Side-hustles - what's yours and how do you make it work?

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sevoflurane said:
Sometimes, but I usually go btw/ 100k-275k per project depending on location and proforma.
Some investors in the group drop 2 mil per project.
What is nice is that it is staggered in a way that as one hotel opens the next one is being built while plans are being made for the one after that.
Goal for me is to have enough to support an income from all of my real estate investments that generate 300k in passive income.
Some in the group that have been at it for a while far exceed that number.
Click to expand...
How do you even have that kind of cash lying around for a project??
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I made my first investment property purchase this past summer. The area is desirable for its outdoor activities and the net rental income will be 10-25K depending on how much my family uses it. Interestingly the property valuation has gone up by 200K since I purchased it due to some local economic changes. If I can pull it off I may make another purchase in 2021 depending on how certain real estate markets play out. My ideal plan would be to keep doing this sort of thing to accrue about 8-10 properties and then just sit on them playing the rental game. My wife was the biggest barrier to investing in this way because she didn’t like the risk but now she is fully on board.

My only other hustle would be extra locums work and/or taking extra call. I do this on occasion to pay down the student loans faster.

I should add that my dream side hustle would be to work as a fishing guide. I still may pursue this because it would give me the chance to be outside and fish but it may also make me hate fishing being with D-bag clients.
 
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PainDrain said:
I should add that my dream side hustle would be to work as a fishing guide. I still may pursue this because it would give me the chance to be outside and fish but it may also make me hate fishing being with D-bag clients.
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What kinda fishing?
 
SaltyDog said:
What kinda fishing?
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In my ideal world I would be a trout guide in the spring and fall then switch to inshore salt water during the summer. That’s kinda a fantasy though.
 
PainDrain said:
In my ideal world I would be a trout guide in the spring and fall then switch to inshore salt water during the summer. That’s kinda a fantasy though.
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What’s your inshore saltwater scene consist of? Mostly stripers and bluefish? No redfish up there are there?
 
So when you guys have a side job are you able to complement your employer side 401k contributions (e.g. approach the max of 55k if your main employer doesn't get you there)?

Or, are you taking any meaningful tax deductions?
 
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"I don't really do this one for the money as my time is more valuable than that honestly but the creativity and excuse to buy more powertools/work on new techniques is addictive."
Well said Neopolymath!
 
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kidthor said:
So when you guys have a side job are you able to complement your employer side 401k contributions (e.g. approach the max of 55k if your main employer doesn't get you there)?

Or, are you taking any meaningful tax deductions?
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A SEP IRA is good for another $57K (but no more than 25% of the other job's income). Deductions are generally much easier and better when taken from the 1099 side job than from the W2 day job.
 
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caveat87 said:
you can implement fairly low risk strategies which generate $$$ over time
Click to expand...

No such thing as low risk, high reward. Please don't get naive people's hopes up. If such a thing existed, everybody would be doing it and it would be arbitraged away.
 
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Zekchar said:
No such thing as low risk, high reward. Please don't get naive people's hopes up. If such a thing existed, everybody would be doing it and it would be arbitraged away.
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Notice I said nothing about high reward. Selling options (especially selling covered calls or puts when you don’t mind buying an equity at a certain point) often provides a relatively small net premium with the downside risk being exposure to an asset. Every investment carries risk and no one should invest more than they can afford to lose.

I appreciate your skepticism and do think there are many naive people out there looking to get rich quick. I’m more in it for the long game
 
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Damn it, this isn't helpful for me at all. I don't have any marketable side skills (not any that would generate significant income anyway) and I don't have networking contacts for joint ventures. I work a lot of hours now though but have energy enough to work more in anesthesia if I could; I'd love to find an ortho or spine guy and do elective cases on my non-call weekends as a sole provider, so many lazy surgeons don't want to work on weekends though. Bah!
 
leaverus said:
Damn it, this isn't helpful for me at all. I don't have any marketable side skills (not any that would generate significant income anyway) and I don't have networking contacts for joint ventures. I work a lot of hours now though but have energy enough to work more in anesthesia if I could; I'd love to find an ortho or spine guy and do elective cases on my non-call weekends as a sole provider, so many lazy surgeons don't want to work on weekends though. Bah!
Click to expand...

Pick up extra shifts.
Save more.
Learn about investments.
Don't get divorced.
 
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dr doze said:
Pick up extra shifts.
Save more.
Learn about investments.
Don't get divorced.
Click to expand...
None available where I work and area hospitals have exclusive contracts, else I would.
Already saving 80-90% of my income
Daily, my friend (although I pretty much stick to boglehead philosophy)
Not married
 
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leaverus said:
None available where I work and area hospitals have exclusive contracts, else I would.
Already saving 80-90% of my income
Daily, my friend (although I pretty much stick to boglehead philosophy)
Not married
Click to expand...
:thumbup: on saving rate and bogleheads and learning.
If you get married, choose carefully.
 
