Stay Away From The Military

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Zoomer

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I wanted to write all of you misguided souls in medical school. I am an attending at "the flagship hospital" of Air Force medicine. I have served in Iraq and was awarded a combat medal. My commitment ends in 2012. Make no mistake, if you are an HPSP student or have an obligation to the military, you have made the largest mistake of your life. If you are comtemplating a military scholarship: DO NOT!!!! I am still having nightmares of the horrors of combat. I could have already payed off both my college and med student loans if I was a civilian. I make about 30% of what my civilian counterparts make and work about 3 times as many hours. Granted, medicine in general is not an easy profession, but the military has made it terrible. By the way, the residency in the specialty you want is NO GUARANTEE!! If you are not the top then you get "stuck" in a surgery or medicine prelim. spot and then get to be a GMO for ATLEAST 2 years before being able to re-apply...the entire time making less than some residents make!! The medical care in the military is poor. Oh yeah, you will get a letter like I did that says you will be sent to war every 16 months for the next 6 years for 6 month periods. IF YOU DO WANT TO JOIN, wait until you have finished residency and then decide...TRUST ME, the military will pay off your loans then and welcome you with open arms. Making a decission at this point is a MISTAKE!! Your life will change so much. Try leaving a sick wife and a 4 month old child in an unfamiliar city to go fight a war you don't believe in...it's hell. The hospitals are underfunded and the residencys are poor training programs. Please, wait. If you have any other questions, write me, I will respond. Thanks.

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There are a similar number of posts from people regarding military medicine who are in highly deployable specialties. MilMD was an anesthesiologist in the Navy. The navysurgeon was obviously a general surgeon who's now off to make the world a bigger place in his plastics residency. Finally, we've got Zoomer who's an ER doc with some branch. All of these specialties are obviously among those who are more likely to be deployed to manage combat trauma.

Is there anyone out there who can vouch for the less deployable specialties in the military? I'm not sure exactly what they may be, but something like derm, path, some sug subspecialties - (ent, uro, plastics, or optho), and rad onc?

What do these people feel about the military if they don't have to deploy much?
Thanks.
 
The deployments actually didn't bother me. I accepted that as part of the mission of military medicine....to take care of combat casualties.

It is everything else that has me up in arms.
 
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Zoomer said:
I wanted to write all of you misguided souls in medical school. I am an attending at "the flagship hospital" of Air Force medicine. I have served in Iraq and was awarded a combat medal. My commitment ends in 2012. Make no mistake, if you are an HPSP student or have an obligation to the military, you have made the largest mistake of your life. If you are comtemplating a military scholarship: DO NOT!!!! I am still having nightmares of the horrors of combat. I could have already payed off both my college and med student loans if I was a civilian. I make about 30% of what my civilian counterparts make and work about 3 times as many hours. Granted, medicine in general is not an easy profession, but the military has made it terrible. By the way, the residency in the specialty you want is NO GUARANTEE!! If you are not the top then you get "stuck" in a surgery or medicine prelim. spot and then get to be a GMO for ATLEAST 2 years before being able to re-apply...the entire time making less than some residents make!! The medical care in the military is poor. Oh yeah, you will get a letter like I did that says you will be sent to war every 16 months for the next 6 years for 6 month periods. IF YOU DO WANT TO JOIN, wait until you have finished residency and then decide...TRUST ME, the military will pay off your loans then and welcome you with open arms. Making a decission at this point is a MISTAKE!! Your life will change so much. Try leaving a sick wife and a 4 month old child in an unfamiliar city to go fight a war you don't believe in...it's hell. The hospitals are underfunded and the residencys are poor training programs. Please, wait. If you have any other questions, write me, I will respond. Thanks.

are you at WHMC in Lackland AFB, SATX?? which specialty?? ER??

well, as you can see from my username I am filling a field surgeon spot and counting the days when I can get out as well... :(

what about path and rad...do they get deployed as much?
 
bobbyseal said:
There are a similar number of posts from people regarding military medicine who are in highly deployable specialties. MilMD was an anesthesiologist in the Navy. The navysurgeon was obviously a general surgeon who's now off to make the world a bigger place in his plastics residency. Finally, we've got Zoomer who's an ER doc with some branch. All of these specialties are obviously among those who are more likely to be deployed to manage combat trauma.

