I am a new member and I was just interested to know how many active duty docs have disability insurance. I was Navy for 12 years and sustained an injury that damaged my spinal cord and resulted in an Erbs palsy. It ended my career because most people dont want to see a doc with a hooked, creepy looking hand. I had some pretty shameful treatment by my CoC as they were mostly concerned with RVUs rather than my health or patient safety. I always heard that no company would insure you on active duty. Is this true or was I just a ***** for not searching til I found one. I was always under the impression if you got hurt on duty you would get taken care of. It seems many folks dont undeerstand the Medical Board process, docs included. You can end up with a fraction of your usual pay as BAH and bonuses are not included in the rating. I had to file bankruptcy after leaving Navy and hope to spare others the same fate. Please do yourself a favor and consider your situation.
All Branch Topic (ABT) Survey for AD Docs, how many have Disability Insurance?
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I didn't have disability. I think a few folks found policies but they were in the substantial minority. Not to be a prick but a ****ed up hand wouldn't preclude some jobs. Go back to residency and become a shrink. You'll make a good living and help people. You're gonna die young if you sit around drinking your va check.
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Thanks forn the reply. That is what i thought. I dont think many people ever thought of this what if type scenario. No one expects to be kept fat but a junior O3 could easilyu end up with $1700 a month. Good luck if u got a family or mortgage. True about becoming shrink. Problem is the arm is just a simplification. Took a couple years to discover that brachial plexus injury caused chronic CSF leak with cranial nerve involvement. List of symptoms is pretty long but basically I am not viable working for myself and nobody would hire me if I leveled what my issues were. Multiple blood patches and intrathecal infusions of no relief. Fluid noises audible to other people can be heard out of the right side of my skull. I would have been happy staying in but as soon as you identify that you have a defect that might complicate life for your superiors you will feel the effects very soon.
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I have disability insurance, but I got it before I went on active duty. 100% service connected disability with spouse and child is currently $3,134.32, tax free. It sounds like you need to resubmit or appeal your claim if you are only getting $1700 and your disability is as bad as you state it to be. I'm sure you can find an AmVets or DAV organization that can help you navigate the system if you are having trouble.
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I checked into this, but the only company willing to insure me was Lloyd's of London at a ridiculous premium. For military physicians, I think the inability to get adequate disability insurance is a huge issue, and it'll be one of the first things I take care off once separated.
You are correct. I eventually got totaled out and I cant complain about that. The problem is the length of time that it took. The VA is just apathetic as everyone now knows. What I dont think most Navy docs know is the degree of treachery they very well might experience from their own command. In an ideal world, all would be treated the same. The irony is that the higher your rank the more directly you are tied to the HCAs beloved speadsheets and bar graphs, the more likely they will try to screw you. Your CoC should never be selecting your doctor for you. They picked the most junior doc in the hospital so they could intimidate her not to pursue a med board. It was by an accidental email that I discovered that she never even reviewed my record. It was beaten into our heads that provider health must always be reported but then you get treated like scum. All I want young docs to know is that getting hurt/sick does happen. If it does, your familys future could be in the hands of the administrator or careerist nurse that is likely running your MTF. Will they treat you like a shipmate or will they see you as hindrance to their career progression?
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1) The very first attending physician I had in residency had a robotic prosthetic arm. He took it in good humor and tried to creep out resident as a joke. He had not problems getting by in his military career as a physician.
2) You may be able to find somebody, but the premiums will be higher is you already have a medical condition.
3) You will be taken care of, but you are correct, the process is not what everybody thinks it will be. I had so many soldiers make the mistake of thinking that if they just got into the WTU, their life would be better because their unit was mistreating them. Yeah, the WTU, where they watch you take your pills from a brown paper lunch bag, tell you when you can drive, not drive, etc. Overall, treat you like you're 12 years old. "I got TBI", you know, you sir are solid evidence that the disability money is not what everybody thinks it will be. If you want to do the world a favor, do not get onto a medical forum full of medical professional with military history, we already know this stuff, preach it to the younger crowd. Let every 22 year old e-4 know that if he/she thinks that they are going to cash out on $1700 per month that they are wrong.
1. I was an eye doctor. I am very happy that you had an attending with a robotic arm. If your assertion is that someone would let me dig metal out of their cornea with a robotic or twisted arm, I think you may be incorrect. Again, the situation you describe is dependent on the willingness of your hospital executives being willing to accept your disability and open themselves up to liability.
2. Someone above reported that only Llkyods would insure at cost prohibitive premium. So I bet more than a few are relying on the Navy med board system.
3. It seems that you may be a little jaded from years of being inundated with the TBI claims. A 22 yo just wanting to "cash out" is not same as a senior officer facing the loss of a six-figure income. Especially if they still have over $100K student loans. Apples n oranges man. My thread is for just the community you speak of- mid career professionals with a WHOLE lot to lose fiscally speaking. I am not even saying we should get bigger checks. What I am saying is that there should not a double standard on when to initiate a med board based on how inconvenient it is for hospital leadership.
