tossing acceptances and re-applying

[cpants]

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I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting to go to a particular school and continuing to reapply until you get in. If that's your goal, then fine.

What's WRONG is applying to a bunch of other schools too and then rejecting their acceptances because you didn't get in the one you wanted.

Only apply to the schools you WANT to go to. If you don't have that luxury and pray to get in anywhere, then beggars can't be choosers.

For crying out loud...

This is the part I don't get too. If you are only satisfied going to 10 of the top schools in the country, why bother applying anywhere else?

 

[halekulani]

how about this option...

don't accept a spot at either of the schools and don't re-apply.

 

[Gut Shot]

Yeah, that Johns Hopkins. Man. Same with Harvard and Yale. I can't believe they allow DOs into their residency programs. So are they new, malignant, last chance, not in a good area, headed by a DO, or linked to a third world school?

Don't waste your time with this individual. I strongly suspect that he is not ex-military, has never been an EMT, has never taken the MCAT, and has never even applied, much less been accepted, to any medical school.

Can't speculate on the veracity of his GPA.

 

[87138]

Well, many premeds are jerks who are only premed so they can look in the mirror every day and think, "I'm better/smarter/more accomplished than everyone else. Mwa ha ha ha ha!"

Yes, we're all Stuart Smalleys on 'roids.

 

[deleted212936]

Grades =/ MD (good grades don't make good MD)
Practice = MD

Suppose you were a patient, would you go to a doc who got 3.4 GPA but great reputation or a doc who got 4.0 and crappy at practicing?

 

[dynezxice]

Grades =/ MD (good grades don't make good MD)
Practice = MD

Suppose you were a patient, would you go to a doc who got 3.4 GPA but great reputation or a doc who got 4.0 and crappy at practicing?

At the end of the day, it's actually Pass = MD no matter how you look at it.

 

[tungers]

i think i'm in a similar situation - i only applied to md/phd programs and only got an offer for a school in which i think the research labs are less cutting edge/interesting as opposed to other top tier schools. If it were only for the MD degree, i would take the offer with no hesitation. But I think where I do my PhD and what lab i work in plays an important factor, so i'm not sure what to do..

i obviously wish i could work in some of the most cutting edge labs, but also dont want to end up with no school to go to if i reapply

any thoughts?

 

[sindadel]

No it's not any different - you shouldn't apply to programs you wouldn't go to. Don't give up an acceptance this cycle in order to re-apply next cycle.

As far as research goes, be selective about who to pick as a mentor. You may be able to be more self-directed with someone nice but less cutting edge, even collaborating with some of the labs you are more interested in. Or you may find a lab whose research direction is exciting enough to do for a few years. Doing your own research is for after you complete your second post-doc.

 

[tungers]

No it's not any different - you shouldn't apply to programs you wouldn't go to. Don't give up an acceptance this cycle in order to re-apply next cycle.

As far as research goes, be selective about who to pick as a mentor. You may be able to be more self-directed with someone nice but less cutting edge, even collaborating with some of the labs you are more interested in. Or you may find a lab whose research direction is exciting enough to do for a few years. Doing your own research is for after you complete your second post-doc.

thanks for the input, but suppose i should be more clear. I think I will be okay to settle for my offer, that's why I applied. My concern is whether or not working in less cutting edge/interesting labs will affect how well i do in my PhD years and future career in research.

I am currently trying to weigh the benefits of reapplying and possibly being able to work in more cutting edge labs and the costs of maybe ending up with no offers..

 

[Kaustikos]

i think i'm in a similar situation - i only applied to md/phd programs and only got an offer for a school in which i think the research labs are less cutting edge/interesting as opposed to other top tier schools. If it were only for the MD degree, i would take the offer with no hesitation. But I think where I do my PhD and what lab i work in plays an important factor, so i'm not sure what to do..

i obviously wish i could work in some of the most cutting edge labs, but also dont want to end up with no school to go to if i reapply

any thoughts?

Take the acceptance.

 

[usermike8500]

Lets put this in perspective. Lets say YOU are a patient with a very serious medical condition. Whom are you more likely to entrust your life/well-being to? A doctor from Harvard with 20 years of experience or one from Medical College of Nowhere with 20 years of experience.

If it was my life on the line, I'd be inclined to go with the Harvard doc.

