Wait another year for MD or sludge through DO bias?

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I don't think I'm *that* ignorant. I have craptons of OBs in my family and I've shadowed actual residents, not private-practice Gyns. I'm vaguely familiar with the long hours. So much hubris.. wth is wrong w nursing now.

OHHHHH, pardon me. I didn't realize you had shadowing experience! I take it all back.

Nothing's wrong with nursing. However you foolishly think by waiting another year you will be bestowed with MD acceptances next year. You likely won't. And those DO schools will see a gap year and know you are only applying to DO because you didn't get into MD the previous cycle.

End result: no one let's you in.

Alas, have fun in nursing school.

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OHHHHH, pardon me. I didn't realize you had shadowing experience! I take it all back.

Nothing's wrong with nursing. However you foolishly think by waiting another year you will be bestowed with MD acceptances next year. You likely won't. And those DO schools will see a gap year and know you are only applying to DO because you didn't get into MD the previous cycle.

End result: no one let's you in.

Alas, have fun in nursing school.

I only applied to MD schools last year and I was accepted at two DO schools this year (so far).

Obviously it will vary person to person, but it's def possible.
 
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OHHHHH, pardon me. I didn't realize you had shadowing experience! I take it all back.

Nothing's wrong with nursing. However you foolishly think by waiting another year you will be bestowed with MD acceptances next year. You likely won't. And those DO schools will see a gap year and know you are only applying to DO because you didn't get into MD the previous cycle.

End result: no one let's you in.

Alas, have fun in nursing school.

MANY people get in after unsuccessful cycles. Gap years are a GOOD thing so long as you did something with yourself in the meantime.
 
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Dude just go DO. If you do well in med school and on your boards you will get a good residency. Period. Or you can wait another year and reapply MD with, but who says that you will get in second time around? Plus remember that if you don't get in second time around you will not get into any DO schools after turning down acceptances this cycle so you had better be damn sure that you get in or you might find yourself blacklisted from both programs. Also remember, If you do get into an MD school it doesn't automatically mean big shot residency, there is still that little problem of getting good grades and board scores.
 
I only applied to MD schools last year and I was accepted at two DO schools this year (so far).

Obviously it will vary person to person, but it's def possible.

Of course it's possible. It's also possible to get into an MD school during your first application cycle. Doesn't mean it'll happen...right OP?
 
Dude just go DO. If you do well in med school and on your boards you will get a good residency. Period. Or you can wait another year and reapply MD with, but who says that you will get in second time around? Plus remember that if you don't get in second time around you will not get into any DO schools after turning down acceptances this cycle so you had better be damn sure that you get in or you might find yourself blacklisted from both programs. Also remember, If you do get into an MD school it doesn't automatically mean big shot residency, there is still that little problem of getting good grades and board scores.

I find it funny how SDN seems to throw that little tidbit out there as if there is no logical reason to object to it.

Seriously though OP, if your objections to going DO are related to your ego or prestige those are very poor reasons (for the record I don't think those are your objections). The general consensus is it is still manageable to match into Ob/Gyn if you want to going DO. It might not be somewhere like Penn, Temple or where ever but you're still an Ob/Gyn at the end of the day if that is what you really care about.
 
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I read your thread in the Reapplicant's forum.

Honestly, you should take your acceptance and run with it, because unless you want to risk it all on an SMP, your chances of gaining acceptance to MD next year (or DO in the future without a major upgrade to your applicant profile) are much less than your chances of matching to a competitive OB residency in PA or NY/NJ etc.

Take what you've been given, perform to your absolute best, and I promise you things will turn out well for you. You may not be the next Rudolph Virchow, but you'll be a good Physician (even Obstetrician if that's still where your interests lie) which should be all that matters at this point.
 
I find it funny how SDN seems to throw that little tidbit out there as if there is no logical reason to object to it.

Seriously though OP, if your objections to going DO are related to your ego or prestige those are very poor reasons (for the record I don't think those are your objections). The general consensus is it is still manageable to match into Ob/Gyn if you want to going DO. It might not be somewhere like Penn, Temple or where ever but you're still an Ob/Gyn at the end of the day if that is what you really care about.

