Will a mediocre old MCAT score be superior to a poor new MCAT score in allopathic admissions

[cryhavoc]

Say I am a non-traditional student. I take the old MCAT, and keep my score for 2-3 years before it expires.

Say it is a 28-29. And most allopathic schools want at least a 30.

Then all the new kids take the new MCAT with no real way to study. So the first waves don't have such great scores.



Will a mediocre (28/29) old MCAT score be superior to a poor new MCAT score in allopathic admissions decisions?

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[Narmerguy]

I think it'd be difficult for anyone without inside knowledge to predict how schools will handle the new MCAT. I imagine it will vary by school. Some will probably be more hesitant to use it to disqualify otherwise strong candidates, some will use it interchangeably (using percentile performance).

 

[cryhavoc]

I think it'd be difficult for anyone without inside knowledge to predict how schools will handle the new MCAT. I imagine it will vary by school. Some will probably be more hesitant to use it to disqualify otherwise strong candidates, some will use it interchangeably (using percentile performance).

I'm applying this June, I know a bunch of people a year younger than me taking the new one and applying at the same time. Just wondered how the comparison would work and if it might work in my favor.

Guess we'll see, I plan to apply broadly and to both types of schools regardless, in case it makes no difference.

 

[Premixis]

I think that every score falls within a certain "percentile", which is deduced by the cumulative test takers' performance (or performance on previous trial sections, as some argue that MCAT scoring is predetermined). So if everybody performs poorly on the new MCAT, the higher performing students will still score in the higher "percentile" as the lower scoring, giving medical schools a way to essentially "sort" the applicants, and even to compare them to students who took the old test.

Although the AAMC has only released one practice test of the new MCAT, it will definitely help people gauge how to prepare for the MCAT when they do in fact take it.

Given how much weight medical schools currently place on the MCAT, they may be more lenient than they normally are, but not by much. After all, it is still a standardized test. Who really knows, though?

 

[cryhavoc]

I just imagined this scenario at an allopathic admissions office:

Bob took off his glasses and rubbed his temples. He sighed and looked out the window wistfully. The leaves were just starting to fall lazily from the auburn trees outside the aged glass, and the grass had started to turn brown around the edges.

Not the only thing falling, he thought, referring to the tufts of hair he had lost since the advent of the new MCAT format.

"What's wrong, Bob?"

"It is just this new MCAT format, Melinda. Everyone seemed to miss the same amount of questions. No one did well on the biochemistry questions. We can't expect biology majors to understand psychology questions. All the applicants are in the same percentile. I knew we'd be paying for the AAMC's mistakes."

Melinda made Bob an herbal tea and decided to rest a gentle hand on his shoulder.They were both married, but shared a platonic friendship that carried them through many harsh admissions cycles.

She handed him cryhavoc's application, knowing he yearned for the old way of life.

"He's got a good GPA, lots of clinical experience. Research experience. Shame about his mediocre MCAT score," Bob noted. He sipped at his tea pensively.

A tear gleamed in his eye, "You know what Melinda, at least this score is something I can understand. I'm going to send him an interview request."

 

[Goro]

Both mediocre and poor are not good.

Don't assume that Adcoms will place more value on the old MCAT because it's familiar. We'll still see your percentile score.

On the plus side, it will still take a few years for us to suss out what the new MCAT scores really mean (ie, finding the new "triple double", ie, the baseline minimum being 10/10/10 = 30.

The MCAT people say that as long as one is well read, once can still do well on the new section, and the old standbys, you still have to know.

Say I am a non-traditional student. I take the old MCAT, and keep my score for 2-3 years before it expires.

Say it is a 28-29. And most allopathic schools want at least a 30.

Then all the new kids take the new MCAT with no real way to study. So the first waves don't have such great scores.



Will a mediocre (28/29) old MCAT score be superior to a poor new MCAT score in allopathic admissions decisions?

 

[cryhavoc]

Both mediocre and poor are not good.