Is there anyone out there who can vouch for the less deployable specialties in the military? I'm not sure exactly what they may be, but something like derm, path, some sug subspecialties - (ent, uro, plastics, or optho), and rad onc?

What do these people feel about the military if they don't have to deploy much?
Thanks.


USAF FPs deployed about once every 2-3 years; at at my base, everyone liked being deployed,in fact, many offerred to take the place of those who did not want to go (we all considered our CONUS locale a worse "deployment" than the middle East, or at least our clinic was worse).
 
Where were you in CONUS? Not Malcolm Grow Medical Center by any chance? That place was (probably still is) a hellhole.
 
every single job out there has a bunch of bs. there's no such thing as a non-bs job. it's the way YOU look at it and how YOU handle it. if you see something you dont like, what are you doing (besides complaining) to at least try to fix the problem?
 
jammocah said:
if you see something you dont like, what are you doing (besides complaining) to at least try to fix the problem?

ok, YOU try and fix it in 2015 when you finish your residency and first utilization tour when you will have a wheeeee bit of rank. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
 
Zoomer said:
get to be a GMO for ATLEAST 2 years before being able to re-apply...the entire time making less than some residents make!!

this statement is so inaccurate that it calls the rest of your post into question. GMO's make a lot more, especially after taxes, then the vast majority of civilian residents.
 
I don't believe that this post is authentic in the least:

First, an attending officer would never show such poor leadership as to say "to fight in a war I don't believe it" to subordinates.

Second, no attending physician would have such poor grammar.

Third, I DO work at the Air Force's Flagship hospital and there is no such cowardice on our staff that I've seen.

Sorry slick, I'm not buying your post for a minute. Take your political agenda elsewhere or have the guts to not lie about who you are.
 
an attending officer would never show such poor leadership as to say "to fight in a war I don't believe it" to subordinates.

LMAO.....What military are you in? I heard this all the time from the docs I worked around when they were all preparing to go to Kuwait and Iraq. No, only brainwashed or totally spineless officers don't speak up, not even to those they respect and trust.

And yes, I saw a great deal of cowardice amongst the ranks while I was in. But then again, I see a great deal of cowardice among the general population.

As for doing something for this nation, taking care of the general populace is doing just as much, if not more, than caring for wounded soldiers.
 
The French military is hiring if you're interested buddy. Those kinds of comments would be welcomed there.

A leader never complains to his or her subordinates. Period. Didn't you see Saving Private Ryan? Complaints go up the chain, not down.
 
tomplatz said:
The French military is hiring if you're interested buddy. Those kinds of comments would be welcomed there.

A leader never complains to his or her subordinates. Period. Didn't you see Saving Private Ryan? Complaints go up the chain, not down.

I thoroughly agree with Tomplatz. I too found Zoomer's post ridiculous and erroneous. So you think a resident makes more than $90,000 (the gross income of a GMO in San Diego...do the math via the DFAS website)???

"A war we don't agree with" ??? Okay, frenchie, it would be better if Saddam was still in power and France, Russia, China, and UN continued to get their underhanded "oil for food" money. I enjoyed the fact that China was building a fiber-optic military command and control system for Iraq. Great.
I've been in the Navy a long time and have sat in on many closed-door (something above secret) level briefings and believe me, he needed a butt-kickin. So for some highly educated doctor in the military to say such a thing only proves to be a lie (fabricated post) or a very blind and naive person.

Zoomer, take your views to the DNC.com website.
 
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Ah, you know, on one hand, the OP has a point - people need to make an informed decision.

On the other hand, I really wish people would shut the F up about how often they're deploying. I really think your average infantryman in the 82nd, or your average marine, would find it rather humorous... no, strike that, make that "pathetic" hearing about how poor ol Doc has to actually deploy for six months every sixteen.

Did you know some units are doing 12-13 month tours over there? Seems not everyone can waltz in for half a year like some prima donna.