 

[aznb0y129]

Lets put this in perspective. Lets say YOU are a patient with a very serious medical condition. Whom are you more likely to entrust your life/well-being to? A doctor from Harvard with 20 years of experience or one from Medical College of Nowhere with 20 years of experience.

If it was my life on the line, I'd be inclined to go with the Harvard doc.

If your life were on the line, you wouldn't be in any position to make this sort of decision. More than likely, you would be coding.

In all seriousness, I would look at which doctor had more relevant and appropriate experience to my individual medical condition, not which school they graduated from 20 years ago.

 

[ButImLETired]

If your life were on the line, you wouldn't be in any position to make this sort of decision. More than likely, you would be coding.

In all seriousness, I would look at which doctor had more relevant and appropriate experience to my individual medical condition, not which school they graduated from 20 years ago.

This is absolutely true. In fact, I have an anecdote. One of my best friends from college is the daughter of two Hopkins doctors (ps. this is in no way a way to take a shot at Hopkins- it's a fabulous school). Her mom is a department head at Hopkins Med, and last year she was diagnosed with a really malignant lung cancer. Of course, she first went to a Hopkins oncologist, Harvard grad, Hopkins-trained. He, however, told her that her case was not an interesting research case and that he was not interested in seeing her as a patient. After some research, she found that the best guy for her particular type of cancer was a Mt. Sinai grad who works in NY. So she packed her bags, and off she went.

Granted, Sinai isn't a super low-tier school by any means, but it's not Harvard or Hopkins either. Point is, some of the best doctors in various fields come from fairly random schools. My PI, one of the foremost authorities in his field, is a Utah grad. He is now a department head at Stanford. Another one of our attendings is a DO. Anyway, there are hundreds of these examples in every field. You REALLY aren't tied to your school's reputation. Would a huge name help your future? Probably. Would a not-so-huge name hinder your future? No. Ultimately that's all that matters.

 

[dynezxice]

This is absolutely true. In fact, I have an anecdote. One of my best friends from college is the daughter of two Hopkins doctors (ps. this is in no way a way to take a shot at Hopkins- it's a fabulous school). Her mom is a department head at Hopkins Med, and last year she was diagnosed with a really malignant lung cancer. Of course, she first went to a Hopkins oncologist, Harvard grad, Hopkins-trained. He, however, told her that her case was not an interesting research case and that he was not interested in seeing her as a patient. After some research, she found that the best guy for her particular type of cancer was a Mt. Sinai grad who works in NY. So she packed her bags, and off she went.

Granted, Sinai isn't a super low-tier school by any means, but it's not Harvard or Hopkins either. Point is, some of the best doctors in various fields come from fairly random schools. My PI, one of the foremost authorities in his field, is a Utah grad. He is now a department head at Stanford. Another one of our attendings is a DO. Anyway, there are hundreds of these examples in every field. You REALLY aren't tied to your school's reputation. Would a huge name help your future? Probably. Would a not-so-huge name hinder your future? No. Ultimately that's all that matters.

Couldn't have said it better myself. Great anecdote, btw.

 

[PremedIowa]

This is absolutely true. In fact, I have an anecdote. One of my best friends from college is the daughter of two Hopkins doctors (ps. this is in no way a way to take a shot at Hopkins- it's a fabulous school). Her mom is a department head at Hopkins Med, and last year she was diagnosed with a really malignant lung cancer. Of course, she first went to a Hopkins oncologist, Harvard grad, Hopkins-trained. He, however, told her that her case was not an interesting research case and that he was not interested in seeing her as a patient. After some research, she found that the best guy for her particular type of cancer was a Mt. Sinai grad who works in NY. So she packed her bags, and off she went.

Granted, Sinai isn't a super low-tier school by any means, but it's not Harvard or Hopkins either. Point is, some of the best doctors in various fields come from fairly random schools. My PI, one of the foremost authorities in his field, is a Utah grad. He is now a department head at Stanford. Another one of our attendings is a DO. Anyway, there are hundreds of these examples in every field. You REALLY aren't tied to your school's reputation. Would a huge name help your future? Probably. Would a not-so-huge name hinder your future? No. Ultimately that's all that matters.

Even House doesn't sound like that much of a d-bag. Actually, he does, but it's allowed when you are a tv character. RL physician, not so much.

 

[Kaustikos]

Lets put this in perspective. Lets say YOU are a patient with a very serious medical condition. Whom are you more likely to entrust your life/well-being to? A doctor from Harvard with 20 years of experience or one from Medical College of Nowhere with 20 years of experience.

