What’s it like living on an attending’s salary

[otherstuff12321]

I need motivation gas bros...

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Iso4ane]

I can afford a few nicer things now and not have to worry about it, like two-ply toilet paper or name brand Kraft Mac-n-Cheese, and if i wanted to push myself, a G-Wagon instead of a red one.

 

[sevo00]

Cocaine and hookers every weekend

 

[IMGASMD]

Vacations, to actually get away….

Don’t have to worry about “everyday” things.
That 10 year old car, breakdown? No more. You CAN fix jt, or buy a new one.
Eating instant noodles (not there’s anything wrong with it, if you like it) at end of the month, because all the bills are due.
Really paying down your student loans, so you can be financially independent.

You’re getting there….

 

[IMGASMD]

Cocaine and hookers every weekend

This dude knows!

 

[D P356]

You cannot outearn the rules of addition, subtraction and basic accounting. The numbers for in and out get larger, but basic math still applies.

 

[DocMcCoy]

Ya it could be better, but I can't think of any full time anesthesia gig you won't be able to live really comfortably, indulge yourself regularly, and still be able to save adequately for retirement.

 

[Pappy Van Propofol]

You can have anything you want. You just can’t have everything you want.

 

[aneftp]

You cannot outearn the rules of addition, subtraction and basic accounting. The numbers for in and out get larger, but basic math still applies.

That’s the problem. The spending. 15-20k is a average number for a 7 day family vacation for 4 with airfare. If you want to do it the right way.

Kids day care if both parents works. Kids activities accelerate as they get into more activities.

Say you have two kids. $1000 each into their 529 account. That’s $2k. Dance cheer tennis baseball etc. that’s another $500 a month etc. m

It all depends if you are married or single and kids or no kids with attending salary.

 

[GassYous]

You're just watching everything get more expensive while your pay stays the same

 

[nimbus]

You're just watching everything get more expensive while your pay stays the same

Gas is under $6/gal. Inflation is over!!

 

[Mman]

I need motivation gas bros...

I get to save a very large amount of money every year

 

[coffeebythelake]

Better work life balance, more money and better vacations.
lifestyle creep does set in pretty quickly
you won't be rich, and you still have to mind your spending, but you'll live a pretty decent lifestyle

 

[dannyboy1]

Cocaine and hookers every weekend

It’s all about priorities. If you skip the cocaine you can get hookers for weeknights as well….

 

[JOHNBROCHILL]

I get the guacamole at chipotle

 

[DocVapor]

It’s all about priorities. If you skip the cocaine you can get hookers for weeknights as well….

Yeah but neither are as good alone. Very much a symbiotic relationship.

 

[Guillemot]

I make five figures and drive a Dodge Stratus.

 

[Ashers]

I live with my parents and can't afford a 2000sqft house built between 1940-1960 in my metro area (in a safe neighborhood). Well, I could afford it, but then I couldn't do anything else, like travel anywhere, because all I'd be doing is making house payments and repairing it. The market is cooling, I hope.

 

[Drwine]

You can afford a nice home, 2 cars and take nice vacations. A vacation home is also a possibility. You can't afford an expensive airplane of large yacht which take a VA attending salary to maintain. To reach the next level requires a steady million dollar plus income. The people in that group can't afford the multiple multimillion dollar homes that corporate CEOs and the Hollywood A list own which require over 20 million a year.

 

[anbuitachi]

I can afford a few nicer things now and not have to worry about it, like two-ply toilet paper or name brand Kraft Mac-n-Cheese, and if i wanted to push myself, a G-Wagon instead of a red one.

definitely this. i dont need to conserve paper towers and stuff. i freely use them because im not worried about the 30$ i spend on a pack. also toilet paper is 2 ply. my apartment i rent is also larger now.

im also less stressed with money over all despite spending majority of my paycheck every month

i would say those are the main differences

 

[anbuitachi]

I live with my parents and can't afford a 2000sqft house built between 1940-1960 in my metro area (in a safe neighborhood). Well, I could afford it, but then I couldn't do anything else, like travel anywhere, because all I'd be doing is making house payments and repairing it. The market is cooling, I hope.

