Waking up without waking spouse?

[PL198]

I fully respect differences of opinion. But it is MY opinion that some of your comments are very disrespectful towards women and that you lack understanding of the teamwork of a relationship. You can either learn something from a different viewpoint or ignore it and continue on your merry way.

I'd say yours are the ones that are disrespectful. Mine empower the women to realize that they can do something about it themselves, yours are all about the man doing something so the woman doesn't have to. Funny how that works, eh?

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[operaman]

I love how all the older married guys are quietly shaking theirs heads laughing at the comments from the young, unmarried ones.

All I can say is: I hope your approach ends up working out for you, I really do. Good luck with it all!

 

[PL198]

I like how "You knew what it was like" or "You knew what you were getting" when you married me, is somehow the go to excuse that physicians can use in all situations. Relationships change over time, people have children, and life events happen. People's marriages aren't static from their wedding day.

It's unbelievably selfish to believe that bc you're a physician, the other spouse should bend their will completely towards you bc you're special. I knew a woman who married her high school sweetheart who was an orthopedic surgeon, and she was telling me she literally had to tell him to stop ordering her to do things, bc he was so used to the hospital where he could tell nurses to do something and they would do it and was used to always getting what he wants.

I've made it clear that it has nothing to do with being a physician...

 

[Ismet]

I'd say yours are the ones that are disrespectful. Mine empower the women to realize that they can do something about it themselves, yours are all about the man doing something so the woman doesn't have to. Funny how that works, eh?

What are you even talking about? Every post of mine in this thread has highlighted the importance of discussing it with each other and mutually coming to a solution. My goodness.

 

[PL198]

What are you even talking about? Every post of mine in this thread has highlighted the importance of discussing it with each other and mutually coming to a solution. My goodness.

Exactly. Why does she need to discuss it first? If she can do something on her own about it, why wouldn't you encourage that first? If I have a problem I can fix without talking to my SO about it, I do it, because why waste their time or effort if it's something I can readily handle myself? hmmmmm

 

[Robotman]

Get a mistress and sleep at the mistress' place and see if she complains.

 

[Ismet]

Exactly. Why does she need to discuss it first? If she can do something on her own about it, why wouldn't you encourage that first? If I have a problem I can fix without talking to my SO about it, I do it, because why waste their time or effort if it's something I can readily handle myself? hmmmmm

I'm not sure if you're trolling or if you really don't get it.

The issue has to do with both parties, as do most issues in a relationship. Husband needs to get up to go to work, wife would prefer not to wake up that early. Some people can't just fall back to sleep easily or there are other reasons that honestly aren't our business. Husband and wife should both discuss their wants and needs and figure out a solution that works for both of them. An earlier poster said that it wasn't the alarm clock, it was rummaging around in the closet that woke the wife. So he learned that laying out clothes the night before would alleviate the problem. Maybe they have a crappy bed that creaks and makes a lot of noise when one person gets up. Who knows. But the same brainstorming of ideas that OP got from this thread can potentially also be obtained from discussing the problem with his wife.

 

[Armadillos]

Skipped most the thread b/c it looked to be going badly. But has she tried using foam ear plugs? Seems like the sort of thing that wouldnt actually work, but works really well for my wife.

Do you set alarms that sound different? After awhile its gotten to the point where my alarm wont wake up my wife b/c somehow she knows its not hers.

Is getting a bigger/nicer mattress an option?

Also guessing you've already done this, but we store stuff in our house so that I can get out of bed, immediately walk out bed room door and never have to open the door again so she won't be continually bothered.

 

[PL198]

I'm not sure if you're trolling or if you really don't get it.

The issue has to do with both parties, as do most issues in a relationship. Husband needs to get up to go to work, wife would prefer not to wake up that early. Some people can't just fall back to sleep easily or there are other reasons that honestly aren't our business. Husband and wife should both discuss their wants and needs and figure out a solution that works for both of them. An earlier poster said that it wasn't the alarm clock, it was rummaging around in the closet that woke the wife. So he learned that laying out clothes the night before would alleviate the problem. Maybe they have a crappy bed that creaks and makes a lot of noise when one person gets up. Who knows. But the same brainstorming of ideas that OP got from this thread can potentially also be obtained from discussing the problem with his wife.

Or they can just do something on their own, like get up earlier. but that wouldn't even cross your mind, of course not.

