The Post Bacc Blues: Post Bacc students please help!

[AKamM]

So I found myself stuck having to do post bacc work ( I am sad but I blame no one but myself). I wanted to hear from any Medical School students or those who got accepted that did post bacc programs, what was your strategy? What GPA did you having going into your post bacc verses what you got when we came out? What did you do to supplement that fact that you had to do post bacc work?

Now for me....my gpa is a 2.9 and I am waiting until next year to take the MCAT. I am spending this year entire year taking 12 credits a semester (spring of next yr and fall) and 6 hours in the summer. I spoke to the potential schools I'll be applying too and I was advised that this plan would be better for me. Also, that for fall semester of next yr, I would just submit my grades when they come out since by that time application deadlines would be just about over. I'll be sending in my overall app early though.

My trend in my gpa is a little wavy because I started off strong, I got weak in the middle and ended on a good note but because of my failures in my junior year, my gpa never fully recovered.

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[advair250]

Is there a reason you're only taking 12 credits a term? Like work or some other big commitments ?

 

[AKamM]

Yes it's work and my financial situation. If I could find some way to get more money for more courses, I would take more. I was a financial aid student during undergrad and so paying for classes outside of undergrad would have to be done on my own since I'd be a non-degree seeking student.

 

[Stixman28]

The post bacc forums might be a good place to find some stories. FYI, not all students doing a post bacc are in gpa repair mode.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/forumdisplay.php?f=71

But I agree, it's going take more than 12 credits to get you to a confidently competitive gpa.

 

[AKamM]

I'm taking 12 in spring, 6 in the summer and 12 in the fall. Does that sound enough? Although I'm not a degree seeking student I have found a neurology/psychology major that has science courses that Med schools would approve of and things that I like.

 

[MrSunny1]

No that will not even look good on your transcript you need to take 15+ hours to show you are competitive 12 hours is just limping by. With a 2.9 you need to focus on rocking the MCAT 30+ and then you can get into a competitive SMP like Georgetown, Tulane or boston which will make you much more competitive.

 

[Stixman28]

No that will not even look good on your transcript you need to take 15+ hours to show you are competitive 12 hours is just limping by. With a 2.9 you need to focus on rocking the MCAT 30+ and then you can get into a competitive SMP like Georgetown, Tulane or boston which will make you much more competitive.

I don't agree with the SMP yet. Gpa <3.0 is going to get screened out when applying to MD's. He needs more classes to add into his uGPA to bring up the average.

When GPA repairing, go at the pace you need to go to maintain a 4.0 or as close to that as possible. People make the argument that you show med schools you can handle the load of taking more science at one time, but I disagree. They won't even look at how many classes you were taking at once if you don't get your gpa out of the dumps.

Just recognize, this will take more than one year at your pace.

 

[AKamM]

No that will not even look good on your transcript you need to take 15+ hours to show you are competitive 12 hours is just limping by. With a 2.9 you need to focus on rocking the MCAT 30+ and then you can get into a competitive SMP like Georgetown, Tulane or boston which will make you much more competitive.

Ok so if I squeeze 15 hours in the fall and spring and then 6 in the summer, I should be ok?

 

[Stixman28]

Not if adding those extra classes reduces your semester gpa.

I did a post bacc before medical school, so I can speak from some experience.

 

[AKamM]

Not if adding those extra classes reduces your semester gpa.

I did a post bacc before medical school, so I can speak from some experience.

I'm doing the post bacc at a different school than my undergrad. Also, I was looking at getting a second degree because if I transfer my credits to this school that I am looking at in my area, I would only need 24-30 credits before I get a second science degree so I could get financial aid. Would that be a good idea?

 

[1stmeds]

So I found myself stuck having to do post bacc work ( I am sad but I blame no one but myself). I wanted to hear from any Medical School students or those who got accepted that did post bacc programs, what was your strategy? What GPA did you having going into your post bacc verses what you got when we came out? What did you do to supplement that fact that you had to do post bacc work?