If it was my life on the line, I'd be inclined to go with the Harvard doc.

I'd go with this guy

Seriously, your statement has no bearing in this argument. Statical analysis would prove your point wrong if anyone ever wanted to be a big enough d-bag to ask that sort of question to patients. People want a doctor.

 

[cpants]

Lets put this in perspective. Lets say YOU are a patient with a very serious medical condition. Whom are you more likely to entrust your life/well-being to? A doctor from Harvard with 20 years of experience or one from Medical College of Nowhere with 20 years of experience.

If it was my life on the line, I'd be inclined to go with the Harvard doc.

Maybe if the only information you had was what medical school they went to, but no one is making choices like this in a vacuum. Which would you rather go to? The doctor who went to Harvard, did ok, and now practices in your community hospital, or a state school grad who is now chief of medicine at MGH and does research in the field of your illness? 20 years out from med school, the important thing is what the doctor has been doing during those past twenty years, not where he went to med school.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

For a bunch of smart kids you people sure are a bunch of *****s. You want to risk your entire dream to have a more prestigious piece of paper hanging in your office? How vain. And stupid.

Taking this step ensures that you will be rejected next year from the only schools which accepted you this year. So basically you will be reapplying to a list of schools which have already rejected you once. Keep in mind next year's applicant pool will be even more difficult than this year's, so you better have some significant improvements on your application. No, that doesn't mean improved interview skills. The schools will all be comparing your last year's application to the new one. The default option will be reject, unless there is significant reason to reevaluate.

If he's already been accepted to mid tier or low tier schools (like he has), and is very close to getting into top tier schools (like he is), then taking an extra year to improve his application will not hurt him. It is a certainty (i'd bet a nut on it) that he would get into medical school next year. He could just apply to the other 50 or 60 mid/low tier schools he didn't apply to this year while taking another shot at the top tier dream schools he would love to go to.

 

[cpants]

If he's already been accepted to mid tier or low tier schools (like he has), and is very close to getting into top tier schools (like he is), then taking an extra year to improve his application will not hurt him. It is a certainty (i'd bet a nut on it) that he would get into medical school next year. He could just apply to the other 50 or 60 mid/low tier schools he didn't apply to this year while taking another shot at the top tier dream schools he would love to go to.

There are no guarantees. Your chances would be better if you applied to 50-60 schools, true, but you'd also be out 7k+ for application fees alone. Not only that, but it's safe to assume that the OP applied to the schools he liked the most last year. So, even if we assume he will get into at least one school next year, he has to consider whether it's worth risking an acceptance that was on his top ~20 schools list for an acceptance at one of his top ~70 schools next year, just for the possibility of it being a dream school. Chances are good that he will like next year's acceptance even less than this year's.

Unfortunately, life isn't a Disney movie, and following your dreams often does not pay off.

 

[Chuck's Right Foot]

If he's already been accepted to mid tier or low tier schools (like he has), and is very close to getting into top tier schools (like he is), then taking an extra year to improve his application will not hurt him. It is a certainty (i'd bet a nut on it) that he would get into medical school next year. He could just apply to the other 50 or 60 mid/low tier schools he didn't apply to this year while taking another shot at the top tier dream schools he would love to go to.

It would hurt him in lost wages and retirement funding.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

There are no guarantees. Your chances would be better if you applied to 50-60 schools, true, but you'd also be out 7k+ for application fees alone. Not only that, but it's safe to assume that the OP applied to the schools he liked the most last year. So, even if we assume he will get into at least one school next year, he has to consider whether it's worth risking an acceptance that was on his top ~20 schools list for an acceptance at one of his top ~70 schools next year, just for the possibility of it being a dream school. Chances are good that he will like next year's acceptance even less than this year's.

Unfortunately, life isn't a Disney movie, and following your dreams often does not pay off.

Haha, no it's not a movie, but going for it won't hurt. Yes, he could end up in a school less desirable than those that he was accepted to this year, but that's the risk he has to decide on taking. If attending his state school or whatever other school he got into is going to be depressing, then he should try again next year.

 

[aznb0y129]

Haha, no it's not a movie, but going for it won't hurt. Yes, he could end up in a school less desirable than those that he was accepted to this year, but that's the risk he has to decide on taking. If attending his state school or whatever other school he got into is going to be depressing, then he should try again next year.

Unless of course, he doesn't get in anywhere next year, which is a very real possibility that you're ignoring.

