Why are you in the stock market?

[goldsummer]

I am curious of the motivation to do stock trading/investing of the members here, since most here are presumably all high income earners and have a higher than average IQ.

Is it because:

- you're trying to ensure security in the event of problems
- you're trying to retire early and get out of the rat race that comes with your job
- you're addicted
- you're bored
- you have the extra expendable income and its fun/hobby
- you're trying to be as rich as possible to afford certain items or a standard of living
- everyone else around you and your family is doing so
- you know you want to invest but dont want to do real estate or other alternatives
- maybe you dont know

Maybe its a combination of a few of the above... Maybe something else that wasnt mentioned...

What is your motivation?

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[Dr. Anonymouss]

The only stock market I do is low expense cost S&P index funds and it’s for the purpose of retiring. Any single individual stock is no more than “educated” gambling. The rest of my investment portfolio is real estate and physical silver.

 

[Groove]

Combination of hobby and interest in wealth generation/early retirement.

 

[Saddleshoes]

----ANYBODY in a IRA or a 401K or a 403b is doing stock trading/investing whither they know it or not.
----As a healthcare professional you had better have some kind of a plan in this area or your later years may be financially problematic.

 

[pbuttah]

Investing allows me to use cash that I have available but don't need in order to earn more cash that I can use later. It's pretty simple.

I don't view myself as a trader. I buy positions in funds and real estate with very low turnover and avoid actively managed stock funds. I very seldom sell anything. That's the strategy most likely to provide solid returns with relatively low volatility so I can sleep easily each night. I look at my holdings once a month and update my net worth, but other than that it's just left alone. When I have enough saved to buy another real estate placement or fund position, I buy one that comports with my goals. It's a strategy that has been working for me through the years.

I've known a lot of colleagues over the years that have told me about all these stock picks they've made that have worked out great for them. Oddly, none of them ever tell me about any losses they've had. Maybe they've never had any, but I doubt it. It just strikes me as a stressful way to go through life.

 

[Splenda88]

I have ~10% of my net worth in individual stocks (mega cap) but it's a long term play.

 

[airplanes]

If you don't invest, your money is guaranteed to lose purchasing power to inflation. If your only tool to build wealth is earned wages, then it will take a much longer time to build a portfolio to cover your expenses in retirement.

There's many ways to invest, and having a plan (preferably written) is imperative to achieving your financial goals. Physicians have big shovels, but most have significant loan burdens and don't start earning a high income until their 30s. Compound that with high spending due to delayed gratification and most NEED to invest in order to retire at a reasonable age.

Your question shouldn't be why you invest, it's why wouldn't you?

 

[Mad Jack]

My wife doesn't work, so I invest in the market to have a safe plan for her in the event something happens to me in the short term, and a meams by which I can retire early in the medium term (11 years or so). I invest in generally stable ETFs, such as VINIX and SCHD, aside from during downturns, during which I'll buy things that are obviously on sale (such as stocking up on energy stocks during COVID). I invest about 50% of my total income per month in a mix of 403b, 457b, traditional IRA to backdoor Roth, and post-tax accounts in the most boring way possible, a real Bogle type. Ultimately I plan to convert everything to dividend-yielding assets as I hit retirement to have a predictable income that grows over time and has historically outpaced inflation, after which I'll probably head overseas to spend the rest of my days in peace.

 

[Splenda88]

My wife doesn't work, so I invest in the market to have a safe plan for her in the event something happens to me in the short term, and a meams by which I can retire early in the medium term (11 years or so). I invest in generally stable ETFs, such as VINIX and SCHD, aside from during downturns, during which I'll buy things that are obviously on sale (such as stocking up on energy stocks during COVID). I invest about 50% of my total income per month in a mix of 403b, 457b, traditional IRA to backdoor Roth, and post-tax accounts in the most boring way possible, a real Bogle type. Ultimately I plan to convert everything to dividend-yielding assets as I hit retirement to have a predictable income that grows over time and has historically outpaced inflation, after which I'll probably head overseas to spend the rest of my days in peace.

Wow. That is remarkable.

What countries are you looking at? I am looking into Spain and Mexico

 

[Mad Jack]

Wow. That is remarkable.

What countries are you looking at? I am looking into Spain and Mexico

I'm looking at Portugal, Spain, and Argentina. Though I've also considered going to New Zealand if I'm still feeling work but want a change of pace, as I've heard being a psychiatrist there is far more benign.

 

[Groove]

Yeah, I'm admittedly extremely high risk and I would never, ever suggest a close friend or family to adopt my trading style but I really hope (and pray) that my good fortune continues. It would greatly accelerate reaching my early retirement goals. Of course, things could go exactly the opposite! I'd absolutely love to quit work and do this full time. It wouldn't even be a job for me.

