Why the LECOM hate?

[selttiks288]

You know what I have to say about choosing the cheapest school? View attachment 21415

I really just wanted to share the photo. I have no opinion other than all schools are pretty much equal in that they will get you the degree you want. The only factors that differ are really personal choices, like do I like the area, do I prefer this curriculum, etc. That's my opinion.

You're so wise.

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[dudeliness]

Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

Ha ha! But you saw the picture, right?

 

[selttiks288]

Now I have

 

[moneytree]

I have no opinion other than all schools are pretty much equal in that they will get you the degree you want. The only factors that differ are really personal choices, like do I like the area, do I prefer this curriculum, etc. That's my opinion.

Preclinical/basic science education is roughly the same for all schools. I think the most important difference is the quality of rotations and hospital affiliates. The problem is, as an applicant, what makes a good clinical experience is hard to quantify because we don't know what the hell we're looking at.

 

[dudeliness]

Preclinical/basic science education is roughly the same for all schools. I think the most important difference is the quality of rotations and hospital affiliates. The problem is, as an applicant, what makes a good clinical experience is hard to quantify because we don't know what the hell we're looking at.

+big number

This is what I was getting at. I started the cycle thinking of a million different things that were super important to me, and then realized its really just rotations that are significantly different from one school to another (although I will accept the argument that curriculum CAN be a factor as well, although it is all pretty much the same material just presented in different ways). But as been so aptly pointed out, as pre-meds we have only vague ideas as to what would be preferable (such as ward vs preceptor, but THAT could be argued different ways as well) and on top of all that, even if you can find definitive proof that one school's rotations>some other school's there's no way that ALL your rotations at a specific site will be awesome and no guarantee that you'll even get any specific site for your rotations. End rant

 

[scpod]

....An example is MSUCOM and its superior rotation sites. That makes MSUCOM a good school. MSUCOM's ridiculous OOS tuition makes it undesirable, but not bad. That's a distinction many of you don't seem to understand....

My question is what do YOU know about the rotation sites that makes them superior? Have you personally rotated at all the sites of both of these schools? If not, then your opinion holds absolutely no weight whatsoever.

There are a LOT of factors that go into evaluating the "quality" of any given rotation, but the biggest factor is what you put into it. What is considered an excellent rotation by most people can be truly crappy if you don't put forth the effort to make it good. And don't for a second think that a rotation will be a "good one" just because it's at a large academic center with hundreds of faculty and scheduled didactics out the ying-yang. Some of the "better" rotations can occur at smaller places where you are one-on-one with the attending and get some hands-on experience managing patients, rather than chasing down your intern (who is more concerned with getting labs ordered, rounding on the patients and finishing notes before rounds) and saying a total of forteen words to the attending during the month.

 

[thecgrblue]

I would for the dress code, but not for eating. I NEED food and especially drink to study and pay attention in class. Make it $10K for dress code only and you've got a deal!

You can eat in the cafeteria...no deal!

Shoot, I'd be lying if I didn't say I was ECSTATIC when I heard there was no eating in lecture. The majority of the population has enough self-awareness to know that eating a crunchy granola bar, stinky corn nuts, or some other irritating food just pisses off everyone in the periphery. However, it is that narrow margin of people that will pull out 5 course dinners during lecture that I am glad the school steps in and tells them, "No."

At most schools people sneak a smoke in the bathroom...there they sneak a handful of trail mix.

 

[Wolverines83]

So....

In the interest of ensuring premeds get reliable information instead of irrational internet anger, any premeds wanting a more detailed description of the school, feel free to PM me. If you want the flip side, just read this thread.

For whatever reason the policies of LECOM seem to be a polarizing topic so just remember all the people railing against the policies that they've never experienced won't be at LECOM so you won't have to deal with their misery. The policies probably select for people who don't mind them so all these haters won't be there (neither will their attitudes).

Apparently it's "cool" on SDN to trash LECOM. I'll let you form your own opinion about people who subscribe to the "cool kid club" on an internet board....

 

[thecgrblue]

So....

In the interest of ensuring premeds get reliable information instead of irrational internet anger, any premeds wanting a more detailed description of the school, feel free to PM me. If you want the flip side, just read this thread.

For whatever reason the policies of LECOM seem to be a polarizing topic so just remember all the people railing against the policies that they've never experienced won't be at LECOM so you won't have to deal with their misery. The policies probably select for people who don't mind them so all these haters won't be there (neither will their attitudes).

