Should we call a wambulance?

[urge]

Colorado woman's $8,000 tax bill leaves her in tears


A PhD in neuroscience and an MD couple, and she is crying over 8k in taxes?!!

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[caligas]

Should be crying over the years of free loans she’s been giving the government.

...And I guarantee they are paying a lower percentage this year than last. What an idiot.

 

[PainDrain]

What does it mean when she says “my husband had an MD”? Either he does or doesn’t. Or he is your former husband.

 

[Frogger27]

What does it mean when she says “my husband had an MD”? Either he does or doesn’t. Or he is your former husband.

Not too hard to find out who the husband is. Looks like he is a pediatric anesthesiologist. Not sure if she misspoke or if they are separated.

 

[IlDestriero]

Another article that doesn’t investigate or mention the % tax they paid this year vs last year. If you or your company isn’t withholding the right amount, that’s not the IRS’s fault.
I haven’t done mine yet, but I owe a few thousand every year. I think the changes to the AMT will be greater than the loss of some SALT deductions.

 

[DM27]

I will say I was very surprised with how much I ended up owing this year.

 

[GlowInTheDark]

Why is she crying? I can’t wait until I have to pay a truckload in taxes.

 

[deleted50478]

Why is she crying? I can’t wait until I have to pay a truckload in taxes.

It’d be nice to pay the most in taxes because you make the most money but that’s not how it works. I pay the most taxes and people both richer and poorer than me pay less. Nobody likes that!

 

[nimbus]

I will say I was very surprised with how much I ended up owing this year.

I am getting a significantly smaller refund, but when I looked at the actual taxes paid, my overall federal rate was 22.5% in 2017 compared to 23.5% in 2018. It was basically a wash.

 

[dhb]

I am getting a significantly smaller refund, but when I looked at the actual taxes paid, my overall federal rate was 22.5% in 2017 compared to 23.5% in 2018. It was basically a wash.

Since you're on sdn and thus making seven figures that 1% is a 10k hit at the least.

Seriously, i'm surprised you have that kind of overall rate, if you add state and other taxes you must be approaching 30-35%

 

[deleted162650]

I am getting a significantly smaller refund, but when I looked at the actual taxes paid, my overall federal rate was 22.5% in 2017 compared to 23.5% in 2018. It was basically a wash.

OK, that makes me feel better. I am anticipating basically a wash. You had me concerned there for a minute.

 

[nimbus]

OK, that makes me feel better. I am anticipating basically a wash. You had me concerned there for a minute.

Sorry. Tax man can strike fear in the best of us.

 

[nimbus]

Since you're on sdn and thus making seven figures that 1% is a 10k hit at the least.

Seriously, i'm surprised you have that kind of overall rate, if you add state and other taxes you must be approaching 30-35%

I’m in a high tax state so you’re right.

 

[btbam]

First year filing married, we owe $8k. That was a little eye opening.

 

[cchoukal]

First year filing married, we owe $8k. That was a little eye opening.

Marriage penalty is the WORST.

 

[Ronin786]

Biggest problem for me was the job expense deduction being removed. I was planning on expensing all my fellowship costs but only federal employees can now.

 

[PainDrain]

I am getting a significantly smaller refund, but when I looked at the actual taxes paid, my overall federal rate was 22.5% in 2017 compared to 23.5% in 2018. It was basically a wash.

How is this possible? Unless you are a resident or fellow? I am paying in the 35% bracket.

 

[Man o War]

How is this possible? Unless you are a resident or fellow? I am paying in the 35% bracket.

How are you paying that much? I’m in a fairly high tax state and I’ve always been around 30% for both state and federal. As an attending.

 

[deleted50478]

How is this possible? Unless you are a resident or fellow? I am paying in the 35% bracket.

I don’t think he’s quoting his marginal rate. It’s probably his taxes paid/gross income. Right?

 

[nimbus]

I don’t think he’s quoting his marginal rate. It’s probably his taxes paid/gross income. Right?

Yes

 

[<(^_^)>]

Marriage penalty is the WORST.

What marriage penalty are you referring to? As far as I understand it things are pretty equal except you get screwed on SALT. But salt kind of sucks these days anyway, regardless if whether it’s 5k or 10k.

 

[getdown]

What marriage penalty are you referring to? As far as I understand it things are pretty equal except you get screwed on SALT. But salt kind of sucks these days anyway, regardless if whether it’s 5k or 10k.

I think he's saying that by being married and having combined income puts you both at a higher tax rate than if each spouse filed separately under the single tax bracket. This year with the changes it became a wash. Probably more true before the new tax brackets came into being.

