St. George's University

[Infamous]

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I'm a prospective student - who would like to get some feedback on SGU SVM. Thanks.

 

[Infamous]

Do you think they will become AVMA-accrediated in the next couple of years?

 

[mokadet]

I applied to Ross this year as a back-up plan. From what I understand Ross and SGU are in very similar situations. From here on I'll mainly be talking about Ross, but again I think they are very comparable.

From talking to alumni and doing some research I believe that both are good options for someone that has exhausted their opportunities at US schools. I, for one, am not convinced that I have exhausted my opportunities and this is why I will most likely not be attending Ross (at least not for another app cycle).

As far as accredidation, according to alumni, they have been saying they are working on getting AVMA accredidation for 10+ years now, so don't hold your breath. But, at the same time, it is getting easier for graduates to practice in the US. There is a relatively new system, PAVE, that is now accepted in 13 states where as long as you pass your TOFEL (yes, even if you have only ever spoken English) and a Qualifying Exam before you begin your final year of clinicals you can take your boards along side US grads directly after graduation. The other system ECFVG requires a clinical exam done after graduation and apparently the backlog to take this test can take months and it costs about $6000.

Also, from talking to grads there is less stigma in the field then many people assume mainly because (particularly Ross) has been graduating 200+ vets each year for the past 15 years. The majority of these now practice in the US, so most vets are friendly with at least one Ross grad.

For these reasons, like I said before, I think that off-shore schools are a good option, but one that I'm not ready to take.
Downsides:
1. cost - at least twice the cost of my in-state schools
2. distance from family/friends - plane flight cost equal to flying to Europe
3. safety - I think SGU might be better than Ross in this area because they have a larger (combined vet and med) campus and on-campus dorms. But, both are on islands with extreme poverty and as a large group of white Americans the schools/students are often targets for theft/mugging

 

[Infamous]

Any clue what the average GPA and GRE scores are for those "off-shore" choices?

 

[mokadet]

From what I've seen they don't publish these numbers, but they aren't incredibly competative. I believe that if you are qualified for US schools: cummulative or recent GPA above 3.0, decent GREs and show potential/determination to be a good vet, they will take you. I would look up some minimum requirements for US schools and if you meet those, you should be ok. Unlike US schools were they can only admit 20-30% of the qualified applicants Ross and SGU can admit almost all (I know Ross only routinely fills their September class, the January and May semesters are much less popular).

 

[Boxsterluv]

Actually SGU posts some averages, check out their website for some info on their applicants and accepted students...

http://www.sgu.edu/website/sguwebsite.nsf/Home/demographics.htm

Good luck!

 

[Infamous]

Thanks. Anyone apply to these schools or interview with any of them (Ross or SGU)?

 

[eaglemeag]

Thanks. Anyone apply to these schools or interview with any of them (Ross or SGU)?

I applied to SGU, interviewed, and was accepted.

My stats: 3.5ish GPA, 1270 GRE, 1200+ small / wildlife / exotic experience. Rejected @ Va-Md, waitlisted at Tufts.

The application was fairly easy, and I interviewed mid-December. I live in VA but go to school in SC, and there was an interviewer in BFE North Carolina. She is a grad of NCSU and is the only doc in her own private practice. She was not "warm and fuzzy" but was very down-to-earth and earnest with me about the profession. She even interviewed me while spaying! However, I did not get the feel that she was very professional, and she didn't seem to know a whole lot about SGU (and had never been there).

Part of the interview process includes an impromptu essay; they give you a choice of three questions and you have to write about 300 words in response. They were easy questions... I think the one I chose was "describe a defining moment in your pre-veterinary career", whereby I talked about rescue work in Slidell, LA after Hurricane Katrina.

I heard back from them about mid-January (at the same time I was getting interview info from the others!).

I was kind of disappointed in communication with the school, though. I had a horrible time getting in touch with Financial Aid to ask them some questions. Another consideration: SGU is not on the US Government's list of "approved schools" for Stafford loans, which is a huge part of many vet students' funding. I don't know how else SGU students pay for school, although I've heard that they usually use one of three private banks that contract just for the school. I was disappointed that they didn't tell me this up-front when I applied (and because I couldn't get in touch with them before I made my decision, I gave up on it). I was seriously concerned after my acceptance that I wouldn't even be able to get money to go.

