What Are My Chances and Other General Questions

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If I plan on applying this year when is the appropriate time to ask for LORs? And my school does have a pre-med committee. Should I just ask for one collective letter, individual letters, or a combination of both? My advisors are not the greatest at my campus, and any help I can get here would be great.

 

[uday28fb]

If I plan on applying this year when is the appropriate time to ask for LORs? And my school does have a pre-med committee. Should I just ask for one collective letter, individual letters, or a combination of both? My advisors are not the greatest at my campus, and any help I can get here would be great.

I agree this is a question I've been wondering about. Say you want to send your LOR's to multiple schools, do you just have your professors make a letter that is generalized to all schools and then make copies of the letter?

 

[Daniel312]

Hey- kind of random, but I figure this is the best place to ask such questions.

I don't have any of my pre-meds yet... these are the classes that I know for a fact that I need.

1 year of Biology with lab
1 year of inorganic chem with lab
1 year of organic chem with lab
1 year of physics with lab

I was just going to minor in Chem and take some upper level chem courses to go with these classes...
I've already had AP English in High School, but went on to take British Lit and Advanced Expository writing in college just for the sake of doin it.... I guess that knocks out my English... the only maths I've had are College algebra and business calculus... I've not had any foreign languages in college- only High School. Thanks fer the advice.

 

[167649]

If I plan on applying this year when is the appropriate time to ask for LORs? And my school does have a pre-med committee. Should I just ask for one collective letter, individual letters, or a combination of both? My advisors are not the greatest at my campus, and any help I can get here would be great.

1) Ideally, you want to approach your profs for the LOR's soon (I would say middle spring at the latest). It can take longer than you think for them to do it, they are busy professors and often have more letters to write. Ideally, you want to apply early, so having those letters done early is much better than waiting on them to get finished through the summer (and hassling them to finish it!) which would drag your application's completion timewise.

2) In general, many med schools prefer a committee letter if your school offers one. So if you have this option than use it. Otherwise, it varies as to who they want to write the letter for you and how many they need. Check up on each school you are applying to and what their specific requirements are.

I agree this is a question I've been wondering about. Say you want to send your LOR's to multiple schools, do you just have your professors make a letter that is generalized to all schools and then make copies of the letter?

They are almost always generalized. Most undergraduate schools have a premed advising office that uses either a letter collection or committee letter service. With a letter collection service, your LOR writers write the letter and they get placed in a file. You tell your college which schools you applied to and they send the letters you designate in a packet to the school. Although committee letters vary by college, in general your "endorsers" make their recommendations to a committee at your premed office, and then the committee drafts 1 letter that summarizes those recomendations. Then you designate where it is sent. You technically don't have to send the letters out in any case, in fact you will usually be asked if you wish to waive your rights to their access in your file at all (which is recommended). Check with your pre-med office as to their procedure.

 

[167649]

I am in the same situation as the 3.2 GPA guy!
I am taking 3 classes this quarter and studying for MCAT. I need to apply in June.
It scares the bejeezes out of me, when I hear people talking in front of the MCAT class door, how they dropped two of their classes to study for MCAT.
What should do...???

You need to bring your GPA up as far as possible, and you need a good score on the test to offset it. My advice if you don't think you can do both at once; don't do both at once. You don't need to apply in June. Take the classes, pull all A's until you graudate, and study for the MCAT the summer/year after you finish. Taking a year off will allow you to focus on one at a time, plus EC wise that is one of the best things to do, you can do research, travel, humanitarian work, all kinds of things. All will give a good boost to your app.

 

[167649]

Hi, I was recently accepted to MSU CHM Class of 2012 and I have paid my deposit and given them my written letter of acceptance of the offer and have withdrew all my other applications. I am currently finishing a Master's program, but last quarter, due to some unforeseen circumstances, I received an F in one of my classes. I called MSU about their policy on transcript updates after acceptance and they told me that they need the transcript to verify my reception of the Master's degree. My questions are: 1) How much will this F affect me, even though I have already been accepted? and 2) What options do I have to try and fix this problem, so I don't get my acceptance taken away from me (because then I would be left sitting on the curb with literally nothing)?

It is hard to say how this will affect you. I think you need to call MSU and ask them about this because everyone varies on their post acceptance standards. Perhaps if you explain the circumstances to them they will understand. Will it prevent you from getting your masters? That might be more of an issue to them.

 

[167649]

Bump!

No need to bump a sticky!

Hey- kind of random, but I figure this is the best place to ask such questions.

I don't have any of my pre-meds yet... these are the classes that I know for a fact that I need.

1 year of Biology with lab
1 year of inorganic chem with lab
1 year of organic chem with lab
1 year of physics with lab

I was just going to minor in Chem and take some upper level chem courses to go with these classes...
I've already had AP English in High School, but went on to take British Lit and Advanced Expository writing in college just for the sake of doin it.... I guess that knocks out my English... the only maths I've had are College algebra and business calculus... I've not had any foreign languages in college- only High School. Thanks fer the advice.

What is your question?

 

[Daniel312]

heh, man... i must have been reeeealy tired when I wrote that (which I was...)


anyway, what I'm asking is what pre-reqs do I really need? As in, do I need more Math, etc...

 

[uday28fb]

You need to bring your GPA up as far as possible, and you need a good score on the test to offset it. My advice if you don't think you can do both at once; don't do both at once. You don't need to apply in June. Take the classes, pull all A's until you graudate, and study for the MCAT the summer/year after you finish. Taking a year off will allow you to focus on one at a time, plus EC wise that is one of the best things to do, you can do research, travel, humanitarian work, all kinds of things. All will give a good boost to your app.