There is. It's been discussed ad nauseum on SDN.
 
Ok 1/2 of this thread was constructive and the other half was vitriol. but what did i expect? Thanks for those who answered... My question was about staying in this region, not about prestige. Last post I will make so I can end the poo-slinging. I will go DO, and I am thankful for it! (I just got scared for a sec.) ENDOFTRANSMISSION.
 
OP, it would help if you gave us a little bit of your stats and app. If you are trying to get into MD school with a 3.3 and 22 MCAT, ur gonna have a bad time.
 
OP, it would help if you gave us a little bit of your stats and app. If you are trying to get into MD school with a 3.3 and 22 MCAT, ur gonna have a bad time.

The question wasn't about my competitiveness for MD (although tangentially related), it was just about waiting another year in order stay in the immediate region. But, I see now that there are many other progs in the area. :)
 
Last post I will make so I can end the poo-slinging. I will go DO, and I am thankful for it! (I just got scared for a sec.) ENDOFTRANSMISSION.



The question wasn't about my competitiveness for MD (although tangentially related), it was just about waiting another year in order stay in the immediate region. But, I see now that there are many other progs in the area. :)

:shrug:
 
There is. It's been discussed ad nauseum on SDN.

Point taken. I think I had more the people who are inclined to saying 'go DO' as if there are no consequences to doing so or the only reason someone wouldn't want to go is because they're a prestige ***** or their ego is too big. -Edit- That isn't to say it doesn't happen however.

That aside, good luck OP. :thumbup:
 
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This wasn't meant to be inflammatory, though sorry for using such words as "sludge" and "relegating".... Just look two threads down, "would you have gone MD if you were accepted?" Same crap, different smell.

No worries, OP. You didn't offend me. I just kind of liked the imagery you used. I definitely see your point, too. I've seen a lot of residency websites devoid of DO's and it makes me wonder why as well. I really have come to the conclusion though that I will be able to go anywhere I want as a DO. There will be certain residencies in any field (some fields more than others) that I won't get in it, no matter my board scores or grades. . There are, however, residencies in every field that will take DO's. I've also noticed that this is relatively independent of the residency's 'prestige.' Some really prestigious residencies do take DO's, some unheard of residencies don't. Moreover, as a lot of medical students have pointed out, it's really hard for us as premeds to judge the quality of a residency. A big brand name sometimes =/= the best training.

That's funny because there were FMGs on these lists and no DOs. So uh, maybe?

Excellent point. One that I don't think many pre-meds realize. When you hear people say certain residency programs don't accept DOs but they accept FMGs, they may not realize that these FMGs are not often coming from Ross, SGU, etc. They are coming from places like Germany, India, China, etc. I would also suspect that these are rock-star applicants.

Some of them are accepting FMG's/IMG's from Ross, SGU, etc. But those schools have waaaaay bigger graduating classes than typical US schools. Just because a school has a lot of FMG's doesn't mean it doesn't reject 85% of the FMGs that apply.
 
The question wasn't about my competitiveness for MD (although tangentially related), it was just about waiting another year in order stay in the immediate region.

......It's seems silly to wait another year for MD. but SDN is making me poop my pants... :scared:

I think this is where the "vitriol" half probably went astray. It sounded like you thought you could wait a year and maybe get into MD next year.

Sorry if my post came off as too harsh.
 
I won't do it. You might end up with nothing next cycle. Go for what you have right now.
 
Some of them are accepting FMG's/IMG's from Ross, SGU, etc. But those schools have waaaaay bigger graduating classes than typical US schools. Just because a school has a lot of FMG's doesn't mean it doesn't reject 85% of the FMGs that apply.

Oh no doubt. OP was talking about OB/GYN programs and I was talking about some of the neuro programs I've researched. Although, looking back I didn't specify that at all. Oops.

Anyways, I'm not losing any sleep over the fact that it's probably not worth applying to them when that time comes. It is what it is.
 