I've been in the army for 18 years now, and one thing I've found is true - in EVERY career field the whiners and naysayers are the loudest voices out there.

Please stop whining. We are at war. Your deployments will slow down when the war ends. If you don't like how long that's taking, exercise your power at the ballot box, but otherwise KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT. You'll look pretty silly when you're applying for that cush civilian position, trying to explain away your federal conviction for "conduct unbecoming an officer".

Not to mention, that enlisted corpsman or medic who heard you mouthing off, has probablylost friends over there. So how do you think he (or she) will feel when some overpaid doctor is bitching about the impact to his lifestyle?
 
ORIFaddict said:
!!!!!Cowboy up doc!!!!! I'll just tell you like they told me, "Nobody put a gun to your head when you signed that contract". You have to know all the bs that comes along with being in the military. Don't discourage some young motivators out there who might actually want to serve this GREAT nation. You should have enlisted as a Navy Corpsman, then you might be a little tougher.

But they were not told exactly what they were getting into either. And many DON'T know all the B.S. they are getting into. I think this board serves a very good purpose to those who are thinking of HPSP. Without it, young people thinking of taking the scholarship only hear what the recruiters want them to hear. And that often either contains outright lies or lies of ommission from individuals who don't know much about what a young doctor really needs to know.

Making the decision to join, warts and all, makes it much easier to deal with the tough life (long deployments, idiotic O5/O6/GOFO, Clipboard commandos, etc) that you will see when serving your country. If it turns some off - GOOD. But trust me, the military will still find someone to fill those billets.

Keep the great sea stories coming!
 
Yeah, complaints go up, but nothing good happens (quite the opposite), so you bitch to those around you and it makes you feel not as bad for getting bent over by Uncle Sam. It's just like getting on here and complaining about how your attending treats you or some other such stuff. It might not change anything but it probably makes you feel better.

As for my views on the war, yeah I agree Saddam needed to be taken out. I've never waivered in that view. Although I think there were a lot more people (some Americans and Brits included) profiting from him being in power, and from his overthrow than you are willing to accept. Just my 2 cents.....by the way, the French suck.
 
My mom told once, "Life isn't fair." Then again, maybe I was one of the lucky ones.
 
tomplatz said:
A leader never complains to his or her subordinates. Period. Didn't you see Saving Private Ryan? Complaints go up the chain, not down.
You gotta love the irony of calling a poster's authenticity into question, then backing it up with lines from a fictional movie. I love it.
 
tomplatz said:
The French military is hiring if you're interested buddy. Those kinds of comments would be welcomed there.

A leader never complains to his or her subordinates. Period. Didn't you see Saving Private Ryan? Complaints go up the chain, not down.

Not all officers are good officers.
 
No, life is not fair, and using a fictional movie to back up your side of this argument is rather funny (although it certainly does accurately portray the "correct" :rolleyes: attitude of an officer).

I guess what it boils down to is that I don't see any difference in level of respectability between a good decent civilian doctor and someone who enlists in the military. There is nothing more or less honorable about either path, contrary to what a lot of people here would lead one to believe.

It's a matter of personal choice in regards to whether you feel that you can best serve your fellow man by enlisting or by doing good things as a civilian. I did my time in the service, and I am proud of my service (to a certain extent) and I have lost several friends in Iraq and Afghanistan. I don't look at officers any differently than I do enlisted- we're all soldiers, airmen, sailors or Marines. However I do feel that anyone who does willingly enlist, especially those who become officers, has no right to feel or act superior or holier than thou towards those who have no desire to serve in that capacity.

I have always felt I did more towards protecting and serving my country as a volunteer firefighter (running over 1000 calls a year mind you- basically a full time job on top of my paying job) than I ever did while I was in the service. But that's just my opinion...you can take it or leave it.
 
