Step 2

[b&ierstiefel]

This...test...was...the...silliest...most...useless...exam...I...have...ever...had...to...pay...one...thousand...dollars...for........I...am...so...serious...ly...pissed...off...right...nyah...!!!

Interesting story...I met another SDN path person there who was taking the exam along with me and the other 20 people(!). All I had to say was that "I'm going into path...I'm at Michigan" and he assumes (correctly) that I was Andy.

I won't reveal who you are...that's your prerogative to identify yourself. But it was nice meeting you and thanks so much again for giving me a ride to the Ramada Inn. I hope traffic getting out wasn't too bad and you've repressed the memories from this silly exam.

BTW, this person is tall as yaah. I would pay top dollar to see these two giants go at it. Bets? Wagers? anyone?

---

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[yaah]

As tall as me? Well, that's nice. Path needs more tall people, we are an underrepresented minority.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

As tall as me? Well, that's nice. Path needs more tall people, we are an underrepresented minority.

I think you're a bit taller though. I mean let's face it...you're pretty frickin tall!

 

[yaah]

I think you're a bit taller though. I mean let's face it...you're pretty frickin tall!

My height came in handy the other day when I was able to reach a tray of slides in the histology lab. I spared the poor ladies who work there from fetching the step ladder. From now on, I said, My powers will only be used for good. No more evil.

Everyone always thinks I am getting taller but it is actually an optical illusion. I have been somewhere between 6'4" and 6'5" since college or perhaps even end of high school. My growth plates have closed.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

My height came in handy the other day when I was able to reach a tray of slides in the histology lab. I spared the poor ladies who work there from fetching the step ladder. From now on, I said, My powers will only be used for good. No more evil.

Oh come on man. Evil yaah is better.

Everyone always thinks I am getting taller but it is actually an optical illusion. I have been somewhere between 6'4" and 6'5" since college or perhaps even end of high school. My growth plates have closed.

Well, now all you can do is shrink from now on. You'll still be pretty frickin tall though. People like you probably enjoyed giving people like me sh1t back in grade school.

 

[yaah]

No no, I have never been an evil tall person. I got more crap for being tall than I ever gave out. In grade school I was middle of the pack until 8th grade when my growth spurt hit. But I never made fun of short people. I like leprechauns.

 

[SpinachPizza]

No no, I have never been an evil tall person. I got more crap for being tall than I ever gave out. In grade school I was middle of the pack until 8th grade when my growth spurt hit. But I never made fun of short people. I like leprechauns.

Cool avatar yaah, it that in Berlin or some such place?

 

[SpinachPizza]

Cool avatar yaah, it that in Berlin or some such place?

whoops, never mind.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

But I never made fun of short people. I like leprechauns.

That's too bad yaah. Apparently, the tall folks who gave me sh1t as a child were having a great ol' time. It's too bad you missed out on that fun. Easy pickins!

 

[yaah]

That's too bad yaah. Apparently, the tall folks who gave me sh1t as a child were having a great ol' time. It's too bad you missed out on that fun. Easy pickins!

Well, they do say that leprechauns are diminutive men who are often drunk. So where's your pot of gold?

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Well, they do say that leprechauns are diminutive men who are often drunk. So where's your pot of gold?

Heh! I'd like to know this as well. If I had a pot of gold, assuming it was worth a buttload of money, I'd fund my own lab and would never have to write grants. Then I really could do 50%/50% diagnostic path/research!

 

[wanderlust]

Well, I have never posted on this before, but I have read through the pathology forum over the past few months. I like the forum a lot. It soothes me to be with others that want to go into pathology. Well, anyways, I'm a bit sad because I got my Step 2 score back yesterday, and it wasn't as good as my Step 1 score. (In fact, it was kind of considerably worse than my Step 1 score.) Granted, I still passed Step 2, but it's just an average score (like one point above the projected mean). What I'm worried about is that some residency programs may require you to submit your Step 2 scores before the ROL deadline...at least that's what I've read from a few of the posts in here. What if the program that I really like is one of those programs? Since my Step 1 score is much higher than my Step 2, would that really hurt my chances of getting ranked highly by that program, especially if that program is considered a very competitive one? Would the program think, "Oh, this person has not been improving and has done much worse."?