2000 sq ft is massive for 1 person.

 

[Gator7]

These threads always helped when I was a struggling resident.

Took a high paying job in a low COL area. Just bought our first home that’s ~5000 sq ft on 2-3 acres (5 kids) for 1x my salary. This was our 10th move in 10 years mostly from crappy apartment to crappy apartment. We both now drive our dream cars (nothing crazy). Formerly drove a 20 yr old Subaru and my wife had a worn out minivan. With a large family I have a lot of extra expenses but still saving half my take home. Attending life has a different set of stresses but the life I am able to provide my family is great. Wife and I just took our first vacation in about a decade and where able to stay in a 5 star resort in the mountains of Wyoming without really thinking about it. Would I do it all over again? Nah probably not too much sacrifice but ask me in another decade and might be a different answer

 

[anbuitachi]

That’s the problem. The spending. 15-20k is a average number for a 7 day family vacation for 4 with airfare. If you want to do it the right way.

Kids day care if both parents works. Kids activities accelerate as they get into more activities.

Say you have two kids. $1000 each into their 529 account. That’s $2k. Dance cheer tennis baseball etc. that’s another $500 a month etc. m

It all depends if you are married or single and kids or no kids with attending salary.

my babys special formula alone is 1000$ a month.

 

[markneil]

As a single guy, I'm able to save. No need for a large home, 1 nice car. So I put away maybe 80-90% of my income. Done with this in 7-10 years.

 

[Silo004]

As a single guy, I'm able to save. No need for a large home, 1 nice car. So I put away maybe 80-90% of my income. Done with this in 7-10 years.

Amazing that everyone finished with training is looking to exit as soon as they get just a bit of financial comfort.

Worked hard to get in and even harder(?) to get out.

 

[Status Sciaticus]

2000 sq ft is massive for 1 person.

Nah, my dog needs a living room and a bedroom for himself.

One of the things I am looking forward to is getting a 911 Turbo S. Its nice when you dont have kids sucking all the money out of your life.

 

[chessknt]

my babys special formula alone is 1000$ a month.

If legit you can probably get your health insurance to cover that if you dig in and work on it. I know someone else with a similar problem and after some fighting they got the special formula covered at full cost.

 

[Ashers]

2000 sq ft is massive for 1 person.

The 3000sqft house I owned before was massive. 2000sqft is downsizing. To each their own, but my cats get their own room for their stuff. I work hard to give my cats a better life.

 

[anbuitachi]

If legit you can probably get your health insurance to cover that if you dig in and work on it. I know someone else with a similar problem and after some fighting they got the special formula covered at full cost.

yea we been working on it. so far nothing yet. also im not sure they will cover since im buying from third party sellers, on amazon. ebay probably next. official websites out of stock

 

[anbuitachi]

I get the guacamole at chipotle

funny because i havent gotten there yet... one day hopefully!

 

[anbuitachi]

Amazing that everyone finished with training is looking to exit as soon as they get just a bit of financial comfort.

Worked hard to get in and even harder(?) to get out.

every premed should know this! but they dont, and wont believe for some reason. they being fed the coolaid

 

[IMGASMD]

every premed should know this! but they dont, and wont believe for some reason. they being fed the coolaid

Sort of the corollary to this is you will actually have some means to “self care”. Since you’re always chasing the next “goal” while being “poor.”

You’re no longer subject to insurances 5-10 psych visits a year. Or getting a proper massage or spa treatment. Or getting a painter/contractor to take care of a job properly. I also like buying second-hand stuff or fixing broken electronics. Now it’s no longer a necessity, but more of a hobby.

 

[Iso4ane]

Sort of the corollary to this is you will actually have some means to “self care”. Since you’re always chasing the next “goal” while being “poor.”