2. Someone above reported that only Llkyods would insure at cost prohibitive premium. So I bet more than a few are relying on the Navy med board system.
3. It seems that you may be a little jaded from years of being inundated with the TBI claims. A 22 yo just wanting to "cash out" is not same as a senior officer facing the loss of a six-figure income. Especially if they still have over $100K student loans. Apples n oranges man. My thread is for just the community you speak of- mid career professionals with a WHOLE lot to lose fiscally speaking. I am not even saying we should get bigger checks. What I am saying is that there should not a double standard on when to initiate a med board based on how inconvenient it is for hospital leadership.
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That was not my assertion at all, in fact, until know you did not provide the fact that you were an eye doctor and I certainly am not a good at guessing.
No, the military is not excited about med boarding senior officers that are medical professionals. As you have already pointed out, you are not a 22 year old E-4, so the amount of cash the Navy invested in you becoming an eye doctor is astronomical in comparison. Not to mention the vast shortage of medical professionals in the military.
On the other hand, you have to be very careful of what you wish for. If the military sends you through an MEB and considers you disabled, gives you a rating, then who in the civilian world would to hire you? For what it is worth, I am a relatively healthy person and had no pre-existing conditions whenever I applied for civilian disability insurance. I can tell you that if I had to cash in on my disability insurance tomorrow, that the monthly reimbursement pales in comparison to my monthly salary. Also, some civilian insurance companies have a waiting period before they disperse money.
As far as being jaded, truthfully I am not, I believe in Karma and we all get what we deserve in the end. I have more than once overhead soldiers coach each other as to how to obtain a formal diagnosis of PTSD and TBI so that they could boost their ratings. Yes, I sat their quietly without them knowing that I was listening or knowing who I was. Hey, we all have a concsious and we all know what is right and wrong. Once these guys bankrupt the VA system, which by the way is doing a bang up job with their reputation in the press these days, they will only hurt themselves. The only anger that I have is the fact that these types ruin it for men and women that really need it. I suppose that was the moral of my rant earlier, because the system is unreliable (and when was it ever?) and there are those out there ruining it for everybody else, then we simply cannot rely on the military to take care of our needs. Sad? Perhaps? But unfortunately a truth the affects individuals like yourself and I am sorry for your experience.
I suppose my only advise, which somebody already sort of gave you, would be to cash in on your 911 GI Bill and go back and re-train in a medical profession that does not require mechanical aptitude. If you are already an eye doctor, then you posess a wealth of knowledge to share with others and can make a smooth transition.
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I have a disability policy through the AMA. They limit the available coverage to AD physicians, but it's very inexpensive.
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+1 to this
I'm sorry to hear all of this happened to you, but your story isn't much different than any other person who's suffered a life-altering injury, in or out of the military, whether a highly educated professional or an undocumented immigrant gardener.
You're actually in better shape than most people would be. You have an education and a path to retraining to a high income, GI Bill benefits, and some kind of disability benefit from the military.
When Juan the gardener slips a disc, he's done.
Sorry to hear you had terrible leaders. Move on, live well. You've got a lifetime of meaningful work ahead of you, if you want it and take it.
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And giving away as many details as you've done here, is probably not a good idea. If your chain really doesn't like you, this thread will certainly help their case. You'd be wise to stop posting such details here and to seek a lawyers advice
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I've had the policy about 4-5 years now. There was a premium discount for members so I joined. I've since cancelled my membership but still have the policy.
It's pretty limited for AD physicians. Max benefit $2500/month, and only for 5 years. I elected a 1-year exclusion period, figuring that for at least that time the Navy would still be paying me my normal salary. Premium is dirt cheap. Not a great policy but better than nothing.
I figured if I needed it, the $2500/month would be a big help during the years right after I got med boarded out, when I was retraining in another specialty.
AD physicians have a disability policy equivalent that's implicit in service (med retirement) but I think most of us would agree that it's not really enough for physicians. Inability to get a good own-occ policy from a major insurer while on AD is a real problem, because the price goes way up as you get older and pick up a condition or two. It's a disadvantage to service for sure.
I looked long and hard, direct and through two brokers, and the best I could do was the small AMA policy.
It really is simple. All I wanted was my command to follow established instructions. To leave someone on limited duty and a plan of supervision for almost two years is just not appropriate. Not fair to service member or to patients. The medical community should not want damaged, non-deployable providers hanging around anyway. What rubs is the associations you have made to all the gamers with TBI and PTSD. I didnt wake up almost 40 yo and decide to become a malingerer to seek a med board. If you got MS next month, would peoples actions match their words. My gaining command had the option to accept my PCS or not. They could have left me at my old command where everyone knew me and people might not have jumped to conclusions. If they take you its with knowledge you are damaged goods and they need to accept responsibility.