I'm just not sure what to think about this. Also, how do programs view you in general if you did very well on Step 1, but average on Step 2?

Oh, darn, I wished I had studied more for Step 2. Sorry for sounding down about this--don't want to bring others down with my attitude.

 

[wanderlust]

Well, I have never posted on this before, but I have read through the pathology forum over the past few months. I like the forum a lot. It soothes me to be with others that want to go into pathology. Well, anyways, I'm a bit sad because I got my Step 2 score back yesterday, and it wasn't as good as my Step 1 score. (In fact, it was kind of considerably worse than my Step 1 score.) Granted, I still passed Step 2, but it's just an average score (like one point above the projected mean). What I'm worried about is that some residency programs may require you to submit your Step 2 scores before the ROL deadline...at least that's what I've read from a few of the posts in here. What if the program that I really like is one of those programs? Since my Step 1 score is much higher than my Step 2, would that really hurt my chances of getting ranked highly by that program, especially if that program is considered a very competitive one? Would the program think, "Oh, this person has not been improving and has done much worse."?

I'm just not sure what to think about this. Also, how do programs view you in general if you did very well on Step 1, but average on Step 2?

Oh, darn, I wished I had studied more for Step 2. Sorry for sounding down about this--don't want to bring others down with my attitude.

Oops, didn't want that angry face there. I'm not angry, just sad.

 

[deleted57552]

Wanderlust,

I understand your worries regarding the step 2 score. However, my understanding is that step 2 scores is only one part of your application. If you have other strengths in your application, programs may just look the other way. It's just one test and you may have had a bad day. Clearly programs will not think that you are dumb because you did well on step 1. Especially in pathology, I think programs are more likely to look away from step 2 than step 1 (although, in previous posts it was mentioned that some program directors are starting to emphasize the value of step 2). As an applicant myself, I will admit I don't know all the answers. The above statements are only opinions that maybe others might share.

What I am trying to say is that this is not the end of the world. There are many other facets to your application such as pre-clinical grades, clinical grades, step 1, letters of recommendation, etc.

Don't get so down on yourself. Especially with holidays coming up.

P.S. Did you choose to automatically send Step 2 scores?

 

[QuietSylph]

I'm just not sure what to think about this. Also, how do programs view you in general if you did very well on Step 1, but average on Step 2?

I highly doubt that your Step 2 score will be an obstacle in getting into a good residency. "Average" is still fine. Plus, your high Step 1 score shows that you are very comfortable with concepts that are arguably more closely related to pathology.

There is so much more to applicants than their scores - in five interviews, my scores came up only once, with one interviewer. The rest of the time we discussed far more interesting things!

 

[wanderlust]

Thanks, SeenTheLight and QuietSylph. I feel better at least because of what you guys said. SeenTheLight, no, I did not automatically release my Step 2 scores to the residency programs. I don't think I will until after the Match...although, I heard there are some programs that require Step 2 scores to be released before ROL deadline. I'm just not sure which schools yet, so I may have to call the ones I'm especially interested in and find out their policy.

 

[deschutes]

wanderlust, the names that keep coming up are the New Hampshire programs - for some reason, NH state licensure requires Step 2 scores before the rank list or even December.

As for the others, until you have interviewed, I would take any requests for Step 2 results with a pinch of salt - I've made the telephone rounds too. One program (non-NH) told me they needed Step 2 by the ROL deadline before I applied - on the day of the interview I asked the assistant PD about Step 2 score requirements, and she said she'd never seen any from their previous applicants.

 

[geddy]

This...test...was...the...silliest...most...useless...exam...I...have...ever...had...to...pay...one...thousand...dollars...for........I...am...so...serious...ly...pissed...off...right...nyah...!!!

Interesting story...I met another SDN path person there who was taking the exam along with me and the other 20 people(!). All I had to say was that "I'm going into path...I'm at Michigan" and he assumes (correctly) that I was Andy.