Current 1mo performance = 17%, 3mo performance = 42%

 

[stillpremed]

Yeah, I'm admittedly extremely high risk and I would never, ever suggest a close friend or family to adopt my trading style but I really hope (and pray) that my good fortune continues. It would greatly accelerate reaching my early retirement goals. Of course, things could go exactly the opposite! I'd absolutely love to quit work and do this full time. It wouldn't even be a job for me.

Current 1mo performance = 17%, 3mo performance = 42%

Congrats G love it!

 

[stillpremed]

I am curious of the motivation to do stock trading/investing of the members here, since most here are presumably all high income earners and have a higher than average IQ.

Is it because:

- you're trying to ensure security in the event of problems
- you're trying to retire early and get out of the rat race that comes with your job
- you're addicted
- you're bored
- you have the extra expendable income and its fun/hobby
- you're trying to be as rich as possible to afford certain items or a standard of living
- everyone else around you and your family is doing so
- you know you want to invest but dont want to do real estate or other alternatives
- maybe you dont know

Maybe its a combination of a few of the above... Maybe something else that wasnt mentioned...

What is your motivation?

Higher than average IQ does not equate to better investments. There's a reason why scammers target docs, we are kind-hearted, gullible, and gentle folk.

Retire early and travel is my biggest motivation.

 

[Monocles]

Yeah, I'm admittedly extremely high risk and I would never, ever suggest a close friend or family to adopt my trading style but I really hope (and pray) that my good fortune continues. It would greatly accelerate reaching my early retirement goals. Of course, things could go exactly the opposite! I'd absolutely love to quit work and do this full time. It wouldn't even be a job for me.

Current 1mo performance = 17%, 3mo performance = 42%

Can I ask how you are doing on a longer term basis?

Ex: 6 month performance, 1 year, 3 year, 5 year, etc

 

[Groove]

Can I ask how you are doing on a longer term basis?

Ex: 6 month performance, 1 year, 3 year, 5 year, etc

My TDA converted to Schwab last year so my graph data is only a few months old. 44% gain over 7 months. I took 250K out of my non tax deferred brokerage to use as a new home downpayment so that has pulled the performance down since I took it out 1-2 months ago. I don't have any of my past few years performance anymore since I can't access TDA and I never put any of that stuff in a spreadsheet. I'd say I probably turned a 350K account into 1.2M or so over 4 years if I had to guess.

Currently 20 positions. Portfolio fairly sideways since mid April. Loaded up on more NVDA during most recent pull back. Bought some SMH this morning.

 

[Monocles]

I'd say I probably turned a 350K account into 1.2M or so over 4 years if I had to guess.

Wow you are a trading genius!

 

[Groove]

Wow you are a trading genius!

Not really but thank you.

 

[Chemist0157]

I am not trading but am doing some stock picking. I think this is more of a hobby. I do not think it is a great use of time though 🤣 I would make more money if I just converted the time I spend looking at stock income statements and listening to earnings calls into my regular job pay.

But it is fun.

 

[HopelessMS]

To pay off my student loans before completing residency.

 

[tartesos]

Wow. That is remarkable.

What countries are you looking at? I am looking into Spain and Mexico

Spain is nice, great quality of life and food, lots of things to do and see but taxes suck.
Live less than 6 months and 1 day there so you only pay taxes in USA because otherwise they tax every source of income you have.

 

[tartesos]

I'm looking at Portugal, Spain, and Argentina. Though I've also considered going to New Zealand if I'm still feeling work but want a change of pace, as I've heard being a psychiatrist there is far more benign.

Argentina if you like meat 👌👌
I dig it.

 

[Splenda88]

Spain is nice, great quality of life and food, lots of things to do and see but taxes suck.
Live less than 6 months and 1 day there so you only pay taxes in USA because otherwise they tax every source of income you have.

Spain #1

France #2 (suburb of Lyon)

Mexico #3

That is the plan regarding taxes.

 

[tartesos]

Spain #1

France #2 (suburb of Lyon)

Mexico #3

That is the plan regarding taxes.

We can visit each other in Spain. You can even use my place as it will be vacant 6 months out of the year 😬.

 

[Splenda88]

We can visit each other in Spain. You can even use my place as it will be vacant 6 months out of the year 😬.

Living in Spain for 6+ months every year will be fun.

 

[worthless]

I just put the max into my tax-advantage retirements accounts (401k, back door ROTH, etc) and the rest into my businesses and real estate.

 

[Dr. Anonymouss]

I just put the max into my tax-advantage retirements accounts (401k, back door ROTH, etc) and the rest into my businesses and real estate.

