What's the average veterinary salary, after taxes?

[HopefulAg]

I know the average veterinary salary, starting out, is $50,000 - 70,000, but what is it after taxes? Obviously this will be variable from state to state (for instance, Texas has sales tax, but no state income tax) but was hoping for a ballpark figure of actual take home pay each month.

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[Armymutt25A]

I always use an estimate of 72% take home after Fed income, Social Security, and Medicare. It will be a lowball figure, which is always good for planning purposes.

 

[Morganator]

Go to paycheckcity.com and you can put in the state you would be residing in and all deductions you would expect. You can even put in pre and post tax deductions for medical/401k/etc. It's probably the best estimate you can find.

 

[chii chan]

72% seems about right, but also depends on if you're married, have kids, own a home, etc. My friend (making 60k in management) gets taxed 28%, and said that the percentage might go up soon. My friend is also male, white, single, and renting a home as of right now.

 

[HopefulAg]

Go to paycheckcity.com and you can put in the state you would be residing in and all deductions you would expect. You can even put in pre and post tax deductions for medical/401k/etc. It's probably the best estimate you can find.

Neat. Think I might just go with the magic number of 72% though, as I'm lazy lol.

 

[HopefulAg]

Ok so here's what I'm hung up on. My best estimate for monthly payment of a $230,000 loan, is $3,300. If you make $60,000, and use the 72% rule, you get $43,200 which leaves you with $3,600 to actually live on for a year. Not possible.

But obviously people do it, or else vet schools wouldn't be able to charge that much for tuition, because all their graduates would starve. So are my calculations way off? Or I suppose they could have a spouse that works to make the 'real' money for 10 years? So basically being single and paying off that much debt is impossible?

Anyone have any insight? I'd love to hear from a vet with that much debt if anyone's asked, but I don't know any personally (all the vets I ever worked with have been out for a while now) and it's not exactly a tactful subject to bring up unless you know them well.

 

[Morganator]

Ok so here's what I'm hung up on. My best estimate for monthly payment of a $230,000 loan, is $3,300. If you make $60,000, and use the 72% rule, you get $43,200 which leaves you with $3,600 to actually live on for a year. Not possible.

But obviously people do it, or else vet schools wouldn't be able to charge that much for tuition, because all their graduates would starve. So are my calculations way off? Or I suppose they could have a spouse that works to make the 'real' money for 10 years? So basically being single and paying off that much debt is impossible?

Anyone have any insight? I'd love to hear from a vet with that much debt if anyone's asked, but I don't know any personally (all the vets I ever worked with have been out for a while now) and it's not exactly a tactful subject to bring up unless you know them well.

Excuse my prying, but weren't you recently accepted to your in-state school? I could be thinking of someone else, but if you were to attend Texas in-state wouldn't the total cost be somewhere around $130,000? Maybe you have an abnormal amount of undergrad debt, but I was just curious when I saw such a huge loan amount.

 

[HopefulAg]

Excuse my prying, but weren't you recently accepted to your in-state school? I could be thinking of someone else, but if you were to attend Texas in-state wouldn't the total cost be somewhere around $130,000? Maybe you have an abnormal amount of undergrad debt, but I was just curious when I saw such a huge loan amount.

I am, but I'm also trying to decide if I want to go to Edinburgh over A&M. Edinburgh is the $230,000 school, which from a financial standpoint, doesn't seem possible, so that may make the decision for me.

 

[BlacKAT33]

id also like to know about a higher loan because mine will be about 260k . I know 100k of debt is a lot too, but mine will be more than double that! so i am also slightly freaking out about how the f i will pay it off in a reasonable amount of time. i looked up every scholarship i can find and nothing seems to fit. i've talked with students who are doing lab animal at my school and they said they haven't gotten any scholarship in that field. will i just be doomed to pay my loans off over 30 yrs? so i wont be done until i'm 58?? sighh

 

[random23]

HopefulAg,
If you make over $3,000 payments on your loan each month your first year out, you will have next to nothing to live on that year like you said. But I don't think most people pay their loans back that way. I am going to start out with a longer repayment plan (it reduces your required monthly payments to what you can afford, and you're not bound to it-so you can always pay back more if you want/can).

Then, as your salary goes up (because of more experience and because of inflation) you can afford to make larger payments on your loan each month. After 5 years you could be making $80-100,000 / year, or perhaps more (perhaps less depending on what you do). If you decide to specialize, you will probably incur a lot of interest during your additional training years, but you could come out with a salary significantly above $100,000/year. I wouldn't base your entire loan repayment on your first-second year salary.