I posted my science GPA and overall GPA above. In the post I also said that I have many more science classes. The only classes I've taken are gen-eds and the pre-reqs for medical school. Would you suggest I do the same? Finish up my undergrad with the highest possible GPA, and then concentrate on the mcat, does that sound reasonable? Even then I still need to finish up Org II and Phy II with their respective labs.

I've always heard that the best way is to take the MCAT in your junior year and apply in the summer before you senior year, however that route makes it seem like everything is getting crammed.

 

[EngineerDr2B]

You need to bring your GPA up as far as possible, and you need a good score on the test to offset it. My advice if you don't think you can do both at once; don't do both at once. You don't need to apply in June. Take the classes, pull all A's until you graudate, and study for the MCAT the summer/year after you finish. Taking a year off will allow you to focus on one at a time, plus EC wise that is one of the best things to do, you can do research, travel, humanitarian work, all kinds of things. All will give a good boost to your app.

Thanks for the advice, But the deal is, that I am a senior in EE and I am 23 so by the time I'm hoping to start Med. school, I'll be 24. The way I planned it was to finish the premed courses, take the MCAT and then finish my own classes by the winter of 09.
I feel so pressured by this time frame, but I find it hard to work my way around it!
I feel it will be too late.
I have some EC activities, and I am currently volunteering too.
I also do have some research experience in bio-med engineering lab.
I am a member of 2 Engineering honor societies (am a woman engineer BTW). The rep from UCLA med school told me that these all could be counted as a plus, is that true? how much do these stuff matter??

 

[yogreen]

I have a 31 MCAT score right now, but a low GPA. I am in a "special master's program" and doing pretty well. I will be applying this summer for the first time. I want my application to be complete as early as possible when I apply.

My question is: Could i retake the MCAT in January of '09 and send it as supplemental material to schools, kind of like sending new reccs or new grades? This way, my application is not "held" until my MCAT score comes in and I don't have to indicate I'm taking the MCAT again.

 

[ChubbyChaser]

I have a 31 MCAT score right now, but a low GPA. I am in a "special master's program" and doing pretty well. I will be applying this summer for the first time. I want my application to be complete as early as possible when I apply.

My question is: Could i retake the MCAT in January of '09 and send it as supplemental material to schools, kind of like sending new reccs or new grades? This way, my application is not "held" until my MCAT score comes in and I don't have to indicate I'm taking the MCAT again.

The latest date that most schools accept MCAT scores is September.

 

[dreams]

So I just figured out everything with all my GPA and I have no clue if I even have a shot at med school, but if I do I was wondering what type of score on the MCAT I would be having to hope for to have a shot at any med school? I take it on may 31st.

Stats:

undergrad overall GPA: 2.79
post-bac GPA (science only): 3.65
overall science-math GPA:2.5
overall GPA with post-bac:3.13

My EC's include 1 year membrane research, shadowing docs (about 50-70 hours when I apply), and work at a kids foster care clinic (50 hours when I apply), dean list a few semesters in undergrad, thats about it.

I am planning on applying this summer, do I have any hope?🙁

 

[armybound]

I wouldn't really approach it like you need to score a certain score.. just try to do as well as you can.

Realistically I think something above a 33 would do a lot for you.

 

[dreams]

I wouldn't really approach it like you need to score a certain score.. just try to do as well as you can.

Realistically I think something above a 33 would do a lot for you.

thanks for the advice, I think you have given me some before, and told me to post with my GPAs when I figured them out, didnt know they were this bad🙁

 

[somethingpositi]

Apply broadly (including DO schools), and I would shoot for 32-33 or greater on the MCAT. And you always have hope. =)

 

[167649]

heh, man... i must have been reeeealy tired when I wrote that (which I was...)


anyway, what I'm asking is what pre-reqs do I really need? As in, do I need more Math, etc...

The 4 pre-reqs you listed are core requirements everywhere. English is required at about half of schools, the two eng classes you listed will have you more than covered. Math is a bit of an outlier, some schools require no math, some require any college level, a few require calculus (Hopkins comes to mind as requiring calculus). You can check the MSAR as to who requires what math. Also, about half of all schools require some coursework in the humanities (about 2 semesters worth) but it is always at least recommended to take a broad collection of these classes as it helps diversify your collegiate academic experience.

PS: I realized I forgot to include Biochem. A lot of schools do require it, but it is always recommended to have 1 semester of it.

 

[167649]

I posted my science GPA and overall GPA above. In the post I also said that I have many more science classes. The only classes I've taken are gen-eds and the pre-reqs for medical school. Would you suggest I do the same? Finish up my undergrad with the highest possible GPA, and then concentrate on the mcat, does that sound reasonable? Even then I still need to finish up Org II and Phy II with their respective labs.

I've always heard that the best way is to take the MCAT in your junior year and apply in the summer before you senior year, however that route makes it seem like everything is getting crammed.

Thanks for the advice, But the deal is, that I am a senior in EE and I am 23 so by the time I'm hoping to start Med. school, I'll be 24. The way I planned it was to finish the premed courses, take the MCAT and then finish my own classes by the winter of 09.
I feel so pressured by this time frame, but I find it hard to work my way around it!
I feel it will be too late.
I have some EC activities, and I am currently volunteering too.
I also do have some research experience in bio-med engineering lab.
I am a member of 2 Engineering honor societies (am a woman engineer BTW). The rep from UCLA med school told me that these all could be counted as a plus, is that true? how much do these stuff matter??

Since both of your situations are similar:
It is not necessarily better to take the MCAT as a junior and then apply as a senior. This is just the "traditional" path, going to med school directly after college. In recent years though, more and more applicants have taken one or two years off of college (some a lot more). The average age for a matriculant to medical school last year was 24, not the 22 year olds graduating from college. So it certainly isn't too late at all. ADCOMS will look very favorably on time off afterwards, because it gives you an opportinity to mature and really solidify your motivations for medical school. Plus, as I said, it allows you to focus on school, than the MCAT, but not both simultaneously. This allows you to put the full effort into both and maximize your numbers. And then there is the opportunity to really get some good EC experience which can also help a lot.

