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gsmithers68

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EctopicFetus

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Wow.. lovely how all these articles are so slanted to the left. Here is an innovative plan. We take Medicare and dump the old farts out on the street and then use that same money to cover the 40 million or so who are currently working. BTW if you think the European system is so "high quality" why are they moving away from their system?

Oh the joys of being a pre-med..All the answers but most dont understand the question.
 

gsmithers68

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Wow.. lovely how all these articles are so slanted to the left. Here is an innovative plan. We take Medicare and dump the old farts out on the street and then use that same money to cover the 40 million or so who are currently working. BTW if you think the European system is so "high quality" why are they moving away from their system?

Oh the joys of being a pre-med..All the answers but most dont understand the question.

Great idea. Lets create concentration camps and we can just ship people 65+ to them. Sounds like a plan. And you sound like a Marxist who wants a revolution from the proletariat... which by my account is farther to the left on the political spectrum? Maybe I am missing your point.
 

EctopicFetus

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Great idea. Lets create concentration camps and we can just ship people 65+ to them. Sounds like a plan. And you sound like a Marxist who wants a revolution from the proletariat... which by my account is farther to the left on the political spectrum? Maybe I am missing your point.

LOL.. pre-meds always so defensive. what is more socialist than a giant govt program, with the govt setting the rules and telling us what to do leaving out any and all market forces.

The above ideas are asinine and will never pass. Why? Cause Great Aunt Minnie votes and if there is 1 group who will get the screw job it is the old farts. About 1/2 of all healthcare expenses are in the last yr of life.. But you knew that..

Who will pay for this socialist revolution? Why should the successful continue to pay for those who arent successful and spare me the sob stories kiddos cause I came from nothing, my parents and I immigrated here with no money and my parents had little to no education. They came up, explain to me again why they should continue to bear the burden of those who drink, do drugs, act foolishly, gave up on their education thru their own dumb choices and care not for themselves? Sometimes you have to pay for the consequences of our actions.
 

ExKitty Doctor

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LOL.. pre-meds always so defensive. what is more socialist than a giant govt program, with the govt setting the rules and telling us what to do leaving out any and all market forces.

The above ideas are asinine and will never pass. Why? Cause Great Aunt Minnie votes and if there is 1 group who will get the screw job it is the old farts. About 1/2 of all healthcare expenses are in the last yr of life.. But you knew that..

Who will pay for this socialist revolution? Why should the successful continue to pay for those who arent successful and spare me the sob stories kiddos cause I came from nothing, my parents and I immigrated here with no money and my parents had little to no education. They came up, explain to me again why they should continue to bear the burden of those who drink, do drugs, act foolishly, gave up on their education thru their own dumb choices and care not for themselves? Sometimes you have to pay for the consequences of our actions.


So you and your family are deserving of health care beacuse you are successful, whereas poor people should suffer?
 

youngnflyy

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LOL.. pre-meds always so defensive. what is more socialist than a giant govt program, with the govt setting the rules and telling us what to do leaving out any and all market forces.

The above ideas are asinine and will never pass. Why? Cause Great Aunt Minnie votes and if there is 1 group who will get the screw job it is the old farts. About 1/2 of all healthcare expenses are in the last yr of life.. But you knew that..

Who will pay for this socialist revolution? Why should the successful continue to pay for those who arent successful and spare me the sob stories kiddos cause I came from nothing, my parents and I immigrated here with no money and my parents had little to no education. They came up, explain to me again why they should continue to bear the burden of those who drink, do drugs, act foolishly, gave up on their education thru their own dumb choices and care not for themselves? Sometimes you have to pay for the consequences of our actions.

Are you serious? Does that mean that you would be unwilling to treat a patient without healthcare regardless of the extent of their injuries? I agree that everyone should work to better his or herself, but that doesn't mean that everyone should not have the right to see a physician.
 

Towelie

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LOL.. pre-meds always so defensive. what is more socialist than a giant govt program, with the govt setting the rules and telling us what to do leaving out any and all market forces.

The above ideas are asinine and will never pass. Why? Cause Great Aunt Minnie votes and if there is 1 group who will get the screw job it is the old farts. About 1/2 of all healthcare expenses are in the last yr of life.. But you knew that..

Who will pay for this socialist revolution? Why should the successful continue to pay for those who arent successful and spare me the sob stories kiddos cause I came from nothing, my parents and I immigrated here with no money and my parents had little to no education. They came up, explain to me again why they should continue to bear the burden of those who drink, do drugs, act foolishly, gave up on their education thru their own dumb choices and care not for themselves? Sometimes you have to pay for the consequences of our actions.

Blahblahblah. The "I came from nothing, so poor people should just blame themselves for their bad choices" argument. Fun to read, but makes no rational sense whatsoever.
 

DropkickMurphy

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Great idea. Lets create concentration camps and we can just ship people 65+ to them. Sounds like a plan. And you sound like a Marxist who wants a revolution from the proletariat... which by my account is farther to the left on the political spectrum? Maybe I am missing your point.
Oh the irony of responding to a Jewish practicing doc with a comment about concentration camps. :laugh: :rolleyes: You're not going to win this argument.
 