I'm not saying borrowing $230,000 for school is insignificant, and you should certainly weigh your options. However, you will be one of many borrowing a large amount for school (not just Edinburgh students, OOS students probably have around this much debt too) and you may have to sacrifice some things (like buying a house soon after you graduate, putting off children..whatever), but I doubt you will be struggling to afford to live like you are imagining.

good luck with your decision!

 

[StartingoverVet]

Ok so here's what I'm hung up on. My best estimate for monthly payment of a $230,000 loan, is $3,300. If you make $60,000, and use the 72% rule, you get $43,200 which leaves you with $3,600 to actually live on for a year. Not possible.

But obviously people do it, or else vet schools wouldn't be able to charge that much for tuition, because all their graduates would starve. So are my calculations way off? Or I suppose they could have a spouse that works to make the 'real' money for 10 years? So basically being single and paying off that much debt is impossible?

Anyone have any insight? I'd love to hear from a vet with that much debt if anyone's asked, but I don't know any personally (all the vets I ever worked with have been out for a while now) and it's not exactly a tactful subject to bring up unless you know them well.

One part of the equation missing is that student loan interest expense is directly deductible from your income as long as your income is less than 70k (which unfortunately is most likely).. .you don't even have to itemize. So your net take home pay will be higher (or more likely you will get a big tax refund).

Still, as I mentioned (unpopularly) in the other thread on finances, it is a pretty difficult situation unless you have other sources of income.

The 2 vets that I know just out of expensive schools both went to school with "family support."

Anything you can do to lower the amount of debt you come out with really helps. Summer jobs, working during school, sharing expenses, etc all make a big difference to your monthly payments immediately after school but certainly make life during school a little more challenging.

 

[parietal]

Your numbers are off a bit. According to this student loan calculator, 10-year repayment for a $230,000 loan would be $[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]2,646.85 a month.

Monthly after-tax payments for a single Texan with no children on a $60,000 salary would be $.3,837.81.

$1,200 a month certainly is not a ton to live on, but better than your estimates. Also, remember that part of your student loan interest is tax deductible and that your salary is likely to increase after your first year or two. Keep in mind there are also graduated re-payment possibilities.

ETA: Sorry for the repetitive info, a bunch of others posted while I was crunching numbers. The links should bring you straight to the calculators, though, so you can all crunch numbers for yourselves. Very useful, I've found.

 

[Willowhand]

I'm trying to figure out the finances too, since KSU will leave me in about 200k of debt as well.

One bright side I can think of though is that in the veterinary world "experienced" often seems to mean you have 2-3 years of work under your belt -that's not so bad. And with those few years, the average salary rises quite a bit (these are my observations after reading through a few websites of veterinary classified ads). So keep in mind that we probably won't be earning the new graduate salary for long.

 

[david594]

There are also the 25 year extended repayment options and the Income Based Repayment options.

 

[HopefulAg]

Blah, I hate that there's so many unknowns.

Your numbers are off a bit. According to this student loan calculator, 10-year repayment for a $230,000 loan would be $[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]2,646.85 a month..

[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]

Did you use the 6.8% default rate?

The way I did it in Excel was to account for the subsidized interest rate, the unsubsidized interest rate, and the Grad PLUS interest rates, both in and out of school. However, I'm not sure I did it entirely correctly, but it looks right.

But yah, I didn't take the tax deductions into account. Not sure how much that'd be though. Taxes are not my thing. Just way too many of them.




With the 25 year extended repayment option, the total monthly payment goes down to $2,107, but you're paying back almost three times the initial amount ($600,000) in total, which is a $200,000 change from the 10 year option.

But again, I'm not sure my spreadsheet is 100% accurate, so take it with a grain. And this is assuming you pay the same monthly payment every month and never more.
.

 

[BlacKAT33]

[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]


With the 25 year extended repayment option, the total monthly payment goes down to $2,107, but you're paying back almost three times the initial amount ($600,000) in total, which is a $200,000 change from the 10 year option.


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whhaaaaaaaaattt?? i know it goes up after time... but 600k? is this right? i knew it increased...but i didnt realize it was THAT much. hmm i will have to look this up after work

 

[parietal]

[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]Did you use the 6.8% default rate?

The way I did it in Excel was to account for the subsidized interest rate, the unsubsidized interest rate, and the Grad PLUS interest rates, both in and out of school. However, I'm not sure I did it entirely correctly, but it looks right. .