I relate to both of you, I graduated with under a 3.3 science (after pulling all A's my senior year and most of my junior) focused all my weight on the MCAT after I graduated, rocked it, got a great research job, had some time to travel and do humanitarian work, and after a year from graduation applied and was accepted to allo school. My year off and the ability to do one thing at a time (focus on all A's in school, then get a 30+ MCAT, then get some killer EC's) made my application. To be honest I don't know if I would have been accepted straight out of college.

You both seem a little hesitant that you can maximize your potential by doing everything at once. So my advice is to think about this and see if it may be the right thing for you too do. But if you feel you can do as well in both your classes and on the MCAT, and then the burden of actually applying (Like the PS, keeping up with EC's etc) than by all means do it. But if not, nothing bad will come out of taking a year off. Just make sure you take some time to think about it and see which path is right for you. Hope this helps and good luck!

 

[krg1114]

Hey, I have an MDapps profile now, can someone let me know if I'm completely screwed? I'll have a 3.45-3.5 Sci GPA and Overall GPA after this semester...Does this mean everything is riding on my MCAT? A 3.5 seems to not be good enough for most of the schools on my list...Any suggestions for more appropriate schools to apply to?

Thanks!

 

[armybound]

Hey, I have an MDapps profile now, can someone let me know if I'm completely screwed? I'll have a 3.45-3.5 Sci GPA and Overall GPA after this semester...Does this mean everything is riding on my MCAT? A 3.5 seems to not be good enough for most of the schools on my list...Any suggestions for more appropriate schools to apply to?

Thanks!

your GPA will be decent but not extraordinary, so it probably will come down to a strong MCAT. you don't need a 35 necessarily, though it would really help. I think you have a decent shot if you apply broadly, have good LORs, and write a strong PS

 

[167649]

Hey, I have an MDapps profile now, can someone let me know if I'm completely screwed? I'll have a 3.45-3.5 Sci GPA and Overall GPA after this semester...Does this mean everything is riding on my MCAT? A 3.5 seems to not be good enough for most of the schools on my list...Any suggestions for more appropriate schools to apply to?

Thanks!

For one, just make sure that "future" 3.45-3.5 actually occurs! If you do it your grades are still below average for US allo, but not far. Your school list is fine, you have chosen to apply broadly which is good. And it appears that you plan to submit early. Without an MCAT score though, it is impossible to evaluate anyone's candidacy. Have you taken it yet? If not, study as hard as you can for it and don't worry about what score you need, just do as well as possible. If I had to give you something to shoot for though, I would say at least a 31ish to be fairly competitive to get in (although lower wouldn't rule you out). Otherwise, just focus on those grades!

 

[prettyslick]

Hello everyone. I was looking for some advice from a few people who have gone through SMP/Post-Bacc route and could advice me on it. I would really appreciate your help in this.

Before I tell you any other information/stats, I would like to point out that I am considered an 'international student' even though I did my high school and college here in the US (just graduated with B.S degree in December 2007). I havent taken my MCAT yet and I do realize the importance of MCAT. That is one of the reasons why I havent taken it yet (I will only take it when I feel that I am fully prepared -- no need to rush ESPECIALLY when I am an international student). I appreciate your input very much. I have a goal in mind with respect to each of the criteria of medical school process. I am going to list it below and please comment on it, so that I have a general idea whether or not I am in the right path. I don't even know if I can do SMP (don't know whether they offer admission to 'international' students). Also, don't know if my uGPA (see below) would be competitive at SMP programs across the country. Please let me know as to what you would do if you were in my shoes.

GPA - My uGPA is 3.25 overall and 3.15 science. My plan is to take 64 credits atleast of science or math classes and do well in them. My goal is to ramp up my uGPA to 3.4-3.5 range.

MCAT - Listed my plans above about MCAT. Would only take them if I would feel comfortable that I can do well. Since I intend to take classes for another two years, I think I would be better off taking the MCAT by NEXT year (maybe January or April 2009). What do you think about this?

ECs - I currenly have about 100 hours worth of volunteering in the ER room. Additionally, I have shadowed a dermatologist once for 4-5 hours (who is also a professor at a local medical school). These are my only ECs that I would consider worth listing. Please advise me on what to do in this area in order to improve my ECs before it is too late.

LORs - As of now, I don't feel comfortable asking ANY professors that I had in ugrad for a "good" LOR except maybe one. There is one professor whom I did research with (for credit) for a summer and he also taught me a 2 credit "Senior Capstone" class required for all Biology majors. Should I ask him for a LOR? What about the doctor I shadowed once (and plan to shadow more)? I don't know whom to ask for LORs.

Please do let me know if this plan is good or not. As an international student, I would need to enroll in a formal second degree program (I am thinking about Biochemistry). If you were me, would you apply next year (2009) or the year after that (2010)?

 

[LL 2Phat]

Keep your chin up, bust your butt, and your chances are good.

If I had read posts on these forums, I would have never applied to med school. I had a 3.23 UG GPA in Civil Engineering, had to take my post-bacc courses at a local community college due to working full time, and my MCATs were 26N and 29M. I also didn't apply 'till October 😱.

Guess what? I just got into my dream school.

What is my advice to all?