Gut Shot

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Here is an innovative plan. We take Medicare and dump the old farts out on the street and then use that same money to cover the 40 million or so who are currently working.

Great idea. You should take the lead and cover your parents' medical expenses after they turn 65. Forbid them from collecting social security, while you're at it. Have them live in your basement. I'm sure your life will turn into a laugh-a-minute sitcom that you'll cherish until you, too, turn 65 and move in with your offspring.

EctopicFetus said:
BTW if you think the European system is so "high quality" why are they moving away from their system?

Hmmm, last time I checked Europe was composed of dozens of soverign nations, each with a distinct system for delivering its healthcare. The fact that you've lumped them all together indicates that right away, before you've even gotten out of the gate, you're poorly versed in this topic.

EctopicFetus said:
Oh the joys of being a pre-med..All the answers but most dont understand the question.

You're living proof that a few years of experience can still be a waste.
 

nubbey24

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Great idea. You should take the lead and cover your parents' medical expenses after they turn 65. Forbid them from collecting social security, while you're at it. Have them live in your basement. I'm sure your life will turn into a laugh-a-minute sitcom that you'll cherish until you, too, turn 65 and move in with your offspring.



Hmmm, last time I checked Europe was composed of dozens of soverign nations, each with a distinct system for delivering its healthcare. The fact that you've lumped them all together indicates that right away, before you've even gotten out of the gate, you're poorly versed in this topic.



You're living proof that a few years of experience can still be a waste.

This thread is entertaining. I am looking forward to ectopic fetus logging on again to say something really vague and ******ed, and standing behind the facade that because he is no longer a pre-med, he is all knowing. I can't wait to matriculate so that I can be let in on the secret of solving the healthcare crisis. Keep it coming ectopic...you are very entertaining.

here fishy fishy...
 

gsmithers68

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It was an extrapolation from ectopic's claim dpk I wasn't inferring we should actually create concentration camps :laugh:

however, I wouldn't mind shipping my crazy grandma off to Greenland, hehehe :smuggrin:

Anyways, back to the topic at hand. Smart healthcare plans... I think that Oregon is gonna force legislation again, we did it in 1989 with the Oregon Healthcare Plan and now if this bill gets passed and implemented we'll be pretty much moving towards state-wide socialized healthcare for essential expenses.

I think the one loophole is not making people that make a sh!t load of money pay for private insurance. I think we should make all those with 250k+ salaries to purchase the insurance and to compensate give them a small tax cut on the amount they put into the medical insurance fund for the state-wide coverage. It seems this would be a compromise worthy of pursuit IMHO.
 

lilnoelle

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The problem I have with this plan is that we force everyone to buy insurance, but don't put a limit on the costs that insurance companies can charge. If everyone is forced to buy insurance, why not increase insurance costs?

And.... what about families who really choose not to buy insurance because they believe they can save that money and spend less on healthcare by simply paying out of pocket. Obviously there are situations where this could be a problem, but many families are relatively healthy and this could be a viable plan. My family did it for about 30 years and didn't have a problem.
 

youngnflyy

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The problem I have with this plan is that we force everyone to buy insurance, but don't put a limit on the costs that insurance companies can charge. If everyone is forced to buy insurance, why not increase insurance costs?

And.... what about families who really choose not to buy insurance because they believe they can save that money and spend less on healthcare by simply paying out of pocket. Obviously there are situations where this could be a problem, but many families are relatively healthy and this could be a viable plan. My family did it for about 30 years and didn't have a problem.

I think that by having everyone buy insurance, insurance companies are forced to become competitive amongst each other, thereby reducing costs, and increasing incentives for us. I would think that Insurance costs could only go up if there was only one Insurance company because they would have a monopoly.
 

Amemus

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Wow.. lovely how all these articles are so slanted to the left. Here is an innovative plan. We take Medicare and dump the old farts out on the street and then use that same money to cover the 40 million or so who are currently working.

Actually, most plans--liberal and conservative--rely on Medicare/Medicaid cuts to achieve universality. The idea is that if we achieve universal coverage, these programs will not be needed as much.

Back to the article the OP posted.. Wyden's plan is nothing new. The reason why such plans have been shot down in the past is because it's politically risky. You think the American public grumbles about health care costs now, see how they feel when we cut employers out of the equation. It is precisely because most Americans don't pay for health care directly that they don't realize how wasteful the system is.
The idea behind the plan is that when people see how much their health care costs, they will go to their doctors less and thus lower health care costs. That is fine, but it doesn't take into account how angry everyone is going to be when they learn. And that is not the kind of thing you want to be remembered for as a politician. I do believe that education should be a key component of health care reform, but you're going to have to come up with more than that if you want to solve the crisis.
Employment-based coverage probably isn't the best idea, but now that we've used the system for so long we can't just stop it so easily.
 
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