Don't assume that Adcoms will place more value on the old MCAT because it's familiar. We'll still see your percentile score.

On the plus side, it will still take a few years for us to suss out what the new MCAT scores really mean (ie, finding the new "triple double", ie, the baseline minimum being 10/10/10 = 30.

The MCAT people say that as long as one is well read, once can still do well on the new section, and the old standbys, you still have to know.

The "well-read" thing resonated with me. My practice score split is usually 8 PS, 11-12 VR, 8-9 BS.

So let's say I've been scoring 11-12 on verbal reasoning since day one without any prep, would it be in my best interest to take this new MCAT? Or will these "psychology" questions just replace the VR, so I'd just balance like I did on the old one?

I'm just nervous about the predictability of the new test. In my mind it is better to be mediocre at the old one, and not risk bombing the new one. But let us say I do poorly on the new one, would it be as much as a death sentence as retaking the old MCAT and scoring lower than your first attempt?

 

[Lucca]

The night is dark and full of terrors.


I don't think any section will "replace" any other section. Critical Reasoning is still in the MCAT alongside the Psych section and I don't think either of these sections will be considered point for point alongside an old Verbal section. Really, the percentile you score in will matter the most, at least in the early years of this exam (totally my speculation). There is a way to find out how apt you are for the new one. Take a practice exam and see how you do.

 

[Goro]

Nothing is going to replace the VR section; you will still be expected to understand and interpret the English language. See Lucca's sage post above.

So let's say I've been scoring 11-12 on verbal reasoning since day one without any prep, would it be in my best interest to take this new MCAT? Or will these "psychology" questions just replace the VR, so I'd just balance like I did on the old one?


The AMCAS people aren't stupid. They've field tested this. New or old, if you do poorly compared to your peers, then that's not good. You are expected to have a knowledge base and to be able to access it and apply it. The new test is not going to be written in Korean, after all.

I'm just nervous about the predictability of the new test. In my mind it is better to be mediocre at the old one, and not risk bombing the new one. But let us say I do poorly on the new one, would it be as much as a death sentence as retaking the old MCAT and scoring lower than your first attempt?

 

[cryhavoc]

The night is dark and full of terrors.


I don't think any section will "replace" any other section. Critical Reasoning is still in the MCAT alongside the Psych section and I don't think either of these sections will be considered point for point alongside an old Verbal section. Really, the percentile you score in will matter the most, at least in the early years of this exam (totally my speculation). There is a way to find out how apt you are for the new one. Take a practice exam and see how you do.

Hm, I think I'll save my practice exam until I finish biochemistry. If I score in a higher percentile (if they give percentiles) than on my old MCAT, I'm definitely going to take it.

 

[efle]

Don't assume that Adcoms will place more value on the old MCAT because it's familiar. We'll still see your percentile score.

I bet the confidence interval around that score will be massive compared to the old test though, since someone going into a retake has so much better an idea of how to prepare whereas on the current test people are usually as prepped as they'll ever be going into round 1

 

[mehc012]

Hm, I think I'll save my practice exam until I finish biochemistry. If I score in a higher percentile (if they give percentiles) than on my old MCAT, I'm definitely going to take it.

I wish they'd given more specific percentiles on the trial sections. I was excited when I first got it back, thinking I was in the 85th percentile for biochem. But it turned out to just be 85% straight-up, with no more precise percentile given than the vague 'top quartile'...not very helpful.

And then I found myself wishing for a direct score on the real thing...like COME ON AMCAS, just give me as much info on my own performance as you can!

 

[savithramma]

I wish they'd given more specific percentiles on the trial sections. I was excited when I first got it back, thinking I was in the 85th percentile for biochem. But it turned out to just be 85% straight-up, with no more precise percentile given than the vague 'top quartile'...not very helpful.

And then I found myself wishing for a direct score on the real thing...like COME ON AMCAS, just give me as much info on my own performance as you can!

