Would any current podiatrist recommend this profession

[wakaflocka88]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Consider yourself extremely lucky. I know of several fellows that are either still looking for jobs or settled on a terrible private practice associate job...

Yes luck played a role but like DYK343 said before - nothing is handed on a golden spoon/platter. Even with a fellowship, no guarantee a job is lined up for them to do exactly what they were trained to do.

 

[G0dFather]

8 years ago when I started podiatry school that was unheard of. It appears our generation of podiatrist have HAD IT with these awful PP podiatry associate mills.

The only way they go away is if you put them out of business...

I love this .... before i first entered pod school, opening up a PP was my sole focus and goal

 

[air bud]

Current fellows, residents, students, pre-pods - listen to the OGs on here, their advice has served me well. New grad, no fellowship, multiple offers, and now in an ortho group in a large metro city.

This is awesome. Certainty not the norm. Myself included, I have a handful of friends working in ortho groups. They are all killing it and super busy (I will be busier, but hard to kill it when more horses in your state than people...) But none of them got those jobs right out of residency. It takes time to learn and develop. Getting an MSG or Hospital job right out? Sure you can B.S. your way past hospital admin and some family practice docs. But no way doing that with ortho docs interviewing you. Takes time to develop friendships and relationships. That's how you get into these groups. That is what worked for me. If an associate job gets you to a city you want where you think there is opportunity to move on up and get that golden office in the sky...then do it.

Also just wanted to update those on how transferable our skills are...I have now performed minor surgery/wound care a chicken, goat and turkey in the last few months. Have busted some hooves and horns on goats. Getting some mini donkeys/miles/mini pony today and will start doing their hooves soon. #knowyourvalue

Now that I think about it, I bet you I could make more as a farrier in my state than some make as an associate

 

[air bud]

Also, maybe not exactly related to this thread...but did want to point something out. I am a white male. All my friends in this profession are white males. I am sure other people on here might have some different perspectives from their point of view. I know of ZERO women that are in ortho groups (doing more than wounds). I know maybe 2/30 people in MSG that are women. Granted, I went to a school with a large percentage of white people, so that is my circle.

Other perspectives on this would be welcomed I am sure as I assume not everyone on SDN is a white male.

Edit - I mean thinking about it, what percentage of ACFAS speakers are white males? Certainly higher than you might find in other specialties right? Does anyone think that is changing any time soon? More than 50 percent of new MDs are women. Not sure what podiatry is. Of course we all know very successful people that are not Acfas speakers, just an observation.

So I guess what I am saying is would anyone offer their perspective on the future of this profession from a women or minorities perspective?

 

[sloh]

Not a pod but I have friends who are. Do you guys know how much an employer like Kaiser pays their podiatrists?

 

[CutsWithFury]

Not a pod but I have friends who are. Do you guys know how much an employer like Kaiser pays their podiatrists?

Northern Kaiser is 275K at least but insane health benefits. Problem with Kaiser there is no RVU incentive work bonuses like other hospital employed jobs therefore most Kaiser DPMs I've seen work really hard when they are on call and they coast when they are not.

 

[JewOnThis]

I have been practicing a lot longer then most of these posters here. I am in a “MSG” setting as well. I would never recommend podiatry to anyone. It is a horrible profession. It seems like we are always fighting to be “equal” with other specialties.

 

[Feli]

Also, maybe not exactly related to this thread...but did want to point something out. I am a white male. All my friends in this profession are white males. I am sure other people on here might have some different perspectives from their point of view. I know of ZERO women that are in ortho groups (doing more than wounds)....

Not exactly related...

Medical Team - Advanced Orthopedics & Sports Medicine (aosmlv.com)

Find a Provider • The CORE Institute

Staff | Orthopaedic Associates (oadoc.com)

^^^Brown, black, female, LGBT, etc DPMs can all get ortho jobs 😉
...I could list dozens more just from my classmates, co-residents, acquaintances, etc. That is not mentioning the thousands and thousands of podiatrists I don't know from Adam.