The "bias" against DOs exists only in the minds of pre-meds here on SDN, and maybe in MDs >60 years old.



Sorry to spam up the place - I posted in the OB forum, but not sure if this belongs here. :oops:

I'm from PA/NJ area and kind of want to stick around.. but I didn't get into any MD schools so far (all north eastern DO) and reading these MD vs. DO threads is starting to freak me the F out.. For what its worth, I'm interested in OB/gyn. I know I'm totally premature in asking this, but what programs/hospitals should i NOT even consider elective rotations at because the chance of a DO getting residency is still stacked against them even after a brief stint in- house...hell, getting residency period statistically seems immensely difficult.. Looking at the current resident lists for lots of the programs I'm interested in NO DOs. Boo...anyway, should I forget competitive places like penn Hosp, Drexel, Jeff, (and anything in MA/CT/RI) as a DO? I've tried contacting their residency coordinators/offices and no one has the time to talk with me regarding these issues. Should I warm up to the idea of moving to the midwest?......It's seems silly to wait another year for MD. but SDN is making me poop my pants... :scared:
 
The "bias" against DOs exists only in the minds of pre-meds here on SDN, and maybe in MDs >60 years old.

i.e. Program Directors :thumbup: Yep. Only in those two groups
 
All my program directors would be offended you assumed them to be >60, haha.

I knew I was gunna get called out for the age thing :D

but still. We go round and round and round with this. Defining a bias is different than stating that DOs are locked into primary care or AOA programs. DOs do go everywhere (obviously not talking to you at this point), but it is at a reduced rate. The osteo forum has plenty of threads from interviewing MS4s detailing how the bias has impacted them, so to boil it down to nothing except SDN superstition and old man bigotry is somewhat inaccurate.

However, I do think the bias has been overstated in this thread.
 
Technically this is a two-sided fence.

It is indeed. MDs, ACGME, and a few DOs on one side, and the rest of the DOs on the other side with the AOA.
 
I guess there's no problem with shutting the DO door for the possibility of getting into MD, considering none of them wanted you this time around :rolleyes:
 
It is indeed. MDs, ACGME, and a few DOs on one side, and the rest of the DOs on the other side with the AOA.

Hmmm...if you're talking about competitive residencies (which is the only context that matters here) then not really.

More accurately:

On one side, a few MDs and a few DOs on one side and DOs alone on the other.

(The ACGME and AOA are slapping each other on top of the fence)



*so the question for some is, would you rather squeak into an MD school, or be a top DO candidate. Not a clear cut answer, especially with the combined match and accreditation at hand.
 
Hmmm...if you're talking about competitive residencies (which is the only context that matters here) then not really.

More accurately:

On one side, a few MDs and a few DOs on one side and DOs alone on the other.

(The ACGME and AOA are slapping each other on top of the fence)



*so the question for some is, would you rather squeak into an MD school, or be a top DO candidate. Not a clear cut answer, especially with the combined match and accreditation at hand.

I don't follow...? Since when are there any AOA residencies that are more competitive than the top ACGME residencies?

Also, squeaking into MD school and being a top DO candidate have no bearing on how well you will do in school. We all assume/hope/aspire to be top of our class (at least I hope we all do) and to say (not that you have) or even to insinuate (not that you have) that it would be easier to be top of your class at a DO school than an MD school says only that you think that DO students are dumber than MD students.
 
Hmmm...if you're talking about competitive residencies (which is the only context that matters here) then not really.

More accurately:

On one side, a few MDs and a few DOs on one side and DOs alone on the other.

(The ACGME and AOA are slapping each other on top of the fence)



*so the question for some is, would you rather squeak into an MD school, or be a top DO candidate. Not a clear cut answer, especially with the combined match and accreditation at hand.

There aren't a few MD on one side of the fence. All of the MD's are on that side of the fence.
 
Round and round ...These threads make me dizzy

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Honestly I find it somewhat incredible. Seems there has been an above average amount of them lately as well.

Was noticing that as well. I think its because acceptances have started to go out and people are starting to wonder if they REALLY want to deal with the disadvantages of DO. Or if they can justify going that route....meh.
 