 

[Ismet]

Or they can just do something on their own, like get up earlier. but that wouldn't even cross your mind, of course not.

We can just agree to disagree. Of course that is a solution, but perhaps that is not a viable solution for whatever reason. Communication is important in a relationship, lack of communication leads to problems and resentment. I grew up with that lack of communication in my house, and it's not pleasant for anyone involved, especially for the kids who get caught in the middle. Maybe that's why I have such a strong opinion about it now, I don't know.

Anyway, we don't know the whole story so we can throw out good suggestions all day, but ultimately it's a decision for the couple to make.

 

[Neurophage]

My wife is a very light sleeper. I could sleep through WWIII. She's getting tired of waking up with me at 0430. This could be a problem in the long run (If mamma ain't happy, ain't nobody happy). Thoughts on how to wake up reliably without waking her?

Thinking about trying vibrating watch of some variety. Any recommendations? Thanks in advance.

Hey Numberwunn,

That's a tough situation - my heart goes out to you guys. In my marriage I'm the bad sleeper, so our issues are a little different. My apologies if these are obvious, but here are some things that help:

• Use a white noise machine. When I worked graveyard and had a noisy roommate, this was amazing. The basic idea is that if you're constantly hearing the full spectrum of sound waves, hearing more won't disturb you (as much). My wife hated it and thought she'd never get used to it, but after a couple weeks she was fine with it. Sometimes I sleep through her alarm which is not close to my head, but not always.
• Switch to a memory foam or latex mattress - they isolate motion more. Switching from spring to latex made a huge difference for us, and I sometimes sleep through my wife getting up to use the bathroom.
• If possible, wake up at the same time every day, even if it's a crappy time. Eventually you might start to beat your alarm.

Also, better sleep hygiene in general might help her sleep more deeply. For example:

• Use blue light blocking glasses a few hours before bedtime
• Get blackout curtains
• Buy an air conditioner and keep the temperature comfortable
• Reduce or eliminate caffeine

 

[DarknightX]

To address all the ridiculous responses, my view it has nothing to do with the fact that the OP is a doctor/med student. That is completely irrelevant.
What is relevant is that he is waking up at 4:30 to go to work. He's not waking up to go fishing, play video games, or catch a flight to go on a trip with his buddies. He's working. I don't care if he's a f-ing janitor. His wife needs to learn to deal with it, just like men also need to learn to deal with their wives waking up early to go to work.

A lot of these responses absolutely baffle me. If I'm married to someone and she has to go to work early, it would ridiculous for me to be upset about it and vice versa. Also, sorry to burst everyone's bubble here, but doctors aren't exclusive to this problem. Starbucks opens up at 5 am, somebody has to wake up early to open it up. Many fast food places are open all night, somebody has to stay up all night and work at that place.

 

[DermViser]

I'd say yours are the ones that are disrespectful. Mine empower the women to realize that they can do something about it themselves, yours are all about the man doing something so the woman doesn't have to. Funny how that works, eh?

Are you seriously making the argument that your opinions here "empower" women? God, I hope you're joking.

 

[DermViser]

I've made it clear that it has nothing to do with being a physician...

Right. It has more to do with the fact that you'll be making a big paycheck. You essentially want your wife to not complain bc you're bringing home a huge slab of bacon.

 

[PL198]

Are you seriously making the argument that your opinions here "empower" women? God, I hope you're joking.

How do they not? I'm saying they have the capabilities to handle the problem on their own. Other people are saying they need the man's input on how to solve the problem. Why is that?

 

[DermViser]

To address all the ridiculous responses, my view it has nothing to do with the fact that the OP is a doctor/med student. That is completely irrelevant.
What is relevant is that he is waking up at 4:30 to go to work. He's not waking up to go fishing, play video games, or catch a flight to go on a trip with his buddies. He's working. I don't care if he's a f-ing janitor. His wife needs to learn to deal with it, just like men also need to learn to deal with their wives waking up early to go to work.

A lot of these responses absolutely baffle me. If I'm married to someone and she has to go to work early, it would ridiculous for me to be upset about it and vice versa. Also, sorry to burst everyone's bubble here, but doctors aren't exclusive to this problem. Starbucks opens up at 5 am, somebody has to wake up early to open it up. Many fast food places are open all night, somebody has to stay up all night and work at that place.

He's not a doctor, he's a medical student.