...and yes, of course any group is going to prefer a doc who looks/acts/talks similar to most pts in that area; that is human nature. However, I don't think the ethnicity or gender stuff matters as much as you think (in most areas). I would skip it since it's a touchy subject. Now, if you are talking suburban Indiana or Utah, then sure, being a white guy (preferably with same/similar religion as the other partners) does help a bit... just like it probably hurts in Orlando or Miami or Texas areas where Hispanic speaking is preferred. I worked my last job in MSG where I was at a disadvantage... they likely would've (ok, absolutely woulda) taken a much less trained pod were the applicant Middle Eastern and/or Arabic-speaking, but it worked out well for everyone in the end and I'm still friends with those docs and office managers/owners. My current hospital job is the same way... a Native American DPM with a 1yr training would almost surely get hired or promoted over me (fortunately those are harder to find than Eldorado).

There are plenty of opportunities for those who seek them out... glad to hear many posting in this thread are taking advantage and creating their own luck. For those with sour grapes, that is as much a choice as a condition, but I'd say that counting other people's money or possessions or experiences is a game you can't win. I guess I am one of those crazy people who would probably find a way to be happy doing almost anything... I did fine and had a lot of fun times even during almost a whole year of low pay and house calls (working thru non-compete clause litigation after metro job). Either way, I wouldn't let gender or ethnicity be a major factor or perceived advantage/disadvantage.

 

[air bud]

Not exactly related...

Medical Team - Advanced Orthopedics & Sports Medicine (aosmlv.com)

Find a Provider • The CORE Institute

Staff | Orthopaedic Associates (oadoc.com)

^^^Brown, black, female, LGBT, etc DPMs can all get ortho jobs 😉
...I could list dozens more just from my classmates, co-residents, acquaintances, etc. That is not mention the thousands and thousands of podiatrists I don't know from Adam.

...and yes, of course any group is going to prefer a doc who looks/acts/talks similar to most pts in that area; that I human nature. However, I don't think the ethnicity or gender stuff matters as much as you think (in most areas). I would skip it since it's a touchy subject. Now, if you are talking suburban Indiana or Utah, then sure, being a white guy (preferably with same/similar religion as the other partners) does help a bit... just like it probably hurts in Orlando or Miami or Texas areas where Hispanic speaking is preferred. I worked my last job in MSG where I was at a disadvantage... they likely (ok absolutely) would've taken a much less trained pod were the applicant Middle Eastern, but it worked out well for everyone in the end. My current hospital job is the same way... a Native American DPM with a 1yr training would almost surely get hired or promoted over me.

There are plenty of opportunities for those who seek them out... glad to hear many posting in this thread are taking advantage and creating their own luck. For those with sour grapes, that is as much a choice as a condition, but I'd say that counting other people's money or possessions or experiences is a game you can't win. I guess I am one of those crazy people who would probably find a way to be happy doing almost anything... I did fine and had a lot of fun times even during almost a whole year of low pay and house calls (working thru non-compete clause litigation after metro job). Either way, I wouldn't let gender or ethnicity be a major factor or perceived advantage/disadvantage.

yeah nevermind. anything i am trying to convey is not easily done via the internets

 

[heybrother]

https://www.jfas.org/article/S1067-2516(20)30175-7/fulltext

 

[DYK343]

Every profession, including medicine, is going to have people who are unhappy.

You want to see miserable people? Look at OB/GYN and hospitalists. Those are some stressed out unhappy MDs.

I've NEVER met a happy infectious disease provider. They dont exist.

I would take DPM 10 fold over those specialties.

 

[NatCh]

Every profession, including medicine, is going to have people who are unhappy.

You want to see miserable people? Look at OB/GYN and hospitalists. Those are some stressed out unhappy MDs.

I've NEVER met a happy infectious disease provider. They dont exist.

I would take DPM 10 fold over those specialties.

Hospitalists tend to be pretty unhappy too. Anesthesiologists apparently think of themselves as red-headed stepchildren and they're some of the highest paid physician specialists. Medicine as a whole can be really stressful.

 

[NatCh]

Also, maybe not exactly related to this thread...but did want to point something out. I am a white male. All my friends in this profession are white males. I am sure other people on here might have some different perspectives from their point of view. I know of ZERO women that are in ortho groups (doing more than wounds). I know maybe 2/30 people in MSG that are women. Granted, I went to a school with a large percentage of white people, so that is my circle.

Other perspectives on this would be welcomed I am sure as I assume not everyone on SDN is a white male.

