Were these truly a shot in the dark or image guided?

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Did they take the article down?
 
Did they take the article down?
Works for me; you may need to be logged in to Medscape.

Steroid Injections for Back Pain: A Costly Shot in the Dark?​

Megan Brooks
February 17, 2025
9
115
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Epidural steroid injections (ESIs) offer limited effectiveness in reducing back pain and disability, an updated review by the American Academy of Neurology (AAN) suggested.

“They may modestly reduce pain in some situations for up to 3 months and may reduce disability for up to 6 months or more. The limited available evidence was insufficient to create practice recommendations,” lead author Carmel Armon, MD, of Loma Linda University School of Medicine in Loma Linda, California, told Medscape Medical News.

The review was published online on February 12 in Neurology.



Key Findings

ESIs are commonly used to manage back pain but their efficacy remains debatable.

Armon and an expert panel reviewed the latest evidence on the efficacy of ESIs for cervical and lumbar spinal stenosis and radiculopathies. They focused on 90 randomized controlled trials published between 2005 and 2021 assessing pain and disability outcomes in the short-term (≤ 3 months) and long-term (≥ 6 months).





The panel noted that owing to “great variability” in efficacy measures used in the studies, they report differences based on any measure of success: The success rate difference (SRD).


For cervical and lumbar radiculopathies, ESIs “probably” reduce pain (SRD, −24.0%; number needed to treat [NNT], 4) and disability (SRD, −16.0%; NNT, 6) and “possibly” decrease long-term disability (SRD, −11.1%; NNT, 9), the authors reported. However, there is “insufficient” evidence to determine whether ESIs reduce long-term pain in radiculopathies (SRD, −10.3%).

For lumbar spinal stenosis, ESIs possibly reduce both short-term disability (SRD, −26.2%; NNT, 4) and long-term disability (SRD, −11.8%; NNT, 8) but not short-term pain (SRD, −3.5%) and there is insufficient evidence to gauge whether ESIs reduce long-term pain (SRD, −6.5%).

For cervical spinal stenosis, the effectiveness of ESIs remains unclear due to insufficient data.

“Most of the studies looked at epidural steroid injections for radiculopathy or spinal stenosis in the lower back, so it is unknown how effective they may be for these conditions in the neck,” Armon told Medscape Medical News.



The role of ESIs in preventing surgery is also unclear. The available data show no significant difference in surgical rates between ESI and control groups (risk difference, 10.5%).

This updated review “affirms the limited effectiveness of ESIs in the short-term for some forms of chronic back pain,” author Pushpa Narayanaswami, MD, of Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center in Boston, said in a news release.

“We found no studies looking at whether repeated treatments are effective or examining the effect of treatment on daily living and returning to work. Future studies should address these gaps,” Narayanaswami added.


A Costly Shot in the Dark?

Reached for comment, Shaheen Lakhan, MD, neurologist and researcher based in Miami, said the updated AAN data review “reinforces what many in pain management have observed — ESIs offer limited long-term benefit and come with significant financial burden.”

“ESIs may be effective as a short-term bridge for acute radicular pain, particularly in those with clear inflammatory markers and no signs of central sensitization, allowing patients to participate in rehabilitation and return to daily activities. However, if pain has already chronified in the brain, an ESI is just a costly shot in the dark,” Lakhan told Medscape Medical News.

“Rather than a one-size-fits-all approach, we should refine patient selection using multi-modal biomarker data — including genomics, imaging, biochemical markers, and functional assessments — to predict who is most likely to benefit,” Lakhan said.


“As machine learning models evolve, integrating biomarkers and patient-specific factors will allow for precision-guided ESI use, reducing unnecessary interventions while ensuring those most likely to benefit receive them. The future of pain management should focus on data-driven, personalized care, prioritizing sustainable, cost-effective strategies that prevent chronic pain rather than merely suppressing symptoms temporarily,” Lakhan added.

This research was supported by the AAN. Author disclosures are available with the original article. Lakhan had no relevant disclosures.
9
 
Articles like this always manage to sound intentionally stupid.

So what's this guy's test for pain "already chronified in the brain" so we can start telling these folks- sorry about your L4-5 extrusion and hot L5 radic- it's PT and gabapentin for you!
 
Not being disabled for 6 months at a time is considered financial waste? Lol

You can whine about the short-term benefits of anything that doesn't produce an immediate and permanent cure. I love how the author casually ignores the actual suffering of people with radiculopathy. I hope he finds out someday just how valuable 3 months of pain relief can be.

I would love to see something written that treats the subject and all stakeholders fairly.
 
