This sums up how I feel about student loan forgiveness

[radio frequency]

Who said forgiven and forgotten?

Referring to slavery’s harms as an “‘alleged’ debt” does make it sound like you don’t believe a debt exists.

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[deleted480308]

Referring to slavery’s harms as an “‘alleged’ debt” does make it sound like you don’t believe a debt exists.

I believe 100% that the wrong occurred. I do not believe it is possible to quantify what debt anyone alive today is supposed to owe to anyone else alive today because of that.

I don’t think you can quantify it either

 

[radio frequency]

I believe 100% that the wrong occurred. I do not believe it is possible to quantify what debt anyone alive today is supposed to owe to anyone else alive today because of that.

I don’t think you can quantify it either

I don’t entirely disagree, though I have a suspicion the debt would be greater than the coffers available if it was calculable.

 

[PharmtoCS]

People don't seem to understand, the government is what put us in this situation in the first place.

When are people going to understand our government always makes things worse when they get involved.

Agree with you in this case, the government is partly responsible for the $1.6 trillion student loan crisis.

People wanted equal access to education for all socioeconomic classes. Out of good intentions the government started lending out blank checks to anyone with a pulse so that everyone had a chance to go to college and grad school regardless of socioeconomic status.

Allowing everyone the chance to go to college made sense since higher education theroetically meant higher wages, which meant that the student loans would be paid back easily. Schools cashed in on the easy student loan money and raised tuition exponentially. Students not only had to spend more on tuition but also blew much of the loans on expensive apartments, eating out, alcohol, spring break vacations, cars, stocks, Bitcoin, etc. Many students borrowed tens of thousands of dollars on degrees that are not in demand, leaving them in debt and still stuck at jobs that do not require a college education. Some didn't even finish their degrees.

I'm doubtful that the government will solve the problem without creating a huge new one by throwing over a trillion dollars at the current one.

 

[deleted480308]

I don’t entirely disagree, though I have a suspicion the debt would be greater than the coffers available if it was calculable.

And I’m not down for supporting your notion of indefinite payback for something generations ago that I didn’t partake in. So we’re at an impasse

 

[BMBiology]

The govt shouldn’t be taking people’s money and redistributing it. If you want money, you should earn it through voluntary commerce

That is how our system is set up. Why do we go by electoral college votes?

 

[redfish955]

That is how our system is set up. Why do we go by electoral college votes?

So a faction withen the population with a belief that will infringe on others rights can't win the election.

 

[wagrxm2000]

Agree with you in this case, the government is partly responsible for the $1.6 trillion student loan crisis.

People wanted equal access to education for all socioeconomic classes. Out of good intentions the government started lending out blank checks to anyone with a pulse so that everyone had a chance to go to college and grad school regardless of socioeconomic status.

Allowing everyone the chance to go to college made sense since higher education theroetically meant higher wages, which meant that the student loans would be paid back easily. Schools cashed in on the easy student loan money and raised tuition exponentially. Students not only had to spend more on tuition but also blew much of the loans on expensive apartments, eating out, alcohol, spring break vacations, cars, stocks, Bitcoin, etc. Many students borrowed tens of thousands of dollars on degrees that are not in demand, leaving them in debt and still stuck at jobs that do not require a college education. Some didn't even finish their degrees.

I'm doubtful that the government will solve the problem without creating a huge new one by throwing over a trillion dollars at the current one.

Exactly. Before the government got involved there was no issue. Barely any people went to college so it made it very valuable. Now everyone has to get Masters or PhD just to try to set yourself apart

Before student loans you either worked your way through college or your parents paid for it. Literally a waiter in the summer could pay their way.

Instead the government gets involved and says let's guarantee loans. Banks love this since there is interest. It's free money.

Colleges love it too and rates soared. The price of Yale in 1918 was $160. That's $4000 today. Yale actually costs I believe $50k. People used to go to college on a month or two salary from their parents.

A lot of white collar jobs only needed high school degrees.

 

[redfish955]

Exactly. Before the government got involved there was no issue. Barely any people went to college so it made it very valuable. Now everyone has to get Masters or PhD just to try to set yourself apart

Before student loans you either worked your way through college or your parents paid for it. Literally a waiter in the summer could pay their way.

Instead the government gets involved and says let's guarantee loans. Banks love this since there is interest. It's free money.

Colleges love it too and rates soared. The price of Yale in 1918 was $160. That's $4000 today. Yale actually costs I believe $50k. People used to go to college on a month or two salary from their parents.

A lot of white collar jobs only needed high school degrees.