1. Make sure you have some strengths and the right motivations.
2. Don't read the posts from neurotic pre-meds using "advice" to keep others from trying for their slots in med school.
3. Apply broadly if you have a ton of time and money, but I still haven't heard anything from 80% of the schools I applied to and spent weeks writing essays for. The ones I interviewed at/got accepted at were the in state schools where I knew I had a chance. Most schools just want your money.
4. BE CONFIDENT AND PROACTIVE
5. Go for it

 

[LL 2Phat]

by the way, my above post can certainly be an answer to the previous poster; however it was designed as a post for anyone with above a 3.0 GPA and 24 MCAT who is addicted to these mostly ridiculous forums.

 

[pearljam1]

Hello I have been reading these forums for awhile and thought I would post. I am currently in my second year of Masters program and am interested in applying to Med School. I always had an interest in Medicine but never felt confident enough that I could be competitive. But I have been thinking lately how much I wish to be a doctor and I'll never know without applying. I did my undergrad in Canada and am a Canadian citizen. My first two years were bad (2.7, 2.5) but 3rd and 4th went well (3.85) and 3.7. I then did an extra year (3.7). I have a 3.5 in my special masters program and hopefully published research by the end of the year. My ec's include hospital volunteering (Jan 03- June 05) and (Jan 05-June 05) and then Oct 07 - present. I have been tutoring kids since last year and play intramural hockey this year and last. Other than that I don't have much else for EC's. Would I have a chance? Looking for honest opinions

 

[mmh309]

Hi everyone, thought I'd give it a go on this thread:

Stats:

Junior, applying for the 09 cycle

GPA: 3.78, BCPM: 3.9

MCAT: April 08, Kaplan Diagnostic 33 (I know, it means less than nothing)

clinical experience: summer 07 - shadowing cardiologist, volunteering in CCU
fall 07 - volunteering at cardiothoracic step-down unit
and surgical services
spring 08 - volunteer at ER of level II trauma center

Research: 1 year of organic chem research, hoping to get a summer position

Letters of Recommendation: Average to strong

Started working on the PS

I know it's still too early to say anything but what do you think, worth a shot?

 

[Revenant]

mcat score?

everything else is okay I guess

 

[pearljam1]

I haven't taken the MCAT yet, hopefully in the spring or at latest by August. But my overall GPA with Masters program is 3.35 with Science GPA of 3.3. Is it possible to get accepted to a US School with these stats and ECs?

 

[JShineDoc]

I haven't taken the MCAT yet, hopefully in the spring or at latest by August. But my overall GPA with Masters program is 3.35 with Science GPA of 3.3. Is it possible to get accepted to a US School with these stats and ECs?

Yes! Apply MD and DO... and carribean as a safety. Get atleast mid-twenties on your MCAT... atleast 30 for the more competitive allopathic programs... and you have a decent chance. I wouldnt worry about the low GPA your first 2 years b/c you have an upward trend thereafter. I'd recommend getting some clinical experience too.

 

[pearljam1]

Thanks!

 

[kevster2001]

I haven't taken the MCAT yet, hopefully in the spring or at latest by August. But my overall GPA with Masters program is 3.35 with Science GPA of 3.3. Is it possible to get accepted to a US School with these stats and ECs?

That's a little low but not enough to count you out of anything but maybe the best programs. If you rock the MCAT and you have good ECs, you're competitive to most schools. What schools you apply to will really depend on those factors as well so dont start looking up the Caribbean just yet

 

[Areion]

I haven't taken the MCAT yet, hopefully in the spring or at latest by August. But my overall GPA with Masters program is 3.35 with Science GPA of 3.3. Is it possible to get accepted to a US School with these stats and ECs?

#1 order of business for you is: Try to do well on the MCAT. By now you are familiar with the numbers. Anything above 30 should be considered acceptable. Below 30, and you're going to have some explaining to do, or at least it will limit the number of interviews you get. Your GPA isn't stellar but there are other things that can shine--work on those things that you can change and make them as perfect as you can from this point forward.

When it comes for interview time, go to every single interview and look up information on the school *before* going--you might be asked questions about the school you are going to, and it will show interest if you know information or ask questions. People say you should on average have one offer for every four schools you interview at. So hey, if you get only four interviews, you might actually have a shot. Also, make sure you're not applying only to big name schools. Look at some of the smaller less well known programs, esp. on the east coast! They can be great programs and you'll be surprised that some of the schools that sound like state schools have a good proportion of students from another state.

General advice is to apply early. As soon as AMCAS is open, you should be ready to submit your well thought-out personal statement. Update your CV in between study breaks for your MCAT. You'll be surprised at how long it takes you to complete all of the forms in the AMCAS, and having your stuff together on your CV will help you a great deal. Unfortunately, you cannot upload your cv and must type everything into their format.
Spend a good deal of time on your personal statement--it will help you for your future interviews as well. After I spent the day brainstorming with my MCAT study buddy I wrote out a draft, revise it a few times, and then I had 9 people read it. They were mostly med students, two doctors, and one professional non-medical writer who actually gave me some great ideas. At the end of my 8th draft, I thought it was very good. You can have a wide variety of people read yours too, but make sure your pre-med advisor is the main guidance because he/she has seen a ton of them.

As far as medical schools in the US, I would tell you that sometimes it's unfair...when I meet some of my colleagues from DO and foreign schools and they are pretty good at what they are doing, they unfortunately do get discriminated against in terms of positions after medical school. Unfair, because on the floors and wards we all do the same work, except they will not be offered the same opportunity as MD students. I would strongly encourage you to consider, if you do not get in this year to take a year or two off and either:

1. Do research in a lab at a major university and get involved on a poster presentation or publication. Don't rule out clinical rather than bench research if you can get into it! Two reasons: 1-it's fun and dealing with people is fun and a big part of being a doctor, 2-you might get publications/presentations faster than you would at a basic science lab. in fact, I'm pretty sure that is true. Sometimes it really is true that if you have some publications behind you, it can reasonably speak louder than an average/low gpa. Remember this also looking to the future that this can help you on your residency applications, if you decide you want to apply into a competitive specialty; a research publication can get you a long way. Even if it's ultimately unrelated to your future medical specialty.