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“Rather than a one-size-fits-all approach, we should refine patient selection using multi-modal biomarker data — including genomics, imaging, biochemical markers, and functional assessments — to predict who is most likely to benefit,” Lakhan said.”

Lol…yes cause that’s free
 
Not being disabled for 6 months at a time is considered financial waste? Lol
That’s how I read it, too. We all know the dire stats for the chances of returning to work after being out for 6 months. It seems innocuous but Lordy that’s why I sound the alarm when the disability flirts with that point. Hint - they’re very very very unlikely to return to work.
 
um... you dont have to dig that deep. but if you want to, go ahead. ( in truth, only Narayanaswami has significant disclosures)


these are neurologists. remember their training and what they focus on - diagnosis rather than treatment. so it is fitting they want to look at biomarkers etc rather than do something.



fwiw, there is data that suggests that ESI can reduce opioid use, so theres that.
 
“Rather than a one-size-fits-all approach, we should refine patient selection using multi-modal biomarker data — including genomics, imaging, biochemical markers, and functional assessments — to predict who is most likely to benefit,” Lakhan said.”

Lol…yes cause that’s free

lol exactly. I’m sitting here laughing at the image of the farmers out here I take care of being told they actually need to have a genomic and biochemical profile sent off to the Mayo lab before I can do a LESI. How incredibly silly and impractical of an idea.
 
Neurologist can’t do anything except nerve studies
 
Works for me; you may need to be logged in to Medscape.

Steroid Injections for Back Pain: A Costly Shot in the Dark?​

Megan Brooks
February 17, 2025
9
115
Add to Email Alerts
Epidural steroid injections (ESIs) offer limited effectiveness in reducing back pain and disability, an updated review by the American Academy of Neurology (AAN) suggested.

“They may modestly reduce pain in some situations for up to 3 months and may reduce disability for up to 6 months or more. The limited available evidence was insufficient to create practice recommendations,” lead author Carmel Armon, MD, of Loma Linda University School of Medicine in Loma Linda, California, told Medscape Medical News.

The review was published online on February 12 in Neurology.



Key Findings

ESIs are commonly used to manage back pain but their efficacy remains debatable.

Armon and an expert panel reviewed the latest evidence on the efficacy of ESIs for cervical and lumbar spinal stenosis and radiculopathies. They focused on 90 randomized controlled trials published between 2005 and 2021 assessing pain and disability outcomes in the short-term (≤ 3 months) and long-term (≥ 6 months).





The panel noted that owing to “great variability” in efficacy measures used in the studies, they report differences based on any measure of success: The success rate difference (SRD).


For cervical and lumbar radiculopathies, ESIs “probably” reduce pain (SRD, −24.0%; number needed to treat [NNT], 4) and disability (SRD, −16.0%; NNT, 6) and “possibly” decrease long-term disability (SRD, −11.1%; NNT, 9), the authors reported. However, there is “insufficient” evidence to determine whether ESIs reduce long-term pain in radiculopathies (SRD, −10.3%).

For lumbar spinal stenosis, ESIs possibly reduce both short-term disability (SRD, −26.2%; NNT, 4) and long-term disability (SRD, −11.8%; NNT, 8) but not short-term pain (SRD, −3.5%) and there is insufficient evidence to gauge whether ESIs reduce long-term pain (SRD, −6.5%).

For cervical spinal stenosis, the effectiveness of ESIs remains unclear due to insufficient data.

“Most of the studies looked at epidural steroid injections for radiculopathy or spinal stenosis in the lower back, so it is unknown how effective they may be for these conditions in the neck,” Armon told Medscape Medical News.



The role of ESIs in preventing surgery is also unclear. The available data show no significant difference in surgical rates between ESI and control groups (risk difference, 10.5%).

This updated review “affirms the limited effectiveness of ESIs in the short-term for some forms of chronic back pain,” author Pushpa Narayanaswami, MD, of Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center in Boston, said in a news release.

“We found no studies looking at whether repeated treatments are effective or examining the effect of treatment on daily living and returning to work. Future studies should address these gaps,” Narayanaswami added.


A Costly Shot in the Dark?

Reached for comment, Shaheen Lakhan, MD, neurologist and researcher based in Miami, said the updated AAN data review “reinforces what many in pain management have observed — ESIs offer limited long-term benefit and come with significant financial burden.”

“ESIs may be effective as a short-term bridge for acute radicular pain, particularly in those with clear inflammatory markers and no signs of central sensitization, allowing patients to participate in rehabilitation and return to daily activities. However, if pain has already chronified in the brain, an ESI is just a costly shot in the dark,” Lakhan told Medscape Medical News.