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leaverus said:
None available where I work and area hospitals have exclusive contracts, else I would.
Already saving 80-90% of my income
Daily, my friend (although I pretty much stick to boglehead philosophy)
Not married
Click to expand...

Bogleheads is good but is a long term philosophy. You will miss out on the Teslas and other unicorn stocks. You just have to make peace with that. But you will make good yearly gains and over 30 years will do great.

What is your longterm goal? Retire early? Amass as much wealth as possible?

But in your situation, if you want to generate extra revenue:
Investment properties
Investing in riskier stocks (trying to find the next Tesla)
Getting involved in options

None of these involve any real skills. Just having some capital and doing your due diligence and accepting the increased risk (non paying tenants, stocks imploding etc).

Like others have said, enjoy life as well. No point in living a completely spartan lifestyle. Life goes quick.
 
dhb said:
Fo real? Don't forget to live, you don't want to be the richest of the nursing home.
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Yes, for real. I am a simple man with few needs, but
anonperson said:
Bogleheads is good but is a long term philosophy. You will miss out on the Teslas and other unicorn stocks. You just have to make peace with that. But you will make good yearly gains and over 30 years will do great.

What is your longterm goal? Retire early? Amass as much wealth as possible?

But in your situation, if you want to generate extra revenue:
Investment properties
Investing in riskier stocks (trying to find the next Tesla)
Getting involved in options

None of these involve any real skills. Just having some capital and doing your due diligence and accepting the increased risk (non paying tenants, stocks imploding etc).

Like others have said, enjoy life as well. No point in living a completely spartan lifestyle. Life goes quick.
Click to expand...
my goal is min. $8-10M so that I can eventually travel other countries and experience their cultures and sample their culinary varieties (and maybe buy a Tesla Cybertruck, but not their stock). I steer clear of individual stocks - finding a "unicorn" doesn't suit my personality so I'm already at peace with that. I'm not interested in retiring early either, and plan to keep working in some capacity as long as I'm physically/mentally able. I probably won't marry either as it's likely too late for me since I won't date/marry outside of my religion and finding someone pious of like faith at my age is nigh impossible (although I would certainly love to meet someone to share in my aspirations and that's why my NW goal is high for a single guy. just in case). As for spartan lifestyle - it suits me fine for now; to each his own.
 
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leaverus said:
Yes, for real. I am a simple man with few needs, but

my goal is min. $8-10M so that I can eventually travel other countries and experience their cultures and sample their culinary varieties (and maybe buy a Tesla Cybertruck, but not their stock). I steer clear of individual stocks - finding a "unicorn" doesn't suit my personality so I'm already at peace with that. I'm not interested in retiring early either, and plan to keep working in some capacity as long as I'm physically/mentally able. I probably won't marry either as it's likely too late for me since I won't date/marry outside of my religion and finding someone pious of like faith at my age is nigh impossible (although I would certainly love to meet someone to share in my aspirations and that's why my NW goal is high for a single guy. just in case). As for spartan lifestyle - it suits me fine for now; to each his own.
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Honestly, I'd be living how you are right now if I hadn't met my wife. That was the plan at least. My only piece of advice I can give you is to take 5-10% of your income and travel NOW. **** happens in life and you have no idea what the future may hold for you in 20 years when you finally feel "ready" enough to travel. Take advantage of your youth dude. There is no surer way to live with regret than to put off for the future what you are capable of doing now. (keep in mind I'm not saying go YOLO and start doing hookers and blow in the Caribbean). But **** man, it'll pay itself over ten fold by living at least a little bit.
 
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leaverus said:
my goal is min. $8-10M so that I can eventually travel other countries and experience their cultures and sample their culinary varieties (and maybe buy a Tesla Cybertruck, but not their stock).
Click to expand...
You don't need $8-10M for that unless traveling involves casinos.

I mean $10M at 4% SWR is $400K per year. Unless your idea of travel is a hot tub full of champagne and paid company at the Mt Everest base camp, maybe lower the goal, retire early, and live it up sooner.
 
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pgg said:
You don't need $8-10M for that unless traveling involves casinos.

I mean $10M at 4% SWR is $400K per year. Unless your idea of travel is a hot tub full of champagne and paid company at the Mt Everest base camp, maybe lower the goal, retire early, and live it up sooner.
Click to expand...
I like working to some degree. And who says that withdrawal rate is sustainable?or, we won’t see a 30 percent correction in the next 24 months? Not everyone has a guaranteed pension to fall back on so working part time or 3/4 time May be prudent to keep your skills up. Once you retire many find it very difficult to return back to work.
 