2. OR, go for a master's program. People might say "oh, but that's $30,000 extra!" however, my classmates who completed a master's program tended to do very well on the 1st year exams because they had already taken similar exams. Darn for the rest of us--they messed up the grading curve! Good for them, I suppose they deserved it. Consequently, one or two of them did very well first year and was in the top of the class, which will be significant for you later. Not everyone who completed a master's program was in the top of the class during first year, but many of them did so keep that in mind.

So, again, a Summary:
-Work on what you can change, the rest is history! It's reasonable to expect that you are a reasonable candidate for medical school.
-do well on your MCAT (under 30: you need fantastic EC's letters and/or publications, over 30: standard, 33: getting in the good chance range, 35: great! over 35: something has to be wrong with you if they don't take you) keep in mind I had a friend with a 39 who got in nowhere because he didn't submit his application on time. (he was also a bit arrogant-he ruined his own interviews and they took someone the next day with a 28 and great people skills and better time management skills) Do not underestimate the early application. Respect the college and send it in early and you just might get an interview. So, on to the next point:
-be thoughtful and EARLY in your application
-if you don't get what you want this year, think about going for an allopathic US MD school again in 1-2 years after some research and get outside letters of rec from doctors that you worked with. It's going to take more effort than applying for a DO or foreign program. I'm sorry if this sounds discriminatory, because I have friends from both kinds of programs who are excellent doctors, BUT, you will limit yourself!
Look at places like UCLA, UCSD, UCSF, Stanford, or the like if you're in a different state, to get a job as a research assistant in something that you like, and do well in your job and make some connections.
Another option: Some people in my class who were awesome did stuff like Peace Corps for 2 years, learned spanish, and rocked the med school interviews and essays. (later in 3rd year, these same folks *rocked* the floors and got exceptional evaluations) Many schools are increasingly looking for well rounded applicants who can distinguish themselves in some way other than gpa or mcat.


Good Luck!

 

[pearljam1]

hey thank you so much for that post. I am actually in my second year of a SMP doing research related to cardiology. Just wondering if you could direct me to schools at which I would be competitive or a site where I could find this info. Keep in mind I am a Canadian citizen as well which might limit my choices. Once again thanks!

 

[Deanis]

Hey everybody.

I'm 30 years old and have B.Sc. in statistics with a GPA of around 3.7 and a M.Sc. in statistics (my thesis project was on efficient design of multiple sclerosis clinical trials) with a GPA of around 3.6. The undergrad GPA is okay, but also deceptive because there is significant downwards trend after second year and a lot of it is part-time. I am currently taking my organic chemistry and biology credits and intend to take some biochem next fall and am planning on taking the MCAT this July. I've only wanted to get involved in medicine for about a year and a half.

My EC stuff is pretty scarce and random: A few years (with breaks in between) of volunteering with a youth program and a young adult program at my church. Some one-off type volunteering. On a comittee in grad school.

I am currently getting trainging to volunteer at a hopsice center and this summer will be going to Ecuador for a month to volunteer and shadow doctors at a hospital.

I'm wondering, well, what my chances are. Reading the forum, I'm sure people will say that I can get in somewhere, but that isn't really my question. I am looking for a somewhat realistic assessment of my candidacy and advice on how to improve it.The reason I'm asking is that last September I applied to the only schools in Canada that do not require the MCAT (since I hadn't written it, and yes, they are accredited) and recently got the news that I did not even qualify for an interview. I'm quite antsy to get in and start (seeing as I'm 30).


Keep in mind that I want to get into med school in Canada, since it is my only affordable option (I'm Canadian). Also, I am only going to have the added Ecuador experience and the hospice training (essentially no volunteer hours) as well as my MCAT score and the few pre-med courses (for which I should get in the A range).

In particular what are some essentials that I should look to doing over the next year (I am assuming that I wil not be matriculating in Fall 09) and a half to make me a better candidate. Specifics would be appreciated. Should I take some first-aid training. What specific volunteering?

Thanks guys (and girls).

 

[Deanis]

Whoops, I accidentally double posted.

 

[Mamy]

Hi everyone,

I'm an international applicant and I applied pretty late in the season (not being familiar to the US system and all that). My GPA is 3.83 and my MCAT score is 38Q. I have a really strong research background (I'm finishing a Psychology Research Specialist HBSc program and I've done over 2.5 yrs of research). I've also had a year of clinical experience/shadowing, done a lot of tutoring, and a bunch of other extracurricular activities. I admit that my friends inflated my confidence and I applied to a bunch of top-tier schools, thinking that my stats would make me competitive. I reallized that applying late would be a challenge, but i never realized that, as someone said, it would be "the kiss of death" for me. I've been rejected from Vanderbilt, Stanford, Pritzker, and possibly Harvard. My only interview has been at WashU, and I'm still in review for 11 other schools: Yale, UPenn, NYU, BostonU, Baylor, Emory, Mt Sinai, Columbia, Cornell, Hopkins, and Dartmouth. I've reached the point of desperation and am on the verge of developing OCD with checking my e-mail/mail. Do I have any chances of hearing anything positive from the schools I'm waiting on? 🙁

Thanks

 

[prettyslick]

Hi everyone,

I'm an international applicant and I applied pretty late in the season (not being familiar to the US system and all that). My GPA is 3.83 and my MCAT score is 38Q. I have a really strong research background (I'm finishing a Psychology Research Specialist HBSc program and I've done over 2.5 yrs of research). I've also had a year of clinical experience/shadowing, done a lot of tutoring, and a bunch of other extracurricular activities. I admit that my friends inflated my confidence and I applied to a bunch of top-tier schools, thinking that my stats would make me competitive. I reallized that applying late would be a challenge, but i never realized that, as someone said, it would be "the kiss of death" for me. I've been rejected from Vanderbilt, Stanford, Pritzker, and possibly Harvard. My only interview has been at WashU, and I'm still in review for 11 other schools: Yale, UPenn, NYU, BostonU, Baylor, Emory, Mt Sinai, Columbia, Cornell, Hopkins, and Dartmouth. I've reached the point of desperation and am on the verge of developing OCD with checking my e-mail/mail. Do I have any chances of hearing anything positive from the schools I'm waiting on? 🙁

Thanks

When did you graduate or are you still in school?