I won't reveal who you are...that's your prerogative to identify yourself. But it was nice meeting you and thanks so much again for giving me a ride to the Ramada Inn. I hope traffic getting out wasn't too bad and you've repressed the memories from this silly exam.

BTW, this person is tall as yaah. I would pay top dollar to see these two giants go at it. Bets? Wagers? anyone?

Sorry it took so to reply to this - took took the family with me for 2 weeks to CA, coinciding with interviews at UCSF and Stanford. I really liked Stanford. Also, no snow at Stanford... definite plus.

It was great to meet you Andy at the step 2 CS - as for recognizing you, it was easy! You said in a previous post about how you would answer the question "tell me about yourself" that you would say "I'm a fat Asian guy." Well, you're not fat, but let's just say there was enough supporting evidence to figure it out pretty quickly.

Also, that CS test was crap - utter crap. Here's what I hated the most - it completely inverts the normal doctor/patient relationship. Normally, when I interview a patient, I feel confident b/c I am more of an "expert" than they are, and if I am nice, they'll usually appreciate it. In the Step 2 CS, the "patient" holds all the power, and I felt like I was walking on eggshells not to upset them, to push enough but not too much, etc. What a farce. My only fear is that somehow I failed and the result doesn't come out until April, and I can't repeat it in time to graduate from medical school and I end up at Tom's House of Pathology for my residency... Ok, I feel better now.

As for me vs. Yaah, I would suggest that everyone bet against me. I may be tall, but I am thin and weak. I've never seen Yaah, but I can only assume he has a more normal body habitus.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Sorry it took so to reply to this - took took the family with me for 2 weeks to CA, coinciding with interviews at UCSF and Stanford. I really liked Stanford. Also, no snow at Stanford... definite plus.

Who are you again? Just kidding. Yeah, I remember you telling me about your upcoming trip to CA. I'm glad you liked Stanford. Stanford is my last interview and my PhD boss thinks I will really like Stanford too. I'll be doing the same 2 week tour of CA in the New Year. It'll be good to get back to some warmer weather. It's really really cold where I am.

It was great to meet you Andy at the step 2 CS - as for recognizing you, it was easy! You said in a previous post about how you would answer the question "tell me about yourself" that you would say "I'm a fat Asian guy." Well, you're not fat, but let's just say there was enough supporting evidence to figure it out pretty quickly.

That's hilarious.

Also, that CS test was crap - utter crap. Here's what I hated the most - it completely inverts the normal doctor/patient relationship. Normally, when I interview a patient, I feel confident b/c I am more of an "expert" than they are, and if I am nice, they'll usually appreciate it. In the Step 2 CS, the "patient" holds all the power, and I felt like I was walking on eggshells not to upset them, to push enough but not too much, etc. What a farce. My only fear is that somehow I failed and the result doesn't come out until April, and I can't repeat it in time to graduate from medical school and I end up at Tom's House of Pathology for my residency... Ok, I feel better now.

I couldn't have said it better myself. I had the same sentiments but couldn't put it in words. The patient is not a patient, the patient is someone who is testing you. So establishing rapport basically amounts to trying to get brownie-points.

As for me vs. Yaah, I would suggest that everyone bet against me. I may be tall, but I am thin and weak. I've never seen Yaah, but I can only assume he has a more normal body habitus.

I don't know who is the weaker one, you or yaah. I have no idea how much you two can benchpress or squat. As for body habitus, both of you seem to have pretty high metabolism. But with the holiday season in full swing, body habitus is bound to change.

 

[yaah]

Yeah right, like I'm going to gain weight over the holidays. Perhaps eventually my metabolism will slow down from "TSH of 0.01 equivalent" to normal TSH range (my actual TSH is 1.5, it's been tested) but not yet.

Honestly I don't know how much I can benchpress. I don't play macho games like that. I don't measure my worth or personal achievements by silly numbers like that.

I am sorry you folks have to suffer through this utter crap that is the Step II BS. So are you allowed to ask the patient how much they weigh? Or is that insensitive? Their ethnic background? Do they have 60 year old ladies portraying 18 year old pregnant crack ******?

 

[deschutes]

Normally, when I interview a patient, I feel confident b/c I am more of an "expert" than they are, and if I am nice, they'll usually appreciate it.