It's called a trial section for a reason. Why do you need further validation on a trial section that isn't part of your official scoring that's evaluated by medical schools, considering that you're just try-harding to beat a bunch of burnout dudes who just want their god damn gift-card? Gonna laminate your trial section score and hang it in your bedroom to make yourself feel good about yourself?

 

[efle]

It's called a trial section for a reason. Why do you need further validation on a trial section that isn't part of your official scoring that's evaluated by medical schools?

It's never about the relevance of the score, by that logic a 98 and a 93 are the same thing since they both go down as an A. Around here we don't tolerate that nonsense. Here you gun for the god damn top.

 

[mehc012]

It's called a trial section for a reason. Why do you need further validation on a trial section that isn't part of your official scoring that's evaluated by medical schools, considering that you're just try-harding to beat a bunch of burnout dudes who just want their god damn gift-card?

Try-harding? I did the same as anyone - I took the damn thing because I wanted the gift card, and I gave it a reasonable shot based on what I already knew because it was a test and that's what you do...but I didn't put anywhere near as much effort into it as the real deal. I don't want validation, just some concept of relative standing because the new MCAT is something of a mystery and it'd be nice if we could see some sort of correlation between raw and percentile like we have for the current one. I don't see why wanting to know that for my own curiosity's sake somehow makes me a tool.

It's never about the relevance of the score, by that logic a 98 and a 93 are the same thing since they both go down as an A. Around here we don't tolerate that nonsense. Here you gun for the god damn top.

I'm usually equally happy with a 98 and a 93, actually (and closer to 'equally happy with an A or a B as long as I learn the material')...but for an exam which is graded on percentile, not percentage, not getting one is akin to getting no grade at all, which, well...sometimes it's just nice to see how you did. If I'm going to spend the time to take a test, I like to know the results!

 

[efle]

I'm usually equally happy with a 98 and a 93, actually (and closer to 'equally happy with an A or a B as long as I learn the material)...but for an exam which is graded on percentile, not percentage, not getting one is akin to getting no grade at all, which, well...sometimes it's just nice to see how you did. If I'm going to spend the time to take a test, I like to know the results!

wasnt serious

equally happy with an A or a B as long as I learn the material

does not compute

 

[savithramma]

Try-harding? I did the same as anyone - I took the damn thing because I wanted the gift card, and I gave it a reasonable shot based on what I already knew because it was a test and that's what you do...but I didn't put anywhere near as much effort into it as the real deal. I don't want validation, just some concept of relative standing because the new MCAT is something of a mystery and it'd be nice if we could see some sort of correlation between raw and percentile like we have for the current one. I don't see why wanting to know that for my own curiosity's sake somehow makes me a tool.

I'm usually equally happy with a 98 and a 93, actually (and closer to 'equally happy with an A or a B as long as I learn the material')...but for an exam which is graded on percentile, not percentage, not getting one is akin to getting no grade at all, which, well...sometimes it's just nice to see how you did. If I'm going to spend the time to take a test, I like to know the results!

Where's your happiness with just knowing the material on the trial section? lulz. Try again, cuz that wasn't convincing.

 

[efle]

Where's your happiness with just knowing the material on the trial section? lulz. Try again, cuz that wasn't convincing.

No you don't understand. He only cares about feeling satisfied with his education, that's why raw score is meaningless and he needs to know how many other people he beat.

Wait

 

[mehc012]

Where's your happiness with just knowing the material on the trial section? lulz. Try again, cuz that wasn't convincing.

Fair enough - I could try to elaborate further regarding the difference between my opinion on course grades and exam grades, as well as college-me vs post-bacc-me, but at the end of the day, no one cares.

However, I do want to point out that just because I want to know how I did doesn't necessarily imply that I have my heart set on having done particularly well. I stated that I wanted to know, not that I expected what I found out to be some super-awesome thing that I could brag to everybody. Even in my first post, I said I was psyched when I thought I was 85th percentile...not exactly gunner-level.