Apparently it's "cool" on SDN to trash LECOM. I'll let you form your own opinion about people who subscribe to the "cool kid club" on an internet board....

Ditto. PM me if you want as well. I have zero problems with LECOM.

 

[Dr.TurkandJD]

I just received a secondary from LECOM-B, is it a joke? Name, social security, DOB, and we need 50$? lol

 

[selttiks288]

I just received a secondary from LECOM-B, is it a joke? Name, social security, DOB, and we need 50$? lol

Nope. Short and sweet. My favorite type of secondary.

 

[Dr.TurkandJD]

Let me use a clever analogy. Choosing a med school is like choosing a beautiful woman. Really, all the women (med schools) you're choosing from are pretty good looking (if you're goin american know wut i mean cuz them carib ones just dont do it for me) so really you cant go wrong with your choice. It all comes down to personal preference beyond that, where do you see yourself as being the most happy at/with lol.

This^

Can someone clarify the whole, "Wearing shirt and tie to the library?" I thought the dress code was only for lecture/class.

 

[yellowperil]

Nope. Short and sweet. My favorite type of secondary.

Me too, even though im not applying this cycle. I hate writing essays (ironically I am currently taking two classes where all I do is write papers).

 

[moneytree]

This^

Can someone clarify the whole, "Wearing shirt and tie to the library?" I thought the dress code was only for lecture/class.

I think the dress code applies anywhere on campus until after hours past 5 or 5:30.

 

[DolFAN]

I interviewed at LECOM-B not too long ago and I really liked it. The students seemed happy and the girl giving us a tour told she found plenty of free time to do her own thing which I really liked it.

 

[MedPR]

My question is what do YOU know about the rotation sites that makes them superior? Have you personally rotated at all the sites of both of these schools? If not, then your opinion holds absolutely no weight whatsoever.

There are a LOT of factors that go into evaluating the "quality" of any given rotation, but the biggest factor is what you put into it. What is considered an excellent rotation by most people can be truly crappy if you don't put forth the effort to make it good. And don't for a second think that a rotation will be a "good one" just because it's at a large academic center with hundreds of faculty and scheduled didactics out the ying-yang. Some of the "better" rotations can occur at smaller places where you are one-on-one with the attending and get some hands-on experience managing patients, rather than chasing down your intern (who is more concerned with getting labs ordered, rounding on the patients and finishing notes before rounds) and saying a total of forteen words to the attending during the month.

Oh right I forgot, community hospitals have competitive residency programs that top applicants are interested in too. My bad.


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[timmaycakes]

Oh right I forgot, community hospitals have competitive residency programs that top applicants are interested in too. My bad.


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wait...i thought we were talking about quality of rotation sites...not competitive residency programs

but is it necessary to do rotations where you want to get residencies? (serious question)

 

[MedPR]

wait...i thought we were talking about quality of rotation sites...not competitive residency programs

but is it necessary to do rotations where you want to get residencies? (serious question)

Clerkships are done with residents and attendings. If the residency program is desirable, it's likely the rotation is desirable too.

And yes, during M4 you'll need to audition places you really want to match at.

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[Druggernaut]

but is it necessary to do rotations where you want to get residencies? (serious question)

Sometimes. If you're applying to competitive osteopathic residencies, many of them strongly suggest or even require you to rotate there.

They're much less likely to hold it against you in an allopathic program if you don't rotate there. I've even heard that in some fields, such as ENT, it's typically not in your best interest to rotate where you'd like to match, as there's very little chance that you'll be able to impress someone in a competitive, specialized field with your limited medical student knowledge, and if your personality rubs them the wrong way, you're out. You're supposedly more likely to hurt your application than help it.

It's a crapshoot if good residency programs will also offer good rotations. Many places without residencies will give students more opportunities to be involved, since they only have to worry about training you, not the residents.

 

[HockeyDr09]

Oh right I forgot, community hospitals have competitive residency programs that top applicants are interested in too. My bad.


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You really missed the mark on this. Scpod was referencing that some of the "competitive residency" slots that you love to reference have horrible rotations because you have 6 attendings, 12 residents, and 10 medical students. Have fun trying to do/learn anything meaningful as one of those medical students.

Are there great rotations at some of these larger competitive hospitals? Of course there are. I didn't mean to imply that all large hospitals will leave you holding a retractor all day in the O.R. However, this doesn't mean that "smaller" community hospitals are weak. In some of the "smaller" community hospitals you can be 1 on 1 with attendings and first assist on surgeries. To be honest, you have absolutely no idea where LECOM's rotations are, so I'm not sure where you come off assuming our rotations are all at smaller hospitals. Some aren't very small at all, another example, one more . I will say that our rotations process is going through a huge overhaul right now, but I think it will be a better system for future students.