 

[mmag]

What marriage penalty are you referring to? As far as I understand it things are pretty equal except you get screwed on SALT. But salt kind of sucks these days anyway, regardless if whether it’s 5k or 10k.

Here's the marriage penalty in the 2018 tax year brackets:

Marginal Rate Single Filers vs Joint Filers
35% $200,000-$500,000 $400,001-$600,000
37% Over $500,000 Over $600,000

 

[fakin' the funk]

Effective federal tax rate about 27% in 2018, up from about 25% in 2017. I was getting a big SALT/property tax deduction, but no more. Incidentally I thought the charitable contributions deduction was capped, but no. Shoulda donated like I usually do.

 

[anbuitachi]

Effective federal tax rate about 27% in 2018, up from about 25% in 2017. I was getting a big SALT/property tax deduction, but no more. Incidentally I thought the charitable contributions deduction was capped, but no. Shoulda donated like I usually do.

i mean donations is only to help charities not for paying less taxes since you still end up giving away more money..
but either way this new tax law trump passed hurt most doctors

 

[AdmiralChz]

Everyone on SDN clearly is a fabulous accountant

 

[samwise gamgee]

To be fair, this was the biggest tax cut since Bush 2. The federal government is bringing in significantly less on revenue.... on the order of adding almost 2.5 trillion to the national debt over ten years. So that’s a lot of money people aren’t paying in taxes. If her bill went up (about 10K)..... mine also went up about 10K.... who is getting these tax cuts. I’m not whining, I’m just wondering, who got these tax cuts (and yes, I’m being rhetorical and mildly disingenuous, I know who got them.... and it ain’t the working man).

 

[mmag]

Effective federal tax rate about 27% in 2018, up from about 25% in 2017. I was getting a big SALT/property tax deduction, but no more. Incidentally I thought the charitable contributions deduction was capped, but no. Shoulda donated like I usually do.

Look into a DAF and bunch your contributions so you can itemize some years and take the standard deduction in others.

 

[anbuitachi]

To be fair, this was the biggest tax cut since Bush 2. The federal government is bringing in significantly less on revenue.... on the order of adding almost 2.5 trillion to the national debt over ten years. So that’s a lot of money people aren’t paying in taxes. If her bill went up (about 10K)..... mine also went up about 10K.... who is getting these tax cuts. I’m not whining, I’m just wondering, who got these tax cuts (and yes, I’m being rhetorical and mildly disingenuous, I know who got them.... and it ain’t the working man).

haven't you been following the news? the corporations are the ones with the major tax cuts... their tax got like halved? (dont remember exact # but significant decrease), thats why all the companies are even richer now. typical trump move, do whatever benefits him and screw over the upper middle class

 

[Hamhock]

Look into a DAF and bunch your contributions so you can itemize some years and take the standard deduction in others.

I have been missing out on this. DAF is the way to go as far as I am concerned. Even WCI is on board now:

Our Donor Advised Fund with Vanguard Charitable | The White Coat Investor - Investing & Personal Finance for Doctors

Although I am typically a huge fan of Vanguard -- and despite what WCI is recommending in the very post I linked -- I would suggest looking at the expense ratios, fees, minimum contributions to open, and minimum ongoing contributions from multiple companies (eg Fidelity vs Vanguard). Also, note Vanguard retirement/brokerage is not the same as Vanguard DAF.

HH

 

[DM27]

In retrospect, this is probably one of the few times a lack of salt is leading to hypertension...

 

[IlDestriero]

In retrospect, this is probably one of the few times a lack of salt is leading to hypertension...

The salt cap sucks for most upper middle class families. I’m losing several thousand dollars there alone. What I don’t know yet is if the change to the AMT will offset that loss. I think I have all my paperwork by now, so I really should get this done. I usually pay a few thousand.

 

[d2305]

What's the difference if you pay quarterly or in April? You still pay the same (might have a penalty).

 

[emergentmd]

Who cares what is the truth or lies. All that matters to 90% of Lazy American's are the headlines because most are tooooo Lazy to educate themselves.

"I AM GETTING A SMALLER REFUND THIS YEAR"!!!! = Oh... I paid less in taxes so kept more of my money.

"THOSE RACIST CATHOLIC BOYS BEING DIRESPECTFUL TO AN ELDERLY INDIAN"!!!!! = Oh, forgot who started this and the boy stayed calm all the time

"THEY SHOT A BLACK UNARMED GUY, HE JUST HAD A PHONE"!!!! = Oh, its pitch black and he was jumping fences. He pulled out his phone and its impossible to tell if that shinny object was a gun or not.

