Study Abroad transcripts and grades

[fccoppa]

So i have a few questions about study abroad and how it transfers etc. I did a search through these forms about how study abroad grades are included in the amcas application and it seems like they don't count them, correct? BUT my pre-med advisor said that I'd have to send the foreign transcript directly to the medical school?? Do the medical schools even ask for the foreign transcript in the secondary application?
Basically I spent my entire junior year in london taking some classes that could potentially help me later in medicine like pharmacology and some others for fun. My home school will get the grades from these and on their transcript it will say junior year abroad as the class with a number of credits earned vs attempted (essentially pass/fail). The thing is my grades from here don't come out until late july and my home school said that they prolly won't put it on their transcript till sometime in september. Can I send in my application w/o this and just put it all as current/future coursework? and lastly is there ANY way that medical schools will see these grades other than pass/fail?? b/c if they do....i might be screwed.

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[flip26]

So i have a few questions about study abroad and how it transfers etc. I did a search through these forms about how study abroad grades are included in the amcas application and it seems like they don't count them, correct? BUT my pre-med advisor said that I'd have to send the foreign transcript directly to the medical school?? Do the medical schools even ask for the foreign transcript in the secondary application?
Basically I spent my entire junior year in london taking some classes that could potentially help me later in medicine like pharmacology and some others for fun. My home school will get the grades from these and on their transcript it will say junior year abroad as the class with a number of credits earned vs attempted (essentially pass/fail). The thing is my grades from here don't come out until late july and my home school said that they prolly won't put it on their transcript till sometime in september. Can I send in my application w/o this and just put it all as current/future coursework? and lastly is there ANY way that medical schools will see these grades other than pass/fail?? b/c if they do....i might be screwed.

If you don't yet have the grades from that program and won't get them until after you submit AMCAS, I don't see any reason to list it on your AMCAS - I think it wouid create a problem for you if you list the courses taken as Spring 2010 but then put no grades.

Your issue isn't that these are from a semester abroad program. Maybe people who have the same problem with stateside grades can better explain what you put on AMCAS for spring term (probably quarter system) grades that you don't receive until after the AMCAS is submitted. What does AMCAS say to do in that situation?

I found the AMCAS telephone service to be extremely helpful. Just call and ask...

Finally, study abroad grades DO count for AMCAS if you took the classes through a US college, or through a US affiliate college - could be your home institution, or if you registered through another US college - that is how the vast majority of study abroad programs work. There is an exception, I think, for foreign coursework you took on your own, independent of a US college...

 

[MossPoh]

I did two study abroad programs. They were both in non-english speaking countries, which could change things.

Most study abroad program grades are directly transferred as an equivalent course at your home institution. In addition, most study abroad programs are THROUGH a middle-man of sorts, whether your home school or something like IES and have general assignments for grades to be transferred.

I did NOT have to send transcripts from two German universities. It would've taken forever and not done them any good since they use a different grade system there.

Unless independently taken work, you just list that you took the coursework for AMCAS but don't sweat the grades. I am going off of AMCAS from two years ago now, but that was how it worked for me.

 

[flip26]

I did two study abroad programs. They were both in non-english speaking countries, which could change things.

Most study abroad program grades are directly transferred as an equivalent course at your home institution. In addition, most study abroad programs are THROUGH a middle-man of sorts, whether your home school or something like IES and have general assignments for grades to be transferred.

I did NOT have to send transcripts from two German universities. It would've taken forever and not done them any good since they use a different grade system there.

Unless independently taken work, you just list that you took the coursework for AMCAS but don't sweat the grades. I am going off of AMCAS from two years ago now, but that was how it worked for me.

Same here. But to be clear for the OP, you still list the school on AMCAS, then check the box for "is a transcript necessary for this school" or whatever it says on AMCAS to reflect that a tranny is NOT required. The rule of thumb is that if the grades are reflected on a US college transcript, you send that tranny to AMCAS in lieu of the foreign school tranny, but no matter what, you must list the foreign school and any other US colleges as "attended" even if the grades are on your home institution tranny.