Either way, you've been exposed as misinformed on this thread enough by now.

For anyone interested in LECOM, read through the school specific threads

2012-2013 Eriehttp://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=912629

2012-2013 Bradentonhttp://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=912627

2011-2012 Erie http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=815683

2011-2012 Bradenton http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=815684

There are many current and former students answering questions (myself included).

 

[Mehd School]

If it's not your thing, who cares. Don't apply there. I'd be more than happy to take your seat. Hell, I'll wear two ties.

 

[GypsyHummus]

If it's not your thing, who cares. Don't apply there. I'd be more than happy to take your seat. Hell, I'll wear two ties.

My thoughts exactly. Heck, all it takes is one acceptance, u best believe I'm putting down a deposited if I get that acceptance letter.

 

[Dr.TurkandJD]

Just talked to LECOM-B on the phone. Very mean and rude! Bad impression so far.

 

[michow87]

I really hope that everyone bases their interest in a school on their own impressions and not on the impressions of other premeds. This would be analogous to judging someone based on what others (that also don't really know said person) are saying. Don't do it. If you are going to be listening to any advice, listen to those that are attending the school.

And for those of you reacting to a rude person on the phone or a rude security guard...are you serious? Will that really deter you from a med school? Is that what you use to determine the quality of education at a school?

Be smart, do your own research, and ignore the opinions of those who lack the knowledge.

 

[Dr.TurkandJD]

I really hope that everyone bases their interest in a school on their own impressions and not on the impressions of other premeds. This would be analogous to judging someone based on what others (that also don't really know said person) are saying. Don't do it. If you are going to be listening to any advice, listen to those that are attending the school.

And for those of you reacting to a rude person on the phone or a rude security guard...are you serious? Will that really deter you from a med school? Is that what you use to determine the quality of education at a school?

Be smart, do your own research, and ignore the opinions of those who lack the knowledge.

No, it wont deter me from attending a med school. But it does leave a bad taste in your mouth. When I called DMU, CCOM, AZCOM, PCOM, SOMA, ext. EVERYONE was extremely nice. However, employees do represent the institution. If they are not happy with their work, I wonder why.

 

[Veritas23]

Just talked to LECOM-B on the phone. Very mean and rude! Bad impression so far.

Did you just call them to ask if it was ok to submit the Erie secondary after receiving the Bradenton one (or vice versa)?

 

[Dr.TurkandJD]

Did you just call them to ask if it was ok to submit the Erie secondary after receiving the Bradenton one (or vice versa)?

Nope, I had to ask them how to proceed with the supplementary since I have a waiver.

Since there are more LECOM people on here, maybe you can help. If I received a LECOM-B supplementary, can I fill that one out AND fill out the LECOM-E supplementary?

 

[Veritas23]

Nope, I had to ask them how to proceed with the supplementary since I have a waiver.

Since there are more LECOM people on here, maybe you can help. If I received a LECOM-B supplementary, can I fill that one out AND fill out the LECOM-E supplementary?

This question has been answered numerous times on this year's LECOM-E school-specific thread.

Also, in the email you received from Bradenton it says:

"If you wish to apply to the Erie or Seton Hill Campuses, you must indicate LECOM Erie as a choice on your AACOMAS application. You must also complete a separate LECOM Supplemental Application for consideration at the Erie or Seton Hill Campus."

This is an invitation to submit the Erie supplemental. Most people get either a Bradenton or Erie "received" email and then are able to fill both out.

TLDR; Yes, fill it out. I think no one answered you sooner because this question has been asked a bunch of times in that thread .

 

[Dr.TurkandJD]

This question has been answered numerous times on this year's LECOM-E school-specific thread.

Also, in the email you received from Bradenton it says:

"If you wish to apply to the Erie or Seton Hill Campuses, you must indicate LECOM Erie as a choice on your AACOMAS application. You must also complete a separate LECOM Supplemental Application for consideration at the Erie or Seton Hill Campus."

This is an invitation to submit the Erie supplemental. Most people get either a Bradenton or Erie "received" email and then are able to fill both out.

TLDR; Yes, fill it out. I think no one answered you sooner because this question has been asked a bunch of times in that thread .

Thank you! I always tend to ask then look. Found the answer and already submitted it!

 

[Veritas23]

Thank you! I always tend to ask then look. Found the answer and already submitted it!