Tuition at big state schools is still wicked cheap. IMO the biggest game changer is what has happened around the college campuses. Luxury $1300 a month apartments in small towns, craft beer extravaganza, fine dining, etc. I could live on a $10,000 budget plus tuition while in college. Many of these kids are living on $25k budgets plus tuition. Most of these schools such as Harvard have huge endowments and anyone that needs loans will get funding.

 

[deleted480308]

That is how our system is set up. Why do we go by electoral college votes?

Redistribution is actually not how our system was set up

 

[deleted898085]

Agree with you in this case, the government is partly responsible for the $1.6 trillion student loan crisis.

People wanted equal access to education for all socioeconomic classes. Out of good intentions the government started lending out blank checks to anyone with a pulse so that everyone had a chance to go to college and grad school regardless of socioeconomic status.

Allowing everyone the chance to go to college made sense since higher education theroetically meant higher wages, which meant that the student loans would be paid back easily. Schools cashed in on the easy student loan money and raised tuition exponentially. Students not only had to spend more on tuition but also blew much of the loans on expensive apartments, eating out, alcohol, spring break vacations, cars, stocks, Bitcoin, etc. Many students borrowed tens of thousands of dollars on degrees that are not in demand, leaving them in debt and still stuck at jobs that do not require a college education. Some didn't even finish their degrees.

I'm doubtful that the government will solve the problem without creating a huge new one by throwing over a trillion dollars at the current one.

Student loans are great, especially federal loans. It gives poor ppl access to colleges at their choice. That's what I love about America.
It's just private colleges are greedy. And taxpayers have to pay. Tax system sucks here in the US.

Instead taxing Amazon, Facebook, Google, for profit colleges,... they tax middle class the most.
Middle class is raped in America.
Instead increasing savings interest rate, decreasing mortgage rate, they lower savings interest rate, and pump all the cheap money into the market.
Look at Fed Reserve chairman partying at Jeff Bezos'. Look at Mark Z talking to Trump in private.
Trump is mad when EU starts having digital tax bc he said EU is taking advantage of American companies.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Exactly. Before the government got involved there was no issue. Barely any people went to college so it made it very valuable. Now everyone has to get Masters or PhD just to try to set yourself apart

Before student loans you either worked your way through college or your parents paid for it. Literally a waiter in the summer could pay their way.

Instead the government gets involved and says let's guarantee loans. Banks love this since there is interest. It's free money.

Colleges love it too and rates soared. The price of Yale in 1918 was $160. That's $4000 today. Yale actually costs I believe $50k. People used to go to college on a month or two salary from their parents.

A lot of white collar jobs only needed high school degrees.

Brand name schools like HPY and Stanford have income-based tuition policy. Admitted students with household income less than a threshold, 60k will get a full ride scholarship and 150k for 10% contribution. Check your facts before you post~

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Student loans are great, especially federal loans. It gives poor ppl access to colleges at their choice. That's what I love about America.
It's just private colleges are greedy. And taxpayers have to pay. Tax system sucks here in the US.
Instead taxing Amazon, Facebook, Google, for profit colleges,... they tax middle class the most.
Instead increasing savings interest rate, decreasing mortgage rate, they lower savings interest rate. Look at Fed Reserve chairman partying at Jeff Bezos'. Look at Mark Z talking to Trump in private.
Trump is mad when EU starts having digital tax...

Many European universities are free, and many top Chinese universities cost very little and often hand out scholarships to attract international students. But they will require some foreign language skills. Nobody is forcing American students to attend US institutions. Some dumb students sign up for loans to attend schools that charge big amounts. They were stupid so they have to pay for their stupidity.

 

[deleted898085]

Many European universities are free, and many top Chinese universities cost very little and often hand out scholarships to attract international students. But they will require some foreign language skills. Nobody is forcing American students to attend US institutions. Some dumb students sign up for loans to attend schools that charge big amounts. They were stupid so they have to pay for their stupidity.

Yes. I start to see the majority of Americans are stupid. And they are hell being taken advantage.
But I see middle class also pay.
If they weren't ignorant and voted, their life would have been much better.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Exactly. Before the government got involved there was no issue. Barely any people went to college so it made it very valuable. Now everyone has to get Masters or PhD just to try to set yourself apart

Before student loans you either worked your way through college or your parents paid for it. Literally a waiter in the summer could pay their way.

Instead the government gets involved and says let's guarantee loans. Banks love this since there is interest. It's free money.