Sledge2005 said:
this statement is so inaccurate that it calls the rest of your post into question. GMO's make a lot more, especially after taxes, then the vast majority of civilian residents.


yeah..my NET pay after taxes, SGLI is just over 8k/month
 
ORIFaddict said:
!!!!!Cowboy up doc!!!!! I'll just tell you like they told me, "Nobody put a gun to your head when you signed that contract". You have to know all the bs that comes along with being in the military. Don't discourage some young motivators out there who might actually want to serve this GREAT nation. You should have enlisted as a Navy Corpsman, then you might be a little tougher.


r u a HPSP recruitter? :D
 
GMO2003 said:
yeah..my NET pay after taxes, SGLI is just over 8k/month

In the civilian world, you'd have to be making almost 150k before taxes to get 8k per month afterward. Not too shabby. I'm currently making the civilian equivalent of 75k before taxes this year, and I'm just an intern.
 
I am incredibly disapointed that so many military docs/residents would personaly attack me for my post.

Tom, I know you, you are a hard working, nice guy. Why would you personaly attack me?

To clarify a point: GMOs do make more than a typical civilian resident's salary however many civilian residents moonlight. I made more than I do now moonlighting as a 2nd and 3rd year resident - which is more than a GMO's salary. As a side note: military residents are not permited to moonlight, and it is dang hard to as a military attending.

To clarify another point: I have passed the problems up the chain several times and even to the IG (inspector general) with little success. I can't really go into the things I have done to try to improve military medicine, but it has fallen on deaf ears and weak hands.

Lastly,

There is no comparing real war to a movie - no matter how realistic the movie is made. There is nothing like unzipping a body bag from the field and trying to make sense of it. There is nothing like copying the names on the dog tags. There is nothing like being attacked by angry Iraqis. There is nothing like reading the name of the dead soldier's daughter on his "pink" dog tag.

I have never been to a movie that has left me in constant panic for months and months. I have never been in a situation that has left me with anger management problems. A car backfired yesterday next to us, and I had to lay down because I was shaking so bad. That is what real combat does to you.

I am just asking students to think hard before signing an HPSP contract. Their lives will change. The military will always need motivated men and women. It will gladly accept them after medical school and residency. A force that is built by those who do not feel betrayed will be a stronger one.
 
zoomer, I 'm with you....they attack me too.....I feel exactly same as you.
 
Zoomer said:
I am incredibly disapointed that so many military docs/residents would personaly attack me for my post.

Well, I agree with a lot of the points you make. However, higher pay during residency is one of the few advantages of a military residency so I get really annoyed when somebody tries to discredit that fact.

Zoomer said:
To clarify a point: GMOs do make more than a typical civilian resident's salary however many civilian residents moonlight. I made more than I do now moonlighting as a 2nd and 3rd year resident - which is more than a GMO's salary. As a side note: military residents are not permited to moonlight, and it is dang hard to as a military attending.

The vast majority of civilian residents I know do not moonlight, and the minority who do certainly aren't able to do it enough to get their salaries as high as a gmo's. I still think your comment was pretty misleading, although some of your other points may be valid.
 
zoomer just proved he's bogus, NONE of the ER attendings know me, and my real name is nothing like my alias on here, and no one I work with knows my alias.

whatever, I really couldn't care less what this guy thinks. I just don't appreciate it when people pretend to be something they're not to try and push their agenda from a more advantageous point of reference. then some poor soul looking for an honest critique of military medicine before signing on comes to the board and reads his post, believing he is what he says he is.

Zoomer I don't fault you for your opinion (even though I disagree with it) but don't pretend to be something you're not. that disrespects all of us who wear the uniform.

on the other hand, I can respect a guy like militarymd. he's been there, done that, and speaks honestly from his perspective. THAT is a valuable opinion to share, again - even if I disagree with it.

and yes, the french do suck.
 
I agree that no film, even documentary film, does combat justice. I never saw combat in the sense that there were insurgents running around trying to shoot me or blow me up,

I don't normally discuss it, but I feel it's important that you all see where I was coming from. I was present at a particularly dark event in American history. Suffice to say that the noise of a low flying jet or the smell of avgas makes me want to cower and provokes horrible memories, a full PTSD flashback- the screams, the sirens, visions of the wounded and the , the smell of charred flesh and fuel.