Now for me....my gpa is a 2.9 and I am waiting until next year to take the MCAT. I am spending this year entire year taking 12 credits a semester (spring of next yr and fall) and 6 hours in the summer. I spoke to the potential schools I'll be applying too and I was advised that this plan would be better for me. Also, that for fall semester of next yr, I would just submit my grades when they come out since by that time application deadlines would be just about over. I'll be sending in my overall app early though.

My trend in my gpa is a little wavy because I started off strong, I got weak in the middle and ended on a good note but because of my failures in my junior year, my gpa never fully recovered.

I did a post-bacc program and its not something to be discouraged or concerned by. I completed it in August (having started June 2011) and have been accepted to med school at this point with a couple more interviews to go. My understanding of the grades from postbaccs is that they are more important than undergrad (not that I'm discounting undergrad), primarily because of the recency of the grades. But of course all your grades will be reviewed whenever you eventually apply. That being said, you have to be sure you do better in those postbacc classes since you will be viewed as having had another shot at them and would be expected to improve. I took time off after graduating undergrad before doing the postbacc, which I highly recommend as a way to give yourself a chance to get some work or research or other real-world experience. A year or two off in the long run isnt a big deal and will actually likely make you a more competitive applicant. But whatever path you take, I cant emphasize enough how crucial it is you do well in the postbacc courses, while still continuing to volunteer, do research, and/or some other health-field endeavor.

 

[xXIDaShizIXx]

Ok so if I squeeze 15 hours in the fall and spring and then 6 in the summer, I should be ok?

Regardless of what people say on SDN, if you can't handle 15 hours, then don't. It's not worth ruining your GPA any more or putting too much on yourself..

 

[Hemorrage]

why not just retake the classes that are dumping your GPA and apply DO? your gpa will rise much faster

 

[503224]

Not if adding those extra classes reduces your semester gpa.

I did a post bacc before medical school, so I can speak from some experience.

How significantly did you have to raise your GPA and how long did that take you?

Did you do an SMP afterwards?

 

[Stixman28]

I wasn't doing a gpa repair (>3.8), just doing pre reqs bc I had a different ugrad major. But my buddy had a 3.01 ugrad gpa, then a solid 2 yrs of 4.0 post bacc, ~50 credits and got interviews at multiple top tens.

My point was just that 10 credits here, 15 credits there didn't have a huge change on my 140 some ugrad credits. And no, I really am not a strong advocate of the SMP. You gotta do the math and see what you can accomplish and how long it will take.

The time that a post bacc takes is reflected in the fact that you need a gap year often, bc you want schools to see what you've accomplished your whole second year.

Regardless of what people say on SDN, if you can't handle 15 hours, then don't. It's not worth ruining your GPA any more or putting too much on yourself..

QFT

 

[Marika11]

why not just retake the classes that are dumping your GPA and apply DO? your gpa will rise much faster

This. If I were you, I would think of it like this: You want to be a physician. What's the most realistic way of accomplishing that? Getting your amcas GPA to >3.4 with a 2.9 to start is going to be very difficult. Even then, a 3.4 is on the very low end for MD schools. With grade replacement, if you can get your GPA >3.4, or even >3.5, then you are in a great place for DO schools.

 

[spacetomatoes]

So I found myself stuck having to do post bacc work ( I am sad but I blame no one but myself). I wanted to hear from any Medical School students or those who got accepted that did post bacc programs, what was your strategy? What GPA did you having going into your post bacc verses what you got when we came out? What did you do to supplement that fact that you had to do post bacc work?

Now for me....my gpa is a 2.9 and I am waiting until next year to take the MCAT. I am spending this year entire year taking 12 credits a semester (spring of next yr and fall) and 6 hours in the summer. I spoke to the potential schools I'll be applying too and I was advised that this plan would be better for me. Also, that for fall semester of next yr, I would just submit my grades when they come out since by that time application deadlines would be just about over. I'll be sending in my overall app early though.