I am also disappointed in the amount of work that it takes to become eligible to practice in the U.S. That is something that nobody could give me a straight answer on; I got different answers from everyone I talked to.

So, because I'd much rather go to Tufts if I get off the $%&@! wait-list, and because I'm a little leary of SGU now, I decided to let it go. If I don't get into Tufts this year, I'll probably apply to Ross next year instead of SGU; Ross has a MUCH better reputation AND funding is much more likely.

 

[tygris]

So, because I'd much rather go to Tufts if I get off the $%&@! wait-list, and because I'm a little leary of SGU now, I decided to let it go. If I don't get into Tufts this year, I'll probably apply to Ross next year instead of SGU; Ross has a MUCH better reputation AND funding is much more likely.

Well by the looks of your stats, if you don't get in this year and meet with someone to discuss potential ways to improv your app (and then do what they tell you!), I imagine you shouldn't have too many issues getting into a U.S. school next year if you reapply 🙂 That's my two cents anyway!

 

[wishes]

Well by the looks of your stats, if you don't get in this year and meet with someone to discuss potential ways to improv your app (and then do what they tell you!), I imagine you shouldn't have too many issues getting into a U.S. school next year if you reapply 🙂 That's my two cents anyway!

Ditto. According to your GPA/GRE/Work experience I suspect you're not too different from alot of people getting into American veterinary schools. I would really suggest talking to those schools that you were rejected at and seeing what you can do to improve your application for next year. Also, take a good hard look at what schools traditionally accept alot of non-residents and apply to those schools.
Good luck at Tufts!

 

[eaglemeag]

Ditto. According to your GPA/GRE/Work experience I suspect you're not too different from alot of people getting into American veterinary schools. I would really suggest talking to those schools that you were rejected at and seeing what you can do to improve your application for next year. Also, take a good hard look at what schools traditionally accept alot of non-residents and apply to those schools.
Good luck at Tufts!

Thanks Tygris and Wishes for your comments. I do plan on taking up the offer of application counseling... I imagine that it was simply an issue of numbers this year. I was such a competitive candidate for my state school that I have NO idea why I didn't get in, but I'm sure I'd get in next year if I applied again. (Even Patty at Tufts was surprised at that rejection! [she asked; I did NOT volunteer that info, lol]). Same with Tufts.

I do plan on doing some more work this summer... trying to get my summer job back (at a small animal hospital that sees exotic and wildlife as well), and trying to get short internships (1-2 weeks) with a wildlife clinic and the local zoo. Maybe take the GREs again, although I hate that idea 🙁 Which is why I really hope I hear from Tufts soon,

 

[tygris]

You know, I did notice you are missing large animal experience... that seems to be a determining factor at many schools. You already seem to have some experience in wildlife stuff - rather than spend your summer doing zoo/wildlife work, why not try to get a position at an equine or food animal clinic? Most schools like to know that you are at least comfortable working with large animals, since you can't really avoid it once you're in vet school 🙂 But if Tufts says you don't need it, then maybe you don't... but next year my opinion is that you should apply to more schools other than VA-MD and Tufts! 😉

 

[eaglemeag]

why not try to get a position at an equine or food animal clinic?

I'm glad you mentioned that... you reminded me that I was going to call a local equine clinic as well! I think you're right... the fact that I've never touched a cow/horse/pig probably was a problem despite my experience elsewhere (especially considering Va-Md is such a 'large animal' school).

but next year my opinion is that you should apply to more schools other than VA-MD and Tufts! 😉

Oh, definitely! It's just that this year, I was so certain I was going to get into Va-Md that I didn't want to bother spending the time and money doing applications and interviews for schools when I was pretty sure I'd get into my state school. That'll teach me to be cocky! 😛

 

[tygris]

It's just that this year, I was so certain I was going to get into Va-Md that I didn't want to bother spending the time and money doing applications and interviews for schools when I was pretty sure I'd get into my state school. That'll teach me to be cocky! 😛