I did, good point. Forgot Grad PLUS has higher rates and I didn't include the interest during school, which of course adds up. I like your idea of doing it all in Excel to get even better numbers. I may have to do that myself.

And I'm with you on trying to pay off the debt as soon as possible. Especially as a non-trad, there's no way I want to still be paying off student debt in 30 years.

 

[HopefulAg]

Ok so here's the calculator I've been talking about. Go to the last tab (General Calculator). The top two calculators are done assuming payment during vet school. The bottom two are done assuming no payment during vet school. I've been using the bottom two because they're more complete and there's some problems with the top two.

To use it, just pop in the estimated amount of debt in the purple box and your target goal pay off period (Duration of Loan) in the top cell of that column (it'll automatically change all the other duration cells).

If anyone wants to go over it and see if I did it correctly, feel free. Hell, it's encouraged.

http://www.mediafire.com/file/m1wctzaltra/EdinburghLoanCalc.xls



Oh you might play with changing the Grad PLUS interest rate from 8.5 to 7.9, as there is a 7.9 option, I just don't know how to get it. Only changes the monthly payment by about $100 though.

 

[parietal]

whhaaaaaaaaattt?? i know it goes up after time... but 600k? is this right? i knew it increased...but i didnt realize it was THAT much. hmm i will have to look this up after work

Yep. Even without factoring the higher interest for Grad PLUS and the accrued interest during vet school, a $230,000 loan will cost [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]$539,792.38 over 30 years versus $.[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]317,621.59. over 10 years. [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]Interest is a bitch. 🙁.

 

[parietal]

If anyone wants to go over it and see if I did it correctly, feel free. Hell, it's encouraged.

Oh you might play with changing the Grad PLUS interest rate from 8.5 to 7.9, as there is a 7.9 option, I just don't know how to get it. Only changes the monthly payment by about $100 though.

Cool spreadsheet. From my Iowa State information, graduate subsidized Staffords are at 6.8% and the Grad/Vet PLUS loans are 7.99%. Maybe it's different for foreign schools?

Also, keep in mind that the official cost of attendance does not need to be what it actually costs you to attend... You can get roommates, buy used books, take public transportation rather than drive, etc.

 

[HopefulAg]

Cool spreadsheet. From my Iowa State information, graduate subsidized Staffords are at 6.8% and the Grad/Vet PLUS loans are 7.99%. Maybe it's different for foreign schools?

I don't think it's different for foreign schools, however I was under the impression that 6.8 is the unsubsidized and subsidized is 5.6. However, that might've been an undergraduate rate I suppose.

Also, keep in mind that the official cost of attendance does not need to be what it actually costs you to attend... You can get roommates, buy used books, take public transportation rather than drive, etc.

Oh no doubt, and you can bet I'll be riding my bike on nice days. Good exercise and cheap! But I always like to plan for the worst-case.

 

[david594]

Stafford are 6.8% for grad school, doesn't matter if they are subsidized or not. Grad Plus loans are 7.9% through Federal Direct Lending schools, 8.5% otherwise.

From what I remember, with Direct loans there is also something like a 0.25% interest rate deduction you can get after 3 years of on-time payment.

 

[Bill59]

I am, but I'm also trying to decide if I want to go to Edinburgh over A&M. Edinburgh is the $230,000 school, which from a financial standpoint, doesn't seem possible, so that may make the decision for me.

I mean this is the nicest way possible but ... are you nuts? Unless you are independently wealthy why would you not pick your in-state school?

 

[UFHopeful2014]

If anyone wants to go over it and see if I did it correctly, feel free. Hell, it's encouraged.

http://www.mediafire.com/file/m1wctzaltra/EdinburghLoanCalc.xls



Oh you might play with changing the Grad PLUS interest rate from 8.5 to 7.9, as there is a 7.9 option, I just don't know how to get it. Only changes the monthly payment by about $100 though.

Your calculation of interest while in school is wrong on the high side. You should use a PMT of $1000 instead of a present value of $48000 for the unsubsidized. Same thig for the grad plus ($3129 PMT instead of present value of $150192.)

Actually, you should use a yearly payment instead of monthly since the loan will be taken out all at once, not in monthly payments. You would have to convert the interest rate to an annual effective rate if you do that though.

ETA: Sorry, i didnt see the calculation below where you project the interest year by year.

 

[Morganator]

I am, but I'm also trying to decide if I want to go to Edinburgh over A&M. Edinburgh is the $230,000 school, which from a financial standpoint, doesn't seem possible, so that may make the decision for me.