There are cases involving courses taken abroad independently of a US college - those reqs are different and I am not sure how it works.

 

[MossPoh]

I didn't even enter those classes in on mine as a different university I don't think. Once agian, it has been two years since I did it. The reason I did not enter them in as a different school was because the classes were on my transcripts from my home university and it would essentially be double entering.

 

[flip26]

I didn't even enter those classes in on mine as a different university I don't think. Once agian, it has been two years since I did it. The reason I did not enter them in as a different school was because the classes were on my transcripts from my home university and it would essentially be double entering.

Really? I guess you got away with it, because you are absolutely required to list all schools attended, and the courses taken at those schools, including study abroad schools even if you are not required to get trannies from them.

I think AMCAS is overly complicated in this area, BTW. It caused me a ton of confusion - I did 2 different abroad programs. One through my home institution, and one through another college. For that one, I had to list the other US college (and had to obtain a tranny from that college), plus I listed the foreign school. Convoluted mess - my guess is that this is one of the least understood sections of the AMCAS and that you are not alone in what you did.

 

[mdeast]

Nope. They do count them sometimes. Even if they are at a non-US affiliated foreign university.

I studied abroad in the UK. My college doesn't count my grades towards my overall GPA at my home institution, so they appear as Pass/Fail courses on my home institution transcript.

I sent along my foreign transcript direct from the UK university...which (even given the difference in grading systems....70%+=A, 60%+=B, 50%+=C, lists both my numerical grade, my English system grade (First Class, Second Class Honors, etc.) as well as a letter Grade (A,B,C, etc.). I got straight A's when I was abroad and let's just say that it was very helpful to both my cGPA and my sGPA. I think I would have gotten less interviews had they not be included...so definitely send along a transcript if they include a A/B/C/D/F grading scheme.

They definitely included them in my GPA even though my home institution does not.

 

[krs881]

Call AMCAS and do what they say. It seems to vary, even for the same exact situation. Case in point:

I applied in the 2009 cycle. I listed all my schools -- UG, Post-bac (main post-bac school plus 2 colleges I just took 1 class at each as post-bac) and UG study abroad, which was through another U.S. institution (SIT). My study abroad grades were transferred and appear in my UG transcript. Based on everything I read, I selected that my study abroad transcript was "not necessary." When amcas reviewed my app they did not say otherwise, they approved my app, and that was how it was submitted to med schools. So I never sent a study abroad transcript.

After going through the whole process and deciding on a school last year, I decided to defer med school a year. When you defer, you are required to submit your amcas application again in the following cycle (2010), just for the school you'll be attending. I think the point is for amcas and the school to know if you have taken additional classes during that year, and also so that amcas has all their stats on you for your entering class. You submit your original app from the year before as is (PS, ECs, etc) but have to send ALL your transcripts again. So, I submitted them, exactly as I did the year before. This time, much to my surprise, AMCAS reviews my app and tells me I have to submit my study abroad transcript!! I called twice and they told me the same thing both times, and that the year before had been an error!

So who knows... it really is a crap shoot. Do what they say.

 

[flip26]

Call AMCAS and do what they say. It seems to vary, even for the same exact situation. Case in point:

I applied in the 2009 cycle. I listed all my schools -- UG, Post-bac (main post-bac school plus 2 colleges I just took 1 class at each as post-bac) and UG study abroad, which was through another U.S. institution (SIT). My study abroad grades were transferred and appear in my UG transcript. Based on everything I read, I selected that my study abroad transcript was "not necessary." When amcas reviewed my app they did not say otherwise, they approved my app, and that was how it was submitted to med schools. So I never sent a study abroad transcript.

After going through the whole process and deciding on a school last year, I decided to defer med school a year. When you defer, you are required to submit your amcas application again in the following cycle (2010), just for the school you'll be attending. I think the point is for amcas and the school to know if you have taken additional classes during that year, and also so that amcas has all their stats on you for your entering class. You submit your original app from the year before as is (PS, ECs, etc) but have to send ALL your transcripts again. So, I submitted them, exactly as I did the year before. This time, much to my surprise, AMCAS reviews my app and tells me I have to submit my study abroad transcript!! I called twice and they told me the same thing both times, and that the year before had been an error!