 

[DermViser]

How do they not? I'm saying they have the capabilities to handle the problem on their own. Other people are saying they need the man's input on how to solve the problem. Why is that?

You realize if the genders were reversed our answers would be exactly the same? This isn't a gender issue.

 

[Ismet]

How do they not? I'm saying they have the capabilities to handle the problem on their own. Other people are saying they need the man's input on how to solve the problem. Why is that?

Because it is a relationship issue. There are two people in the relationship. It's not a gender issue of "needing a man's input to solve the problem." It's an issue of two people figuring out what works best for their marriage and lifestyle. I would say the same if OP were a woman or if the couple was same-sex.

 

[DermViser]

Exactly. Why does she need to discuss it first? If she can do something on her own about it, why wouldn't you encourage that first? If I have a problem I can fix without talking to my SO about it, I do it, because why waste their time or effort if it's something I can readily handle myself? hmmmmm

Heck, why bother even discussing and talking with each other at all? She signed up for it, amirite? Newsflash: Communication in a marriage is always good. If you feel differently, marry a mute.

 

[PL198]

You realize if the genders were reversed our answers would be exactly the same? This isn't a gender issue.

No way. The responses would be " your wife is getting up at a very early hour, to make money for your family, sleep with a pillow over your head." or something similar. I mean come on, let's not white knight here.

 

[DermViser]

Because it is a relationship issue. There are two people in the relationship. It's not a gender issue of "needing a man's input to solve the problem." It's an issue of two people figuring out what works best for their marriage and lifestyle. I would say the same if OP were a woman or if the couple was same-sex.

I just realized if he graduated HS in 2011 that means he's at most, 21 years old now (he's currently in what would be a traditional MS-2), essentially a junior in undergrad. It explains a lot of his black-and-white viewpoint, which just needs maturity to set in - which will come with time.

 

[DermViser]

No way. The responses would be " your wife is getting up at a very early hour, to make money for your family, sleep with a pillow over your head." or something similar. I mean come on, let's not white knight here.

No, not really. Have you actually seen married females in medical school who aren't married to a medical student/physician (maybe not, bc you're in an accelerated BS/MD from high school)? They're all the time evaluating and second-guessing how their actions impact their families who are dragged along for the ride, esp. if they have children.

The issue here is communicating with your spouse in a marriage, which is what @Ismet is pretty clearly getting at, which you're confusing with genders for some reason.

 

[Ismet]

I just realized if he graduated HS in 2011 that means he's at most, 21 years old (he's currently in what would be a traditional MS-2), essentially a junior in undergrad. It explains a lot of his viewpoint, which just needs maturity to set in - which will come with time.

Let's hope so. Although I do know several older people with these same viewpoints, but interestingly enough they've either never been in a serious relationship or they/their partner are miserable in their relationship/divorced.

 

[DermViser]

Let's hope so. Although I do know several older people with these same viewpoints, but interestingly enough they've either never been in a serious relationship or they/their partner are miserable in their relationship/divorced.

And now it's easier to understand why residencies question the maturity of those from accelerated BS/MD programs: http://www.studentdoctor.net/2012/08/accelerated-bsmd-programs-what-you-need-to-know/

Some things you just can't speed up.

 

[BurghStudent]

I'm hardly someone to be a feminist, but why should his wife give a **** that he's a soon-to-be doctor? Bc of the possibility of his future salary in a field he has yet to match into? I'm pretty sure wives (esp. ones that work) want a lot more in a marriage than the pay check you're bringing home. Just ask the neurosurgeons.

I was kind of hoping the Benjamins would suffice. The further along I go, the greater my aversion to marriage.

 

[PL198]

Let's hope so. Although I do know several older people with these same viewpoints, but interestingly enough they've either never been in a serious relationship or they/their partner are miserable in their relationship/divorced.

interesting, so the increasingly high divorce rates, along with decreasing amounts of happiness in marriage, those don't tell you anything about advocating for the exact same dynamics? I suppose your answer is more communication?

I have know tons of people that are both engaged or married. I don't think it's black and white, I just think that each person can do a whole lot more individually before needing to even consult the other person. People are supposed to be in a relationship that has an positive value to them. Because of this, I'm not going to negatively share with someone about an action, if I can easily address it myself. I'm not against communication, just saying the first step shouldn't be to talk to your spouse. Why bring up an issue when you can fix it fast on your own? If something is significant, absolutely bring it up. Not advocating for hiding stuff. Just saying that if every little road bump is talked about together, you end up thinking they're much bigger things than they really are.