You’re no longer subject to insurances 5-10 psych visits a year. Or getting a proper massage or spa treatment. Or getting a painter/contractor to take care of a job properly. I also like buying second-hand stuff or fixing broken electronics. Now it’s no longer a necessity, but more of a hobby.

I always been a tinker (or at least not afraid to tinker around), but it’s nice knowing that if something goes wrong I don’t have to sweat it about bringing a professional in.

 

[Dr. Rude]

Amazing that everyone finished with training is looking to exit as soon as they get just a bit of financial comfort.

Worked hard to get in and even harder(?) to get out.

Because of unmet expectations of how satisfying the work would be.

 

[GassYous]

Amazing that everyone finished with training is looking to exit as soon as they get just a bit of financial comfort.

Worked hard to get in and even harder(?) to get out.

Yeah because what you think the job is as a premed vs what it actually is are two totally different things

 

[Pappy Van Propofol]

I had a difficult time with the “arrival fallacy” throughout my life. It really hits hard once all your goals are finished like passing boards and becoming a partner and making great money. I’m now just realizing how awesome it is to not worry about how much that prime steak costs or spending tons of money on your kids hobbies. There’s no destination anymore. Just live and try to enjoy it.

 

[IMGASMD]

I always been a tinker (or at least not afraid to tinker around), but it’s nice knowing that if something goes wrong I don’t have to sweat it about bringing a professional in.

I bought/sold and fixed a few cellphones while in residency…
Maybe making $20-50 a phone, just for some spending money. I was also trading unlimited data plans and iPhones…. Now no need to hustle, more just for tinkering and fun.

 

[anbuitachi]

I bought/sold and fixed a few cellphones while in residency…
Maybe making $20-50 a phone, just for some spending money. I was also trading unlimited data plans and iPhones…. Now no need to hustle, more just for tinkering and fun.

I just upgraded my phone plan to 12gb from 5gb. Wifi is crap at work. I decided I make enough to not have to constantly budget my data for the month. Feels good to be attending

 

[pgg]

Amazing that everyone finished with training is looking to exit as soon as they get just a bit of financial comfort.

Not really. I won't be working at all when I'm 70, and I won't be working full time when I'm 60 (maybe 55 depending on what the markets do). But it's useful, mostly enjoyable work.

I like my job and the people I work with. Of note, I did not take the highest paying job available to me - just the one in the best place and the best practice structure available to me. I easily left a couple hundred $K on the table, but I'm debt free, kids are grown, just me and my wife and some dogs and a cat, and I'm working a good job for enough money. Why would I torture myself to scratch my way up to $700K+?

Decide what's enough for you, and be happy with it. If your happiness hinges on what other doctors or even CRNAs are earning, you're in for a lifetime of heartburn.

It's a good life.


Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness.

Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery.



There's plenty of money in anesthesia so long as you don't feel the need to "keep up" with the ortho spine guys.

 

[ethilo]

I'm currently 4 years out of residency, ended residency with $396k student loan debt and $40k car loans. Wife is 0.5 FTE primary care.

- Bought our first house 2 years in - a 5800 sq. ft. property with 10 acres using 20% down we had saved up earlier.
- We afford a nanny whose schedule matches my wife's clinic hours
- Maxing out our profit sharing plan and wife's 401k and both of our backdoor roth IRAs, allots to about $85k post-tax saved per year.
- 2 kids' 529 accounts now have $30k each in them, they are 3 and 5 years old.
- Cars paid off.
- We budget $1000 a month for vacation money
- 8 weeks vacation a year for me, 4 weeks for my wife
- Still have our cars from residency but they are "good enough" and we are not car people, however we did buy a $28k tractor for the property
- Student loans will be done in the 3rd quarter of the 5th year out of residency. I committed to a 5 year fixed payoff plan with a private lender, and we plan to put an end to it early.