“Rather than a one-size-fits-all approach, we should refine patient selection using multi-modal biomarker data — including genomics, imaging, biochemical markers, and functional assessments — to predict who is most likely to benefit,” Lakhan said.


“As machine learning models evolve, integrating biomarkers and patient-specific factors will allow for precision-guided ESI use, reducing unnecessary interventions while ensuring those most likely to benefit receive them. The future of pain management should focus on data-driven, personalized care, prioritizing sustainable, cost-effective strategies that prevent chronic pain rather than merely suppressing symptoms temporarily,” Lakhan added.

This research was supported by the AAN. Author disclosures are available with the original article. Lakhan had no relevant disclosures.
9
To the authors -

Then quit sending your patients to me and you perform your magic on them.

Guess what, if you send them to me, I’m gonna give them an epidural.
 
Neurologist can’t do anything except nerve studies
they cant do those, either.

most neurologists get little if any residency training in EMG/NCS. this is only a requirement for PM&R. if neuro does a separate EMG/neuromuscular fellowship, then they get adequate exposure
 
they cant do those, either.

most neurologists get little if any residency training in EMG/NCS. this is only a requirement for PM&R. if neuro does a separate EMG/neuromuscular fellowship, then they get adequate exposure
Would you say a PM&R certified in EMG is better than a neurology certified in EMG then? I started sending all of mine to a physiatrist including re-evals and I noticed his conclusions were different on those
 
Would you say a PM&R certified in EMG is better than a neurology certified in EMG then? I started sending all of mine to a physiatrist including re-evals and I noticed his conclusions were different on those

Yes for radics and compression neuropathies
 
Would you say a PM&R certified in EMG is better than a neurology certified in EMG then? I started sending all of mine to a physiatrist including re-evals and I noticed his conclusions were different on those
not necessarily. it is doc-dependent. if the neuro guy has done an EMG fellowship, then neuro is probably better. especially for weird neuromuscular stuff or myopathies. but if you dont know, then PM&R is better. EMG "certification" means nothing re: quality.
 
What’s the difference between a neurologist and a neurosurgeon? A neurologist just tells you what’s wrong a neurosurgeon can actually do something about it..
 
What’s the difference between a neurologist and a neurosurgeon? A neurologist just tells you what’s wrong a neurosurgeon can actually do something about it..
neurologists know everything and do nothing
neurosurgeons know nothing and do everything
psychiatrists know nothing and do nothing
 
neurologists know everything and do nothing
neurosurgeons know nothing and do everything
psychiatrists know nothing and do nothing
lol psychiatrists catching strays out here
 
They poo hoo epidurals it do any of their medical treatments for chronic neurodegenerative diseases do any better?? What a bunch of garbage
 
not necessarily. it is doc-dependent. if the neuro guy has done an EMG fellowship, then neuro is probably better. especially for weird neuromuscular stuff or myopathies. but if you dont know, then PM&R is better. EMG "certification" means nothing re: quality.

Agree with ssdoc

Neuro doing EMGs without a fellowship -don’t trust

You want the doc to either be PMR as a big chunk of PMR residency is dedicated to EMGs, or to be a neurologist who did an EMG fellowship.
 
and EMG/NCS are the biggest waste of time/effort
For a lot of basic stuff it's pretty good. Like carpal tunnel or ulnar neuropathy but now a lot of people are using ultrasound for diagnostics. Seems that a lot of younger ortho docs are learning about ultrasound in their training and they want ultrasound instead or possibly in tandem which seems like overkill. At least some of the surgeons I've interacted with. The problem with emg is that there is a portion which can be very subjective, like evaluating chronic changes. Plus every clinic/lab (whatever you want to call it) use different values. People have a hard time activating muscles with a needle in them. A lot can't even tolerate it. Had a grown man cry the other day. Legit cry. As someone (PM&R trained with decent emg/ncs exposure in residency) who relearned to do them for the hospital I work for, I'm no expert. But agree that a lot people, especially neurologists, without formal training doing emgs don't do them well at all. I have a few where I work who do them and they call stuff that makes no sense. And there can be repercussions to that ie unwarranted surgeries. I try my best to very conservative with calls and use a lot of "possible" or "suggestive" when I'm not sure. A lot of people just have weird stuff going on that doesn't make sense. The bigger problem to me is other specialties understanding the value in an emg and who is a good person to test. Not sending a 350 lb person who is in a power wheelchair for an emg when they've had a chronic (4 year) displaced humeral fracture that wasn't corrected who ortho eventually decided to fix only for them to dislocate their TSA and has "worsening" weakness in their arm. Just why?
 