No you don't understand. He only cares about feeling satisfied with his education, that's why raw score is meaningless and he needs to know how many other people he beat.

Wait

*She. Also, MCAT scores are directly dependent on percentile - if it were a normal exam you know how you did with a raw score. On this, you only know how you did if you have a percentile. Besides, as I said, it would be nice to have an idea of how they interconvert between raw and scaled scores on the new one.

 

[efle]

Billy Goat Gruff is a she? Weird

Man, you take us too srsly

 

[savithramma]

No you don't understand. He only cares about feeling satisfied with his education, that's why raw score is meaningless and he needs to know how many other people he beat.

Wait

lmao.

Fair enough - I could try to elaborate further regarding the difference between my opinion on course grades and exam grades, as well as college-me vs post-bacc-me, but at the end of the day, no one cares.

However, I do want to point out that just because I want to know how I did doesn't necessarily imply that I have my heart set on having done particularly well. I stated that I wanted to know, not that I expected what I found out to be some super-awesome thing that I could brag to everybody. Even in my first post, I said I was psyched when I thought I was 85th percentile...not exactly gunner-level.

*She. Also, MCAT scores are directly dependent on percentile - if it were a normal exam you know how you did with a raw score. On this, you only know how you did if you have a percentile. Besides, as I said, it would be nice to have an idea of how they interconvert between raw and scaled scores on the new one.

Sweet semantics and mental gymnastics, next. If you need validation about your score relative to others on something that doesn't even count that badly you obviously weren't hugged enough when you were little.

Even if what you said is true, keep it yourself because you got #seriouslyentitledpeopleproblems and nobody care's about your 85%+, hell the amcas doesn't even care enough to show the damn score. You must be seriously sheltered if you think knowing more than that you got over an 85% is a big deal.

 

[mehc012]

Billy Goat Gruff is a she? Weird

Man, you take us too srsly

Billy goat gruff isn't bothered by trolls!
(as in, I don't care whether they're trolls, not that I don't engage)

You I get - we've had plenty of threads together and come through just fine. Savi is annoying the crap out of me, though.

 

[efle]

If you need validation about your score relative to others on something that doesn't even count that badly you obviously weren't hugged enough when you were little.

oh a chance to use my cowboy bebop gif

 

[efle]

You I get - we've had plenty of threads together and come through just fine. Savi is annoying the crap out of me, though.

Glad to hear this, I am very bad at reading (pun intended) which people hate me, for the longest time I thought Ace Khal and I was tight but alas, no more

 

[TheBoiii]

I just imagined this scenario at an allopathic admissions office:

Bob took off his glasses and rubbed his temples. He sighed and looked out the window wistfully. The leaves were just starting to fall lazily from the auburn trees outside the aged glass, and the grass had started to turn brown around the edges.

Not the only thing falling, he thought, referring to the tufts of hair he had lost since the advent of the new MCAT format.

"What's wrong, Bob?"

"It is just this new MCAT format, Melinda. Everyone seemed to miss the same amount of questions. No one did well on the biochemistry questions. We can't expect biology majors to understand psychology questions. All the applicants are in the same percentile. I knew we'd be paying for the AAMC's mistakes."

Melinda made Bob an herbal tea and decided to rest a gentle hand on his shoulder.They were both married, but shared a platonic friendship that carried them through many harsh admissions cycles.

She handed him cryhavoc's application, knowing he yearned for the old way of life.

"He's got a good GPA, lots of clinical experience. Research experience. Shame about his mediocre MCAT score," Bob noted. He sipped at his tea pensively.

A tear gleamed in his eye, "You know what Melinda, at least this score is something I can understand. I'm going to send him an interview request."

LMAO. This is the funniest thing i have ever read. Props man props.