Haha, it's not an issue of being cocky, you do sound like a competitive candidate - unfortunately, I think very few or none of us can be absolutely sure about admissions when it comes to vet school 🙁 Sometimes, I swear it's just luck of the draw! When I first started applying, I sincerely thought that Cornell was my best shot since I am a NY resident. HA! A couple years of applications taught me better You live, you learn, but no worries because what you're experiencing is certainly not out of the ordinary 👍

 

[eaglemeag]

You live, you learn, but no worries because what you're experiencing is certainly not out of the ordinary 👍

Heh... I wish it were as easy for me to be optimistic as you! I just hate the limbo of not knowing... it would be much better to know one way or the other for sure. Although... patience has never been a virtue of mine and perhaps I will finally cultivate it

 

[Infamous]

Ross has a MUCH better reputation.

What are the reasons for that?

 

[eaglemeag]

What are the reasons for that?

It's been around a lot longer and has graduated more classes of students. Because of this, just about everyone knows someone who went there. Moreover, because the school is on a tropical island, they don't want people to think that their students are partying slackers who don't know jack... so, they err in the opposite direction and really push their students. (If I'm not mistaken, you have to attend classes during the summer as well.) Everyone I know who has worked with a Ross student during 4th year clinicals (because Ross students have to come back to the U.S. for that) has said that they're better-prepared than the U.S. students are.

That said, I'm not saying that SGU is a bad school. I just don't think they've had time to develop as good of a reputation as Ross has. And personally, I'd rather not be the Guinea pig 😉

 

[UKYWildcat]

Everyone I know who has worked with a Ross student during 4th year clinicals (because Ross students have to come back to the U.S. for that) has said that they're better-prepared than the U.S. students are.
😉

Having worked and taught Ross, SGU and plain ol 'domestic' students in clinical rotations, I'd say the split is pretty even...just as many good students coming from each program as there are bad ones.

The positive thing that I see to Ross is this: If you are accepted even with what a US school would find "unacceptable" for stats, they work you pretty hard and aren't afraid to take your money and kick you out if you just don't cut it. That really doesn't happen in US schools because they *think* they have such a great method for choosing the best candidates.

 

[HorseyVet]

The positive thing that I see to Ross is this: If you are accepted even with what a US school would find "unacceptable" for stats, they work you pretty hard and aren't afraid to take your money and kick you out if you just don't cut it. That really doesn't happen in US schools because they *think* they have such a great method for choosing the best candidates.

I think many of the US schools would rather start cutting their fingers off then admit that their method of selecting sudents may not be 100% perfect.

It is my understanding aswell that for the majority of medical professional schools, they work really really hard to keep you in once you're there. I think it looks really bad for them if you drop out or don't pass your boards.

 

[eaglemeag]

Having worked and taught Ross, SGU and plain ol 'domestic' students in clinical rotations, I'd say the split is pretty even...just as many good students coming from each program as there are bad ones.

Don't tell me that.. I just turned down a spot at SGU 😛

 

[Apollo84]

For these reasons, like I said before, I think that off-shore schools are a good option, but one that I'm not ready to take.
Downsides:
1. cost - at least twice the cost of my in-state schools
2. distance from family/friends - plane flight cost equal to flying to Europe
3. safety - I think SGU might be better than Ross in this area because they have a larger (combined vet and med) campus and on-campus dorms. But, both are on islands with extreme poverty and as a large group of white Americans the schools/students are often targets for theft/mugging

Just wanted to add to this post. I was looking at possibly applying to Ross for next year because I heard that it might be easier to get in than the very competitive US schools. In addition to what has already been said, here are other factors I was considering:

Pros:
-might be easier to get in
-can live on an island with nice weather
-can bring your pets (vs. going abroad to say, London or Scotland who are really strict with animals coming in to their country)
-the last 3 semesters, you transfer out to another vet school to finish your education

Cons:
-ECVFG or some other troublesome test after you graduate
-if you have a spouse, they likely won't be able to find a job on the island. With neither of us working, I can't figure out what we are going to live on 🙂

 

[Infamous]

CON: COST (of school and travel)

Im guessing this is also a pretty large con.

