Tell Me About This Quitting Thing....

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anonymousername

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I see a surprising number of posts by med students and residents talking about quitting and being depressed. This forum seemed a little slow compared to the premed one, so if you don't mind me asking...

why, specifically does it suck?

when the compensation gets better (both salary and lifestyle) for your work, do you think that you will like it any more?

do you regret going into medicine?

are you still interested in medicine? should your interest dictate your career choice?

what were your motivations for going into medicine? was it primarily "helping people"?

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Intern year - a life that consists of little more than eating, sleep deprivation, and working almost every waking hour in many if not most programs - is essentially indentured servitude, and a prescription for despair. Who wouldn't feel like quitting? Fortunately things tend to improve with each year of residency. I've met plenty of happy residents and even more happy attendings. Even interns can have a positive attitude but it's not easy...
 
I agree with what humu has to say.

My own take on things is that there is a LOT that has to do with expectations as you go into it. I have a very good friend working 90-110 hrs/wk as a surgical intern at the same institution as I'm at, and he's happy - only wants to get to the gym more. But he expected to be getting killed (hours-wise), and the nurses and ancillary staff are a lot nicer here that at his medical school. I'm a Nervous-Nelly, and I expected to be getting creamed, yelled at, assulted physically and emotionally AND working a lot of hours. Things might be bad (although I suspect not), but they're BETTER than I expected...MUCH MUCH BETTER. So from that point of view, life is great.

There is something to be said for the "culture" of a place; I think it's really difficult to feel that out when ranking programs. What is the place committed to doing? Workign you? Teaching you? I asked about educational policies at every interview, and I asked about remediation policies as well. If the remediation policy was "after two bad ITE scores, you're fired/not promoted", that was a red flag. What was the "feel"? The only place I interviewed at that did not make my final ROL was a place where the residents looked unhappy...their body language spoke volumes, etc. THAT'S the kind of stuff I tell applicants to look out for, and to ask about, and to get a "sense" of.

Who knows if I'm right, or if my tune will change. Right now though, this residency thing has been a good $100,000 investment.

dc
 
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The most depressing part is the sacrifice of friends, family, and outside interests that make you feel like a normal person. It gets old. When you start to see how much your relationships/friendships have changed as a result of this journey and you begin to question whether the sacrifice was worth it.

I'm married with a kid and my time off is totally devoted to my family. Sometimes the lack of "me time" weighs heavy but I am just not willing to let my most important relationships suffer more than they have to.

It is a different hard than I anticipated.
 
...
It is a different hard than I anticipated.

I think this is a very common mantra. Working 80 hours a week sounds better in theory than practice. Having only one day off per week doesn't sound so bad on paper. Getting yelled at for things that didn't get done the way an attending wanted but never conveyed, but never getting a pat on the back for things that went well despite the odds, gets very old after a few months. Not to mention all the overnight calls. It's something you can really appreciate only when you get there. You learn a lot, you hone a lot of defense and coping mechanisms, and sleep anytime, anywhere you get the chance. Not really living the life, even if you don't hate what you are doing. Fortunately intern year goes by very fast and there's a light at the end of the tunnel.
 
LOL
The light at the end of the tunnel is simply NOT being an intern any more. Thus you are not the lowest one on the totem pole, and your hours tend to get a little better (well, if you're not doing surgical residency) and the stuff you have to do tends to get a little more interesting as opposed to more scut and note writing.
 
LOL
The light at the end of the tunnel is simply NOT being an intern any more. Thus you are not the lowest one on the totem pole, and your hours tend to get a little better (well, if you're not doing surgical residency) and the stuff you have to do tends to get a little more interesting as opposed to more scut and note writing.

that sounds terrible...
 
Internship was thusfar the worst year of my life. There were few days when I didn't feel like quitting for all the reasons above. Residency has been light years better.

I went into medicine because I wanted to help people. I mean, isn't that why we all did it? :)
 
For some of us, dealing with patients gets very unpleasant. Patients are becoming more demanding, and more unreasonable.

One thing I found pretty distasteful is the complete lack of control I have over my workday. Most of my workday consists of meeting other people's demands on their timeframe.

There are plenty of other posts about why people are dissatisfied. The bottom line is that, you can't know what it's like and if you can tolerate the BS until you are too far into it to quit. Given how much debt most of us incur, if we don't like it, we are trapped, as there are very limited options to make enough money to make the student loan payments. And, for me anyway, that just exacerbates the dissatisfaction.
 