Colleges love it too and rates soared. The price of Yale in 1918 was $160. That's $4000 today. Yale actually costs I believe $50k. People used to go to college on a month or two salary from their parents.

A lot of white collar jobs only needed high school degrees.

Just to remind you, most research based US Masters and PhD programs are usually fully funded and will pay monthly stipends to candidates, which often are more than sufficient to cover tuition and living cost.

 

[Lubeckd]

Many European universities are free, and many top Chinese universities cost very little and often hand out scholarships to attract international students. But they will require some foreign language skills. Nobody is forcing American students to attend US institutions. Some dumb students sign up for loans to attend schools that charge big amounts. They were stupid so they have to pay for their stupidity.

Many international third world countries students protest European fee of 500 usd per semester

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Many international third world countries students protest European fee of 500 usd per semester

All public German and Swiss universities are free. What else should I say?

 

[Lubeckd]

All public German and Swiss universities are free. What else should I say?

Germany scraps tuition fees after mass student protests cause shift in public opinion | Economy Watch

After experimenting with tuition fees, all the federal German states have been persuaded to reverse their decision. In the UK and US, there is no political will to change the policies which are blighting whole generations. The only way forward is to copy German protest movements.

www.economywatch.com

What Does It Cost to Study in Germany - Study in Germany for Free

What is the average cost of studying in Germany? How much will an international student spend on tuition fees, housing and food?

www.studying-in-germany.org

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Yes. I start to see the majority of Americans are stupid. And they are hell being taken advantage.
But I see middle class also pay.

Middle class can just send their kids to European or Asian Universities. It's all supply and demand. When application numbers drop, American colleges will race to cut tuition costs. By the end of the day, most US employers don't give a damn about where the degree is from, as long as it is from a reputable school, domestic or international, who care?

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Germany scraps tuition fees after mass student protests cause shift in public opinion | Economy Watch

After experimenting with tuition fees, all the federal German states have been persuaded to reverse their decision. In the UK and US, there is no political will to change the policies which are blighting whole generations. The only way forward is to copy German protest movements.

www.economywatch.com

What Does It Cost to Study in Germany - Study in Germany for Free

What is the average cost of studying in Germany? How much will an international student spend on tuition fees, housing and food?

www.studying-in-germany.org

Go to Swiss Universities then~

 

[Lubeckd]

Middle class can just send their kids to European or Asian Universities. It's all supply and demand. When application numbers drop, American colleges will race to cut tuition costs. By the end of the day, most US employers don't give a damn about where the degree is from, as long as it is from a reputable school, domestic or international, who care?

Are you said all the elites go to uk and USA universities. Most don't teach in European universities. Salaries for professors suck

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Germany scraps tuition fees after mass student protests cause shift in public opinion | Economy Watch

After experimenting with tuition fees, all the federal German states have been persuaded to reverse their decision. In the UK and US, there is no political will to change the policies which are blighting whole generations. The only way forward is to copy German protest movements.

www.economywatch.com

What Does It Cost to Study in Germany - Study in Germany for Free

What is the average cost of studying in Germany? How much will an international student spend on tuition fees, housing and food?

www.studying-in-germany.org

Why Is Germany the Perfect Place to Study Abroad? - Study in Germany for Free

Recently Germany is becoming a magnet for international students from all over the world. Let’s explore some of the reasons why students prefer to study in this amazing country. Germany is a higher education paradise. Unlike in any other country, in Germany you will find many worldwide ranked...

www.studying-in-germany.org

How much does it cost to study in Germany?

Find out how much it will cost to study in Germany as an international student, whatever your study level.

www.topuniversities.com

German tuition fee is still small, after reintroduction, ~3000 euros per year.

 

[redfish955]

Only like 25% of germans and swiss to go universities. The rest get pushed into apprenticeships. In the U.S. 70% of all people attempted college. Maybe demand for vocational skills and a fantastic vocational skill development program is really what is needed.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Are you said all the elites go to uk and USA universities. Most don't teach in European universities. Salaries for professors suck

Top Indian, Chinese and Russian technical universities like IIT, Tsinghua, PKU and Moscow state, cost like nothing, yet their graduates make up the bulk of the FAANG SWE workforce. So you are telling me they aren't elites?

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Only like 25% of germans and swiss to go universities. The rest get pushed into apprenticeships. In the U.S. 70% of all people attempted college. Maybe demand for vocational skills and a fantastic vocational skill development program is really what is needed.

The only problem? Some dummies think everyone should go to college, yet they absolutely suck in STEM but still want a college diploma. So they took the easiest BS courses in gender studies and got a degree for 200k. Let the dummies pay for their stupidity plz.