 

[PL198]

And now it's easier to understand why residencies question the maturity of those from accelerated BS/MD programs: http://www.studentdoctor.net/2012/08/accelerated-bsmd-programs-what-you-need-to-know/

Some things you just can't speed up.

lol which is funny because I actually agree with that and support bs/mds being removed. however I'm not really sure how this supports that and I'm pretty sure it's clear from previous postings that I'm a bit ahead of the average one in terms of maturity level(money,future opportunities, clinical conduct, etc etc etc). Not sure how having one specific viewpoint changes that, but hey to each their own.

 

[xffan624]

interesting, so the increasingly high divorce rates, along with decreasing amounts of happiness in marriage, those don't tell you anything about advocating for the exact same dynamics? I suppose your answer is more communication?

I have know tons of people that are both engaged or married. I don't think it's black and white, I just think that each person can do a whole lot more individually before needing to even consult the other person. People are supposed to be in a relationship that has an positive value to them. Because of this, I'm not going to negatively share with someone about an action, if I can easily address it myself. I'm not against communication, just saying the first step shouldn't be to talk to your spouse. Why bring up an issue when you can fix it fast on your own? If something is significant, absolutely bring it up. Not advocating for hiding stuff. Just saying that if every little road bump is talked about together, you end up thinking they're much bigger things than they really are.

My ex probably had that same philosophy of not bringing up little things. I would have to directly ask him if he was mad about something because he wouldn't tell me otherwise. Needless to say, we're not together anymore. His "mature" solution to the problem was to move out of my place in the middle of my anatomy lab and not tell me.

 

[Arkangeloid]

I'd say they're dumb then for not finding out and that it's their fault. They are investing themselves into a relationship and didn't understand how it would be? Their fault, which also is backed up by the fact that the average layperson is dumb.

If she worked so late that she was never home and didn't want to have any fun, I'd either deal with it or leave. I'm never going to complain though. There is literally nothing more negative for relationships than complaint in my opinion. It's like anthrax for your relationship I swear.

Oh come on, think about how many public misconceptions there are of what our lives are like. Then remember that your future wife is a member of this public.

 

[PL198]

My ex probably had that same philosophy of not bringing up little things. I would have to directly ask him if he was mad about something because he wouldn't tell me otherwise. Needless to say, we're not together anymore. His "mature" solution to the problem was to move out of my place in the middle of my anatomy lab and not tell me.

Assuming you're a rational, mature person, then I feel his solution was immature and that it would have been more respectful and mature to do that all in person. If you're irrational and immature, then I understand his position in terms of doing it to avoid a blow up, but I also realize it would be difficult to go through for you.

However my problem is when you said you had to ask him. to me that makes it sound like he was passive aggressive and you knew he was mad about something, but you asked to get him to talk about it. that's sh*tty behavior on his part in my opinion. I mean actually not bringing things up and being outwardly normal.

 

[drcrispmd]

First, knowing people who are in a serious relationship/engaged/married does not make anyone an expert on what it is like to be married. Especially as a med student.

Dealing with things that bother you in the marriage alone will push you apart. It can cause resentment. Apparently my ex hubby had an issue with me
"wasting money" going to medical school when I had a perfectly good job that I hated (pharmacy tech). I did not know this until we were going through our divorce. He had had enough of me always being away (even though he was military and was stationed in Turkey at the time). We did not have good communication. I would a lot of times not bring issues up because I knew he would get mad and tell me to deal with it because I put is us that situation. Trust me, you do not want to be going through a divorce and applying for residency at the same time.
It is a good idea to discuss different options on morning routine with your spouse. Like I said before, when you match, you will need to have the discussion about what your schedule will be like as an intern and resident so there are so not as many surprises the spouse will know kinda what to expect.

 

[DermViser]

lol which is funny because I actually agree with that and support bs/mds being removed. however I'm not really
sure how this supports that and I'm pretty sure it's clear from previous postings that I'm a bit ahead of the average one in terms of maturity level(money,future opportunities, clinical conduct, etc etc etc). Not sure how having one specific viewpoint changes that, but hey to each their own.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/artificial-maturity/201211/the-marks-maturity
http://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebat.../adulthood-what-the-brain-says-about-maturity

Maturity level isn't defined as "money, future opportunities, clinical conduct". Maturity is a learned behavior and worldview that usually develops and changes with age and experience, which as a 21 year old you naturally would not have. Heck you just recently reached the legal age to drink this year! You can speed up the prerequisites by cutting things out, but you can't speed up the maturation process. There's a very good reason that medical education in the United States as a whole, has not gone and adopted the 6 year model from high school en masse that all other countries in the world have.