 

[mehc012]

Glad to hear this, I am very bad at reading (pun intended) which people hate me, for the longest time I thought Ace Khal and I was tight but alas, no more

Wry comments and digs I get. Debates and arguments on actual real-world topics I think are great - they promote learning and discussion.
Debates about whether an individual person is a tool or not, though? I don't see the point...if I felt the need to convince everyone on the internet to like me, I'd be an excellent demonstration of the sort of validation seeking they're talking about.

So, fine...I don't care about my class grades but I care about test grades. I want to know how I did on the MCAT in both raw and scaled forms, and I also want to know that about the trial section. I guess I'm just a walking conundrum and thus a tryhard tool.

 

[efle]

I don't care about my class grades but I care about test grades

For most people I believe these are related

I want to know how I did on the MCAT in both raw and scaled forms, and I also want to know that about the trial section. I guess I'm just a walking conundrum and thus a tryhard tool.

The truth at last, @savithramma finally cracked her

 

[Ace Khalifa]

Glad to hear this, I am very bad at reading (pun intended) which people hate me, for the longest time I thought Ace Khal and I was tight but alas, no more

When did we ever establish that we weren't "tight" anymore? If you're going to say something about a relationship with someone else in an example, make sure you know what that relationship is first...

 

[efle]

When did we ever establish that we weren't "tight" anymore? If you're going to say something about a relationship with someone else in an example, make sure you know what that relationship is first...

I just feel we're going our separate ways, it's not you it's me, change as we grow, I've been unfaithful!!

But ok we cool

 

[savithramma]

For most people I believe these are related



The truth at last, @savithramma finally cracked her

High fives all-around. I'm proud of your work too.

Wry comments and digs I get. Debates and arguments on actual real-world topics I think are great - they promote learning and discussion.
Debates about whether an individual person is a tool or not, though? I don't see the point...if I felt the need to convince everyone on the internet to like me, I'd be an excellent demonstration of the sort of validation seeking they're talking about.

So, fine...I don't care about my class grades but I care about test grades. I want to know how I did on the MCAT in both raw and scaled forms, and I also want to know that about the trial section. I guess I'm just a walking conundrum and thus a tryhard tool.

The point is so you can resolve your personal deficiencies after all what are you possibly going to do with yourself when you end up in a place where people are smarter than you and better than you at tests without the feigned hubris and self-contradictory facade of being collaborative? I mean this is a constructive forum and we are all trying to help each other . You and I both know you're being a walking and talking textbook case on insecurities and desperate validation-seeking behavior throughout this thread, others, and no doubt real life. Plus you just can't win with the semantics and damage control, so now you're back-pedaling with your "I don't see the point" because you got trapped in your little box of contradictions. Life isn't always going to go the way you want it to and now is a better time than any for you to have that realization about it .

Better luck next time. Deuces.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

She simply wanted to know how well she did compared to others... What's wrong with that?!

 

[altblue]

I just hope there are sufficient study materials by the time I take the MCAT (late 2015 to early 2016)...

And I wonder if taking the 2015 MCAT is just matter of luck and UG topics covered rather than reasoning ability. I'm not exactly seeing a lot of prep material on it what would even things out, so to speak.

 

[savithramma]

She simply wanted to know how well she did compared to others... What's wrong with that?!

It's less to do with what she originally asked and everything to do with her repugnant entitled attitude , self-contradictory insecure cut-throat personality, and her need for constant validation that she's smarter than everyone else. She can't even manage to keep her story straight either.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

It's less to do with what she originally asked and everything to do with her repugnant entitled attitude , self-contradictory insecure cut-throat personality, and her need for constant validation that she's smarter than everyone else. She can't even manage to keep her story straight either.

mrh, is that you?!

 

[savithramma]

mrh, is that you?!

nah. I'm just a dude who knows how to call out and recognize the entitled and sheltered for what they are.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

She started a helpful Anki thread and actually uploaded her deck! And somehow, you believe she's cut-throat (in addition to your other baseless attacks)
You gots to chill...