I can feel the hair on my arms standing on end as I type this. I wasn't there representing the military, even though I was in the service at the time, but that doesn't change the facts of what I saw, what I heard, what I smelled, what I had to do. It might not have been combat, but that is as close as I ever want to get.

This (among other thigs) is why I have a distaste for the military. I don't disrespect anyone for choosing to serve- in fact more power to you all for doing so, but I don't feel that those of us who choose not to should be treated as somehow less patriotic or be accused of being traitors.
 
tomplatz said:
zoomer just proved he's bogus, NONE of the ER attendings know me, and my real name is nothing like my alias on here, and no one I work with knows my alias.

Zoom,

This is really bad. You gotta tell it like it is...and not make stuff up.
 
militarymd said:
Zoom,

This is really bad. You gotta tell it like it is...and not make stuff up.

*Poof*, just like Keyser Sose, Zoomer disappears.....
 
thanks MilMD. like I said, i have great respect for you even though I disagree with your opinion. this guy on the other hand was just phony all over. too bad, he takes away from people with legitimate gripes about the military and clouds the waters for people trying to make informed decisions.

i'm only a year into military residency. so far it's been good for me. i hope it stays that way. am sorry your experience has not been so good. best regards.
 
I respect your opinion fully Steve. sorry that you had these bad experiences. YOUR opinion DOES count on this board, unlike that of a poser with an agenda like zoom.
 
Tom, email me and you can come by my office. I will give you my cell number and my office number. We need to talk. This isn't a joke. You can read the medal on my wall. If you are not the Tom Splatz I know then whoever you are, I would really like to talk to you. I have not misrepresented myself in anyway or been untruthful in anyway. You are welcome to look at my pictures from Iraq. I am here because I thought a lot of the medical students should have a better idea of what it is to be in the military. To make that choice as a medical student is a mistake. Please email me and I will give you my office number at "the flagship." Thanks.
 
MilitaryMD, "I will not lie, steal, or cheat or tolerate anyone among us who does." I speak the God's honest truth. Also, I would like to talk to you sometime as well. I am really going through a rough time in my life after Iraq and was just hard tasked again (I found out during the MOBEX). I guess I am worried about the reprocusions (sp?) of going to the head shrinkers. Anyway, I would appreciate it if you could email me sometime.
 
Zoomer said:
MilitaryMD, "I will not lie, steal, or cheat or tolerate anyone among us who does." I speak the God's honest truth. Also, I would like to talk to you sometime as well. I am really going through a rough time in my life after Iraq and was just hard tasked again (I found out during the MOBEX). I guess I am worried about the reprocusions (sp?) of going to the head shrinkers. Anyway, I would appreciate it if you could email me sometime.

I would think a diagnosis of PTSD wouldn't hurt you, although you'd know better than I do. As a pilot looking to change career fields, I would be leery, but I dont' know why you would be.
 
MoosePilot said:
I would think a diagnosis of PTSD wouldn't hurt you, although you'd know better than I do. As a pilot looking to change career fields, I would be leery, but I dont' know why you would be.

Moose, thanks for the reply. I get it with Pilot/Navs but my specialty also requires a level head under pressure so I worry if that will mark me for the future (ie when I get out.) Anyone have any experience on this?

PS: which airframe is refered to as a Moose? I know the warthog and the viper and the eagle and the BUFF (Ha! always liked that one.)
 
Zoomer said:
Moose, thanks for the reply. I get it with Pilot/Navs but my specialty also requires a level head under pressure so I worry if that will mark me for the future (ie when I get out.) Anyone have any experience on this?

PS: which airframe is refered to as a Moose? I know the warthog and the viper and the eagle and the BUFF (Ha! always liked that one.)

C-17

Will civilian employers have access to your military medical records?
 
Civilians don't have access to medical records but most groups require a full disclosure statement when you join. I remember these from when I used to fill them out from my moonlighting jobs. As long as it does not interupt my clinical duties, I do not have to disclose it. However, I have a feeling that as soon as I raise the flag they are going to send me into counseling.