One thing I found pretty distasteful is the complete lack of control I have over my workday. Most of my workday consists of meeting other people's demands on their timeframe.

Let me guess...you've never had a full-time job outside of being a student or residency, have you?

Newsflash Sunshine. Essentially every job out there (barista, corporate lawyer, surgery intern, president of Goldman Sachs, custodian, rock star, drug dealer, ER attending, hooker, senior Senator from New York, whatever) requires meeting someone else's demands on their timeframe. The major difference is the scale of the timeframe (minutes --> years).

Residency is exhausting/frustrating because the timeframe we're talking about is minutes to hours and the days feel neverending because of that.

But every job, even the most chill, has a timeframe, and deadlines, and a boss (or 13) that needs to be appeased. Even those "at the top" (of whatever) have somebody to answer to.
 
Let me guess...you've never had a full-time job outside of being a student or residency, have you?

Newsflash Sunshine. Essentially every job out there (barista, corporate lawyer, ..., president of Goldman Sachs, custodian, rock star, drug dealer, ER attending, hooker, senior Senator from New York, whatever) requires meeting someone else's demands on their timeframe. The major difference is the scale of the timeframe (minutes --> years).

Residency is exhausting/frustrating because the timeframe we're talking about is minutes to hours and the days feel neverending because of that.

But every job, even the most chill, has a timeframe, and deadlines, and a boss (or 13) that needs to be appeased. Even those "at the top" (of whatever) have somebody to answer to.

Sure. But in very few jobs are you required to stay in the same building all day (or night) and be at someone's beck and call by pager at all times. In some of the jobs that you described you can disappear for a while, run an errand, take care of things offsite and stop for lunch while doing it, dodge phone calls of people you aren't anxious to talk to yet, call in sick (when you are), even telecommute etc., so long as things get done by the "hard" deadlines. It's not always that way in medicine -- you have to attend to this NOW and then you have to attend to this NOW, and so on. And if you don't call back promptly you are gonna hear about it. And people don't always behave professionally and will give you a tongue lashing just because they can.
 
In addition to L2D's comments above, given that notinkansas comes from a surgical residency, I might interpret her comment also reflects the total lack of control that comes with that type of residency.

One of the hardest things for me was that I could never make plans...I had no idea what time I would be leaving, whether I could make dinner plans with friends, if I'd be home to celebrate my birthday with my BF, etc. So in addition to meeting other's demands, the lack of control, unpredictability and knowledge about when you might actually see some sunshine can be terribly frustrating (even to those of us who had other careers before).
 
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Let me guess...you've never had a full-time job outside of being a student or residency, have you?

Newsflash Sunshine

And you base this assumption on what? That I am regret going into medicine? You are dead wrong. And as someone who has generally tried to post helpful posts in a respectful manner, I also don't appreciate the derogatory tone of your post.

Actually, I started medical school in my late 30's. It took me two tries to get in. I worked 2 jobs (one FT, one PT) while taking classes part time and going to a MCAT review course in the immediate time period before getting accepted to medical school. Prior to that, I worked a number of jobs. And I overcame a major illness that actually put me on disability for a 5 year period from about age 26-31. I will not go into the details because it will identify me. But before I qualified for disability, I was sick and had to work and I dragged myself in to work sick many times (even before I started medical school)

I've done more, and overcome more than most people can imagine. In fact, I've been though more, with a better attitude, than many of my patients!

I wanted to be a doctor all my life. When circumstances allowed, I did everything i could to achieve my goal. I was highly motivated in medical school, sometimes running circles around my younger counterparts. I even worked a very part time job during medical school.

Law2Doc and Winged scapula make the point that the degree of lack of control over one's workday is NOT the same as it is in other types of jobs. (and I appreciate that!!) While I have certainly disliked some of the jobs I have had, in no other job have i felt the life being sucked out of me the way it as a doctor. I posted elsewhere on this, but it is best described as "altruistic self destruction" (i didn't coin that term, but I've adopted it- because it perfectly describes my feelings)

The great irony is that I wanted to be a doctor so bad for so much of my life, and now I hate it more than I've ever hated anything that I have done. Be careful what you wish for. You might get it.
 
And you base this assumption on what? That I am regret going into medicine? You are dead wrong. And as someone who has generally tried to post helpful posts in a respectful manner, I also don't appreciate the derogatory tone of your post.