So who knows... it really is a crap shoot. Do what they say.

What is SIT? Did you list SIT on your first app as a school attended? Based on the rules, you should have provided the transcript from SIT, not the foreign school itself, even if the grades show up on your home institution tranny. It sounds like when you sent it through this cycle, they caught the omission having overlooked it in the prior cycle. I am positive that there has been no change in the rules or how these situations are supposed to be handled in at least the last 2 years, and it is not surprising that you and someone else higher up in the thread "got away with it" because it is so confusing not only to applicants but to the AMCAS reviewers.

Who knows? I blame AMCAS for poorly explaining it in the PDF. Gave me a huge headache and I sent many emails and made many phone calls last year to get it straight.

 

[krs881]

SIT is School for International Training, which has dozens if not hundreds of study abroad programs around the world. It is a U.S. institution. I believe I listed it as a school attended, but "transcript not required." I did not have credits at any foreign institution because the SIT program is stand alone, you don't enroll at a local university. According to the amcas help section or whatever it was i was reading at the time, it appeared to me that I did not have to submit their transcript since the classes appeared on my UG transcript. I really don't remember the details of why I interpreted their instructions that way. But like you say, their instructions are not clear, and it seems like AMCAS also does not always know how to apply them!

 

[flip26]

SIT is School for International Training, which has dozens if not hundreds of study abroad programs around the world. It is a U.S. institution. I did not have credits at any foreign institution. But according to the amcas help section or whatever it was i was reading at the time, it appeared to me that I did not have to submit their transcript since the classes appeared on my UG transcript. But like you say, their instructions are not clear, and it seems like AMCAS also does not always know how to apply them!

I agree with the underlined, but the fact that the grades appeared on your home institution transcript is not the test. The US based institution through which you took the classes is the transcript they want, and evidently the first time you submitted they missed it, but they caught the error this time.

For example, as I said earlier in the thread, I did 2 study abroad programs, and in both cases, the grades appeared on my home institution tranny. But in both cases, I had to list the foreign school attended and indicate tranny not required, but for the other US college that I enrolled through, I had to list this institution as attended and transcript required - that is the same as your case, and you were required to submit it this way, but they overlooked it the first time, catching the error the second time.

I am not criticizing you, just pointing out that the rules were consistent over these cycles, and that AMCAS missed it the first time - there has been no policy change on this.

When in doubt, call AMCAS. They are very helpful.

 

[krs881]

I wish I remembered the details now... but for example I submitted the 2 transcripts that were listed on my primary post-bac institution's transcripts as transfers from other colleges. It was clear that I had to do that. But for some reason it was NOT clear that the same was required for study abroad. I wonder if the problem my be in the mix of terminology -- study abroad, foreign institution -- and that study abroad may involve either a U.S. or foreign institution transcript, or both. It seems from what you are saying, that AMCAS needs to make that difference more clear?

 

[flip26]

I wish I remembered the details now... but for example I submitted the 2 transcripts that were listed on my primary post-bac institution's transcripts as transfers from other colleges. It was clear that I had to do that. But for some reason it was NOT clear that the same was required for study abroad. I wonder if the problem my be in the mix of terminology -- study abroad, foreign institution -- and that study abroad may involve either a U.S. or foreign institution transcript, or both. It seems from what you are saying, that AMCAS needs to make that difference more clear?

That is exactly what I am saying - AMCAS is totally at fault for not explaining it well with concrete examples. The whole business of the applicant needing to check a box when the tranny is not required is stupid - the applicant can't figure out from the instructions if it is required or not.

I only got it right after talking to an AMCAS person several times. One would think they would clear this confusion up in the PDF - I bet they get a ton of questions on this very issue every year.

 

[Ashers]

I know I applied in 2004, but I had the same, I went to a school in London, I was officially enrolled there.

What I did was list each class I took at the London uni as per the London school. Then I got a copy of the transcript from my home school (since the uni had sent it to the study abroad dept) and had it included with my official home school's official transcript.