Even at Northwestern's HPME program, people say the HPME stood for "High Potential, Mediocre Effort" ---> that's indicative of maturity.

 

[DermViser]

My ex probably had that same philosophy of not bringing up little things. I would have to directly ask him if he was mad about something because he wouldn't tell me otherwise. Needless to say, we're not together anymore. His "mature" solution to the problem was to move out of my place in the middle of my anatomy lab and not tell me.

 

[PL198]

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/artificial-maturity/201211/the-marks-maturity
http://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebat.../adulthood-what-the-brain-says-about-maturity

Maturity level isn't defined as "money, future opportunities, clinical conduct". Maturity is a learned behavior and worldview that usually develops and changes with age and experience, which as a 21 year old you naturally would not have. Heck you just recently reached the legal age to drink this year! You can speed up the prerequisites by cutting things out, but you can't speed up the maturation process. There's a very good reason that medical education in the United States as a whole, has not gone and adopted the 6 year model from high school en masse that all other countries in the world have.

Even at Northwestern's HPME program, people say the HPME stood for "High Potential, Mediocre Effort".

Nothing of what you just said addressed my last post. I'm not saying I have the wisdom of a 60 yr old. I'm saying that the avg 21 yr old is drinking booze and thinks investing is stupid.

 

[Kahreek]

tell her to wake up at the same hour, no need to sleep late, even if you don't have to work, so many great things can be done in the morning

 

[DermViser]

Nothing of what you just said addressed my last post. I'm not saying I have the wisdom of a 60 yr old. I'm saying that the avg 21 yr old is drinking booze and thinks investing is stupid.

No one said you have/should have the wisdom of a 60 year old. You have the wisdom of a 21 year old with high academics, high standardized SAT/ACT scores, and extracurricular accomplishments ahead of your chronological age. Obviously, that's why you were able to get into an accelerated BS/MD program in the first place as that's who these programs tend to matriculate. Regardless of what other people your age are doing, you're a 21 year old in the medical profession. Naturally, you won't be able to see how your viewpoint on this is immature. Anyone reading your first post would view it as being quite self-centered. which is the hallmark of not being mature.

 

[kraskadva]

***dear god, some people are silly...***

OP-
I'm in a similar situation, but genders reversed. Hubby has insomnia/sleeps light and hurricanes don't wake me (literally).
What has worked for us so far with early/later scheduling challanges is:
-A good bed (most important. we've got latex foam. $1500 was absolutely worth it)
-blackout curtains
-hubby wears earplugs and takes melatonin (often +ambien) before bed
-sometimes a fan or AC for help with noise.
-I use 2 alarms, 1 right by the bed where I can shut it off immediately and one set 10-15 min later just outside the door, where I have to get out of bed to turn it off. I can and do sleep through the first one, but it starts getting my brain turned on. The second one gets me on my feet (very important for waking up). If the vibrating watch works for you, then great. If it's inconsistent, than maybe use it like this in place of the first noisy alarm.
-I have my clothes outside the bedroom, so once I'm out of the bed, I don't come back in and wake him up. This kinda depends on the layout of your house/apt, but if I can shut the bedroom door and do all my morning routine elsewhere, hubby can usually go back to sleep without any issues.

Good luck.

 

[xffan624]

Assuming you're a rational, mature person, then I feel his solution was immature and that it would have been more respectful and mature to do that all in person. If you're irrational and immature, then I understand his position in terms of doing it to avoid a blow up, but I also realize it would be difficult to go through for you.

However my problem is when you said you had to ask him. to me that makes it sound like he was passive aggressive and you knew he was mad about something, but you asked to get him to talk about it. that's sh*tty behavior on his part in my opinion. I mean actually not bringing things up and being outwardly normal.

I was rational and mature and I would have wanted to hear his problems and address them instead of him just bugging out, but I guess the action itself kinda defined his conflict management skills which were nil. Funnily enough, he also had to get up very early most days for his job and the only accommodation I asked was for him to do his morning routine (dressing, brushing teeth, etc) in another part of the house. I had no problem falling back to sleep though and after a month or so I didn't even wake up some days with his alarm. Everybody's different. If OP is bringing it up on a message board then it's probably a big enough deal to have a discussion about.