 

[jasmine112]

Hi everyone,

I'm an international applicant and I applied pretty late in the season (not being familiar to the US system and all that). My GPA is 3.83 and my MCAT score is 38Q. I have a really strong research background (I'm finishing a Psychology Research Specialist HBSc program and I've done over 2.5 yrs of research). I've also had a year of clinical experience/shadowing, done a lot of tutoring, and a bunch of other extracurricular activities. I admit that my friends inflated my confidence and I applied to a bunch of top-tier schools, thinking that my stats would make me competitive. I reallized that applying late would be a challenge, but i never realized that, as someone said, it would be "the kiss of death" for me. I've been rejected from Vanderbilt, Stanford, Pritzker, and possibly Harvard. My only interview has been at WashU, and I'm still in review for 11 other schools: Yale, UPenn, NYU, BostonU, Baylor, Emory, Mt Sinai, Columbia, Cornell, Hopkins, and Dartmouth. I've reached the point of desperation and am on the verge of developing OCD with checking my e-mail/mail. Do I have any chances of hearing anything positive from the schools I'm waiting on? 🙁

Thanks

Hey Mamy,

I totally understand what you're going through!!!!! I'm an applicant from a first tier US university with a 3.8 molecular biology major and 35T, lots of community service, leadership, research, and jobs w/ people skills, BUT I APPLIED LATE!!! It truly is the "kiss of death" as you put SO perfectly.

Honestly, I feel that all we can hope for after mid March is to interview for wait list spots. I'm starting to make my peace with the idea of working for a while if I don't get in and reapplying much much earlier in the next cycle.

 

[Mamy]

When did you graduate or are you still in school?

I'll graduate in June.

And Jasmine, it sucks that you're in the same boat as I am. You're profile looks really good. I have to say I'm quite bitter that something as aribitrary as time of completion of application trumps merit. *tear* 🙁

Oh and I was also wondering about this: Does it ever happen that schools don't review complete applications at all b/c they run out of time?

Thanks.

 

[Areion]

hey thank you so much for that post. I am actually in my second year of a SMP doing research related to cardiology. Just wondering if you could direct me to schools at which I would be competitive or a site where I could find this info. Keep in mind I am a Canadian citizen as well which might limit my choices. Once again thanks!

Hi Canadian student,

I don't know what SMP is. I'll tell you there are US MD schools with canadian citizens; I have one or two in my class. They do pretty well.

I think your best shot will be at some of the schools close to the US/Canadian border, actually. I don't know where you can find this info about number of canadians accepted in each class. I think you'll most likely be competitive at private schools (you'll pay a lot more because you're considered international AND you wont' be eligible for as much or maybe any financial aid) so that's one thing to consider, but then again most american students have to take out ridiculous loans anyway. You might just have to find your loans from a canadian source. You likely might have limited choice at public schools plainly because they receive governmental funding (I am at a private school and don't know about the public school admissions process, so don't quote me on that)

Don't neglect a good look at schools in Vermont, Upstate NY, NYC, Michigan, Missouri, Illinois etc...some of those have decent programs and really look for candidates that are well rounded. Some prefer candidates who have done something outside of undergraduate before medical school while others are just looking for grades and numbers.

Any program you apply will definitely be interested in your cardiology research, so get as much out of that as you can! As I mentioned, doing that will help you for your residency applications down the line, no matter what you decide to go into.

summary:
-focus a look on private schools, and call up some public schools you're interested in and ask their admissions secretary about canadian applicants! You might be surprised.... (?)
-Rarely, a phone call with an inquiry and a cheerful pleasant tone of voice may get you an interview if the secretary thinks you're nice!
-you may have more luck near the US/Canadian border at smaller private programs.

 

[Areion]

Hey Mamy,

I totally understand what you're going through!!!!! I'm an applicant from a first tier US university with a 3.8 molecular biology major and 35T, lots of community service, leadership, research, and jobs w/ people skills, BUT I APPLIED LATE!!! It truly is the "kiss of death" as you put SO perfectly.

Honestly, I feel that all we can hope for after mid March is to interview for wait list spots. I'm starting to make my peace with the idea of working for a while if I don't get in and reapplying much much earlier in the next cycle.

That's terrible for both of you. You both have very good stats and some excellent things to offer a program in your profile. Lots of programs would have liked to interview you, but all of the admins and docs looking over your file are just about sweating right now trying to get their work done. It's a stretch to think they are going to be so forgiving at this late date, because a late application is almost like a sign of disrespect. Being late is a big mistake when submitting your application, and when you eventually are on the floors during your 3rd and 4th year. Being late with your application may signify something to them that they would not like in a medical student.