 

[savithramma]

She started a helpful Anki thread and actually uploaded her deck! And somehow, you believe she's cut-throat (in addition to your other baseless attacks)
You gots to chill...

you're doing it wrong and not reading what she says, if you think they're baseless attacks. Anybody can upload a friggin anki deck after they've already taken the mcat because they no longer are competing with others. she cant even get her story right about not being a total insecure self-promoting try-hard. She also self-promotes herself as an "attractive white female" when the personality she's got screams ugly from the inside out which she has to constantly compensate for by constantly try-harding and asserting that she's better than others.

 

[Cyberdyne 101]

I rest my case...

 

[savithramma]

View attachment 187510
I rest my case...

figures you'd use an image with a taylor swift/taylor swift look-a-like bc mehc012 is just as delusional, repugnant, and insecure as that taylor swift skag.

 

[SpaceyWacey]

Came in looking for 2015 MCAT opinions.

 

[Ace Khalifa]

figures you'd use an image with a taylor swift/taylor swift look-a-like bc mehc012 is just as delusional, repugnant, and insecure as that taylor swift skag.

Okay, I was giving you the BOTD, but since you just insulted Taylor Swift, I have no more respect for you. @Cyberdyne 101 and @mehc012, don't waste any more time on this fool.

 

[savithramma]

Okay, I was giving you the BOTD, but since you just insulted Taylor Swift, I have no more respect for you. @Cyberdyne 101 and @mehc012, don't waste any more time on this fool.

lmao taylor is a joke and great only if you're a heart broken teeny-bopper, otherwise it's the same old recycled crap about her "relationship stuff" when she is the one and only issue, kind of like mehc012 in this thread.

 

[Ismet]

This is a reminder that personal attacks are not permitted on SDN. Please remember to keep your posts courteous and contribute positively, including staying on topic.

 

[efle]

Wtf happened to this thread

 

[mehc012]

She started a helpful Anki thread and actually uploaded her deck! And somehow, you believe she's cut-throat (in addition to your other baseless attacks)
You gots to chill...

So, as fun as it was for a day to occasionally see nice comments such as this (thanks @Cyberdyne 101 and others!) seemingly at random, they eventually piqued my interest enough view my ignored posts in this thread, and wow that was...interesting. But here's my fav:

[insert bizarrely vehement rant here]She also self-promotes herself as an "attractive white female" when...[rant continues].

It is true; I did once post something with almost exactly that wording...

there is a certain privilege/power to being female. I know that as a small, nonthreatening, reasonably attractive, educated white girl, I can usually get away with far more than my male or minority counterparts.

...except, you know, with qualifiers and in the context of pointing out my own privilege to other posters.
A search on SDN failed to come up with any other recent/clear* instances where I described myself that way, so I have to assume that this was the self-aggrandizing statement which so infuriated savi.
*qualifier added because I admittedly did not sift through all 4500+ posts in my history

The rest of the ranting is just as ridiculous, but sadly not as funny, so let's just leave that be.

 

[efle]

oh boy mehc replied

round 2 *ding ding*

reasonably attractive

ayy bb

 

[mehc012]

oh boy mehc replied

round 2 *ding ding*

Nah, they're banned or I probably wouldn't have stirred the pot (as much as I was tempted earlier, I resisted). I just couldn't let the 'attractive white girl' one stand without its context, because I had such a hard time posting that to begin with despite it being relevant to the discussion at hand in the other thread. I probably went through ~5 edits trying to find a way to keep my message intact without sounding like - well, exactly the kind of tool savi apparently took me to be - and so I figured I'd just let the post speak for itself instead of letting someone who finds me repugnant (really?) throw their version out there.

 

[Ace Khalifa]

Thank god that fool got banned (again). His posts just made me sick.

 

[efle]

Thank god that fool got banned (again). His posts just made me sick.

I'm surprised they don't IP ban people

 

[Ace Khalifa]

I'm surprised they don't IP ban people

They really should. If any moderator could enlighten me as to why this isn't the the gold standard, please do so.