Actually, I started medical school in my late 30's. It took me two tries to get in. I worked 2 jobs (one FT, one PT) while taking classes part time and going to a MCAT review course in the immediate time period before getting accepted to medical school. Prior to that, I worked a number of jobs. And I overcame a major illness that actually put me on disability for a 5 year period from about age 26-31. I will not go into the details because it will identify me. But before I qualified for disability, I was sick and had to work and I dragged myself in to work sick many times (even before I started medical school)

I've done more, and overcome more than most people can imagine. In fact, I've been though more, with a better attitude, than many of my patients!

I wanted to be a doctor all my life. When circumstances allowed, I did everything i could to achieve my goal. I was highly motivated in medical school, sometimes running circles around my younger counterparts. I even worked a very part time job during medical school.

Law2Doc and Winged scapula make the point that the degree of lack of control over one's workday is NOT the same as it is in other types of jobs. (and I appreciate that!!) While I have certainly disliked some of the jobs I have had, in no other job have i felt the life being sucked out of me the way it as a doctor. I posted elsewhere on this, but it is best described as "altruistic self destruction" (i didn't coin that term, but I've adopted it- because it perfectly describes my feelings)

The great irony is that I wanted to be a doctor so bad for so much of my life, and now I hate it more than I've ever hated anything that I have done. Be careful what you wish for. You might get it.


Agree. :thumbup:
 
I'm soooo looking forward to being done with intern year. It's close to the worst year of my life, but that was actually the work I did before med school when I was a phlebotomist while living at home. I hated every day at work all 40h/week. There's only been 1 month here that was worse than any given month working as a vampire. I'm glad I have the skill, but there's no way I'd ever repeat that year again... I'd repeat intern year again if forced to pick between the 2.

I wouldn't think about quitting because I'd be too bored. I need to be doing something, and medicine is what fit.
 
notinkansas,
maybe you just need a different specialty. Surgery is cool, but they just work too damn much. I mean, I work a LOT, but surgical residency is worse. Also, I think the unrelenting pressure is worse, and the lack of control is worse.

guton,
don't see why you felt the need to pile on to notinkansas. We're in IM...it's not the same, although for sure I've gotten my a-- kicked from time to time.

I think from my point of view, the lack of control over my life and work day has been the worse (i.e. the getting yelled at for stuff I didn't do, and never being able to make plans b/c I didn't know when I'd actually be getting home, etc.). I've never minded the work itself, and most of the time I like it a lot. And yes, I did go into medicine b/c I wanted to help people. The problem is, the "helping people" and "learning stuff" parts of your day can be smaller than you expect as a resident, particularly as a PGY1.
 
I was pretty miserable from my second year of med school on (although 4th year was pretty great). I kept waiting for things to get better. When internship came and I was the most unhappy I'd ever been, I wished I could go back in time and talk my younger self out of going to med school. I really, really hated my life.

But then I quit that residency, switched specialties to PM&R, and actually found that I enjoyed my work. I've had bad days of course, but generally I've found residency to be a good experience. Plus I've had a pretty close approximation of an 8 to 5 kind of schedule with most weekends off. That's why I don't go around bashing medicine anymore. I believe that there are SO many specialties out there, including possibilities for research and academics, there is an option out there that would probably be a good fit for any given person. If I, the most miserable intern on the planet, found a good fit, I think other people could do it too.
 
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So, I will try to actually answer each of your questions as best I can. I am nearing the end of intern year and found it generally quite depressing. It does have its good moments though, and the job description in and of itself is better than being a medical student, I think.