That must be something that comes with the MSIV year? The thing about talking to patients (especially those that have an inherent mistrust of the healthcare system) is that they sometimes spring these outrageous situations onto you ("The line you put into my sick kid won't stay because he's immunocompromised!"), and the very moment you frown and wonder how on earth that could be so, it's "Get me someone who knows what they're doing!"

My only fear is that somehow I failed and the result doesn't come out until April, and I can't repeat it in time to graduate from medical school and I end up at Tom's House of Pathology for my residency...

Gee thanks. Let's sit and flesh out every single thing that could go wrong from now till July...
(AAAAAAARRRGGGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!)

Ahem.

I dreamt up this wild scheme where I would tack on a Step 2 CS date coinciding with a Feb-Mar San Antonio visit... no available dates.

Hey, you guys who've done it already - what's the date shuffle like? Do you think I should hold on scheduling and see if a Houston date I like becomes available and I can tack it onto my San Antonio trip?

 

[jeff2005]

I got my Step2 scores back recently. I basically did the same as on Step 1, which was pretty surprising. I sent a note to programs saying hello and, by the way, my Step 2 score is available. I got an interesting response from one PD. He said that in his experience high Step scores don't translate into better residents, so he doesn't pay much attention to them.

 

[yaah]

I got my Step2 scores back recently. I basically did the same as on Step 1, which was pretty surprising. I sent a note to programs saying hello and, by the way, my Step 2 score is available. I got an interesting response from one PD. He said that in his experience high Step scores don't translate into better residents, so he doesn't pay much attention to them.

I got a response from a PD (presumptively not the same one!) who said in his experience Step II scores are more of an indication than step I as to who will do well in residency.

It takes all kinds, I guess!

 

[geddy]

I got a response from a PD (presumptively not the same one!) who said in his experience Step II scores are more of an indication than step I as to who will do well in residency.

I hope this is true for most directors. I was fretting because I had chosen the "send automatically" option for my step 2 scores - if I did poorly, I may have some trouble, because my step 1 scores were ok but not great. But, as it turns out, I got my scores the day before Christmas, and I did much better on step 2 than step 1. What a relief to have the exam finished!

 

[b&ierstiefel]

I hope this is true for most directors. I was fretting because I had chosen the "send automatically" option for my step 2 scores - if I did poorly, I may have some trouble, because my step 1 scores were ok but not great. But, as it turns out, I got my scores the day before Christmas, and I did much better on step 2 than step 1. What a relief to have the exam finished!

Congrats! I'm glad to hear you did well. Go party. GG med school!

How long did it take for you to get your scores?

 

[geddy]

How long did it take for you to get your scores?

Score report was generated almost exactly 3 weeks after I took it. Now I need an SSRI to stop myself from checking ERAS to see who's downloaded the scores.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Score report was generated almost exactly 3 weeks after I took it. Now I need an SSRI to stop myself from checking ERAS to see who's downloaded the scores.

hmm...not good. wrong answer geddy. try again please?

Edit: actually, i didn't click automatic send. if the 3 week rule holds true, i should get my scores like the day before ROLs are due. it's all good.

 

[geddy]

if the 3 week rule holds true, i should get my scores like the day before ROLs are due. it's all good.

I felt I needed to have step 2 done b/c I wasn't very happy with my step 1. However, board scores seem to be used as a cutoff for getting an interview, as best I can gather. As for making the rank list, I don't think they matter as much - the actual interview and other features of your application are more important. I doubt you'll have any trouble matching wherever you decide to go, with or without step 2 scores.

 

[deschutes]

I got an interesting response from one PD. He said that in his experience high Step scores don't translate into better residents, so he doesn't pay much attention to them.

Hmm. That's to be read one of two ways:

If your scores were low, then that is reassuring to know.
But if your scores were high, then ... he was either brushing you off, or stating the facts.

Either way I guess your position hasn't changed....? *shrugs*

~
Is this Step 2 CS something that I can do at the end of 3rd year?

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Is this Step 2 BS something that I can do at the end of 3rd year?