"AMAZON IS GETTING $3 Billion CORPORATE HANDOUT FROM NYC"!!!!! = Oh, its actually not money given but a small rebate on taxes paid. No instead of getting 20 Billion in Taxes, NYC gets nothing.

"OUR UNEMPLOYMENT RATE IS LOW BECAUSE EVERYONE HAS TO WORK TWO JOBS"!!!! = Oh, who cares if this is blatantly false... it sounds good.

"AMERICA NEEDS TO GO GREEN AND FIX THE WORLD"!!! = Oh, America fixes nothing b/c the majority of pollution is caused by China and India.

The downward spiral of our country is people spouting stuff that is not true and never being accountable for this with ignorant minions not wanting to spend 15 minutes looking things up.

 

[DocVapor]

My wife is a CPA. Has been giving bad news like this a lot this season. Says it's because nobody adjusted their withholding properly when the new tax laws went into effect. People didn't notice or wonder why their paychecks got bigger, so now it's a shock when they get less back (or owe more) now.

 

[samwise gamgee]

Who cares what is the truth or lies. All that matters to 90% of Lazy American's are the headlines because most are tooooo Lazy to educate themselves.

"I AM GETTING A SMALLER REFUND THIS YEAR"!!!! = Oh... I paid less in taxes so kept more of my money.

"THOSE RACIST CATHOLIC BOYS BEING DIRESPECTFUL TO AN ELDERLY INDIAN"!!!!! = Oh, forgot who started this and the boy stayed calm all the time

"THEY SHOT A BLACK UNARMED GUY, HE JUST HAD A PHONE"!!!! = Oh, its pitch black and he was jumping fences. He pulled out his phone and its impossible to tell if that shinny object was a gun or not.

"AMAZON IS GETTING $3 Billion CORPORATE HANDOUT FROM NYC"!!!!! = Oh, its actually not money given but a small rebate on taxes paid. No instead of getting 20 Billion in Taxes, NYC gets nothing.

"OUR UNEMPLOYMENT RATE IS LOW BECAUSE EVERYONE HAS TO WORK TWO JOBS"!!!! = Oh, who cares if this is blatantly false... it sounds good.

"AMERICA NEEDS TO GO GREEN AND FIX THE WORLD"!!! = Oh, America fixes nothing b/c the majority of pollution is caused by China and India.

The downward spiral of our country is people spouting stuff that is not true and never being accountable for this with ignorant minions not wanting to spend 15 minutes looking things up.

all i can go on is what i see with my own eyes. i made less this year and payed significantly more in federal income taxes. i have heard the same from all of my colleagues. sorry buddy, the Trump tax cut did, in fact, raise taxes on this small sample of professionals. I am sure there is regional variation.

 

[urge]

To be fair, this was the biggest tax cut since Bush 2. The federal government is bringing in significantly less on revenue.... on the order of adding almost 2.5 trillion to the national debt over ten years. So that’s a lot of money people aren’t paying in taxes. If her bill went up (about 10K)..... mine also went up about 10K.... who is getting these tax cuts. I’m not whining, I’m just wondering, who got these tax cuts (and yes, I’m being rhetorical and mildly disingenuous, I know who got them.... and it ain’t the working man).

The working man in low tax states.

 

[urge]

all i can go on is what i see with my own eyes. i made less this year and payed significantly more in federal income taxes. i have heard the same from all of my colleagues. sorry buddy, the Trump tax cut did, in fact, raise taxes on this small sample of professionals. I am sure there is regional variation.

I actually think the tax cuts were genius.

Now the States need to compete with each other. Have you seen all the ads from Texas telling people in high tax States to move out to Texas? Connecticut, California, New Jersey, and New York have lost thousands of millionaires already. Even Ocasio Cortez's mother moved to Florida in search of lower State taxes-

It puts pressure on the politicians not to keep raising taxes because people will move out. Perhaps even lower them, but don't hold your breath. It's the biggest favor the Federal government has done to residents of high tax States.

 

[vector2]

The working man, eh?

Trump's Tax Reform Plan Explained

 

[anbuitachi]

I actually think the tax cuts were genius.

Now the States need to compete with each other. Have you seen all the ads from Texas telling people in high tax States to move out to Texas? Connecticut, California, New Jersey, and New York have lost thousands of millionaires already. Even Ocasio Cortez's mother moved to Florida in search of lower State taxes-

It puts pressure on the politicians not to keep raising taxes because people will move out. Perhaps even lower them, but don't hold your breath. It's the biggest favor the Federal government has done to residents of high tax States.