My trend in my gpa is a little wavy because I started off strong, I got weak in the middle and ended on a good note but because of my failures in my junior year, my gpa never fully recovered.

I finished my post-bacc in May of this year, and I've been accepted for the class of 2017!!! I didn't have a huge change in GPA, starting with a 3.4 and ending with a 3.5. I did, however, bump my BCMP GPA from a 3.3 to a 3.8.

I took 8 credits during the summer (accellerated gen chem 1 and 2), and then 12 credits for two semesters, and took the MCAT in May. I felt like 12 credits was PLENTY - that was bio 1 and 2, physics 1 and 2 and o chem 1 and 2 with labs. Making a 4.0 with that on my plate was hard enough, especially topping it with MCAT prep during the second semester! Could I have handled another class? Maybe. Would I have had a nervous break down? Probably. So do what you can do. I hadn't taken a science class in ten years before my post-bacc, so maybe someone fresher could have taken on more, but don't be a hero - do what you need to do to get that 4.0.

One question about your schedule - it looks like you're going to take the MCAT in May or June of 2013 to submit early, but not finish your pre-reqs until the Fall of 2013? Am I reading this correctly? If this is the case, BEWARE of taking the MCAT before finishing your pre-reqs.

Good luck!

 

[Chip N Sawbones]

Do retakes and go the DO route. Unless you have something else outstanding on your application, like an extremely high MCAT or amazing EC's, if you have under a 3.0 you will not be able to bring your GPA over a 3.5 without taking at least as many credits as you've already took. I did a postbac and found that DO schools were much more willing to consider my 4.0 in 28 credits of postbac work rather than my 3.1 cGPA. I didn't change my GPA with retakes, but that didn't seem to matter. I didn't have nearly as much success on the MD side. I got two interviews, one at my state school and one at Tulane. Don't use the fact that I got interviews as proof that you will. I've got so much full-time volunteer work that I'm kind of a special case. If you are dead set on applying to MD schools, you will need to be very selective in where you apply and only consider schools like Tulane and Rosalind Franklin that place a higher than average emphasis on ECs and less on cGPA.

You might try asking similar questions on the nontrad forum. Over there we're all in the same situation you're in, and there's a lot of information in the sticky threads that will help you.

 

[AKamM]

I was thinking of pursuing a second degree and doing well in that. If I transfer some of my credits I will only have 30 to do before I get a second degree from another school. I know I cannot raise my GPA from my undergrad school so I have given up on trying to do that and my goal right now is the prove to them that although my degree at my undergrad school was not great, my second degree gpa is much better.

Also, I am done with all my pre-reqs for medical school so I don't need to do those. I think need to focus on proving to them that I am competent despite my failures maybe? I took classes during my undergrad at the school I intend to go to for my second degree and my gpa there is very high (in the competitive range) so I want to build on that.

Lastly, I am moving back up my where my old school is later on and I was going to ask an adviser if I should retake some of the core classes I didn't do well on when I returned. I am not doing it to raise my gpa but show competence again. I am also planning on applying for a bridge program my undergrad school offers as a way to automatically assimilate into their medical school. I am in close contact with a person who sits on the board for that and they have been kind enough to review my essay, which they really liked, and offer me advice on how to get in whenever I need it. I appreciate the help in referring me to DO school but I have not counted myself as a loss for allopathic medicine. I may sound foolish to some but....It's all I want to do.

 

[Chip N Sawbones]

I was thinking of pursuing a second degree and doing well in that. If I transfer some of my credits I will only have 30 to do before I get a second degree from another school. I know I cannot raise my GPA from my undergrad school so I have given up on trying to do that and my goal right now is the prove to them that although my degree at my undergrad school was not great, my second degree gpa is much better.