 

[Ismet]

I suppose your answer is more communication?

Not advocating for hiding stuff. Just saying that if every little road bump is talked about together, you end up thinking they're much bigger things than they really are.

Every relationship is different, but communication is always a good thing.

You talk about the little bumps so that they don't turn into bigger bumps down the road. Yes, one possible solution is certainly for the wife to go to sleep earlier and wake up earlier. But that's not the only solution and it may not be the best solution for the wife or the couple. Maybe the wife doesn't have to go to work until 10. I certainly wouldn't want to wake up at 4am if that's the case. Maybe she's up in the middle of the night feeding a child and already has a disjointed sleep pattern, so more REM sleep is important for her in order to function during the day.

You suggest the wife taking the matter into her own hands and trying to fix it on her part without telling her spouse. While that might work in the short term, that can potentially lead to resentment and escalation of the problem. So why not discuss it when it's just a little problem?

 

[ZuluHotel]

My wife is a very light sleeper. I could sleep through WWIII. She's getting tired of waking up with me at 0430. This could be a problem in the long run (If mamma ain't happy, ain't nobody happy). Thoughts on how to wake up reliably without waking her?

Thinking about trying vibrating watch of some variety. Any recommendations? Thanks in advance.

Wow, sorry you thought you could ask a reasonable question on SDN without a bunch of bitter neckbeards telling you to put your woman in her place.

Anyway, two things might work. I have the Fitbit which will do a vibrating alarm which is nice but if you are a heavy sleeper the vibration might not be strong enough to wake you up. On it's own I wouldn't really rely on it to wake you up.

What works for me is this bedside wakeup lamp. I love this thing. It gradually lights up so you wake up really nice and gently. I have it basically pointed at my head so it doesn't wake up my wife who is a pretty light sleeper. As long as I have the sound feature off, she sleeps right through it. It's especially nice if you have to get up before sunrise because you don't wake up in the dark. $140 is a lot for a lamp but they do make some cheaper ones with fewer bells and whistles if you look around.

 

[xffan624]

Every relationship is different, but communication is always a good thing.

You talk about the little bumps so that they don't turn into bigger bumps down the road. Yes, one possible solution is certainly for the wife to go to sleep earlier and wake up earlier. But that's not the only solution and it may not be the best solution for the wife or the couple. Maybe the wife doesn't have to go to work until 10. I certainly wouldn't want to wake up at 4am if that's the case. Maybe she's up in the middle of the night feeding a child and already has a disjointed sleep pattern, so more REM sleep is important for her in order to function during the day.

You suggest the wife taking the matter into her own hands and trying to fix it on her part without telling her spouse. While that might work in the short term, that can potentially lead to resentment and escalation of the problem. So why not discuss it when it's just a little problem?

 

[Ismet]

Lol yeah doesn't help when one of the parties is not open to communication. :/

 

[DarknightX]

He's not a doctor, he's a medical student.

To address all the ridiculous responses, my view it has nothing to do with the fact that the OP is a doctor/med student. That is completely irrelevant.
What is relevant is that he is waking up at 4:30 to go to work. He's not waking up to go fishing, play video games, or catch a flight to go on a trip with his buddies. He's working. I don't care if he's a f-ing janitor. His wife needs to learn to deal with it, just like men also need to learn to deal with their wives waking up early to go to work.

A lot of these responses absolutely baffle me. If I'm married to someone and she has to go to work early, it would ridiculous for me to be upset about it and vice versa. Also, sorry to burst everyone's bubble here, but doctors aren't exclusive to this problem. Starbucks opens up at 5 am, somebody has to wake up early to open it up. Many fast food places are open all night, somebody has to stay up all night and work at that place.

 

[fancymylotus]

If he has to be up super early he would just hang out w me till I fell asleep and then wake up at some point in the night and go fall asleep in another room and take his cell phone alarm clock w him. I usually woke up at some point when he was getting ready for a hug or kiss before he left...at which point I fall back asleep.

It's really not that deep.

 

[DermViser]

I was kind of hoping the Benjamins would suffice. The further along I go, the greater my aversion to marriage.

Yes, and she can get them. Thru alimony.

