Very Nontraditional Student

[RustyCarpenter]

So I am your Nontraditional-nontraditional student. I recently immigrated to the US last year after I graduated my UG degree as BS Nursing (2012) and went into medical school for 2 years. I currently live in California. In my country, my overall grade was already considered as above average. I had my transcript evaluated and to my disapppointment, the 222 units I earned in my undergrad yielded a gpa of 2.67. I know that this gpa is extremely low for the US medical standards.

I definitely know that my chances to enter medical school here is extremely impossible. But I really want to try and wanted to be an MD.

I am now thinking of getting my prerequiaites again, like starting over since nursing doesnt give you the needed coursework for medicine, from a community college. I also looked through postbacs but all needed a gpa of atleast 3. My chances to get a second degree is also slim.

I talked to a volunteer prehealth advisor and already discouraged me. She said my best bet is to take the PA route or community college.

What do you guys think? I really want to be an MD, but with all these, should I not?

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[esob]

Sorry, but with a 2.67 GPA (and so many hours that it is not feasible to raise it substantially) there is basically zero chance of an allopathic school accepting you. With heavy grade replacement and a good MCAT you could apply to a D.O. school and have a shot if you retake and get all A's.

 

[LingoLaine]

Am I correct in assuming you are a non US-citizen? Unless you hold a green card, that is another HUGE barrier.

 

[RustyCarpenter]

Am I correct in assuming you are a non US-citizen? Unless you hold a green card, that is another HUGE barrier.

I am a green card holder.

 

[DrMidlife]

So I am your Nontraditional-nontraditional student.

It's a mistake to take on this nontrad forum in a "who is more nontrad" cage match.

I recently immigrated to the US last year after I graduated my UG degree as BS Nursing (2012) and went into medical school for 2 years.

That's all foreign coursework, correct?

Don't talk about it on SDN, but the reason you walked away from med school elsewhere is going to be relevant, and it's going to be challenged unless you're from like Syria.

I currently live in California.

Worst state for trying to get into med school. Consider moving to Ohio or Texas or Michigan or Louisiana. Between you and an understanding of why is about 100 hours of reading SDN posts.

In my country, my overall grade was already considered as above average. I had my transcript evaluated and to my disapppointment, the 222 units I earned in my undergrad yielded a gpa of 2.67. I know that this gpa is extremely low for the US medical standards...I definitely know that my chances to enter medical school here is extremely impossible. But I really want to try and wanted to be an MD.

Well, foreign GPAs are not taken seriously in general, but that applies when the foreign GPA is very high more than when it is very low. If the foreign GPA is included in cumulative GPA calcs (I have no idea if it is) then you have to spend more years getting into med school, than if you have a fresh start.

Regardless, the difference between success and failure for you in getting into a US med school is going to come down to 2 things:
1. Don't quit
2. Be the grownup in charge of the big picture and the details. Put in 100-1000 hours of reading SDN history from those who have made it into medicine from GPAs as bad as or worse than yours. There is no grownup who can figure things out for you, and you are competing with the hopes and dreams of the most successful individuals in the US, 60% of whom get rejected every year. Be the grownup.

I am now thinking of getting my prerequiaites again, like starting over since nursing doesnt give you the needed coursework for medicine,

You need to read up on what's required, and you need to be in charge of whether the basic advice applies to your situation. You're correct that nursing school science isn't premed work. If your prereqs were foreign, you have to take them in the US. You have to take much more than the prereqs.

from a community college.

Absolutely not. Your current academic story is 100% doubt and risk. Community college work adds to that doubt and risk. There are probably 7500 SDN discussions about this that you can read.

I also looked through postbacs but all needed a gpa of atleast 3.

Correct.

Also, "postbac" by definition is any undergrad coursework taken after completing a bachelors degree, so the word is a problem if you want to get good help. Be more specific in describing the coursework you need. Such as: "substantial additional undergrad coursework to redeem a sub-3.0 foreign GPA for a greencarded premed currently in Calfornia".

My chances to get a second degree is also slim.

Too bad. Doing a 2nd bachelors in a US university is almost certainly the best next thing you need to do. Finding solutions to whatever your problems are is your job.

Again, read the huge massive body of work on SDN discussing low GPA strategy.