why, specifically does it suck?
--The hours really are outrageous, and there is no rest for the weary. You may be q4 as a med student but there is some downtime generally where you can disappear and maybe get lunch or something
--People are mean to you. Nurses, attendings, sometimes patients/families and sometimes senior residents but more often it's the first two that can really make you miserable.
--People often move to an unfamiliar city for residency. This is generally an awful idea b/c it's nearly impossible to meet people and get a social life started while an intern. This probably depresses me more than my job itself.
--You still do a lot of scut work. Sure, you can write orders, but the downside of that is...that you can write orders. And nurses who don't work 30 hours straight call at 4 am when you've been there since 6 am the previous day to ask, "uhm, so I was flipping through the chart of this patient you're cross-covering, and wonder if you could clarify this order...?"
--It's often a thankless job. You get told that you look too young to be a doctor, patient would like to talk to someone more senior, etc. And it's insulting to write notes for attendings when you've been up for 28 hours straight...I managed this patient for you all night and got stuck at the bedside for 3 hours, write your own f*king note!
--You often don't know what you're doing, and people get mad at you for it. If I could change one thing about med school it would be to spend more time talking about G-tubes and PICC lines and Port-a-caths and all this bull$hit medical equipment that gorked-out wards patients (both adult and pediatric) have in abundance...and much less time talking about the Krebs cycle. You realize that a lot of what you learned in med school wasn't all that useful, and now people expect you to know things that you really never learned much about. I don't know the first f*cking thing about advancing or holding feeds in gorked CP kids who can't stop vomiting...but guess what I get paged about every 5 seconds on peds wards call?

when the compensation gets better (both salary and lifestyle) for your work, do you think that you will like it any more?
--I would like to think the answer is yes. You have more control over what it is that you actually do in terms of specialization. Even if you are a generalist, you can tailor your focus to a certain population. There is a general pediatrician here who focuses on primary care of kids with complex congenital heart disease or kids who've had heart transplants. Personally, i'd rather shoot myself in the face, but it goes to show how much you can really tailor your life and what you see. You can see what you really enjoy. Whereas on wards you have NO control whatsoever over who you admit or manage. Besides, I don't see too many attendings who seem to hate life. I do, however, see a LOT of interns who seem miserable. I have faith that things will get better, we all have to pay our dues.

do you regret going into medicine?
--No, but that may be because I don't know any better. I went straight through everything and started internship at 25. I worked before this but that's b/c I was a poor kid from Nevada so my other "work" jobs were waiting tables, working at petsmart, a brief stint as a catalog model when i used to be cute, etc. I don't know what it would actually be like to have another skilled "professional" job.

are you still interested in medicine? should your interest dictate your career choice?
--Well I think no one would go into medicine who wasn't at least somewhat interested by it. It's simply too much work if you don't find the material interesting, at least in theory. I liked the theory behind medicine so much that I almost went into Pathology, because I knew that the practice of it sucked quite a bit. However, I have found that the thing that makes it suck (at least for me) isn't the patients or families. It's the system and the higher-ups and the ancillary staff and the hospital policies that suck. I do like the patients and families, and I would imagine this would be an even crappier job for someone that didn't.

what were your motivations for going into medicine? was it primarily "helping people"
--There are a lot of ways to help people. You'd be pretty hard-pressed to argue that teachers, nurses, social workers, firefighters, etc don't "help people". I think if we're honest with ourselves there was a part about the feeling of prestige and importance that motivated many of us. Otherwise, why aren't we social workers instead of psychiatrists? Or teachers instead of pediatricians? Because we wanted to be important and powerful, that's why. And there isn't necessarily anything wrong with that, I think it's just something that's hard for many to admit. You'll never convince me that there aren't professions whose members "help people" at least as much if not more than physicians.

Well those are my answers, take em for what they're worth. I'm a half-bitter intern at the end of a very hard year. Best of luck with wherever you are in your search or in this very, very long process....
 
...
why, specifically does it suck?
--The hours really are outrageous, and there is no rest for the weary. You may be q4 as a med student but there is some downtime generally where you can disappear and maybe get lunch or something
--People are mean to you. Nurses, attendings, sometimes patients/families and sometimes senior residents but more often it's the first two that can really make you miserable.
--People often move to an unfamiliar city for residency. This is generally an awful idea b/c it's nearly impossible to meet people and get a social life started while an intern. This probably depresses me more than my job itself.
--You still do a lot of scut work. Sure, you can write orders, but the downside of that is...that you can write orders. And nurses who don't work 30 hours straight call at 4 am when you've been there since 6 am the previous day to ask, "uhm, so I was flipping through the chart of this patient you're cross-covering, and wonder if you could clarify this order...?"
--It's often a thankless job. You get told that you look too young to be a doctor, patient would like to talk to someone more senior, etc. And it's insulting to write notes for attendings when you've been up for 28 hours straight...I managed this patient for you all night and got stuck at the bedside for 3 hours, write your own f*king note!
--You often don't know what you're doing, and people get mad at you for it. If I could change one thing about med school it would be to spend more time talking about G-tubes and PICC lines and Port-a-caths and all this bull$hit medical equipment that gorked-out wards patients (both adult and pediatric) have in abundance...and much less time talking about the Krebs cycle. You realize that a lot of what you learned in med school wasn't all that useful, and now people expect you to know things that you really never learned much about. I don't know the first f*cking thing about advancing or holding feeds in gorked CP kids who can't stop vomiting...but guess what I get paged about every 5 seconds on peds wards call?
....