 

[redfish955]

The only problem? Some dummies think everyone should go to college, yet they absolutely suck in STEM but still want a college diploma. So they took the easiest BS courses in gender studies and got a degree for 200k. Let the dummies pay for their stupidity plz.

Most people defaulting only attempted like 25 hours of classes. They live in areas with low unskilled worker wages so they don't have a manageable way to support themselves and pay off the loans. These people likely got smoked by stem curriculum and dropped out instead of doing an easier major.

 

[Lubeckd]

Only like 25% of germans and swiss to go universities. The rest get pushed into apprenticeships. In the U.S. 70% of all people attempted college. Maybe demand for vocational skills and a fantastic vocational skill development program is really what is needed.

This is a correct stat. Most of the time if you are not smart you won't match with university

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Most people defaulting only attempted like 25 hours of classes. They live in areas with low unskilled worker wages so they don't have a manageable way to support themselves and pay off the loans. These people likely got smoked by stem curriculum and dropped out instead of doing an easier major.

I think that's a very good life lesson for them. Tobacco industry has explicit warning for smoking, yet smokers still buy them. Why stopping them, if they just want financial suicide? It's better for them default on student loan, so that they won't default on mortgage later and drag the entire nation into great recession 2.0 lol.

 

[redfish955]

This is a correct stat. Most of the time if you are not smart you won't match with university

This is where American Universities shine. They can take someone with a good work ethic, start them in college algebra and in 5 or 6 years they are in a high paying stem role. This is where I think making the 100 level classes free would help a lot of people to close the gap between low income public schools and high end private schools. Try the hard 100 level courses for free. If you fail go into the trades or etc.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

This is where American Universities shine. They can take someone with a good work ethic, start them in college algebra and in 5 or 6 years they are in a high paying stem role. This is where I think making the 100 level classes free would help a lot of people to close the gap between low income public schools and high end private schools. Try the hard 100 level courses for free. If you fail go into the trades or etc.

There are already AP calculus, chemistry, biology, physics and computer science lol. High school is free, right?

 

[NITRAS]

Yes. I start to see the majority of Americans are stupid. And they are hell being taken advantage.
But I see middle class also pay.
If they weren't ignorant and voted, their life would have been much better.

Low income people don't pay (much) taxes. Depending on how you classify middle class, they still don't pay as much as the upper classes.

https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/FT_17.10.04_taxes_stats.png?w=420

 

[redfish955]

There are already AP calculus, chemistry, biology, physics and computer science lol. High school is free, right?

There are a lot of rural schools that don't offer those courses. I went to college with people who had to start with college algebra and work their way up to calculus. Then work their way up to advanced math and engineering classes. The key to math is that you have to practice it a lot and you can't skip steps along the way.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

There are a lot of rural schools that don't offer those courses. I went to college with people who had to start with college algebra and work their way up to calculus. Then work their way up to advanced math and engineering classes. The key to math is that you have to practice it a lot and you can't skip steps along the way.

I am from CA, and I took math 101 in 10th grade at a local community college, for free. Local CC usually don't charge for K-12 students. I know of a high school kid who took linear algebra there too, also for free.

 

[deleted898085]

Low income people don't pay (much) taxes. Depending on how you classify middle class, they still don't pay as much as the upper classes.

https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/FT_17.10.04_taxes_stats.png?w=420

Is that personal/individual income tax only?
I was talking about businesses, corporations, for-profit colleges,...included.
Somehow the tax structure makes them pay no tax.
For example, step-up in basis law.

 

[Lubeckd]

This is where American Universities shine. They can take someone with a good work ethic, start them in college algebra and in 5 or 6 years they are in a high paying stem role. This is where I think making the 100 level classes free would help a lot of people to close the gap between low income public schools and high end private schools. Try the hard 100 level courses for free. If you fail go into the trades or etc.

Yes, it's cheap but unequal. No one has a chance to go to university. Here in America they just want money

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Is that personal/individual income tax only?
I was talking about businesses, corporations, for-profit colleges,...included.

Taxes in California for Small Business: The Basics

Understand the tax implications of running a small business in California, and learn which state taxes apply based on business type.

www.investopedia.com

corporations in US are already heavily taxed, and CA, governed by democrats, is the most brutally taxed state.

 

[deleted898085]

Taxes in California for Small Business: The Basics

Understand the tax implications of running a small business in California, and learn which state taxes apply based on business type.

www.investopedia.com

corporations in US are already heavily taxed, and CA, governed by democrats, is the most brutally taxed state.