I keep wondering why so many of you continue to pursue the ROTH after residency. How I interpret ROTH vs Traditional/401k is that if you expect your annual income in retirement to be greater than your working years then ROTH wins, however if you expect your annual income in retirement to be less than your working years then traditional pre-tax wins. I understand this is a very basic way to answer an otherwise complex question and the better way to answer it would be use your effective tax rate. I still, however, fail to believe most of you how pursue ROTH have such a low effective tax rate that would otherwise justify contributing to a ROTH with an anesthesiologist salary. Let's assume you are making 500,000 a year right now. Following the standard 4% withdrawal rule that means you would have to have a nest egg of approximately 12.5 million at retirement in order to justify ROTH contributions over pre-tax contributions. Can someone help me understand your logic or where I am possibly misinformed on this topic?

 

[gutonc]

I keep wondering why so many of you continue to pursue the ROTH after residency. How I interpret ROTH vs Traditional/401k is that if you expect your annual income in retirement to be greater than your working years then ROTH wins, however if you expect your annual income in retirement to be less than your working years then traditional pre-tax wins. I understand this is a very basic way to answer an otherwise complex question and the better way to answer it would be use your effective tax rate. I still, however, fail to believe most of you how pursue ROTH have such a low effective tax rate that would otherwise justify contributing to a ROTH with an anesthesiologist salary. Let's assume you are making 500,000 a year right now. Following the standard 4% withdrawal rule that means you would have to have a nest egg of approximately 12.5 million at retirement in order to justify ROTH contributions over pre-tax contributions. Can someone help me understand your logic or where I am possibly misinformed on this topic?

It's not an either/or situation, it's a both situation. Maximize tax advantages now and in the future as much as possible.

 

[Dr. Anonymouss]

It's not an either/or situation, it's a both situation. Maximize tax advantages now and in the future as much as possible.

It is an either or situation. You can maximize your 401k and leave it as a 401k or you can do a mega backdoor roth. You can max a traditional IRA and leave it as pre-tax contributions or you can do a roth conversion. In neither of these situations can you do both.

 

[worthless]

I keep wondering why so many of you continue to pursue the ROTH after residency. How I interpret ROTH vs Traditional/401k is that if you expect your annual income in retirement to be greater than your working years then ROTH wins, however if you expect your annual income in retirement to be less than your working years then traditional pre-tax wins. I understand this is a very basic way to answer an otherwise complex question and the better way to answer it would be use your effective tax rate. I still, however, fail to believe most of you how pursue ROTH have such a low effective tax rate that would otherwise justify contributing to a ROTH with an anesthesiologist salary. Let's assume you are making 500,000 a year right now. Following the standard 4% withdrawal rule that means you would have to have a nest egg of approximately 12.5 million at retirement in order to justify ROTH contributions over pre-tax contributions. Can someone help me understand your logic or where I am possibly misinformed on this topic?

Couple big things:

1. With write-offs, I’ve been able to get my effective tax rate down, so I’d rather just pay it now

2. We are in a relatively low tax environment currently

3. My NW will be substantially more than that at retirement

 

[worthless]

It is an either or situation. You can maximize your 401k and leave it as a 401k or you can do a mega backdoor roth. You can max a traditional IRA and leave it as pre-tax contributions or you can do a roth conversion. In neither of these situations can you do both.

What he’s saying is you can max out your 401(k) and also do a backdoor Roth. Those 2 are completely independent of each other.

 

[Chemist0157]

I keep wondering why so many of you continue to pursue the ROTH after residency. How I interpret ROTH vs Traditional/401k is that if you expect your annual income in retirement to be greater than your working years then ROTH wins, however if you expect your annual income in retirement to be less than your working years then traditional pre-tax wins. I understand this is a very basic way to answer an otherwise complex question and the better way to answer it would be use your effective tax rate. I still, however, fail to believe most of you how pursue ROTH have such a low effective tax rate that would otherwise justify contributing to a ROTH with an anesthesiologist salary. Let's assume you are making 500,000 a year right now. Following the standard 4% withdrawal rule that means you would have to have a nest egg of approximately 12.5 million at retirement in order to justify ROTH contributions over pre-tax contributions. Can someone help me understand your logic or where I am possibly misinformed on this topic?

My 401k is traditional, and that should be right for most professionals when their careers have ramped up. It is not necessarily true earlier in career. At the same time, I have my IRA as a Roth for protection against unfavorable tax changes between now and retirement plus just having something to withdraw from without stipulations will be nice.

 

[RxPreceptor]

I’m extremely conservative with retirement based accounts in index funds
After clearing off student loan debts, I’ve grown quite fond playing around with brokerage accounts, learning from experience. No crazy losses, but I have become bold enough to make small scale individual stock picks with decent gains. What I’ve learned…individual stock picks are not worth the time, effort, psychological stress, even if I come out on top

Mostly just into a balanced dividend, growth fund currently for my brokerage…I’ve made a game out of it tossing money on dips…bought like crazy on these recent dips (had my retirement accounts cashed out from job transition & gladly took full advantage of…simply went with VT, world index). Might dabble with some combination VTI + VXUS when rebalancing in the future