I agree with all of the above negatives, and yet I didn't think the year was that bad. Maybe it's because I'm coming from a demanding prior career and so my expectation levels were different than most (and because I had a sense of what working 80 hours/week feels like), but a lot of internship was actually interesting and fun, just too much of it, and you are too tired all the time to appreciate it. Sort of like eating ice cream. You might like ice cream, but if you are asked to eat gallons of ice cream all the time, even for 30 hours in a row, you will have a hard time appreciating ice cream any more.
 
Ok, internship is not anything like eating ice cream, in fact it is the exact opposite. The only commonality is that both cause weight gain.
 
Internship isn't that bad. I mean, sure when you're on wards you'll probably average 70-80 hours per week. But on short call or precall days we routinely get out by 3PM. A lot of what makes people depressed I think is that they don't connect with their cointerns and feel isolated. Friends and coworkers can keep you buoyed on days that drag. On one elective I got 13 days off over the month so there are some programs that let you rest between call months. I didn't do it, but I hear nightfloat is a bear...
 
I'm glad I have the skill, but there's no way I'd ever repeat that year again...

As a former phleb, I feel comfortable saying there is no more universally reviled set of workers in the hospital than a phlebotomist. The patients are nearly never happy to see you, the staff never seems to be happy to see you and the docs on the other end of the phone who want whatever they want aren't happy that it hasn't magically happened 5 mins prior to them ordering it. The PTs on the ortho floors are probably a close second, but in 2.5 years of stickin' people, I can count one hand how many folks were actually happy to see me. Thankfully, I learned to set little achievable goals for each interaction with patients because of my time as a phleb, but man, there were days when it was really easy to hate the job. It probably doesn't help that people always identify you with the "lab;" as such, any complaints they have about the lab are directed at you, no matter what level of involvement you have with the problem.
 
Internship isn't that bad. I mean, sure when you're on wards you'll probably average 70-80 hours per week. But on short call or precall days we routinely get out by 3PM. A lot of what makes people depressed I think is that they don't connect with their cointerns and feel isolated. Friends and coworkers can keep you buoyed on days that drag. On one elective I got 13 days off over the month so there are some programs that let you rest between call months. I didn't do it, but I hear nightfloat is a bear...

You have to bear in mind that not all specialties or programs have non-call months, electives or something called short call or precall days where you leave early. This is program specific and not found everywhere.
 
You have to bear in mind that not all specialties or programs have non-call months, electives or something called short call or precall days where you leave early. This is program specific and not found everywhere.

Very true. While this is common in IM programs (and Peds to a lesser extent) it's virtually non-existent in surgical specialties.
 
Ok, internship is not anything like eating ice cream, in fact it is the exact opposite. The only commonality is that both cause weight gain.

Beg to differ. You feel like crap after a 30 hour stint of it in both cases. It can make you feel sick, slow, tired, nauseus. There are times you enjoy it, but you certainly don't enjoy it all of the time. There are a variety of different "flavors" of residency, much as there are different flavors of ice cream. And you often come home with stained clothes and sticky hands in either case. Pretty much the same.:laugh:
 
Ok, internship is not anything like eating ice cream, in fact it is the exact opposite. The only commonality is that both cause weight gain.

I became so depressed when i started residency that I just declined to eat anymore and lost 30 lbs in about 3 months. The morbidly obese should just do internship! It works wonders....
 
I became so depressed when i started residency that I just declined to eat anymore and lost 30 lbs in about 3 months. The morbidly obese should just do internship! It works wonders....

except the stress eating ones ;)
 
This entire thread is a perfect example of why us shrinks are laughing at those other physicians who denegrate our profession. 55-60 hrs per week when not on med ward rotations, q22 call from PGY2-4, q10 call during intern year. Sure, we may not be, "real" doctors, but I'll have plenty of free time at home with my family to lament about it. ;)
 
Sure, we may not be, "real" doctors, but I'll have plenty of free time at home with my family to lament about it. ;)

oh no he di'int

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Tell someone about this quitting thing?