Edit - I mean thinking about it, what percentage of ACFAS speakers are white males? Certainly higher than you might find in other specialties right? Does anyone think that is changing any time soon? More than 50 percent of new MDs are women. Not sure what podiatry is. Of course we all know very successful people that are not Acfas speakers, just an observation.

So I guess what I am saying is would anyone offer their perspective on the future of this profession from a women or minorities perspective?

I'm a male minority immigrant who came from a developing nation. Not sure what to add beyond that at the moment. If anyone has specific questions regarding my experiences in this profession I might be willing to entertain them.

 

[The Last Reclaimer]

Well I'll just share a quick update on me. I will be shadowing starting next week, in the clinic. Hopefully, he can get me into the OR.

As of right now, I'm leaning towards no on switching to DPM since I'm seeing many red flags. And it's a damn shame too, this looked like a really cool profession at first glance. Here are my main sources of "red flags":

a.) This report from the BLS about salary and saturation: Podiatrists : Occupational Outlook Handbook: : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
b.) This thread: New podiatry school approved - UT Rio Grande Valley
c.) Consistent dismissal of the following reports:
MGMA: https://palmcareers.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/MGMAData.pdf

American College of Foot and Ankle Surgeons: http://www.acfas.org/Research-and-P...e annual salary,earning even more at $261,755.

d.) This article: Understanding The Realities Of Student Loan Debt For Podiatry Residents


The idea of being a surgeon and out-patient clinical provider sounded like a great deal. And let me be clear, I'm not in this for the money or to get "rich" I just want to be able to live a middle-class life and I suppose I'm expecting too much. I hope I'm not pissing anyone off, just sharing what I am seeing.

Allegedly you guys are in the same boat as pharmacists. I would never have guessed that would be the case for a medical specialty.

 

[Startingover123]

I'm a male minority immigrant who came from a developing nation. Not sure what to add beyond that at the moment. If anyone has specific questions regarding my experiences in this profession I might be willing to entertain them.

Would you recommend this profession?

 

[deleted1071022]

Well I'll just share a quick update on me. I will be shadowing starting next week, in the clinic. Hopefully, he can get me into the OR.

As of right now, I'm leaning towards no on switching to DPM since I'm seeing many red flags. And it's a damn shame too, this looked like a really cool profession at first glance. Here are my main sources of "red flags":

a.) This report from the BLS about salary and saturation: Podiatrists : Occupational Outlook Handbook: : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
b.) This thread: New podiatry school approved - UT Rio Grande Valley
c.) Consistent dismissal of the following reports:
MGMA: https://palmcareers.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/MGMAData.pdf

American College of Foot and Ankle Surgeons: http://www.acfas.org/Research-and-Publications/ACFAS-Update/Update-Issues/Update-V22I7/#:~:text=The overall average annual salary,earning even more at $261,755.

d.) This article: Understanding The Realities Of Student Loan Debt For Podiatry Residents


The idea of being a surgeon and out-patient clinical provider sounded like a great deal. And let me be clear, I'm not in this for the money or to get "rich" I just want to be able to live a middle-class life and I suppose I'm expecting too much. I hope I'm not pissing anyone off, just sharing what I am seeing.

Allegedly you guys are in the same boat as pharmacists. I would never have guessed that would be the case for a medical specialty.

Hi, I am a current Podiatrist.
Excellent job asking the right questions and coming to a decision that is in your best interest. Remember, it only sucks for those of us that are IN the profession (not you, currently). No other speciality has to brainstorm on ways not to end up in a $100K & below dead-end gig after 7 years of MD-level training (8 with a fellowship) and $300K debt growing at a monthly rate of $1,500. Podiatry is a lot like Rikers island. Seriously consider IF you really want to be dropped off onto this incarcerating island and watch as the ship sails into the sunset. Would Dave Ramsey scoff at it as a “stupid” investment? Good luck.

 

[Startingover123]

Hi, I am a current Podiatrist.
Excellent job asking the right questions and coming to a decision that is in your best interest. Remember, it only sucks for those of us that are IN the profession (not you, currently). No other speciality has to brainstorm on ways not to end up in a $100K & below dead-end gig after 7 years of MD-level training (8 with a fellowship) and $300K debt growing at a monthly rate of $1,500. Podiatry is a lot like Rikers island. Seriously consider IF you really want to be dropped off onto this incarcerating island and watch as the ship sails into the sunset. Would Dave Ramsey scoff at it as a “stupid” investment? Good luck.