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BLADEMDA said:
I like working to some degree. And who says that withdrawal rate is sustainable?or, we won’t see a 30 percent correction in the next 24 months? Not everyone has a guaranteed pension to fall back on so working part time or 3/4 time May be prudent to keep your skills up. Once you retire many find it very difficult to return back to work.
Click to expand...
Agreed, I plan to keep working too, try to keep my mind sharp as long as possible and at least give me something motivating to do. That may change when I'm 50, 55, 60, 65 and so on, but for now it's a plan I want to keep.
 
MirrorTodd said:
Honestly, I'd be living how you are right now if I hadn't met my wife. That was the plan at least. My only piece of advice I can give you is to take 5-10% of your income and travel NOW. **** happens in life and you have no idea what the future may hold for you in 20 years when you finally feel "ready" enough to travel. Take advantage of your youth dude. There is no surer way to live with regret than to put off for the future what you are capable of doing now. (keep in mind I'm not saying go YOLO and start doing hookers and blow in the Caribbean). But **** man, it'll pay itself over ten fold by living at least a little bit.
Click to expand...

I know a few guys who live that lifestyle and it does seem pretty fun. Hookers are a lot hotter down south.
 
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BLADEMDA said:
I like working to some degree. And who says that withdrawal rate is sustainable?or, we won’t see a 30 percent correction in the next 24 months? Not everyone has a guaranteed pension to fall back on so working part time or 3/4 time May be prudent to keep your skills up. Once you retire many find it very difficult to return back to work.
Click to expand...
OK, cut it back to 3% and it's still $300K per year in liquid cash for a retiree who presumably has no kids to support, no debt except maybe a mortgage he chooses to not pay off because the rate is low. 3% SWR is pretty conservative for a diversified portfolio. And if the world economy goes so bad that you have to cut back on 3% for an extended period, you probably won't want to be leaving CONUS anyway, because zombies are roaming free.

I'm just tossing the opinion out there that these $10M retirement nest egg goals being tossed around are enormous. If you like working, fine, be that 70 year old taking weekend call doing cases on meth users ... but let's not pretend that you can't retire with half or less of that figure.

I'll likely stay part time for a few years in my 50s to hedge my bets, but working and taking call because I have bills to pay at age 60 isn't my idea of winning. I won't be playing the game then.
 
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pgg said:
OK, cut it back to 3% and it's still $300K per year in liquid cash for a retiree who presumably has no kids to support, no debt except maybe a mortgage he chooses to not pay off because the rate is low. 3% SWR is pretty conservative for a diversified portfolio. And if the world economy goes so bad that you have to cut back on 3% for an extended period, you probably won't want to be leaving CONUS anyway, because zombies are roaming free.

I'm just tossing the opinion out there that these $10M retirement nest egg goals being tossed around are enormous. If you like working, fine, be that 70 year old taking weekend call doing cases on meth users ... but let's not pretend that you can't retire with half or less of that figure.

I'll likely stay part time for a few years in my 50s to hedge my bets, but working and taking call because I have bills to pay at age 60 isn't my idea of winning. I won't be playing the game then.
Click to expand...

Maybe, but if you hit 5M by late forties then cut back and work 2-3 days a week then likely you can “live it up” and coast into that 10M at a normal retirement age. Most of the work is done if you have that first 5M and still putting some away with a very part time gig.

That’s my plan anyway.
 
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The 3 or 4 percent rule also assumes you don’t want to spend down any principal and die rich. So your kids can say how they worked hard and earned everything they have.
 
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sevoflurane said:
Just opened a 5th hotel in Vegas with our investment partners.

18% returns plus return of capital w/in 5 yrs. Goal is to eventually sell all 5 to a REIT.

These projects have w/stood the bubble and have been profitable the last 5 years.
View attachment 325958
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Even with covid you were making money on this?
 
kidthor said:
My anesthesia job is decent. It pays well enough and I maximize my savings. W2 job, maxing my 401k and 457, plus my employer contributes to the 401k some. But I'm hoping to do more.

I'm curious about how to really do a side hustle and how to save more. My coworkers dabble in real estate investing but that seems to be the limit of my network's side-hustles (notwithstanding some who invest in relatives income streams such). There don't seem to be many of us who make money on the side beyond small-scale real estate investments.

I'm curious for you SDN Anesthesia folks... what's your side hustle and how can we anesthesiologists make more on the side, or at least how do you work a second income stream and optimize tax burdens?

This has been discussed here and on other forums but I'm curious what's the strategy for pandemic-ridden 2020-20201 and how should we think about the future.
Click to expand...

I have a well salaried job that pays well for my area that is building a pension.
But I do some moonlighting as well to fund a defined benefit plan.

Iron Condors, vertical puts, and naked puts on dividend stocks you wouldn’t mind owning. I don’t think it is like picking up nickles in front of a steam roller.
Here is an example.