I probably work 55 hours a week, modest amount of call. Once the student loans are gone we're going to re-evaluate whether or not I need to

 

[cchoukal]

When I first started making money, I had the realization on the way home from work that I could get take-out and not have to worry about it. Time has passed, and both my income and overhead have increased. I think the way "attending money" feels is a combination of one's constitution and expectations, as much as what the number is. I've noticed on here and among colleagues over the years that some people are worriers, some people are chronically less-happy, etc., and I think that bleeds into how they feel about their income. I know two-physician families in my area making close to a million a year and they're still unhappy. For myself, having grown up without a lot of financial security, the thing that feels good to me is that I never have to worry about having enough money for normal, nice things. Vacations, a car, emergencies, etc. I've stocked my twins' 529s, have a reasonably robust retirement strategy (this is one area where I wish I could save more, but we're in a VHCOL area), have two nice cars without payments. All that said, and this is probably as good a place to say it as any, I've accepted a different job in the area that pays more... So even I am not immune to the "just a little bit more" phenomenon.

 

[IMGASMD]

I just upgraded my phone plan to 12gb from 5gb. Wifi is crap at work. I decided I make enough to not have to constantly budget my data for the month. Feels good to be attending

I was on my parents plan. They never really understood how data usage is calculated. (They never will.)
So I’ve always tried to find the best way to get us unlimited data…. Hence the trading, wheeling and dealing. Yes, probably a “waste” for most of the time. But I really didn’t/don’t want to ever spend time and energy to deal with overage. Those can be crazy expensive or I had to spend hours on the phone talking to five or more people.

Now I just pick up their cell phone bills, no one has to worry about data.

 

[nimbus]

When I first started making money, I had the realization on the way home from work that I could get take-out and not have to worry about it. Time has passed, and both my income and overhead have increased. I think the way "attending money" feels is a combination of one's constitution and expectations, as much as what the number is. I've noticed on here and among colleagues over the years that some people are worriers, some people are chronically less-happy, etc., and I think that bleeds into how they feel about their income. I know two-physician families in my area making close to a million a year and they're still unhappy. For myself, having grown up without a lot of financial security, the thing that feels good to me is that I never have to worry about having enough money for normal, nice things. Vacations, a car, emergencies, etc. I've stocked my twins' 529s, have a reasonably robust retirement strategy (this is one area where I wish I could save more, but we're in a VHCOL area), have two nice cars without payments. All that said, and this is probably as good a place to say it as any, I've accepted a different job in the area that pays more... So even I am not immune to the "just a little bit more" phenomenon.

Congrats! Hope you like the new gig.

 

[anbuitachi]

When I first started making money, I had the realization on the way home from work that I could get take-out and not have to worry about it. Time has passed, and both my income and overhead have increased. I think the way "attending money" feels is a combination of one's constitution and expectations, as much as what the number is. I've noticed on here and among colleagues over the years that some people are worriers, some people are chronically less-happy, etc., and I think that bleeds into how they feel about their income. I know two-physician families in my area making close to a million a year and they're still unhappy. For myself, having grown up without a lot of financial security, the thing that feels good to me is that I never have to worry about having enough money for normal, nice things. Vacations, a car, emergencies, etc. I've stocked my twins' 529s, have a reasonably robust retirement strategy (this is one area where I wish I could save more, but we're in a VHCOL area), have two nice cars without payments. All that said, and this is probably as good a place to say it as any, I've accepted a different job in the area that pays more... So even I am not immune to the "just a little bit more" phenomenon.

i think as anesthesiologists, or physicians in general, we just need to accept that there are many with way lighter schedules and make way more. otherwise you will be comparing and chasing forever. i walk by areas to work with houses and apartments that are completely unaffordable to me. but i just accept that as an anesthesiologist, im just middle class,

 

[Iso4ane]

i think as anesthesiologists, or physicians in general, we just need to accept that there are many with way lighter schedules and make way more. otherwise you will be comparing and chasing forever. i walk by areas to work with houses and apartments that are completely unaffordable to me. but i just accept that as an anesthesiologist, im just middle class,

Middle class as compared to some of the proceduralist and C-Suite people. But, at every at a very conservative 300K/yr, that puts us a decent amount (~4-5x) above median household income in the US.