If you didn't learn it now, you WILL learn to be more humble when you get to medical school. If you don't learn it in the first two years in the high volume academia, you will at least learn it on your surgery, if not Medicine rotations. There is nothing like taking care of a relatively young patient with an unexplained stroke and being unable to offer anything more, and watching her die in front of you, despite all of the possible interventions and all of the understood mechanisms of her death. You must develop a sense of humility. (not to end this story on a bad note...because her family knew of her wishes to be an organ donor, she saved 9 people in the end--true story which made me more humble as a medical student and human being)

I hope you will get a wait-list spot from the remaining schools on your list.
However, think about it this way.
You've learned a valuable lesson which is applicable to almost any field of medicine. Never become too confident and lose your reasonability in this field, you'll get crushed if you do.

The worst case scenario for you may actually be your best. Let's say you don't get an offer this year. The worst thing that can happen is that you decide to take another year off (sounds sucky, but wait until first year and you'll wish you had some of that time back) and do more research or whatever you'd like for a year. THE FIRST DAY AMCAS IS OPEN, submit your file and send it! Submit it with the confidence that you might end up with a much better school than you could have ended up from the waitlist. While you're at it, broaden your application to include a few more schools that you didn't consider before, and go to the interviews. Then approach medical school with a healthy balance of humility and confidence. At any rate, you seem like a great student who will do well in medical school. Like the story of the tragedy in medicine I described to you that we couldn't fix, we were able to turn it into something we could, and you can do the same.

All the best,

Areion.

 

[167649]

I don't know what SMP is.

An SMP stands for "Special Masters Program." It is a post-bacc program tailored to premeds who didn't have the grades to get in (but usually a solid MCAT which indicates their potential). You are in a masters program but take classes with the med students, you are compared to them (Not factored into their curve, compared) and these results are sent to the schools you apply to. Doing well therefore demonstrates you can hang with medical school. It is commonly used to overcome "underperformance" in college. Usually they are 1-2 years in length and notoriously intense, you are essentially taking MS1, with some differences.

 

[167649]

Hi everyone,

I'm an international applicant and I applied pretty late in the season (not being familiar to the US system and all that). My GPA is 3.83 and my MCAT score is 38Q. I have a really strong research background (I'm finishing a Psychology Research Specialist HBSc program and I've done over 2.5 yrs of research). I've also had a year of clinical experience/shadowing, done a lot of tutoring, and a bunch of other extracurricular activities. I admit that my friends inflated my confidence and I applied to a bunch of top-tier schools, thinking that my stats would make me competitive. I reallized that applying late would be a challenge, but i never realized that, as someone said, it would be "the kiss of death" for me. I've been rejected from Vanderbilt, Stanford, Pritzker, and possibly Harvard. My only interview has been at WashU, and I'm still in review for 11 other schools: Yale, UPenn, NYU, BostonU, Baylor, Emory, Mt Sinai, Columbia, Cornell, Hopkins, and Dartmouth. I've reached the point of desperation and am on the verge of developing OCD with checking my e-mail/mail. Do I have any chances of hearing anything positive from the schools I'm waiting on? 🙁

Thanks

Hey Mamy,

I totally understand what you're going through!!!!! I'm an applicant from a first tier US university with a 3.8 molecular biology major and 35T, lots of community service, leadership, research, and jobs w/ people skills, BUT I APPLIED LATE!!! It truly is the "kiss of death" as you put SO perfectly.

Honestly, I feel that all we can hope for after mid March is to interview for wait list spots. I'm starting to make my peace with the idea of working for a while if I don't get in and reapplying much much earlier in the next cycle.

It is true applying late, and especially applying late without applying broadly, puts an applicant at significant disadvantage. Although both of your number sets are exceptional, it is also possible you had a bad LOR or poor written statements (Not saying this is the case, but there is no way for me to tell without seeing your app). These sorts of thinks seem like they take a backseat but with so many applicants it can actually do some damage to an app.

If you don't get an acceptance this year, make sure to apply asap the next cycle. That means having everything ready to go on June 1st. Focus hard on the PS, make sure you are confident with your LOR's, get some more experience if you have time, and get that app in early. Also, try to apply broadly across the spectrum. There are no such things as "safeties" in med school but by applying to a broad range of schools with different admissions stats you simply increase the chances of getting more acceptances. And of course don't procrastinate on those secondaries either, those are just as important timewise. If so, with those numbers I would be surprised if you didn't get some more interviews.

I'll graduate in June.

And Jasmine, it sucks that you're in the same boat as I am. You're profile looks really good. I have to say I'm quite bitter that something as aribitrary as time of completion of application trumps merit. *tear* 🙁

Oh and I was also wondering about this: Does it ever happen that schools don't review complete applications at all b/c they run out of time?

Thanks.

Most schools will not review certain applications from day one. At many places, if you don't have the numbers that give you a good standing on the other side of a computer formula, a human being never sees your application. As time passes the "number formula" gets harder and steeper, and near the end of the cycle only those who submit with excellent stats are seriously considered. It is harsh but reality in a process which is highly competitive. But both of you have great stats so I wouldn't worry about that, it just seems you underestimated an early application.

 

[Mamy]

You're so right about me underestimating an early application. 🙁 I wrote my MCAT really late (sep 15th, had results by oct 15th) but I really should have just done all the applications as soon as I learned my score..stupid undergrad school work getting in way of medical school 😛!!!

p.s. ppl weren't kidding when they said sdn is addictive!

 

[viscous]

ok heres the deal. My goal is to get into top tier or at least middle tier med school in USA. I am a Canadian and would be applying this April as an international student.

My cumulative GPA would be 3.72 if I finish my degree this April and would be > 3.75 if I stay back for 1 more year only if I get rejected from Canadian schools.

My mcat score is 32 Q with 8 VR, 13 PS, and 11 BS. I am planning to rewrite my mcat this september to increase my chances within Canadian schools.

I have a lousy first year gpa that was 3.08. After that I have constantly clicked above 3.83 for the last 3 years and reached 4.0 while taking the 'hardest' courses on my campus in the top research intensive university of Canada.