Was noticing that as well. I think its because acceptances have started to go out and people are starting to wonder if they REALLY want to deal with the disadvantages of DO. Or if they can justify going that route....meh.

Damn kids :rolleyes:
 
Was noticing that as well. I think its because acceptances have started to go out and people are starting to wonder if they REALLY want to deal with the disadvantages of DO. Or if they can justify going that route....meh.

Guilty.

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Guilty.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using SDN Mobile

;) I didnt mean you bro. Just the insecure kiddies that get hurt when people say D.O's have a harder time matching competitively.
 
;) I didnt mean you bro. Just the insecure kiddies that get hurt when people say D.O's have a harder time matching competitively.

Oh I know, but I'm still guilty.

Me at start of cycle: Please someone just let me in, I don't even care where I end up.
Me after getting into DO and having several interviews: Sweet, now which of these DO schools will be best.
Me after getting 5-6 MD interviews: Really hope I get into MD. I don't want to deal with anti-DO bias.
Me after getting into MD: Ok, now I need to get into the one I think is the best fit and figure out how to get scholarships.

Imo it's natural to change your goals as you achieve them. Constant improvement is important to me. Some people call it greed, I call it not being complacent.
 
Oh I know, but I'm still guilty.

Me at start of cycle: Please someone just let me in, I don't even care where I end up.
Me after getting into DO and having several interviews: Sweet, now which of these DO schools will be best.
Me after getting 5-6 MD interviews: Really hope I get into MD. I don't want to deal with anti-DO bias.
Me after getting into MD: Ok, now I need to get into the one I think is the best fit and figure out how to get scholarships.

Imo it's natural to change your goals as you achieve them. Constant improvement is important to me. Some people call it greed, I call it not being complacent.
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I'll never join you! Jedi's have their own delicious cookies.
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OP, If you want some perspective, I attended an SMP program and everyone was there because they wanted an MD. I knew a few people who had been admitted to DO schools previously who passed it up to go for the MD. Classmates of mine who clearly could have been accepted to DO schools simply didn't want to attend them. Take that for what you think it's worth. If you just want to be a GYN and you are OK with training at community and low/mid tier academic places, I think DO is fine. As I said earlier, check to see if the school allows deferrals. G'luck

My $0.02
 
OP, If you want some perspective, I attended an SMP program and everyone was there because they wanted an MD. I knew a few people who had been admitted to DO schools previously who passed it up to go for the MD. Classmates of mine who clearly could have been accepted to DO schools simply didn't want to attend them. Take that for what you think it's worth. If you just want to be a GYN and you are OK with training at community and low/mid tier academic places, I think DO is fine. As I said earlier, check to see if the school allows deferrals. G'luck

My $0.02

I know people who have done this as well. Some were successful going MD last cycle, others applied with me this cycle and have not yet been accepted.

I personally would not do it, but I'm not deadset on some super competitive specialty. As of right now I'm most interested in IM/EM because I want to start a clinic in an urban underserved area. Can easily do that as a DO. Regardless though, I think the one thing you have to ask yourself when considering turning down DO and reapplying hoping for MD is what you can do in a year to make yourself more competitive. In my case, the weakest part of my app is my GPA. I don't have the money to do an SMP and continuing to take classes at a community college isn't going to do much for me. Your situation may be different.
 
I know people who have done this as well. Some were successful going MD last cycle, others applied with me this cycle and have not yet been accepted.

I personally would not do it, but I'm not deadset on some super competitive specialty. As of right now I'm most interested in IM/EM because I want to start a clinic in an urban underserved area. Can easily do that as a DO. Regardless though, I think the one thing you have to ask yourself when considering turning down DO and reapplying hoping for MD is what you can do in a year to make yourself more competitive. In my case, the weakest part of my app is my GPA. I don't have the money to do an SMP and continuing to take classes at a community college isn't going to do much for me. Your situation may be different.

Yup. I'd say if you just want to serve the underserved in a clinic then go DO. No problem there.
 
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