 

[dadaddadaBATMAN]

I'd say yours are the ones that are disrespectful. Mine empower the women to realize that they can do something about it themselves, yours are all about the man doing something so the woman doesn't have to. Funny how that works, eh?

Experience is a bitch, but also a remarkable teacher. You'll figure these things out on your own probably. Here's a couple of fundamental points you are missing

1. The reason why people tell each other things in a relationship is not to complain (although that can be part of it). The reason we tell each other things is to learn about one another, and avoid problems before they become an issue.

2. Even if you just want to "do something before complaining," you are making a mistake. The reason the SO wants to know is so they can avoid similar behavior in the future. Some people don't mind being woken up. Others hate it. It's important to know that about your SO.

3. Another reason why # 2 is a mistake: it makes people feel cut out. It makes your boyfriend/girlfriend feel like you don't care about them enough to tell them things. One way that some girls and guys confirm you're "close" is to tell one another things about themselves. Not doing that feels like an insult, or a "bad sign."

4. Some men, and most women I've dated, feel better when they talk about things. Sometimes my fiance just wants to hear me say "that sucks." It doesn't cost me anything, and it's another way to show I care.

5. If you're looking to be the "dominant partner," then you're a *****. The goal is for there not to be one of those. Healthy relationships involve both people trying to make the other person happy, as best they can. Anything else deteriorates into madness. Quickly.
EDIT: [This has been my experience....some relationships function differently, but I havn't seen many healthy ones with "power differences"]

Final note: relationships are often irrational, even between very rational individuals. My fiance is smarter and sharper than me in a lot of ways, and I'm not exactly stupid myself. We still get into ridiculous arguments when emotions run high, which just happens sometimes. When you live together, this is magnified. When you're married, it amplifies still further. If you refuse to compromise or discuss things, you're screwed.

Take the advice or leave it, good luck.

 

[dadaddadaBATMAN]

I love how all the older married guys are quietly shaking theirs heads laughing at the comments from the young, unmarried ones.

All I can say is: I hope your approach ends up working out for you, I really do. Good luck with it all!

For me, it's more horrified fascination.

It's like hearing someone describe how they're going to build this wonderful plane, with no communication equipment, so they'll save on operating costs. The ground crew will just "deal with it."

 

[operaman]

For me, it's more horrified fascination.

It's like hearing someone describe how they're going to build this wonderful plane, with no communication equipment, so they'll save on operating costs. The ground crew will just "deal with it."

Hahaha well put!

I think most of the vitriol coming from the youngins has more to do with their own frustration and insecurity with the opposite sex than anything. I recall saying some similar things when I was 21, though thankfully I grew out of it eventually. For many men (and I assume women) of that age, it probably does seem more like a power struggle than a partnership, so it makes sense that some would recoil at the suggestion that the man "should" go out of his way to make things easier on the woman when she can just as easily "deal with it." After all, to them it probably does feel like the dating game is set up where women have all the "power" (there are many online gurus who capitalize on this quite effectively) and they see this issue yet another instance where the man is expected to kow-tow to his woman's wishes.

Those of us in a mature relationship that functions much more like a true partnership understand that give and take in a healthy relationship is a far more nuanced issue. It doesn't fit well into punchlines or platitudes. It's also painfully difficult to explain to someone who hasn't experienced it yet. It reminds me of what my VA patients say about combat: if you weren't there I can't explain it to you, and if you were then I don't have to. I think marriage is a bit like that too.

 

[DermViser]

Those of us in a mature relationship that functions much more like a true partnership understand that give and take in a healthy relationship is a far more nuanced issue. It doesn't fit well into punchlines or platitudes. It's also painfully difficult to explain to someone who hasn't experienced it yet. It reminds me of what my VA patients say about combat: if you weren't there I can't explain it to you, and if you were then I don't have to. I think marriage is a bit like that too.

And medical school and/or residency.

 

[GFP]

I had a college roommate freshman year ago who was a very light sleeper. I had a cheap cell phone at the time, and I was able to set an alarm clock on it that vibrated only (no sound). I put the phone right under my pillow, and the buzz reliably woke me up every time.

I currently have an iPhone, and I have no clue how to set an alarm clock on vibrate. I'm sure there's an app for that. So, OP maybe instead of the vibrating watch, figure out a way to make your phone vibrate under your pillow. I'm sure your spouse won't be bothered by it.

Edit: I'm wondering if there's a significant risk of getting brain cancer from this...haha.