Not a problem. Good luck with your application. I just find that not many people use the search function and ask questions that have been answered sometimes 3 posts above their inquiry!

 

[Wolverines83]

Just talked to LECOM-B on the phone. Very mean and rude! Bad impression so far.

That sucks. I have to say I'm surprised. They were pretty polite when I spoke with them during the app process (2 years ago, so might be different).

Maybe you got someone on a bad day.

 

[ResearchRetMD]

You really missed the mark on this. Scpod was referencing that some of the "competitive residency" slots that you love to reference have horrible rotations because you have 6 attendings, 12 residents, and 10 medical students. Have fun trying to do/learn anything meaningful as one of those medical students.

Are there great rotations at some of these larger competitive hospitals? Of course there are. I didn't mean to imply that all large hospitals will leave you holding a retractor all day in the O.R. However, this doesn't mean that "smaller" community hospitals are weak. In some of the "smaller" community hospitals you can be 1 on 1 with attendings and first assist on surgeries. To be honest, you have absolutely no idea where LECOM's rotations are, so I'm not sure where you come off assuming our rotations are all at smaller hospitals. Some aren't very small at all, another example, one more . I will say that our rotations process is going through a huge overhaul right now, but I think it will be a better system for future students.

Either way, you've been exposed as misinformed on this thread enough by now.

For anyone interested in LECOM, read through the school specific threads

2012-2013 Eriehttp://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=912629

2012-2013 Bradentonhttp://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=912627

2011-2012 Erie http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=815683

2011-2012 Bradenton http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=815684

There are many current and former students answering questions (myself included).

Great post. Everyone should do their own research. With great rotations, very reasonable tuition, and strong board scores, LECOM is not a bad school at all.

 

[futurdoc2BE]

I am one of those students who was very happy with LECOM. Why?

1. They gave me the chance to be a doctor when no one else did
2. It was close knit like family
3. The dress code is not that bad, they just expect you to be professional since you are going to be a doctor, running an office, etc. Might as well get used to it now. Every job I worked at before going to medical school had a dress code - its just part of life.
4. I got a great education
5. And Yes, the tutition is low.

For those students out there who don't have a lot of options or maybe don't have the greatest stats but have a great story and a overall interesting package you won't think twice about what others say about any specific school because once you get that acceptance letter, all the naysayers will still be waiting, and you will not think twice about all the issues that you thought would bother you.

Well stated!

 

[primadonna22274]

Agree with everything Cabin says, and am happy with my choice. When I struggled in core (not-so-basic sciences) faculty worked very hard to get me through. I am now performing very, very well in 2nd yr and happier, and faculty is encouraging. There is plenty to gripe about, but that's the nature of this stressful education. I'm not 25 anymore and the things the 25 year olds find intolerable are minor annoyances to me. All in all, for me, LECOM is a means to an end, and a less expensive (and shorter, for me 3 yr) one at that.

 

[HeelHookin]

I honestly don't even know why a 100% board pass rate is impressive. Who cares about passing their boards? I'm pretty sure I'll care about doing well and I will not be happy with simply passing.

Actually the class of 2014 from Bradenton, which I am a part of, had a stellar pass rate and a rather high average. I am not sure where it stands nationally, but I was told it is amongst the highest, if not #1.

I definitely see that there are many areas in which LECOM needs improvement. Just do your research, BEYOND SDN, before choosing to go to any school.

 

[HeelHookin]

I just received a secondary from LECOM-B, is it a joke? Name, social security, DOB, and we need 50$? lol

MONEY TALKS, BULL**** WALKS!

all of these schools are as greedy as the next, and it doesn't get any easier (or cheaper) when you start applying for residencies......AND NOW ROTATIONS

 

[dudeliness]

Ah, hello dear thread. And here I thought you had died long ago...

 

[BabyDoc86]

Ah, hello dear thread. And here I thought you had died long ago...

My thoughts exactly.

 

[coolingglasses]

Their dress and conduct policy did put them at the lower end of -my- list. Yes, I'll have to adhere to similar codes in my career. But for me, I see this being a nuisance during my studies which will already be challenging.

To contrast, at WVSOM you can show up in what you're comfortable in and even customize your study space. Whatever you need to learn best.

I guess this is partially moot since LECOM-B put me at the bottom of their list too lol

 

[HalfListic]

ah, hello dear thread. And here i thought you had died long ago...