 

[Status Sciaticus]

i think as anesthesiologists, or physicians in general, we just need to accept that there are many with way lighter schedules and make way more. otherwise you will be comparing and chasing forever. i walk by areas to work with houses and apartments that are completely unaffordable to me. but i just accept that as an anesthesiologist, im just middle class,

Middle class income is 65000-120000 depending on your source. Gross income. Youre easily 3x that. You're at least in top 10% territory if not top 5% (350K).

 

[Silo004]

I like my job and the people I work with. Of note, I did not take the highest paying job available to me - just the one in the best place and the best practice structure available to me. I easily left a couple hundred $K on the table, but I'm debt free, kids are grown, just me and my wife and some dogs and a cat, and I'm working a good job for enough money. Why would I torture myself to scratch my way up to $700K+?

I love to see it.

The 'harder to get out' comment was merely an observation. We all spent ~12 years at minimum working to be anesthesiologists for the majority -- via very informal poll -- to be itching to do other stuff with their lives.

In other words, anesthesiology -- for anesthesiologists -- appears to be merely an honest, medium octane vehicle to some financial destination. I don't think one could say the same for our surgical, medical colleagues. Do interventional cardiologists, spine surgeons think in the same fashion? I doubt it. Their mentalities just seem altogether different.

Just a year out of residency. Left a job in a bit of a sketchy place. Just made a leap to another practice taking the highest paying job I can find for just right around 75th percentile MGMA with people who seem nicer, more collegial. The arrival fallacy is super real already and I am still studying for oral boards.

 

[banister]

Honestly the best part is that I don't really think about money as much. I don't need to budget anymore and don't feel restricted as much. If I feel like going out for dinner, I do it. I can tip generously. If I go out with friends or family, it's not a big deal to pick up the tab. If my kid wants to learn something new that requires lessons, she'll get it.

I don't check my bank account or retirement accounts like I used to. I automate all the bills from credit cards/mortgage/insurance. I automate my DCA savings. I review everything maybe once a month or so for any egregious charges. But otherwise, I think much less about money on a day to day basis. It's great

 

[Mman]

Honestly the best part is that I don't really think about money as much. I don't need to budget anymore and don't feel restricted as much. If I feel like going out for dinner, I do it. I can tip generously. If I go out with friends or family, it's not a big deal to pick up the tab. If my kid wants to learn something new that requires lessons, she'll get it.

I don't check my bank account or retirement accounts like I used to. I automate all the bills from credit cards/mortgage/insurance. I automate my DCA savings. I review everything maybe once a month or so for any egregious charges. But otherwise, I think much less about money on a day to day basis. It's great

yep, a long long time ago JPP posted here that he doesn't have to worry about the price of gas when he fills up. Having a high income lets you forget those multitude of little worries middle class folks have on a day to day basis. You can buy something at the grocery store that looks good without religiously checking the price before throwing it in your cart.

 

[BLADEMDA]

These threads always helped when I was a struggling resident.

Took a high paying job in a low COL area. Just bought our first home that’s ~5000 sq ft on 2-3 acres (5 kids) for 1x my salary. This was our 10th move in 10 years mostly from crappy apartment to crappy apartment. We both now drive our dream cars (nothing crazy). Formerly drove a 20 yr old Subaru and my wife had a worn out minivan. With a large family I have a lot of extra expenses but still saving half my take home. Attending life has a different set of stresses but the life I am able to provide my family is great. Wife and I just took our first vacation in about a decade and where able to stay in a 5 star resort in the mountains of Wyoming without really thinking about it. Would I do it all over again? Nah probably not too much sacrifice but ask me in another decade and might be a different answer

Here is my dream car. I can afford it but no car is really worth more than about $120k. Cars are a waste of money so I stay under $100K but I do want this car.