Also, I am done with all my pre-reqs for medical school so I don't need to do those. I think need to focus on proving to them that I am competent despite my failures maybe? I took classes during my undergrad at the school I intend to go to for my second degree and my gpa there is very high (in the competitive range) so I want to build on that.

Lastly, I am moving back up my where my old school is later on and I was going to ask an adviser if I should retake some of the core classes I didn't do well on when I returned. I am not doing it to raise my gpa but show competence again. I am also planning on applying for a bridge program my undergrad school offers as a way to automatically assimilate into their medical school. I am in close contact with a person who sits on the board for that and they have been kind enough to review my essay, which they really liked, and offer me advice on how to get in whenever I need it. I appreciate the help in referring me to DO school but I have not counted myself as a loss for allopathic medicine. I may sound foolish to some but....It's all I want to do.

A second degree will not help you significantly except for the boost it will give to your cumulative GPA. I repeat, For almost all MD schools, excellent recent coursework will not offset a poor cGPA. I've wasted a lot of money on application fees finding that out. If you are dead set on becoming an MD, which again I do not recommend in your situation, you need to take science classes of any kind to boost your science and cumulative GPAs, regardless of whether they lead to a second degree or not. Retake any Ds and Fs on your transcript. Retake any Cs you may have in the prereq classes. There's no grade replacement, but you still need to show that you can understand the material. Take classes like genetics, biochem and anatomy that will have some value for the MCATs and future medical school work. Unless you have a state medical school with low standards, keep taking them until your cGPA is a 3.4 at a bare minimum.

Where are you moving to? If it's a state with highly competitive schools, you should try to remain a resident of your current state. If it's a state like Texas with schools that are easy to get into, research the residency requirements and establish residency there as soon as possible. You may even want to move to a different state specifically for the medical schools there.

 

[AKamM]

A second degree will not help you significantly except for the boost it will give to your cumulative GPA. I repeat, For almost all MD schools, excellent recent coursework will not offset a poor cGPA. I've wasted a lot of money on application fees finding that out. If you are dead set on becoming an MD, which again I do not recommend in your situation, you need to take science classes of any kind to boost your science and cumulative GPAs, regardless of whether they lead to a second degree or not. Retake any Ds and Fs on your transcript. Retake any Cs you may have in the prereq classes. There's no grade replacement, but you still need to show that you can understand the material. Take classes like genetics, biochem and anatomy that will have some value for the MCATs and future medical school work. Unless you have a state medical school with low standards, keep taking them until your cGPA is a 3.4 at a bare minimum.

Where are you moving to? If it's a state with highly competitive schools, you should try to remain a resident of your current state. If it's a state like Texas with schools that are easy to get into, research the residency requirements and establish residency there as soon as possible. You may even want to move to a different state specifically for the medical schools there.

My second degree is a science degree. Even if I do really well on a second degree at another school in my state it still won't do anything? I have taken genetics, biochem already but this second degree offers me a chance to take different science class other than the ones I took at my undergrad school and the ones they offer at my undergrad. Also, since I have a better gpa and this school because I took some classes here during undergrad and did well, I figured could easily boast my gpa here if I do well. Then, they will have my gpa from my original undergrad where I did my first degree and my gpa from the school I am enrolling in right now. Both my orginal undergrad school and the school I plan on attending are in my home state. I want to do a second degree because financial aid will help pay for it rather than be a non degree.

Also, I feel as though if I work hard even if I don't get into the actually Medical school I may be able to get into the Bridge program my original undergrad offers because it is strictly geared towards students like me who are not ready yet but may have potential. The woman I am in contact with is on the board for that program and she was the one that told me to do postbacc and that would help me a lot in regards to getting into that.

Once again, I appreciate everyone for offering me other ways to go but after seeing some success stories coming from people in my position, finding out about the bridge program and finally getting someone who is willing to help me, I feel my chances are still there.