 

[eaglemeag]

CON: COST (of school and travel)

Im guessing this is also a pretty large con.

For me, going to SGU wasn't going to cost more than going to my state school (Va-Md) until you figured in travel costs. A plane ticket from my hometown to Grenada runs about $2000. Buuut... I wouldn't have a car and therefore wouldn't have to pay for gas, car repairs/maintenance, etc.

The big con with SGU is not cost necessarily but the fact that you can't get Stafford loans to go there, which is (from what I understand) the main source of funding for vet students. So basically you'd have to rely on good credit and a co-signer (the latter I don't have). BIG con.

 

[Lmanuel14]

I am going to be a senior in high school with a GPA of about 3.3 or 3.2. I am looking into some colleges to apply to for pre-vet. What do you think the chances are of being accepted at SGU?

 

[pressmom]

It's really hard to say, I think. Just because HS and college GPA are necessarily one-to-one. I'd concentrate on going to a college that you can a) afford with taking out a MINIMUM of loans, b) has a good science program with lots of extras beyond the basics, c) has a good pre-vet advisor or system, d) has whatever else you're looking for. Tackle one thing at a time. And avail yourself of all extra study opportunities (like at my college they had special chem, math, and physics tutoring centers that were open to all students). And if you're concerned about GPA, don't pile on 16 hours of hard courses your first year because there is a big adjustment from HS to college. Ease yourself in.

 

[Max Power]

I applied (and interviewed) with SGU and am hoping for acceptance. I didn't apply to Ross b/c all in all SGU seemed to be a better school, closer to accredidation, and safer- I can't prove all this but I was completely unbiased before and I chose SGU after I did the research. I talked to a lot of people, including vets who worked with both Ross and SGU grads. I believe SGU is cheaper as well (not sure though). Safety is a HUGE issue. I went to Grenada last week and LOVED IT-but then again I'm looking to get away from the US, start a new life, leave the western lifestyle behind. When I thought I had a chance still at Tuskegee (since they never sent me ANYTHING either way after I spent my own money traveling to the interview on 3 days notice) I still wanted to go to SGU after I did the research.

 

[AuburnPreVet]

I am going to be a senior in high school with a GPA of about 3.3 or 3.2. I am looking into some colleges to apply to for pre-vet. What do you think the chances are of being accepted at SGU?

Are you asking about applying to SGU for UNDERGRADUATE school (ie. regular college)? If so, I would suggest going to college in the states... then, if you need/want to, SGU is a fine choice for vet school...as Max & others have pointed out.

 

[birdvet2006]

The big con with SGU is not cost necessarily but the fact that you can't get Stafford loans to go there, which is (from what I understand) the main source of funding for vet students. So basically you'd have to rely on good credit and a co-signer (the latter I don't have). BIG con.

If you can get past the credit issue, then the worst part about private loans is the high interest rate! Some of mine (most of mine) are at 9.25%. That adds a LOT of debt to your already high debt. At least I have Staffords to decrease the overall debt, and have consolidated to a low rate.

 

[Birdvet2013]

Firstly, I'd like to comment on a message that was posted a few months back that said that the PAVE, taken by veterinary students, is only accepted in 13 states IS NOT TRUE! The PAVE is accepted in 31 states (Arizona, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Georgia, Idaho, Iowa, Illinois, Louisiana, Maine, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Mississippi, Montana, Nebraska, New York, North Dakota, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Vermont, Virginia, Washington, West Virginia, Wyoming, Wisconsin, AS WELL AS Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands).

Also, the TOEFL is not required to be taken if you grew up in the United States AND speak English.

The exams to take in order to practice in the states are the PAVE OR ECFEG and the NAVLE. I have not met anyone who had trouble becoming a veterinarian after graduation and passing these exams.

I would also love to add that Ross accepts a lot of students and gets rid of a lot of students. If you don't believe me, please call Francisco who works for SGU at 631-665-8500
As a veterinary student at SGU, I can say that I've met many people who failed out of Ross and are now students at SGU.

As far as the loan situation, SGU is working on accredidation, they were accredited by the Grenadian goverment last term and working towards US accrediation and increasing the amount of research done at the school. The loans are private, but they are attainable.