That's for only one state. I was talking about federal tax.
Jeez

 

[Lubeckd]

FYI today's news a lot of technology workers are laid off 2020

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

That's for only one state. I was talking about federal tax.
Jeez

That's 21% on the profits of US resident corporations.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

FYI today's news a lot of technology workers are laid off 2020

where is the news?

 

[Lubeckd]

where is the news?

Tech industry layoffs rose 351 percent in 2019. Is a recession looming?

The enormous year-to-year increase in layoffs could be prophetic, some fear

www.salon.com

Hundreds of Macy's tech workers are being laid off or relocated as the retailer closes an office in San Francisco

On Monday, Macy's CEO Jeff Gennette informed employees in its San Francisco tech office that it would be closing on April 1.

www.google.com

 

[Lubeckd]

News, Analysis & Comment | Financial Services & Banking Sectors

Browse news and career advice from the financial services, investment banking, fintech industry. Get expert insight into what it's like to work in finance.

news.efinancialcareers.com

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Tech industry layoffs rose 351 percent in 2019. Is a recession looming?

The enormous year-to-year increase in layoffs could be prophetic, some fear

www.salon.com

Hundreds of Macy's tech workers are being laid off or relocated as the retailer closes an office in San Francisco

On Monday, Macy's CEO Jeff Gennette informed employees in its San Francisco tech office that it would be closing on April 1.

www.google.com

"Indeed, 2019 was dominated by headlines about lay-offs among Silicon Valley startups and established tech companies alike. Many of them involved gig economy platforms, a type of tech company that seeks to replace existing service industries with armies of on-demand contractors who often make less than minimum wage and rarely receive benefits.
Last spring, dog-walking startup Wag, exemplary of the gig economy trend, experienced lay-offs. The same happened last year with contractor-reliant Uber, which laid off 2 percent of its workforce in restructuring.
"

I wouldn't worry at all, if majorities of layoffs are from unprofitable startups lol.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

News, Analysis & Comment | Financial Services & Banking Sectors

Browse news and career advice from the financial services, investment banking, fintech industry. Get expert insight into what it's like to work in finance.

news.efinancialcareers.com

Everyone is switching to free trading platforms like robinhood and thinkorswim. Who is stupid enough to invest millions and only get paid single digit percent annual returns yet stock market is on fire? I am more than happy to see Morgan Stanley downsize, and it's a good sign that financial market is trending towards democratization, finally.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Tech industry layoffs rose 351 percent in 2019. Is a recession looming?

The enormous year-to-year increase in layoffs could be prophetic, some fear

www.salon.com

Hundreds of Macy's tech workers are being laid off or relocated as the retailer closes an office in San Francisco

On Monday, Macy's CEO Jeff Gennette informed employees in its San Francisco tech office that it would be closing on April 1.

www.google.com

btw, Macy's is already on the death bed for years. I am fairly surprised it is still not bankrupt lol.

 

[Lubeckd]

btw, Macy's is already on the death bed for years. I am fairly surprised it is still not bankrupt lol.

Wow VMware too. Their product is amazing, I use it for Cybersecurity

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Wow VMware too. Their product is amazing, I use it for Cybersecurity

VMware stock is down, and Microsoft is dominating the cloud and server virtualization, then there comes AWS, so what else do you expect?

 

[deleted480308]

There are definitely bad government policies that have made a bad situation worse, that's something we can actually agree on. There are racial disparities among those who have been harmed by the war on drugs, though, so I don't agree that the war on drugs is a good example of how race "doesn't matter." And I am not sure what you mean by govt welfare damaging the family structure.

Ideally, the end point would be the elimination of demographic disparities among distribution of poverty and wealth.

That’s an absurd end point. By that metric somehow I need govt benefits over asians. Equality of outcomes isn’t necessary, equality of legal freedom is

 

[deleted480308]

Yes, it's cheap but unequal. No one has a chance to go to university. Here in America they just want money

Literally everyone in the US has a chance to go to university

 

[wagrxm2000]

Brand name schools like HPY and Stanford have income-based tuition policy. Admitted students with household income less than a threshold, 60k will get a full ride scholarship and 150k for 10% contribution. Check your facts before you post~

Um thanks, just using a colleges tuition as an example. Substitute any other school.

Doesn't change the fact that without loans, tuition would still to this day be affordable.

The point is instead of making it free and continuing to pay these colleges all that money, it never should have offered loans in the first place.

Why does no one ever go after the colleges?