 

[smallone]

Really look into your options for post-bacc classes, too -- I mean, where you'll take them. I had an absolutely horrific post-bacc experience and if I had just talked to current students, they would've told me to go elsewhere for classes. Do your research!

 

[RegisBioMedMS]

Pre-health advisor here... This is a tough choice sometimes. A second degree can be helpful for your GPA, but it isn't as targeted as a MS would be, which would prove your ability to do graduate level work in a shorter amount of time. Most MS programs also work to build good connections with the Med and DO schools in their area, even if they aren't official linkages, and so their graduates will get a bit of extra attention in the applicant pool. Also (and I think this can be a big motivation for students who need to step it up to the next academic level) in a structured post-bac, you're surrounded by a very like minded community that is supportive of your goals. If you choose to do the second undergrad degree, your letters of recommendation from those faculty become extremely important as the schools will look to them heavily for an explanation and support of your 2nd degree, so be sure to build those good faculty relationships. Best of luck in whatever path you choose.

 

[Chip N Sawbones]

My second degree is a science degree. Even if I do really well on a second degree at another school in my state it still won't do anything? I have taken genetics, biochem already but this second degree offers me a chance to take different science class other than the ones I took at my undergrad school and the ones they offer at my undergrad. Also, since I have a better gpa and this school because I took some classes here during undergrad and did well, I figured could easily boast my gpa here if I do well. Then, they will have my gpa from my original undergrad where I did my first degree and my gpa from the school I am enrolling in right now. Both my orginal undergrad school and the school I plan on attending are in my home state. I want to do a second degree because financial aid will help pay for it rather than be a non degree.

Also, I feel as though if I work hard even if I don't get into the actually Medical school I may be able to get into the Bridge program my original undergrad offers because it is strictly geared towards students like me who are not ready yet but may have potential. The woman I am in contact with is on the board for that program and she was the one that told me to do postbacc and that would help me a lot in regards to getting into that.

Once again, I appreciate everyone for offering me other ways to go but after seeing some success stories coming from people in my position, finding out about the bridge program and finally getting someone who is willing to help me, I feel my chances are still there.

The degree itself won't help much. The classes you take in it will, especially if you are taking science classes. It doesn't matter much if you go to a school where your GPA is better. Your GPA from every college credit you've taken, even that two-credit community college class you took twelve years ago on a dare, gets mixed together and swirled around to produce your cumulative GPA, and that number is what truly matters for MD school.

No matter what you do you should apply as a degree-seeking student so you can get financial aid, but it doesn't matter if you intend to get a degree or not. I was officially a chemistry major last year even though I had no intention whatsoever of getting a chemistry degree. Concentrate on retaking bad classes and taking classes that will carry over somewhat to medical school. Don't take a formal postbac program; they're for people like me who didn't do any of their prereqs in undergrad.

What state are you in? If you're in someplace like California or Washington, a move to Texas would save you at least a year of postbac work.

 

[AKamM]

I'm in Florida. The advisor I spoke to was at one of the florida college of medicines and she said getting a second degree in a science based major (which is what I am doing) would be helpful and that I should take at least 30 credits (which is what I have left until I get a second degree). Since she also sits on the board for their special master's program that feeds into the Medical school I figured she'd know what her program wanted and what FSU's COM wanted. She also said if I am chosen to get my masters, I have more options because I can automatically assimilate into FSU's COM (Which 97% of the graduates have done in this program) or take my degree and apply to other medical schools. This program allows you to take first year Medical classes and as of next yr, you will be doing hands on work with physicians. Many of the students are lacking in one area (either MCAT or GPA) or both but the potential is seen in the students. A lot of these students go on to being TA's their first year and out of the many years they have been doing it, they only lost about 5 students but other than that, every has graduated and most everyone has gone straight to Medical school.

 

[Chip N Sawbones]

A special master's program like that might be a good option for you. They can be expensive, but if you are able to get accepted to one and do well in a linked program it's a sure path to medical school.