I need to take an ENG credit. Should I take it in summer or maybe next year if I plan to come back as I get rejected from all Canadian schools by mid March? I hope the US schools will start reviewing my application if I plan to take ENG credit starting sept 2008 continuing to April 2009!

I have some solid research experience both in religious studies and chemistry. Hopefully I will also get a fellowship for summer research in neurobiology this summer, God willing. I might get couple of publications from my humanities research as we are still working on the material.

I need some suggestions.

 

[Mamy]

I have a lousy first year gpa that was 3.08. After that I have constantly clicked above 3.83 for the last 3 years and reached 4.0 while taking the 'hardest' courses on my campus in the top research intensive university of Canada.

You sound like a UofTer 😉

 

[viscous]

You sound like a UofTer 😉

right on, you got it baby! 😀

 

[Vihsadas]

ok heres the deal. My goal is to get into top tier or at least middle tier med school in USA. I am a Canadian and would be applying this April as an international student.

My cumulative GPA would be 3.72 if I finish my degree this April and would be > 3.75 if I stay back for 1 more year only if I get rejected from Canadian schools.

My mcat score is 32 Q with 8 VR, 13 PS, and 11 BS. I am planning to rewrite my mcat this september to increase my chances within Canadian schools.

I have a lousy first year gpa that was 3.08. After that I have constantly clicked above 3.83 for the last 3 years and reached 4.0 while taking the 'hardest' courses on my campus in the top research intensive university of Canada.

I need to take an ENG credit. Should I take it in summer or maybe next year if I plan to come back as I get rejected from all Canadian schools by mid March? I hope the US schools will start reviewing my application if I plan to take ENG credit starting sept 2008 continuing to April 2009!

I have some solid research experience both in religious studies and chemistry. Hopefully I will also get a fellowship for summer research in neurobiology this summer, God willing. I might get couple of publications from my humanities research as we are still working on the material.

I need some suggestions.

Ah. There's that darned '10 10 10' rule that a lot Canada has. The Ontario GPA cutoff was 3.87 this year eh? W...T...F.

Good luck on your retake. I'd make sure that you target the schools that are international friendly...and don't go by the school website! See if you can find some canadian => US allo stats somewhere. I haven't looked (even though I'm a Canadian) because I'm a US perm. Doing some crazy ECs in the US will probably help your cause if you have a chance to go down there.

 

[whtlight2121]

I have no research experience and little volunteer. I do have one unusual EC ( I was on the women's basketball practice squad for 2 years) and have worked at a hospital for almost 3 years now as a phlebotomist and micro tech aid. As a phlebotomist I have worked in ICU, CCU, NCU, PICU, and ER at a trauma level I hospital. I have also been specially trained to work as a phlebotomist in the NICU and have worked there as well. I have learned more about medicine from working in the hospital than everything I have done in school combined. In actuality, my experience in the hospital is what pushed the idea of medicine as a career into action.

BCPM 3.62(this included a 0.0 that I received because I missed a final. Yes I screwed up royally here)
Overall 3.7

MCAT--took it JAN 26 (hopefully 30+)

I find it hard to gauge where my app stands. I feel that as far as clinical exposure goes I have great experience, but I lack research. I want to be a clinical doc. which is not to say that I don't think research is important. I like medicine, but I don't like the game that we need to play to get into med school. I can't be fake, and if tried in an interview they would see right through it. With that in mind, how do a write a good personal statement? My friends that have been successful in the app. process have written things along the lines of, "Being a doctor is something I have known I have wanted since I was 10 years old and I broke my arm. BLAh balbal bla bla blah." This definitely is not a lifelong dream for me, but rather a realization that I like science and I like working with people and am not annoyed by sick people (most of them~~have to keep it real).

So my expert friends...what are my chances? Lets consider a worse case scenario 29-30 mCAT. Thank you for your time.

 

[viscous]

I have no research experience and little volunteer. I do have one unusual EC ( I was on the women's basketball practice squad for 2 years) and have worked at a hospital for almost 3 years now as a phlebotomist and micro tech aid. As a phlebotomist I have worked in ICU, CCU, NCU, PICU, and ER at a trauma level I hospital. I have also been specially trained to work as a phlebotomist in the NICU and have worked there as well. I have learned more about medicine from working in the hospital than everything I have done in school combined. In actuality, my experience in the hospital is what pushed the idea of medicine as a career into action.

BCPM 3.62(this included a 0.0 that I received because I missed a final. Yes I screwed up royally here)
Overall 3.7

MCAT--took it JAN 26 (hopefully 30+)

I find it hard to gauge where my app stands. I feel that as far as clinical exposure goes I have great experience, but I lack research. I want to be a clinical doc. which is not to say that I don't think research is important. I like medicine, but I don't like the game that we need to play to get into med school. I can't be fake, and if tried in an interview they would see right through it. With that in mind, how do a write a good personal statement? My friends that have been successful in the app. process have written things along the lines of, "Being a doctor is something I have known I have wanted since I was 10 years old and I broke my arm. BLAh balbal bla bla blah." This definitely is not a lifelong dream for me, but rather a realization that I like science and I like working with people and am not annoyed by sick people (most of them~~have to keep it real).

So my expert friends...what are my chances? Lets consider a worse case scenario 29-30 mCAT. Thank you for your time.

I think, being a US citizen, you have a very good chance at middle tier schools as long as you explain why you missed the final and the reason should be legit. I wonder if it was legit why did not your school comepensate for that in the first place. I am aware of students who defer tests and exams on purpose and get a doctor's note for that. for the makeup, they literally nail it down. They, by now, would have smoked about thousands of their dollars on getting those doctor notes.....but I guess, getting into med school is more important than the means.