Should I quit research?

[DignifiedEffigy]

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I volunteer in a very toxic but prestigious lab & will be applying in 2027. In a couple of months I'll have been in the lab for a year, but its worth noting I committed to 2 years. About 6 months of that was hand on training and another 1 on top of that was all the orientation stuff before I could officially step foot in the lab.

My peers are extremely rude and ice me out socially, and the PI can be childish. The PI expects me to be available for last minute schedule changes, even when sick and then gets upset/antsy when I am not. During training I even had a family member die and the PI seemed more upset at the prospect of me missing some of the training to attend the funeral. I wound up not going because of this and was not offered even a day off.

Every single day I regret joining this lab. I already had prior research experience with 3 pubs.

I really want to quit, but knowing how easy it is to upset the PI, I know they won't take it well if I quit before the 2 years are up. I don't even care about receiving a LOR anymore, I just want to be able to leave on good terms. I am afraid of retaliation if I don't leave on good terms as they have strong ties to a public IS school which also happens to be my dream school.

 

[LizzyM]

You have 3 publications and research experience. Unless you are looking for admission to a MD/PhD program, you have enough. You committed to VOLUNTEER for two years and had six months of hands on training and a month of orientation meaning that the lab invested seven months expecting that you would then serve for at least 17 months. However, it seems you've been treated very badly. Anywhere I've ever been, employees get 3 days off upon the death of a family member but you, a volunteer, were begrudged even one day! The lab was showing you its values right there but you missed the message.

I would walk now. Find something else to do. Leave this experience, as prestigious as it appears, off of your application. You are under no obligation to list everything you ever did on the application and if there is no listing, no one will wonder why you don't have a LOR. Forget leaving on good terms; leaving before your 2 years are up could be grounds for a very bad letter. (Not saying it is right, just that it is how it might go.) Adcoms don't take well to unsolicited comments about applicants. If there is no mention of this PI in your application, the school might just wonder why such a person would bad mouth you. And, I will add, sometimes we know that a specific lab is "prestigious" and the PI is an *******. We take that into account.

 

[DignifiedEffigy]

You have 3 publications and research experience. Unless you are looking for admission to a MD/PhD program, you have enough. You committed to VOLUNTEER for two years and had six months of hands on training and a month of orientation meaning that the lab invested seven months expecting that you would then serve for at least 17 months. However, it seems you've been treated very badly. Anywhere I've ever been, employees get 3 days off upon the death of a family member but you, a volunteer, were begrudged even one day! The lab was showing you its values right there but you missed the message.

I would walk now. Find something else to do. Leave this experience, as prestigious as it appears, off of your application. You are under no obligation to list everything you ever did on the application and if there is no listing, no one will wonder why you don't have a LOR. Forget leaving on good terms; leaving before your 2 years are up could be grounds for a very bad letter. (Not saying it is right, just that it is how it might go.) Adcoms don't take well to unsolicited comments about applicants. If there is no mention of this PI in your application, the school might just wonder why such a person would bad mouth you. And, I will add, sometimes we know that a specific lab is "prestigious" and the PI is an *******. We take that into account.

Thank you so much, I think this is the wake up call I really needed.

I just have a couple follow-up questions about my situation.

Unfortunately, the lab is on my transcript for two semesters. Given these circumstances would it still be best not to mention it elsewhere in the application? Could I list it as an activity and just forgo a LOR from that PI? I just don't want it to look like I did something wrong if it's on my transcript but not mentioned elsewhere. Lastly, my previous lab work was social behavioral, but the current stuff is wet lab. My current PI has said many times that the wet lab research is far better than my old stuff so would it be a huge mistake to not list it on my application?

 

[LizzyM]

So you weren't really a volunteer, you were a student who was receiving college credit for activities in the lab. Is that correct? From what I know of college transcripts, the name of the PI or the description of the lab will not be on the transcript. I've never known anyone to look at the transcript and cross-reference with the activities section of the AMCAS application. I have seen people look for LORs based on what is listed in the activities section but not the transcript (we don't even get the transcript in the AMCAS application, just a listing that has been transcribed from the transcript.

My school, which highly values research, does not ask reviewers to judge the research in any way other than the student's contribution (from a short period of housekeeping tasks, up through publications and presentations, to doctoral degrees (obviously very, very rare). ). There is no premium for wet lab vs social behavioral.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Thank you so much, I think this is the wake up call I really needed.

I just have a couple follow-up questions about my situation.

Unfortunately, the lab is on my transcript for two semesters. Given these circumstances would it still be best not to mention it elsewhere in the application? Could I list it as an activity and just forgo a LOR from that PI? I just don't want it to look like I did something wrong if it's on my transcript but not mentioned elsewhere. Lastly, my previous lab work was social behavioral, but the current stuff is wet lab. My current PI has said many times that the wet lab research is far better than my old stuff so would it be a huge mistake to not list it on my application?

Explain how you committed to this lab for 2 years? Have you talked to your department chair or the university director of undergraduate research? Sure, you have to royally screw up to not pass an independent study credit, but there are rules about your conduct and expectations for a solid research experience. Your PI has some responsibility for how you are treated, and if you have just sucked it up the entire time, it will seem very weird. I also don't understand why you couldn't continue in your old lab and still get credit, even if it is in a different department than your major; it is very common in the applicant pool to see this "discordance."

Why did you join this lab in the first place? (Prestige?) Why didn't you leave after 1 week? Drop/add still exists, and you claim you already showed research productivity. You might have needed it for a thesis designation when you graduate, but aren't there other alternatives?

To the questions, LizzyM and I agree; we don't focus on your PI unless you are an MSTP (MD/PhD) or research (PhD) applicant. You don't need your PI's letter as long as you have other science professor letters in your dossier.