Let say TTD drops from $900 to $800 and you think, good time to buy! Instead, you sell a put for 790. And then the stock drops to 750. I get it - you have to buy it for 790, but you were FINE buying at 800, so it is just an adjustment in your thinking.

I also own a rental in stupid Texas (taxes are ridiculous).

I have some money in a start up medical app business.

I have some shares in a group that buys and operates some Jack n the Boxes.

But basically, my side gig is social security. I’m screwed if that doesn’t come through.

I have made a lots of money on MDXG - a perfect cycling stock this last year.

At one point I owned 47 million shares of the stock BRTX (bought it for .0002). Then that thing rose to .04. That would have been a quick 4mill. But I kept selling on the way up. I have no patience to do well in the stock market.
 
I was inspired by @LineAndBerry . Knowing nothing about woodwork, I went out and purchased this book to get started:

53AE5653-58E6-4A52-A290-5157CC2A35C3.jpeg
 
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If you have 10 mil, at 3% return - that gives you 42K/ month for 30 years.

That’s barely enough for some of you?

Wow.

I live a very different life than most ya all.
 
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leaverus said:
None available where I work and area hospitals have exclusive contracts, else I would.
Already saving 80-90% of my income
Daily, my friend (although I pretty much stick to boglehead philosophy)
Not married
Click to expand...
Move out West were surgeons run the town and operate electively 24/7. To a place where there are no exclusive contracts.
It’s ridiculous and one of the reasons I left. The greed in medicine is real and disgusting.
 
chocomorsel said:
Move out West were surgeons run the town and operate electively 24/7. To a place where there are no exclusive contracts.
It’s ridiculous and one of the reasons I left. The greed in medicine is real and disgusting.
Click to expand...
Moving west within the next 12 - 18mos is exactly my plan. My $10M goal is more to have an extra thick cushion in my latter years rather than to go crazy with a lavish lifestyle. But I do hope to dine at Michelin-starred restaurants in the various cities that they give out those ratings.
 
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leaverus said:
Moving west within the next 12 - 18mos is exactly my plan. My $10M goal is more to have an extra thick cushion in my latter years rather than to go crazy with a lavish lifestyle. But I do hope to dine at Michelin-starred restaurants in the various cities that they give out those ratings.
Click to expand...
Except you most likely will be working harder and not smarter for your money. There is a reason people like @sevoflurane waited to move West. Make good money in the Midwest and South, use your connections to get a good paying partnership job. No need to kill yourself if you don't have to. There is a group that was hiring recently on here in MN that makes damn good money. Don't know if they are still looking but it's a long partnership track and you have to be ok with 100% supervision.
Honestly, I wouldn't move West if you are looking to earn good money. If you are in the NE, I would get out of there.
 
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I think you go west to get control over your employment with less management company/crna shenanigans. The unit values aren't great and the taxes are high. It's quite the tradeoff, especially now.
 
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GassYous said:
I think you go west to get control over your employment with less management company/crna shenanigans. The unit values aren't great and the taxes are high. It's quite the tradeoff, especially now.
Click to expand...
Sevo works for an AMC I believe.
 
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anonperson said:
Bogleheads is good but is a long term philosophy. You will miss out on the Teslas and other unicorn stocks. You just have to make peace with that. But you will make good yearly gains and over 30 years will do great.

What is your longterm goal? Retire early? Amass as much wealth as possible?

But in your situation, if you want to generate extra revenue:
Investment properties
Investing in riskier stocks (trying to find the next Tesla)
Getting involved in options

None of these involve any real skills. Just having some capital and doing your due diligence and accepting the increased risk (non paying tenants, stocks imploding etc).

Like others have said, enjoy life as well. No point in living a completely spartan lifestyle. Life goes quick.
Click to expand...
I don’t know why people think investing is hard. I just started trading this year on my time off (every other week) and have turned $35k into a little over $400k. Had no knowledge of the stock market......just picked up book and started trading. Mostly day trade and weeklong swing.
I have a young family so I am not day trading all day long. 2-3 stocks in and out first hour.
 
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neurochica said:
I don’t know why people think investing is hard. I just started trading this year on my time off (every other week) and have turned $35k into a little over $400k. Had no knowledge of the stock market......just picked up book and started trading. Mostly day trade and weeklong swing.
I have a young family so I am not day trading all day long. 2-3 stocks in and out first hour.
Click to expand...

hahaha
 
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neurochica said:
I don’t know why people think investing is hard. I just started trading this year on my time off (every other week) and have turned $35k into a little over $400k. Had no knowledge of the stock market......just picked up book and started trading. Mostly day trade and weeklong swing.
I have a young family so I am not day trading all day long. 2-3 stocks in and out first hour.
Click to expand...


Your experience of 1000% returns is completely typical and reproducible. Why are you even practicing medicine if you can get these returns? You're absolutely outperforming any actively managed fund out there.

Please post your previous and future trades so we can take advantage.
 
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