BTW, I was a direcxt accession. Navy did not spend a dime on education. Sent me to MANDEV and CE but thats is it. Its great that some of you have the impression that the vast majority will be willing to work with you even if its a headache for them. You may have a great CO. Will your next be as good?? This string is a public service announcemnt to the military medical community. In those years, maybe 4-12, when you are doing the little pro/con sheet to decide to stay or not, you ever considered this?? If not, maybe you will in the future.
Agreed, but I am already gone. This is in some part bitter venting I will admit but my intention was to get those of you who may still be helped thinking and talking about it. I am not an urban legend, it can happen to you. It sounds like some have considered their risks and some havent.
As I have mentioned, my isssue is not about $ amounts as much as it is about delay. My initial rating took two years and over three to get it hammered out. During that time you are just on TDRL/PDRL which will likely be under $2000 a month. Everyones sitch is different and if you got savings or spouse with a good income you may do okay. I have just read some of the things that people have wrote like this should cover me for x period of time.......Thesse were the type of false impressions that made me think I was covered as well. Just as an example everyone is under the belief that people are tripping over themselves to hire vets. Not so much. I went to the county vet rep with a pamphlet on vetwork program. The guy leans over and tells me just cuz there is a shiny pamphlet doesnt mean the program exists. I have submitted over 30 apps ranging from teacher to parking lot attendant. I have been called twice and never offered a job. This is the reality you need to be preparing for.
It sounds like you at least got your head up and had thought about it. More than I did. I lloked into a a couple companies and just figured the Navy must have some way to handle it. That policy would definitely help. When placed on TDRL/PDRL its only 50% base pay or higher if rated over 50%. The board usually gives 30% rating just to get you out the door so its a crap shoot. Many peolpe have mentioned just retraining but what if you get totally F ed and there aint no income down the road? You are right that it is an issue. I know it may not give an egalitarian optic but maybe corp leaders should investigate that the disability system for someone that lost a career at Jiffylube might not fit for a medical specialist.
D
DocRGR
Standard will insure AD physicians, but you must be in residency with at least 6 months left.
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Interesting. Wonder if fellowship counts?
I feel your pain about striking out at low-level jobs. I have also applied to work at Target, Walmart, etc and been denied. I think it has more to do with the HR algorithms than you.
But I don't buy that there isn't a long list of employers willing to hire a doctorate level, disabled Army officer or at least tell you "Go get X degree with your GI Bill and we'll hire you for Y position." To be sure, some of this "supporting veterans" language is platitudinous nonsense, but a great deal of it is not.
http://www.boozallen.com/insights/better-our-world/supporting-veterans
http://www.jobs.nih.gov/veterans/
http://www.federaljobs.net/disabled.htm
http://www.ge.com/careers/culture/us-veterans
http://www.caci.com/job/vets.shtml
http://www.l-3com.com/careers/transitioning-military.html
http://www.saic.com/about/join-us/for-military-professionals/
http://www.dyn-intl.com/about-di/commitment-to-veterans/
http://www.mayo-clinic-jobs.com/go/US-Military-Veterans-Jobs/325822/
I am sure I will find something eventually. Thank you BTW that must have taken a bit of time to coolect the sites. I have been lookin through them. Maybe some VA hosppital spots opening soon. The problem is what flavor disability you have. I am NOT saying I would rathee be missing a leg but brain issues are so variable that I think it scares employers. I dont know how I am going to be from hour to hour. Every time I am faced with not divulging anything or giving them some idea of what to expedt. It wont be a few days until them see something isnt right. That is important for folks to remeber, you dont get to pick what happens to you. When dealing with risk managemnet, take off rose colored glassses and put on poop googles. You will be better prepared. I think many are in the boat I was. Spouse had an English degree and very limited earning potential because they rae following us and our careers. Everyone pays $200/mo the insure the BMWbut the most valuable asset, future earnings, are only covered maybe 20%. Another stirng talking about choice of firearms on deployment. lol. I guess there is a reason few if any companies will insure active duty.
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No, I disagree. It doesn't make any sense. Most life insurance excludes payment for suicide for at least a couple years. Most homeowners insurance has a standard clause that ACTS OF WAR are not covered. There's no reason that a disability policy couldn't simply exclude injuries sustained in a war zone. In CONUS a military doctor is at no more risk than any other doctor.
For sure they could underwrite policy with exclusions but I dont know if folks will sleep any better with a policy loaded with fine print. Their actuaries have determined the military population is just not worth the risk. It is a bad situation and I dont know if there is anything to do about it. Maybe just find what policies do exist to give a little more coverage and then just be aware of your exposure. My main point was just to get people to think on the matter and maybe discuss with your new docs. I just think many have not thought about it for more than a fleeting couple minutes and then got back to their day.