Yeah, I'm with Bill. Sorry to be so direct, but think Edin...where? and enjoy Texas. Go to the school with half the cost and then take a vacation to Edinburgh after you've worked a couple years out of school.

 

[alliecat44]

I am, but I'm also trying to decide if I want to go to Edinburgh over A&M. Edinburgh is the $230,000 school, which from a financial standpoint, doesn't seem possible, so that may make the decision for me.

I'm with Bill, too--are you crazy?! You can get a fantastic veterinary education for cheap cheap cheap at A&M in-state. What a bargain!

I would do ANYTHING to have in-state tuition bills. Sheesh. Go with Texas!! 🙂

 

[HopefulAg]

Your calculation of interest while in school is wrong on the high side. You should use a PMT of $1000 instead of a present value of $48000 for the unsubsidized. Same thig for the grad plus ($3129 PMT instead of present value of $150192.)

How do you figure? Your interest is on the entire amount, not small installments.

I'm with Bill, too--are you crazy?!

Borderline, yes. 😀

 

[parietal]

Also, just noticed that you only are allowing for $12,000 unsubsidized Stafford loans a year. According to ISU's stuff, it's capped at $32,000 for grad school.

One more thing too. Many, but probably not all, schools charge an extra term for the summer between third and fourth years spent on clinicals...

 

[HopefulAg]

According to ISU's stuff, it's capped at $32,000 for grad school.

Oh? Is this 32,000 of subsidized and unsubsidized combined? IE $23,500 unsub and 8,500 sub? Or 8,500 sub + 32,000 unsub?

 

[livvie]

You mentioned somewhere else that Edinbugh meets some of your goals - what about spending your clinical year at Edinburgh or abroad instead of the whole 4 years?

 

[karmapple]

I know A&M was crazy the last two years and rejected you, but they obviously (*ahem* 😳) have this habit of rejecting the best candidates, and they finally came to their senses! You could get one of the cheapest veterinary educations in the country! Take it!

I would have fit in at College Station like a square peg in a round hole, but if they had accepted me, I would be an Aggie right now.

 

[twelvetigers]

See, at least I called you crazy in a PM.

 

[UFHopeful2014]

How do you figure? Your interest is on the entire amount, not small installments.




Borderline, yes. 😀

Because 48000 isnt the present value of 12000 per year for 4 years. The interest is on 8 installments of 6000. So, if you want an exact calculation, the payment would be 6000, and you would use a semiannual interest rate for 8 payments.

Also, you would need to use an annuity due formula, not the annuity immediate calc that excel does since your first loan is paid to you at the beginning of the school year.

 

[vnair2]

One part of the equation missing is that student loan interest expense is directly deductible from your income as long as your income is less than 70k (which unfortunately is most likely).. .you don't even have to itemize. So your net take home pay will be higher (or more likely you will get a big tax refund).

From what I remember interest is only deductible up to a specific relatively small amount ($2500?). So unless they have changed the tax law recently, this wont equate to a very big refund.

Sorry.

 

[parietal]

Oh? Is this 32,000 of subsidized and unsubsidized combined? IE $23,500 unsub and 8,500 sub? Or 8,500 sub + 32,000 unsub?

Looks like $8,500 sub, $32,000 unsub.

I won't join the chorus calling you crazy. You're an adult and if you're considering this all in such detail, you're obviously aware of what's at stake financially. I'd probably choose to stay in state, but I'm not one to pass judgment on how anyone else lives their life.

 

[UFHopeful2014]

The loan payments i got based on 10 year repayment should be $3260.75 for Edinburgh and $2074.27 for A&M. I can send you my spreadsheet if you'd like to look at it.

 

[StartingoverVet]

From what I remember interest is only deductible up to a specific relatively small amount ($2500?). So unless they have changed the tax law recently, this wont equate to a very big refund.

Sorry.

You are absolutely right, I just checked the IRS website and it is limited to a $2500 deduction to income. Sorry didn't realize that. That is really lame.

 

[HopefulAg]

The loan payments i got based on 10 year repayment should be $3260.75 for Edinburgh and $2074.27 for A&M. I can send you my spreadsheet if you'd like to look at it.

Appreciate it, but we're both in the ballpark of each other so I'm not too overly concerned with it. Just when I was doing my other calculator (in tab two), it didn't seem right as it didn't consider the tuition built up while in school, so it was off, by a fair amount too IIRC.