+1

 

[Skeeks]

Why the LECOM hate? Because we are all terrified some day LECOM will be training every Medical student... the school is taking the whole freakin' world over. Their campuses multiply like rabbits and you would be crazy NOT to consider them with how low the tuition is. For more information just look up FLEACOM on youtube... pretty halarious. ...

That said I would still go here if I got in and liked my experience with them.

 

[HalfListic]

I wish every school had a sweet health center like LECOM...pretty awesome if you ask me

 

[GlowInTheDark]

 

[gc91]

To contrast, at WVSOM you can show up in what you're comfortable in and even customize your study space. Whatever you need to learn best.

Which is one of the reasons I choose them over Lecom

Honestly though, the dress code didn't bother me. How they seemed to treat/interact with their students bothered me. Especially during group interview when we were bouncing questions off our interviewers and they kept telling us to "ask the students." And when we got to ask the students they didn't seem close with their advisers or professors, and that turned me right off. I'm used to a close community, I grew up in a rural town and go to a small Jesuit college. WV had that kind of community, Erie didn't. Easy choice for me, but that's me. I didn't see anything wrong with the school academically or professionally, it came down to social aspects and community and it just wasn't right for me.

 

[Dr Yiot]

Which is one of the reasons I choose them over Lecom

Honestly though, the dress code didn't bother me. How they seemed to treat/interact with their students bothered me. Especially during group interview when we were bouncing questions off our interviewers and they kept telling us to "ask the students." And when we got to ask the students they didn't seem close with their advisers or professors, and that turned me right off. I'm used to a close community, I grew up in a rural town and go to a small Jesuit college. WV had that kind of community, Erie didn't. Easy choice for me, but that's me. I didn't see anything wrong with the school academically or professionally, it came down to social aspects and community and it just wasn't right for me.

what im noticing as a first year is that you choose who you want to be close with whether its your advisor or not. are most students close with there advisors? probably not.

do some students have close relationships with certain professors? absolutely. you tend to get closer with the professors in fields that your interested in. i think at least. who knows.

i feel really bad you got that impressrion from erie. i actually like it here. i think the interviewers were telling you to ask the students cause they can probably tell you more about how it is from a students prespective, cause who cares what teh professor feels about certain school policies, you wanna here from students anyway about how they feel there education is.

im glad your so happy with wvsom tho and good luck there bud

 

[Drwatsom]

Their dress and conduct policy did put them at the lower end of -my- list. Yes, I'll have to adhere to similar codes in my career. But for me, I see this being a nuisance during my studies which will already be challenging.

To contrast, at WVSOM you can show up in what you're comfortable in and even customize your study space. Whatever you need to learn best.

I guess this is partially moot since LECOM-B put me at the bottom of their list too lol

I actually didn't like that. Wvsom's lecture hall looked disorganized and i feel all that stuff would distract me. Then again that is just me.

 

[JeetKuneDo]

Their dress and conduct policy did put them at the lower end of -my- list. Yes, I'll have to adhere to similar codes in my career. But for me, I see this being a nuisance during my studies which will already be challenging.

To contrast, at WVSOM you can show up in what you're comfortable in and even customize your study space. Whatever you need to learn best.

I guess this is partially moot since LECOM-B put me at the bottom of their list too lol

What do you mean by customize study space? Bring anything you want into the library?

 

[coolingglasses]

What do you mean by customize study space? Bring anything you want into the library?

Their spots in the lecture hall were set up like personal office spaces. I thought it was pretty neat, although I've never (and won't, evidently) experienced it for myself.

 

[FSUMED323]

I've been getting a vibe from a lot of SDNers that LECOM is the bottom of the barrel of DO schools. Yeah, there's a dress code. But what gives with all the hate?

Students who attend REAL medical schools, you know, schools who actually have standards and don't just let any idiot attend, laugh at LECOM students. You test scores are often a joke, your GPAs are pretty pathetic as well.

When I select my family's physician, I'll make sure he or she is NOT a LECOM graduate. I've seen the caliber of students in attendance at LECOM, and it is a joke.
They even accept transfer credits from medical schools in Mexico!!

 

[Sophocles]

Students who attend REAL medical schools, you know, schools who actually have standards and don't just let any idiot attend, laugh at LECOM students. You test scores are often a joke, your GPAs are pretty pathetic as well.

When I select my family's physician, I'll make sure he or she is NOT a LECOM graduate. I've seen the caliber of students in attendance at LECOM, and it is a joke.
They even accept transfer credits from medical schools in Mexico!!

Wow. I don't know what's wrong with you but I highly doubt it truly has anything to do with LECOM. Good luck in life.