Coat Investor]

I thought you wouldn't need a nanny as people say dermatologist and Emergency doctors work less hours. Also 150k a year for retirement seems insane!

Have you had either children or a job? Who do you think is going to care for that four month old while dermatologist is in clinic (generally bankers hours) and emergency doc is trying to recover from last nights night shift? How about at 2 pm when the emergency doc heads in for an evening shift and dermatologist is still in clinic? I see no way for a two physician couple, both working full-time, to raise young children without child care assistance, even if they are in those two specialties. Now, I can think of a way if they are both shift workers. For example, they somehow align their schedules such that one is always there and awake when the other is not. I could see two EPs doing it, but not an EP and a clinician. But even two EPS...that life would suck. That means every day you're off, your spouse is working. Or your group has to build its schedule around the two of you. Just not going to happen. You'll need child care, and probably at weird times. That means a nanny or au pair or something. Ask around. See if you can find a two physician couple doing it without someone. There can't be many. This all assumes you wait until you're both out of training to get started too.

 

[The White Coat Investor]

I thought you wouldn't need a nanny as people say dermatologist and Emergency doctors work less hours. Also 150k a year for retirement seems insane!

Not sure to me why $150K for retirement seems insane. Everything about an attending physician's budget seems insane to a pre-med. I bet you think it's weird I give $60K a year to charity too. Or that I spend $3K a month on a mortgage. Or blow $5K a month on gas, food, entertainment and other crap. That would have seemed insane to me too as a pre-med, when $5K was my living expenses for an entire year.

But if this couple wants to retire on anything like they're making during their working careers, they'd better plan on saving 20% of their gross for retirement. A two specialist couple ought to be able to make $750K a year. 20% of that is $150K.

 

[user3]

Not sure to me why $150K for retirement seems insane. Everything about an attending physician's budget seems insane to a pre-med. I bet you think it's weird I give $60K a year to charity too. Or that I spend $3K a month on a mortgage. Or blow $5K a month on gas, food, entertainment and other crap. That would have seemed insane to me too as a pre-med, when $5K was my living expenses for an entire year.

But if this couple wants to retire on anything like they're making during their working careers, they'd better plan on saving 20% of their gross for retirement. A two specialist couple ought to be able to make $750K a year. 20% of that is $150K.

how large of a nest egg do you plan to retire on?

 

[The White Coat Investor]

how large of a nest egg do you plan to retire on?

Original plan was $2M in 2006 dollars. Right now I'm thinking more in the $3-4M range. Certainly $2.5M. Reaching that shouldn't be an issue, it's just a matter of when. Right now we're trying to find the right balance between spending, saving, working, playing, giving etc.

 

[doc05]

I thought you wouldn't need a nanny as people say dermatologist and Emergency doctors work less hours. Also 150k a year for retirement seems insane!

Yes 150k is insanely low! I'd hope to save at least 200k per year with that income; of course child care costs will severely limit your savings ability.

p.s. that bloomberg "article" is ridiculous and frankly stupid.

 

[DrMason]

Let's say 325 (ER) and 400 (derm), assuming the system gets milked well enough and you negotiate a decent RVU compensation. I assume you are going to work for a corporate entity.

725

-60% takes (sales, state, federal, tort tax, property tax)

=275 or so.

These money will have to cover housing, living, licensure taxes (license, DEA, boards, etc etc).

It is likely there will be a real-income decease in this reimbursement though, while taxes should go up, so practically speaking, you are probably left with 150 a year or so in 2016 value down the road. Not bad, but if you divide this on two physicians it is 75 a piece. Let's say this is Mon-Fri or equivalent in case of ER and you are left with 6K monthly net each after all leeches have taken theirs.

I wouldn't get a Porsche until I have paid off debt and if you could sacrifice he first 5 years and pay off debt, you will be in less of a jeopardy as government bleeds us even more dry.

"Retirement"???? Yeah, good luck with that one. I think there is no doubt that private retirement accounts are more vulnerable to futur confiscation than having a bible in Mosul. I don't save a dime for that and neither does my wife. The best retirement is a paid off house and some good kids, IMHO.