I have no idea what that means in regard to working in medicine. I love the job. Every day I was in the clinical environment, I loved it even more. But it has been well established I wax poetic and I am a bit of a romantic.

Perhaps it is because internship didn't suck as bad as when I did student rotations in 2000 (time off for illness and research, didn't finish school until 2006.) I know even as students we clocked in 110+ hours, on both medicine and surgery. I chose a surgery internship as I did better in that environment, and I didn't want to disturb medicine lectures with my turbo-powered-chainsaw-like snoring. (my experience is they are worse on hour violations than surgeons...may not be true, but it was my luck of the draw.)

I prepared for the worst. I kept flashing back to images of my time in basic training with drill instructors screaming at the training flight and myself all the livelong day. I drew upon my the experience of being constantly hounded for attention to detail under screaming and sleep deprivation in boot. As someone who taught Advance Crisis Resource Management, I expect worst-case scenarios; they can and do happen when you least expect it.

I was more than pleasantly surprised when I found out the intern year I had was actually pretty bloody good.

What gets you through intern year, and sets you up for success if that program is where you are going to be for 3, 4, 5, or 8 years?

1. Realize you are lower than whale droppings at the bottom of the ocean. Doesn't matter if you were AOA, if you are an MD/PhD. You just got dumped into a bigger pond, and here there be monsters.

2. Keep your ego at home. Ego wars do nothing beneficial. They just burn bridges. Don't get into them. Period. I saw it with a surgery intern when I was a 2nd year. And despite, trying to talk to him (myself, seniors, and attendings,) he kept flaming people, thinking his way was the right way, which is a good way to get patients dead in bad ways. it was to the point when we were both on call, I was called when he was.

3. A quote from Bridge on the River Kwai: "There is always one last thing." Always realize you are always forgetting something. Double check yourself. Make sure if it was forgotten, correct it.

4. To quote Patrick Swayze from the movie Roadhouse (and yes, I am dating myself,) "Be nice." The angst you are spreading around by being an ass is going to come back and bite you in sensitive spots, like your evaluations, especially if your programs do 360 evals. It's unprofessional, and in the end, extremely stupid on your behalf. You are paid the same for being nice as you are being angry. Angry takes more energy. Keep your energy expenditure low. Be nice.

5. Always see the patient if paged, even if it is to renew the medication that expired at 5pm that afternoon. If the person paging you says the patient is in extremis, *run* to see them. Even if that patient was fine 5 minutes ago, doesn't mean he still is. And even if the patient is fine, I would rather have the nurses and support staff over call something and be wrong than under call a bad situation.

6. See what can be done earlier in the call. Meds that expire at midnight? Renew them at 5pm when you have time. Little things like missed renewals cause unnecessary angst later in the evening, as those pages come just as your head hits the pillow.

7. Realize you are over your head. Never be afraid to call for help. Good upper levels on call with you should never leave you hanging. They may whine and complain a bit for calling, but they would rather you call them than not. Even in later in the year, realize that declaring your ignorance and calling for backup will not only save your patient from harm, but save you from being on your PD director's carpet explaining what you were doing going by the seat of your pants, killing your career before it has even started.

Even veteran attendings haven't seen it all. You have seen a lot less than that.


Fellow residents and attendings, please add, modify, or correct as needed based on your experiences. These are based on personal experiences and me being used to things hitting the fan in the most spectacularly nasty ways.
 
This entire thread is a perfect example of why us shrinks are laughing at those other physicians who denegrate our profession. 55-60 hrs per week when not on med ward rotations, q22 call from PGY2-4, q10 call during intern year. Sure, we may not be, "real" doctors, but I'll have plenty of free time at home with my family to lament about it. ;)

So not my shrink schedule, which is still admittedly much better than what the non-shrink people are doing, but still. Our psych rotations have q4 to q5 call first and second year. :( q10 would be awesome.
 
This entire thread is a perfect example of why us shrinks are laughing at those other physicians who denegrate our profession. 55-60 hrs per week when not on med ward rotations, q22 call from PGY2-4, q10 call during intern year. Sure, we may not be, "real" doctors, but I'll have plenty of free time at home with my family to lament about it. ;)


Ophtho residency -- avg 40-45 hrs/week, M-F, call is q3weeks FROM HOME (most days you don't get paged). Usual work day 7:30am-4:30pm. :p
 
5. Always see the patient if paged, even if it is to renew the medication that expired at 5pm that afternoon.

Are you saying I should see every patient about whom I'm paged during every cross-cover call? In my program we do admissions while we cross-cover, so I would never get all my work done if I didn't use discretion in deciding which patients to go see. I have a low threshold for going to see patients, which always entails writing yet another note, but damn, I don't get all the work done as it is at this early stage of the internship game. I can only do one thing at a time and feel as though I have too much responsibility for a single person, but I hope & pray it doesn't irreversibly harm a patient this year.