BS is something that is better taken sooner than later since you're gonna be starting residency this summer. Is BS required for your graduation? If not, completing step 2 is likely required by residency time. The issue is that people have little idea as to how long it will take for scores to be reported after you take the BS.

 

[deschutes]

waitasec. You mean I can take CS before CK?

No Andy, the USMLE Steps are not a requirement for graduation from where I am
At any rate, I see I will need to re-examine my approach to my final four months of med school.

Frick!

btw, can I put my payment for Step 2 CK and CS on the same money order? The NBME should be able to figure that out, no?

 

[b&ierstiefel]

waitasec. You mean I can take CS before CK?

I hope this was a rhetorical question. You know that's what I did right?

btw, can I put my payment for Step 2 CK and CS on the same money order? The NBME should be able to figure that out, no?

I believe you can do that. I distinctly remember paying for both all at once via my credit card. It's a hefty sum of money though...like ~$1400 I think.

 

[yaah]

BS is something that is better taken sooner than later since you're gonna be starting residency this summer. Is BS required for your graduation? If not, completing step 2 is likely required by residency time. The issue is that people have little idea as to how long it will take for scores to be reported after you take the BS.

Why the F does it take so long to get these scores back? I guess that's where the large fees go. So far it seems to be taking months for some people.

Consarnit I have to start thinking about registering for Step III next week. Dammit it never F-ing ends!

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Why the F does it take so long to get these scores back? I guess that's where the large fees go. So far it seems to be taking months for some people.

Consarnit I have to start thinking about registering for Step III next week. Dammit it never F-ing ends!

I think it is because they need scoring from a certain population size to come up with a score reference range or something. I think subsequent administrations will allow for scores to be mailed to test-takers within 4-6 weeks. The folks who first took the test (this past summer) are just getting their BS scores back.

Why are you taking step III now? Be like all the other Michigan folk who take it during their PGY-3 year.

 

[yaah]

Why are you taking step III now? Be like all the other Michigan folk who take it during their PGY-3 year.

Because Ramsburgh is threatening to revoke our residency appointment if we don't (an idle threat, perhaps, but not worth listening to and arguing about for 3 years!). Plus, I would rather get it out of the way sooner rather than later.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Because Ramsburgh is threatening to revoke our residency appointment if we don't (an idle threat, perhaps, but not worth listening to and arguing about for 3 years!). Plus, I would rather get it out of the way sooner rather than later.

yea yeah...blame it on good ol' Dr. Ramsburgh...he's probably just joking around ya know.

Edit: oh wait...my bad...I vowed to only give you **** in the Lounge Seriously speaking though, it is probably better to get it out of the way sooner than later while the clinical medicine knowledge is still relatively fresh in your mind.

 

[deschutes]

I hope this was a rhetorical question. You know that's what I did right?

The reality had escaped me.

You know how you're told something but the full significance doesn't really impact you? Well, this was one of those times. I think somewhere in the depths of my mind I thought it was a US grad free-for-all thing.

I distinctly remember paying for both all at once via my credit card. It's a hefty sum of money though...like ~$1400 I think.

$1420, to be precise. I am watching exchange rates with an eagle eye. Hopefully money orders come in denominations of more than $999.99.

 

[deschutes]

Help! Do I need to print out the form, paste my picture on it and get it stamped by my school? I thought once it was done for Step 1 it was valid for the next 5 years???

 

[b&ierstiefel]

Help! Do I need to print out the form, paste my picture on it and get it stamped by my school? I thought once it was done for Step 1 it was valid for the next 5 years???

yup you need to do it all over again...and while you front the charge to your credit card (if you exercise this option), the school stamps it and sends off the registration form

...bye.

 

[deschutes]

#*&%$ paperwork!! I thought I had seen the end of it yesterday. #*&%$ ID photos!

...bye.

I seem to be using this face a lot. It was nice meeting you too. I'm going back to my friendly paperwork.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

#*&%$ paperwork!! I thought I had seen the end of it yesterday. #*&%$ ID photos!

I seem to be using this face a lot. It was nice meeting you too. I'm going back to my friendly paperwork.

keep on truckin'