I talked to a volunteer prehealth advisor and already discouraged me. She said my best bet is to take the PA route or community college.

Prehealth advisers get paid to help perfect premeds stay perfect. They have no idea what sub-3.0 greencarded Californians historically have done to get into med school, because they don't obsessively read SDN. That's your job.

What do you guys think? I really want to be an MD, but with all these, should I not?

Nobody who knows what they're talking about is going to offer you encouragement to pursue med school. If you need support and encouragement along the way, it's not going to come from the sources available to normal premeds.

If you're successful, you'll be a practicing US physician:
- 10+ years from now
- half a million US dollars from now
- multiple cross-country moves from now
- without enjoying most of the perks of being young
- with a very confused and alienated family that will continue to discourage you (and they are right to do so)

Also: make friends with DO. Definitely.

Best of luck to you.

 

[Seattle Mariners Fan]

https://www.aamc.org/download/321502/data/factstablea20.pdf

Median CA matriculant has a 32.6 and a 3.8 GPA.

 

[lilyzoo]

Hi I'm also a very nontraditional student. I got my BA in a foreign country with a GPA of 3.70 (WES evalutated). The good news is that AMCAS does not care about foreign GPAs, no matter it's a 3.70 or a 2.67. I'm doing a second bachelors... Plus, I have no green card yet. It will take me another two to three years to get my green card. So, do NOT be discouraged, OP. Your situation is better than mine!

 

[esob]

So, do be discouraged, OP. Your situation is better than mine!

Sorry, it's final's week and I couldn't help myself

 

[jl lin]

So I am your Nontraditional-nontraditional student. I recently immigrated to the US last year after I graduated my UG degree as BS Nursing (2012) and went into medical school for 2 years. I currently live in California. In my country, my overall grade was already considered as above average. I had my transcript evaluated and to my disapppointment, the 222 units I earned in my undergrad yielded a gpa of 2.67. I know that this gpa is extremely low for the US medical standards.

I definitely know that my chances to enter medical school here is extremely impossible. But I really want to try and wanted to be an MD.

I am now thinking of getting my prerequiaites again, like starting over since nursing doesnt give you the needed coursework for medicine, from a community college. I also looked through postbacs but all needed a gpa of atleast 3. My chances to get a second degree is also slim.

I talked to a volunteer prehealth advisor and already discouraged me. She said my best bet is to take the PA route or community college.

What do you guys think? I really want to be an MD, but with all these, should I not?

Move to Texas. Establish residency and hopefully it may only take you 2 years and you can naturalize and get a boatload of coursework done. Seriously.

 

[lilyzoo]

Sorry, it's final's week and I couldn't help myself

LOL!! Thanks for proofreading!

 

[DrMikeP]

When you say transcript evaluated, sometimes it's done officially and transfer courses officially entered into your transcript at a university. Then you're usually stuck with it. Sometimes unofficially where it's a we will potentially accept xyz at x GPA done by an advisor but not officially put in the system yet. You can often appeal or get corrections made IF you believe they are incorrect OR some colleges will allow a transfer in as pass/fail vs using your gpa. Even potentially better you could perhaps appeal and get them to not accept any courses. That usually means you have to start over in the US, which might be easier for you. Lots depends on the particular country and state of the transcript. Some schools think they are doing you a favor by accepting classes/scores just to get you closer to a degree, but for premed that's a potential kiss of death.

Something to first explorer before deciding how to proceed. If lucky you might can get them to say nothing will transfer, I've seen it happen with students from countries with a poor university system.

Best of luck



Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

 

[gyrfalcon]

Worst state for trying to get into med school. Consider moving to Ohio or Texas or Michigan or Louisiana. Between you and an understanding of why is about 100 hours of reading SDN posts.

Actually, this is one of the few cases where moving to Texas to establish residency would be a terrible idea. The Texas application system (TMDSAS) will list your foreign coursework with grades. The regular application system (AMCAS) will ignore your foreign coursework as long as you do not try to transfer those credits to a US university.

Get a copy of the AMCAS manual and read up on how they deal with foreign coursework. You may be in the position to start fresh on your GPA if you complete a new bachelor's degree in the US. If you try this, do NOT transfer your old courses to the US university to try to save on tuition. Just start from scratch.