I agree with the poster above who suggested internship is a great strategy for those who need to lose weight. I have so little time to eat that my pants are swimming on me these days. I inhale a good breakfast, but I can't seem to take in enough calories to maintain my weight, which has never been a problem in the past. The act of eating has become more mechanical & pressured than pleasurable for me. More often than not, dinner happens on my commute home and even then only because I don't want to waste my SO's culinary efforts by letting his delicious & healthy grab-and-go food rot. Without that food around I'd forget to eat.

On a positive note, at least I can rock a bikini now. Too bad I have zero time to go to a pool or beach. Do any of the new interns here really manage to stay within the 80 hour limit? :confused:
 
Ophtho residency -- avg 40-45 hrs/week, M-F, call is q3weeks FROM HOME (most days you don't get paged). Usual work day 7:30am-4:30pm. :p

I like your ophtho residency better than mine. We avg around 55 hrs per week and are on call every 6th day from home. Usual call you go on at least once during the week and probably work ~12 hrs for a Sat or Sun.

Granted still a lot better than intern year pulling 80\wk and in house call
 
Seriously? What year of residency are you in? Also, I assume that you are the exception rather than the norm for residencies in your specialty, right?

Ophtho residency -- avg 40-45 hrs/week, M-F, call is q3weeks FROM HOME (most days you don't get paged). Usual work day 7:30am-4:30pm. :p
 
Seriously? What year of residency are you in? Also, I assume that you are the exception rather than the norm for residencies in your specialty, right?

PGY-3.

Actually most ophtho residencies probably avg 45-55 hours/week.

The minute you step away from the hectic environment of the hospital and into out-patient specialties you realize how much nicer your day-to-day becomes.

Lifestyle is one of the biggest draws of ophtho.
 
Ophtho residency -- avg 40-45 hrs/week, M-F, call is q3weeks FROM HOME (most days you don't get paged). Usual work day 7:30am-4:30pm. :p

This post is pure, inexhaustible beauty. Martin Heidegger would have had to invent a word for it.

I will keep it forever and use it to combat my mortal fear of residency, ensuring that I study hard and stay on the ROAD to happiness.:)
 
Update on having control over one's workday..

As I have posted on in other threads, I have now left clinical medicine. I was recruited by a consulting firm. No, I don't have a MBA nor do i have any business experience. What I do have is a friend who works for this firm, who knows someone that heads up a subdivision in the Health Industry Advisory sector of this firm. That subdivision is crazy busy with work and is actively hiring clinical people. They are willing to teach all the other aspects if they feel you are a good fit for the firm.

So how is my life different now? I do have a lot more control over how I structure my workday. I can come in to the office pretty much when I want, and leave when I want (within reason) I can go to lunch when I want. I can go get starbucks when I want. It's considered acceptable to go to your kid's soccer game, or make a commitment to be home for dinner at X time, or enroll in a class to learn something fun, as long as you get your work done by the deadlines. Some people choose to stay in the office later to finish and not take anything home. Others choose to go home earlier, spend time with the family, then do some more work after the kids are in bed.

There is travel involved, so obviously those days I don't have as much control. Still, I was able to visit a friend who lives in another city when I went to a client site.

What's the other difference? I'm surrounded by smart, highly motivated people who go out of their way to add value. Nobody refuses to do anything, nobody tries to push anyone else around. I've never had anybody demand that I do something RIGHT NOW. In fact, I'm pretty much always asked if I am available to do X, or would I mind helping with Y. And I'm thanked for my efforts regularly. It's a so much more pleasant environment.

It's not for everybody. But i have learned that I have a very low tolerance for dealing with the general public (which is what patients are) I'm much happier sitting at a desk playing with Excel while drinking a latte. I interact with my colleagues in terms of planing and discussing work, but my actual work is done solo. Definitely suits me better!
 
are they still hiring???? what does a medical consultant or advisor do anyway?
 
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