For a lot of basic stuff it's pretty good. Like carpal tunnel or ulnar neuropathy but now a lot of people are using ultrasound for diagnostics. Seems that a lot of younger ortho docs are learning about ultrasound in their training and they want ultrasound instead or possibly in tandem which seems like overkill. At least some of the surgeons I've interacted with. The problem with emg is that there is a portion which can be very subjective, like evaluating chronic changes. Plus every clinic/lab (whatever you want to call it) use different values. People have a hard time activating muscles with a needle in them. A lot can't even tolerate it. Had a grown man cry the other day. Legit cry. As someone (PM&R trained with decent emg/ncs exposure in residency) who relearned to do them for the hospital I work for, I'm no expert. But agree that a lot people, especially neurologists, without formal training doing emgs don't do them well at all. I have a few where I work who do them and they call stuff that makes no sense. And there can be repercussions to that ie unwarranted surgeries. I try my best to very conservative with calls and use a lot of "possible" or "suggestive" when I'm not sure. A lot of people just have weird stuff going on that doesn't make sense. The bigger problem to me is other specialties understanding the value in an emg and who is a good person to test. Not sending a 350 lb person who is in a power wheelchair for an emg when they've had a chronic (4 year) displaced humeral fracture that wasn't corrected who ortho eventually decided to fix only for them to dislocate their TSA and has "worsening" weakness in their arm. Just why?
PM&R as well new attendign for a few years and have noticed this. A few patients come in with EMG reports their surgeon ordered and 99% done by one of our neurologist (not sure what her prior EMG experience is but her interpreations make no sense sometimes) calling motor radics on patients with just one muscle group with PSW, and other extensive muscle groups WNL.
 
For a lot of basic stuff it's pretty good. Like carpal tunnel or ulnar neuropathy but now a lot of people are using ultrasound for diagnostics. Seems that a lot of younger ortho docs are learning about ultrasound in their training and they want ultrasound instead or possibly in tandem which seems like overkill. At least some of the surgeons I've interacted with. The problem with emg is that there is a portion which can be very subjective, like evaluating chronic changes. Plus every clinic/lab (whatever you want to call it) use different values. People have a hard time activating muscles with a needle in them. A lot can't even tolerate it. Had a grown man cry the other day. Legit cry. As someone (PM&R trained with decent emg/ncs exposure in residency) who relearned to do them for the hospital I work for, I'm no expert. But agree that a lot people, especially neurologists, without formal training doing emgs don't do them well at all. I have a few where I work who do them and they call stuff that makes no sense. And there can be repercussions to that ie unwarranted surgeries. I try my best to very conservative with calls and use a lot of "possible" or "suggestive" when I'm not sure. A lot of people just have weird stuff going on that doesn't make sense. The bigger problem to me is other specialties understanding the value in an emg and who is a good person to test. Not sending a 350 lb person who is in a power wheelchair for an emg when they've had a chronic (4 year) displaced humeral fracture that wasn't corrected who ortho eventually decided to fix only for them to dislocate their TSA and has "worsening" weakness in their arm. Just why?
Largely agree with what you said. Though I would argue if a grown man is crying during an EMG, the EMG actually is EXTREMELY revealing about at least 1 type of pathology that is present... this is coming from someone who is not tough at all and has had multiple needle EMGs performed on me by residents who are practicing.
 
Largely agree with what you said. Though I would argue if a grown man is crying during an EMG, the EMG actually is EXTREMELY revealing about at least 1 type of pathology that is present... this is coming from someone who is not tough at all and has had multiple needle EMGs performed on me by residents who are practicing.
Agree. I think the same about someone having a fit over a lumbar MBB with 25G needles.
If that little MBB is intolerable, then your problem is either mostly psychiatric, or serious enough to require surgery.
 
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Agree. I think the same about someone having a fit over over a lumbar MBB with 25G needles. If that little MBB is intolerable, then your problem is either mostly psychiatric, or serious enough to require surgery.
One of my worst Google reviews was by a woman who was being overly dramatic during her lumbar mbbs. I was over it so I rushed through them and walked out of the room after telling her to call with the results. She gave me 1 star and said I was cold, uncaring and rushed 🙄
 
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One of my worst Google reviews was by a woman who was being during her lumbar mbbs. I was over it so I rushed through them and walked out of the room after telling her to call with the results. She gave me 1 star and said I was cold, uncaring and rushed 🙄


happens to all of us 🙂
 
One of my worst Google reviews was by a woman who was being overly dramatic during her lumbar mbbs. I was over it so I rushed through them and walked out of the room after telling her to call with the results. She gave me 1 star and said I was cold, uncaring and rushed 🙄
That’s terrible! Especially since your posts are so warm and fuzzy here!

Jokes, jokes…
 
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