Damm are things really that grim with this profession.

 

[deleted285117]

No. SDN does paint a grim picture... but when N=10-15 people you are not getting much variety in opinions.

 

[G0dFather]

Allegedly you guys are in the same boat as pharmacists. I would never have guessed that would be the case for a medical specialty.

LOL come on now !! No comparison

And let me be clear, I'm not in this for the money or to get "rich" I just want to be able to live a middle-class life

Go drive an UBER or a Mr Softee ..... youll get middle class life style and no loans also

 

[G0dFather]

No other speciality has to brainstorm on ways not to end up in a $100K & below dead-end gig after 7 years of MD-level training (8 with a fellowship)

There really is no brainstorming here .... you want to make money in the profession either OWN or PARTNER in SOMETHING .... very simple

Podiatry is a lot like Rikers island.

LMAO ... Yes this only true.... if you are caught up in an ABUSIVE associate position compounded by the fact that you are also in a HIGH cost of living state , you need both of these criteria for that statement to hold up

 

[shadesofgrey]

No. SDN does paint a grim picture... but when N=10-15 people you are not getting much variety in opinions.

Grim but perhaps fair? I dont think it can be disputed that new practitioners are likely to owe close to or even over 300k in student debt. Kent states own numbers suggest a 4 year cost of over 300k. This will vary obviously based on school, and can be dampened somewhat by scholarships and lowering your cost of living, but it will be nearly crippling level of debt without high salary.

Compounding this is also that as a new graduate theres a fairly high likelihood that you will end up in a private practice jobs with limited income potential. Hospital and MSG jobs are increasing but what's the percentage of young docs getting these? Starting a practice after residency is an option, but this is more loans on top of school loans. Plus delay to get on panels and unfamiliarity with billing makes more challenging.

There are certainly ways to make it work, but I maintain if your grades are good/close go DO. If not, there are easier ways to help people and make a living. My $0.02.

 

[The Last Reclaimer]

LOL come on now !! No comparison






Go drive an UBER or a Mr Softee ..... youll get middle class life style and no loans also

I'm making that comparison to pharmacy based on these two sources:
1.) Podiatrists : Occupational Outlook Handbook: : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
2.) New podiatry school approved - UT Rio Grande Valley

As shadesofgrey just put it, the debt to income makes it seem like the financial situation will not be stable after residency. Hence why I am worried, I grew up in very bad financial conditions.

 

[DexterMorganSK]

Hi, I am a current Podiatrist.
Excellent job asking the right questions and coming to a decision that is in your best interest. Remember, it only sucks for those of us that are IN the profession (not you, currently). No other speciality has to brainstorm on ways not to end up in a $100K & below dead-end gig after 7 years of MD-level training (8 with a fellowship) and $300K debt growing at a monthly rate of $1,500. Podiatry is a lot like Rikers island. Seriously consider IF you really want to be dropped off onto this incarcerating island and watch as the ship sails into the sunset. Would Dave Ramsey scoff at it as a “stupid” investment? Good luck.

Grim but perhaps fair? I dont think it can be disputed that new practitioners are likely to owe close to or even over 300k in student debt. Kent states own numbers suggest a 4 year cost of over 300k. This will vary obviously based on school, and can be dampened somewhat by scholarships and lowering your cost of living, but it will be nearly crippling level of debt without high salary.

Compounding this is also that as a new graduate theres a fairly high likelihood that you will end up in a private practice jobs with limited income potential. Hospital and MSG jobs are increasing but what's the percentage of young docs getting these? Starting a practice after residency is an option, but this is more loans on top of school loans. Plus delay to get on panels and unfamiliarity with billing makes more challenging.

There are certainly ways to make it work, but I maintain if your grades are good/close go DO. If not, there are easier ways to help people and make a living. My $0.02.

I'm making that comparison to pharmacy based on these two sources:
1.) Podiatrists : Occupational Outlook Handbook: : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics
2.) New podiatry school approved - UT Rio Grande Valley

As shadesofgrey just put it, the debt to income makes it seem like the financial situation will not be stable after residency. Hence why I am worried, I grew up in very bad financial conditions.

I hope you guys find the career that makes you happy. Good luck!