 

[DrMidlife]

^^ grownup in charge.

 

[jl lin]

Actually, this is one of the few cases where moving to Texas to establish residency would be a terrible idea. The Texas application system (TMDSAS) will list your foreign coursework with grades. The regular application system (AMCAS) will ignore your foreign coursework as long as you do not try to transfer those credits to a US university.

Get a copy of the AMCAS manual and read up on how they deal with foreign coursework. You may be in the position to start fresh on your GPA if you complete a new bachelor's degree in the US. If you try this, do NOT transfer your old courses to the US university to try to save on tuition. Just start from scratch.

para1: So you are saying that this person, after establishing residency, could not be considered for Fresh Start? I mean yes. The approach is very time-consuming, but what isn't throughout the whole process?
para2: That's what I am saying.

It's all incredibly time-consuming. The only people that really "fast-track-it," if you want to call it that, are the non-trads that have their ducks in a row from high school, throughout undergrad, etc. And even for then it's time-consuming.

 

[gyrfalcon]

para1: So you are saying that this person, after establishing residency, could not be considered for Fresh Start? I mean yes. The approach is very time-consuming, but what isn't throughout the whole process?

The Texas academic Fresh Start program requires that there be 10 years since the last coursework was taken in order for the GPA to be ignored. In this case, RustyCarpenter would not be able to start on a new bachelor's in Texas until 2022. (S)he certainly could go that route, but it would take quite a bit longer than establishing residency in another state with plenty of in-state medical schools. In another state, the new degree could probably be started in the fall of 2017, if he/she moved this summer.

 

[jl lin]

The Texas academic Fresh Start program requires that there be 10 years since the last coursework was taken in order for the GPA to be ignored. In this case, RustyCarpenter would not be able to start on a new bachelor's in Texas until 2022. (S)he certainly could go that route, but it would take quite a bit longer than establishing residency in another state with plenty of in-state medical schools. In another state, the new degree could probably be started in the fall of 2017, if he/she moved this summer.

Thank you for your response. So then indeed it would not behoove the OP to transfer old courses outside the US. BTW, 10 years is quite a gap. Yikes.

 

[DrMidlife]

The Texas academic Fresh Start program requires that there be 10 years since the last coursework was taken in order for the GPA to be ignored. In this case, RustyCarpenter would not be able to start on a new bachelor's in Texas until 2022. (S)he certainly could go that route, but it would take quite a bit longer than establishing residency in another state with plenty of in-state medical schools. In another state, the new degree could probably be started in the fall of 2017, if he/she moved this summer.

Consider moving to Ohio or Texas or Michigan or Louisiana

I listed these states as possible alternatives to CA because they each have multiple public medical schools, not because of academic fresh start.

So we've ruled out Texas, on 2 counts now, but there are 45 other states plus PR to consider.

 

[RustyCarpenter]

After talking to another prehealth advisor and a program manager, I was able to get this info.

I could take my prerequisites again, all of them in a community college then apply for the academic finisher program in CSU Fullerton which offers higher division of sciences. The admission is competitive so, be sure to have a minimum of 3.0 gpa and volunteer work experiences. They would still consider my gpa out of the country, but when I explained to them how the grading system in my country doesn't really apply to the education system in the US. How rare it is for them to give As or a perfect 4.0. I also told them how in the US, for my course taken, should only be given 187 units. But I took a whooping 222 units from a structured program to graduate. They were actually impressed that I was able to get that heavy load. There was no assurance that I could be accepted. Only 3, 4 or 5 applicants from an average of 30 per year to enter the program. Hence, I need to work my ass off studying. And like what the above reply said, AMCAS don't consider foreign gpas unless transferred to a US school.

As a result, I gave it a thought for awhile if I am seriously taking this path again. In the end, I chose not to. At 24 years old, I decided to purse my nursig career first. May be earn a little then evaluate my choice again in the future. If I want to become an MD or DO, or pursue higher ed for nursing such as NP or a PA.

Thank you everyone.

To anyone who is on the same boat as I am, there is one way, above, on how to become a med student here in CA. No assurance though, but if you work hard, I think one can make it to med school.