My home school listed each class from the study abroad as a pass, and it wasn't included in my GPA at all.

When I got into med school, I had to have an official transcript from each school, so then, I had to have it sent over to my med school from London.

 

[flip26]

I know I applied in 2004, but I had the same, I went to a school in London, I was officially enrolled there.

What I did was list each class I took at the London uni as per the London school. Then I got a copy of the transcript from my home school (since the uni had sent it to the study abroad dept) and had it included with my official home school's official transcript.

My home school listed each class from the study abroad as a pass, and it wasn't included in my GPA at all.

When I got into med school, I had to have an official transcript from each school, so then, I had to have it sent over to my med school from London.

Med schools compile the most complete record of your academics that they can - so for everyone who did a study abroad, you can expect that your med school will want a copy of the transcript from the foreign school even if it was not required for AMCAS. I am going to start tackling this next week...

 

[fccoppa]

Thanks for the help guys, still seems a little confusing but its def better than before. Heres the thing, I talked to my pre-med advisor and dean back home, they said i am doing an Independent attendance because there is no sponsoring institution (such as arcadia or butler) and my home school does not sponsor any study abroad programs, they are all direct enrollment. Based on this, amcas said to request a transcript exemption on the basis of foreign coursework- independent attendance- credits transferred to a US school. As for gpa I THINK i found the answer in the instruction booklet...
"Independent Attendance, Transferred
Courses attempted independently at a foreign institution must be listed if the credit has been transferred to a U.S. or Canadian institution using a credit hour system convertible to semester hours.
• Include the foreign institution and the U.S. or Canadian institution accepting transfer credit in your list of colleges attended.
• Request a transcript exception for the foreign institution. Indicate the U.S. or Canadian institution on whose transcript these transfer credits will appear.
• List foreign course work under the foreign institution at which it was attempted. • If transfer credits are not assigned to individual courses, subdivide the credit hour total as
appropriate and assign credit hours to each course. • If the U.S. or Canadian institution awarding transfer credit provides letter grades (e.g., A,
B, C, etc.) and credit hours convertible to semester hours for each course on their transcript or on an official letter attached to their transcript:
o Enter all required course data. o AMCAS will include this course work in AMCAS GPAs, regardless of institutional
policies. • If the U.S. or Canadian institution does NOT provide letter grades other than Pass/Fail:
o Indicate "Pass/Fail" as the Course Type and provide all other required course data, entering the transcript grade exactly as it appears on your official transcript.
o AMCAS will NOT include this course work in AMCAS GPAs; however, AMCAS will include this course work in cumulative Pass/Fail - Pass and Pass/Fail - Fail credit hour totals."
Because my US institution does not provide letter grades other than pass/fail, I'm pretty sure it isn't included in amcas.
As for medical schools, they said that they may ask for the transcript at the time of matriculation.
From what I gather you do not need foreign transcripts and your grades only get factored in if you go through a program like arcadia/ifsa-butler OR if your home institution converts the grades from abroad to a US scale and includes them as A, B, C on the home transcript when they are transferred.

 

[Gisele0820]

.My situation is close but a little different and the online guidance docs are not clear. .

.Fall semester of my junior year was in London but it was not “through” a foreign college. My US college sent its own profs, managed the program and graded everything just like it was here in the US. The program was basically a satellite campus. Here is the kicker: My transcript says “Study Abroad” on that semester. I am afraid it will get flagged. .

.Should I ask for a letter from my undergrad college explaining the situation to be sent with the transcript? .

.Thanks in advance for any advice. .

 

[nwdmd]

I studied abroad through International Studies Abroad, independent of any US educational institution.

I entered 'no transcript required' - 'credits transferred to home institution'

The courses transferred to home institution, but are only listed as a single credit total on official transcript (Int'l Univ - 12 quarter credits)

There aren't grades... should I just assume these are P/F credits, much like transferred AP credit from high school?

Also, I plan to break the credit down (i.e. 4x3 credit courses) the courses are listed in spanish, should I translate them (i.e. Lengua Espanola - Spanish Language)

Thank you for any tips.. I've searched forums/read through AMCAS stuff for an hour.