 

[GoSpursGo]

Haha, no it's not a movie, but going for it won't hurt. Yes, he could end up in a school less desirable than those that he was accepted to this year, but that's the risk he has to decide on taking. If attending his state school or whatever other school he got into is going to be depressing, then he should try again next year.

No. He'll get over the "depression" of going to his state school in a lot less time than the year he'd lose by reapplying.

Also, really this thread is still going? I thought we decided last week the OP was a troll when he never showed up again.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

Unless of course, he doesn't get in anywhere next year, which is a very real possibility that you're ignoring.

There is no chance of that. Yes there are some factors that make the admissions process less than logical, but not to the point that his acceptance to at least one school would not be a certainty. If you've already been accepted to mid-tier schools, and have already interviewed at top tier schools, another year of improving your application will only make you more competitive. Admission to different mid tier / low tier schools is guaranteed.

 

[GoSpursGo]

There is no chance of that. Yes there are some factors that make the admissions process less than logical, but not to the point that his acceptance to at least one school would not be a certainty. If you've already been accepted to mid-tier schools, and have already interviewed at top tier schools, another year of improving your application will only make you more competitive. Admission to different mid tier / low tier schools is guaranteed.

Even if you accept that premise (which I don't, but it's been beaten to death), there is absolutely no way that the advantages of going to a slightly higher-ranked school outweigh the cost of waiting an extra year.

 

[aznb0y129]

There is no chance of that. Yes there are some factors that make the admissions process less than logical, but not to the point that his acceptance to at least one school would not be a certainty. If you've already been accepted to mid-tier schools, and have already interviewed at top tier schools, another year of improving your application will only make you more competitive. Admission to different mid tier / low tier schools is guaranteed.

Then we agree to disagree. I personally wouldn't take such a definitive stance on something that I feel is anything but definitive, but that's just me. Best of luck.

 

[umean2tellme]

Don't apply again b/c this process is too crazy to try and beat the odds twice and get accepted. You got in somewhere so just go there. It's not like the school is near a toxic waste dump or in the middle of a battlefield endangering your life. In the end you're going to be a doctor from an accredited medical school, that should be your only focus. Plus, who wants to wait another year when you can realize your dream now? Good luck.

 

[amph119]

I've asked several people about this question because I was curious, but one of the pieces of data out there says 1000 people or so get accepted but do not matriculate. Even if 10% of those are just waiting to reapply (a very low estimate), that's still a significant number that are doing so. I personally know several people who have done this. One went from Ohio State acceptance, Duke post-interview waitlist and subsequent rejection one year to a Duke acceptance on the first possible day the next year (or so he tells me). One was accepted to Harvard the next year (he didn't apply there first year, but received interviews at UChicago, Stanford, only to be rejected later on).

I really think SDN overthinks this idea of "if you weren't sure one year and you toss your acceptances, it's obvious you don't want to become a doctor." If you have the credentials, you will get in, regardless of applying the year before or not. Tossing acceptances to professional and graduate schools to reapply to more prestigious programs later on is not uncommon. Notice I didn't say it was common practice, but to think it isn't successfully done (probably most of the time, too) is kinda short-sighted.

The application process is not "random." It is just shrouded to those not privileged to its exact method of operation.

 

[WashMe]

I agree that this OP is prob a troll. To be honest, I considered tossing my WL's and reapplying. I would love to go to any of the 4 schools where I am currently WL'd, but this process made me think I couldn't succeed in medical school. I felt like I would be the guy about whom everybody would be saying, "He must be a guy who barely got in off the waitlist. He isn't really good enough and it shows."

In the end, I just said "F&*# it, I'll go to school whenever, wherever." Then I'll do everything in my power blow up with a 267 step I to give the finger to all the nay-saying adcoms.

 

[scarletgirl777]

i think i'm in a similar situation - i only applied to md/phd programs and only got an offer for a school in which i think the research labs are less cutting edge/interesting as opposed to other top tier schools. If it were only for the MD degree, i would take the offer with no hesitation. But I think where I do my PhD and what lab i work in plays an important factor, so i'm not sure what to do..

i obviously wish i could work in some of the most cutting edge labs, but also dont want to end up with no school to go to if i reapply

any thoughts?

I think this really is different. There's no point in suffering through a miserable graduate experience--if you hate all the topics available, that's not a good thing. Maybe you should research the program more carefully?