But a lot of high paying jobs are in those high tax places. Like wall street in NYC which also happen to have many high profile tech offices, law firms etc. Not many can just pack up and move to a low paying State unless already retired

 

[urge]

But a lot of high paying jobs are in those high tax places. Like wall street in NYC which also happen to have many high profile tech offices, law firms etc. Not many can just pack up and move to a low paying State unless already retired

Not for long. The companies will move too if the high tax States don't get competitive.

 

[emergentmd]

My wife is a CPA. Has been giving bad news like this a lot this season. Says it's because nobody adjusted their withholding properly when the new tax laws went into effect. People didn't notice or wonder why their paychecks got bigger, so now it's a shock when they get less back (or owe more) now.

And here lies fact that many/most American's are ignorant about finances. So her client's had bigger take home paychecks but gets a smaller refund so they are mad eventhough they kept more of their money? It is so frustrating for me to hear educated colleagues of my spout this crap.

 

[DM27]

And here lies fact that many/most American's are ignorant about finances. So her client's had bigger take home paychecks but gets a smaller refund so they are mad eventhough they kept more of their money? It is so frustrating for me to hear educated colleagues of my spout this crap.

In defense of the average US resident, if they were previously receiving a refund, nothing changed about their job or income streams, and suddenly they are owing money, I can understand the annoyance or frustration from their end. It is not a well run system if the average citizen has to make defensive and anticipatory tax adjustments when nothing has changed about their debt-income situation and it relates entirely to a change on the other end.

 

[anbuitachi]

Not for long. The companies will move too if the high tax States don't get competitive.

dont know if the effect will be that noticeable. i dont see wall street leaving nyc, or the big law firms leaving. its just too profitable for them be to there

 

[GravelRider]

The capping of the SALT deduction was yet another way for the middle class to fund a tax cut for the wealthy and the political donor class. Nothing else.

 

[urge]

The capping of the SALT deduction was yet another way for the middle class to fund a tax cut for the wealthy and the political donor class. Nothing else.

The SALT deduction was a reward for your State over taxing you. It should have never existed. Everyone should pay the same in Federal taxes regardless of where you are living. It's up to you to decide whether the living conditions in the State merit the State taxes.

 

[deleted162650]

The changes to the AMT should offset most of the loss in SALT deductions (especially since the AMT eliminated a good chunk of my would be SALT deductions before anyways). The exception is probably if you are in a dual income household with a high enough combined income that you blew right past the AMT.

 

[emergentmd]

In defense of the average US resident, if they were previously receiving a refund, nothing changed about their job or income streams, and suddenly they are owing money, I can understand the annoyance or frustration from their end. It is not a well run system if the average citizen has to make defensive and anticipatory tax adjustments when nothing has changed about their debt-income situation and it relates entirely to a change on the other end.

Again, its ignorance. I bet if you ask 100 people, over 50% have no clue what withholding is and how it affects their tax refund while having Zero affects on their tax liability.

These are the people voting, protesting on emotion without looking at facts.

Sad that people gets more angry that that tax burden is less for the year but got a smaller refund but would rather be taxed more with a larger refund.

Another reason why people who vote should pass a low level competency test. When my vote where I spend many hours to get educated about topics is the same as one who gets all of their information on facebook is ridiculous.

 

[anbuitachi]

Again, its ignorance. I bet if you ask 100 people, over 50% have no clue what withholding is and how it affects their tax refund while having Zero affects on their tax liability.

These are the people voting, protesting on emotion without looking at facts.

Sad that people gets more angry that that tax burden is less for the year but got a smaller refund but would rather be taxed more with a larger refund.

Another reason why people who vote should pass a low level competency test. When my vote where I spend many hours to get educated about topics is the same as one who gets all of their information on facebook is ridiculous.

not a surprise in a country where 4/10 believe in psychics, and 4/10 believe in creationism.

 

[GravelRider]

The SALT deduction was a reward for your State over taxing you. It should have never existed. Everyone should pay the same in Federal taxes regardless of where you are living. It's up to you to decide whether the living conditions in the State merit the State taxes.

Then every state should get an exact dollar returned in federal aid for every dollar paid in federal taxes. No more welfare for Alabama.

Your theory is the exact same line that the state propaganda network used to push the unpopular tax plan through. The bottom line is the cap on the SALT deduction was put in place to pay for the tax cuts to the political donors. That is the explanation, plain and simple.