C-17, cool, I did not know that. Best of luck on changing AFSCs. If I can be of any assistance to guide you through the painful maze of becoming an MD - I am willing to help.
 
Zoomer said:
Civilians don't have access to medical records but most groups require a full disclosure statement when you join. I remember these from when I used to fill them out from my moonlighting jobs. As long as it does not interupt my clinical duties, I do not have to disclose it. However, I have a feeling that as soon as I raise the flag they are going to send me into counseling.

C-17, cool, I did not know that. Best of luck on changing AFSCs. If I can be of any assistance to guide you through the painful maze of becoming an MD - I am willing to help.

Thanks! If you want, PM me your email. Or I could look you up on the global. I've got an interview in your neck of the woods this weekend (assuming you're at Wilford).
 
Moose,
I PM'ed you my info. I think I have given up on this board. I came here trying to help, and all I think I did was hurt my cause. I just want students to stop and think. I am going as a CCATT doc this time so I'll be spending a lot of time on your airframe. Should be exciting - no doubt. Although transporting wounded soldiers is something I cringe when I think about. Later guys...I give up. I guess I can chalk it up to how headstrong I used to be about the military. Then, I got my first taste of reality - and it was rough. I am glad I serve, but I serve with a lot of guys who are not. This makes life for me very difficult. They felt betrayed, and I just do not want to see waves and waves of them over my next 6 years. Thanks again.
 
Zoomer said:
Moose,
I PM'ed you my info. I think I have given up on this board. I came here trying to help, and all I think I did was hurt my cause. I just want students to stop and think. I am going as a CCATT doc this time so I'll be spending a lot of time on your airframe. Should be exciting - no doubt. Although transporting wounded soldiers is something I cringe when I think about. Later guys...I give up. I guess I can chalk it up to how headstrong I used to be about the military. Then, I got my first taste of reality - and it was rough. I am glad I serve, but I serve with a lot of guys who are not. This makes life for me very difficult. They felt betrayed, and I just do not want to see waves and waves of them over my next 6 years. Thanks again.

Stay safe Zoom.....the end will come...it did for me, and when you go into private practice....your colleagues will have immense respect for you.
 
Sledge2005 said:
Well, I agree with a lot of the points you make. However, higher pay during residency is one of the few advantages of a military residency so I get really annoyed when somebody tries to discredit that fact.



The vast majority of civilian residents I know do not moonlight, and the minority who do certainly aren't able to do it enough to get their salaries as high as a gmo's. I still think your comment was pretty misleading, although some of your other points may be valid.

Really?
I made 110k my last 2 years of residency...about 38k residency money and the rest moonlighting money. Another dude in my residency year made a little more than that. Most residents in my class made about 40k moonlighting, plus their residents salary.
 
tomplatz said:
zoomer just proved he's bogus, NONE of the ER attendings know me, and my real name is nothing like my alias on here, and no one I work with knows my alias.

I'd spot you in a minute. Us bodybuilding types are easy to spot.
 
MoosePilot said:
I would think a diagnosis of PTSD wouldn't hurt you, although you'd know better than I do. As a pilot looking to change career fields, I would be leery, but I dont' know why you would be.

Moose, just curious, why didnt you consider airline instead of medicine? Geez, you could probably fly a 737 for SWA in your sleep.
 
As a last note, I just wanted to say I am sorry for letting some personal stuff slip. These last couple of years have been hard on me (Iraq especially), and I know that it is a bad idea for me to speak up while I am still in, but I am not perfect by any means. I guess what I really need to find is a group of military docs forum so we can bitch,whine, and moan to each other without broadcasting to the rest of the world. Anyway, Later fellas. - man, I think this is the shortest time I have ever been a part of a forum.
 
Zoomer said:
Moose,
I PM'ed you my info. I think I have given up on this board. I came here trying to help, and all I think I did was hurt my cause. I just want students to stop and think. I am going as a CCATT doc this time so I'll be spending a lot of time on your airframe. Should be exciting - no doubt. Although transporting wounded soldiers is something I cringe when I think about. Later guys...I give up. I guess I can chalk it up to how headstrong I used to be about the military. Then, I got my first taste of reality - and it was rough. I am glad I serve, but I serve with a lot of guys who are not. This makes life for me very difficult. They felt betrayed, and I just do not want to see waves and waves of them over my next 6 years. Thanks again.

Thanks for the PM. I'll respond shortly. I do appreciate it.

Don't feel bad. The military is a tough environment these days. I think PTSD needs to be researched much more thoroughly than it is. I imagine there are many "walking wounded" with cases of PTSD along a continuum of severity that are still able to function, but still suffer. The military mindset discourages reporting because of the potential loss of qualifications, options, and perhaps even a job.

Good luck with that job. Know that aeromedical evac, while emotionally tough, is the mission all of us feel strongest about. We'll waive regs that we wouldn't consider waiving to haul standard trash, just to get you where you need to go. Good luck and fly safe.
 
jetproppilot said:
Moose, just curious, why didnt you consider airline instead of medicine? Geez, you could probably fly a 737 for SWA in your sleep.

This is one I thought long and hard about. I wanted to be sure I wasn't entering a "grass is always greener" mindset. I shadowed and talked to as many docs as I could so I could make a good judgement.

1. No security - the economy shifts and airlines go up and down severely. I also think the "good old days" for airline pilots are gone. Docs very rarely go unemployed.

2. More importantly for me, I don't think this is my "calling". That sounds hokey, but I'm a bit of an idealist. Ultimately, when I was deciding what I wanted to do based on my talents, interests, and satisfactions, I wanted to be a doctor. When the application process scared me and threatened my self esteem, when the Air Force said I was one of the "golden boys" qualified to be a pilot, and when all I could think about was "Top Gun" (only without the fruity white uniforms - sorry swabbies), then I decided I'd rather be a pilot.
 
jetproppilot said:
Really?
I made 110k my last 2 years of residency...about 38k residency money and the rest moonlighting money. Another dude in my residency year made a little more than that. Most residents in my class made about 40k moonlighting, plus their residents salary.

You must have moonlighted quite a bit to make an additional 72k per year! Do you really not think that you're in the great minority of residents? And while it's common for fellows to moonlight, most residents don't make 40k per year moonlighting. Your program must have been easier then most residencies. Not many of the residents moonlighted frequently at most programs at my old med school or any other large hospital that I've seen. When they did, it was only occasional since they didn't have much free time.

How did you find time for multiple moonlighting shifts per week during residency?
 
MoosePilot said:
This is one I thought long and hard about. I wanted to be sure I wasn't entering a "grass is always greener" mindset. I shadowed and talked to as many docs as I could so I could make a good judgement.

1. No security - the economy shifts and airlines go up and down severely. I also think the "good old days" for airline pilots are gone. Docs very rarely go unemployed.

2. More importantly for me, I don't think this is my "calling". That sounds hokey, but I'm a bit of an idealist. Ultimately, when I was deciding what I wanted to do based on my talents, interests, and satisfactions, I wanted to be a doctor. When the application process scared me and threatened my self esteem, when the Air Force said I was one of the "golden boys" qualified to be a pilot, and when all I could think about was "Top Gun" (only without the fruity white uniforms - sorry swabbies), then I decided I'd rather be a pilot.

I hear you. I come from an airline family...my dad flew for TWA for 38 years, the last ten in 747s...he retired in 1981, right around the time the industry radically changed. He enjoyed a glorious career during the glory days.

He discouraged me from following in his footsteps when I came out of high school in 1982. Geez, looking at the crumbling airline industry, the old man was right once again!
BUT, sometimes I think I'd be happier flying big hardware for a stable company like Fed Ex or UPS...not that I'm unhappy, because I'm not...I just love to fly. Maybe thats because I dont do it for a living, huh? Although the old man sure loved his job. He kinda died inside when the mandatory 60 retirement time came.
Sure you dont wanna look at UPS or Fed Ex, with your experience, seems like you'd move up pretty quick, at least in hardware...you're looking at around ten years investment for med school and residency...by then you'd be making great cash with them, while making cash while building seniority...
Not trying to discourage you...just living vicariously through your options. :D
 
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