MS and Psy.D.

[Tebs]

Hello guys,

I'm planing on doing my MS in ABA from the Chicago professional school of psychology and then Psy D in applied clinical psychology. I can't directly do Psy D because my GPA recently dropped significantly due to a death in family. And also because I really want to get my BCBA. The problem is that Psy D in applied clinical psychology is not APA accredited program at TCSPP. I don't know what to do please help. Thanks.

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[erg923]

Hello guys,

I'm planing on doing my MS in ABA from the Chicago professional school of psychology and then Psy D in applied clinical psychology. I can't directly do Psy D because my GPA recently dropped significantly due to a death in family. And also because I really want to get my BCBA. The problem is that Psy D in applied clinical psychology is not APA accredited program at TCSPP. I don't know what to do please help. Thanks.

Go to an APA accredited program.

 

[ClinicalABA]

Hello guys,

I'm planing on doing my MS in ABA from the Chicago professional school of psychology and then Psy D in applied clinical psychology. I can't directly do Psy D because my GPA recently dropped significantly due to a death in family. And also because I really want to get my BCBA. The problem is that Psy D in applied clinical psychology is not APA accredited program at TCSPP. I don't know what to do please help. Thanks.

What is your reasoning for doing the Psy.D. in Applied Psych in addition to the BCBA? The BCBA will result in certification (maybe licensure, depending on state) and the ability to practice independently and make a good living. There may not be a lot of overlap between the MA in ABA courses and what you'd typically get in the first few years of clinical graduate program, so it may not be a seamless transition between programs. Plus, as erg923 says above, you should avoid non-APA accredited programs, as the costs (financial and limitations on licensure) frequently outweigh any gains you'd get from the degree.

 

[bcliff]

Look at Eastern & Western Michigan U. They offer an ABA masters & practicum en route to clinical PhD.

 

[WisNeuro]

What erg said, going to a non-accredited grad school is an early career death sentence.

 

[bmedclinic]

What erg said, going to a non-accredited grad school is an early career death sentence.

id argue there'd be no career to kill.
fwiw BCBA > PsyD/PhD from non APA school.
Actually, I have a better idea. Get your BCBA, give me 200k, and I'll give you a piece of paper that says psyd on it that is just as worthwhile. Just for clarity- it's not the psyd that's worthless- its the unaccredited part.

 

[ClinicalABA]

fwiw BCBA > PsyD/PhD from non APA school.

Actually, fwiw, in some cases BCBA > PsyD/PhD from and APA Accredited school, depending on what you want to do. Starting BCBA incomes can be comparable or greater, particularly if you are a general outpatient psychologist in areas with a glut of general outpatient therapists, but a large need for BCBAs. In my area, BCBA salaries can start around 60K, while outpatient psych positions can start in the 50s (or lower!). You may have higher overall career earning potential with a psych license, but when you factor in actual and opportunity costs, things might even out.

There tends to be a pyramidal billing structure with BCBAs, at least as far as insurance billing for ABA services for ASD. An insurance company may approve, say, 40 hours per month of direct services from and non-certified (bachelor's level) therapist. This amount will generally require 4 hours per month on on-site supervision from a BCBA (who may also bill another 2 hours per month of parent training, as well as an hour or so of assessment and treatment planning time). Agencies may accept smaller margins on the BCBA rates because it allows for billing higher margins at the non-certified rate. So, whereas a BCBA may just cover their salary with their own billable hours, they allow for many more hours of billing by "cheaper" staff. This structure may not be common in, for instance, clinic based setting where the only means for a psychologist to cover her salary is through direct billable services. It can translate to BCBA being relatively more financially valuable to an agency than a psychologist (who can be logistically replaced by a cheaper masters-level clinician for many tasks). BCBA recruitment and retention in very difficult, and I'm in an area with a ton of ABA training programs and more BCBAs per capita than anywhere else in the country. Meanwhile, I have been offered starting salaries as a psychologist ranging from 37K-55K.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Meanwhile, I have been offered starting salaries as a psychologist ranging from 37K-55K.

Seriously? I've seen some part-time work in that range, but I don't know how someone even considers that remotely acceptable. My fellowship years were in the low-40s, I can't imagine that salary as a fully-licensed professional.

 

[erg923]

Seriously? I've seen some part-time work in that range, but I don't know how someone even considers that remotely acceptable. My fellowship years were in the low-40s, I can't imagine that salary as a fully-licensed professional.

The state prison system here starts licensed psychologist at 45 or 48, one of the two-so ive heard.

 

[bmedclinic]

Actually, fwiw, in some cases BCBA > PsyD/PhD from and APA Accredited school, depending on what you want to do. .

Fully agree.
I saw a BCBA job (granted, it was in DC) with a starting salary of 90k last week. No doctorate required.

 

[WisNeuro]

Seriously? I've seen some part-time work in that range, but I don't know how someone even considers that remotely acceptable. My fellowship years were in the low-40s, I can't imagine that salary as a fully-licensed professional.

Yeah, I'd only touch the 50k range if it were a 1/2 time job. Know your worth, people.

 

[experi_mental]

Yeah, I'd only touch the 50k range if it were a 1/2 time job. Know your worth, people.

To be fair some of the regulars of this board are the Dr. Zoidbergs of Psychology and a sandwich a day seems just compensation

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

I don't get the inference…and I have watched a great deal of Futurama.

I like sandwiches though, so there is that.

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Know your worth…wise words. Every psychologist needs to know their overhead and their gross/net revenue, these data will help you negotiate a proper salary. Don't get me wrong, I understand why places low-ball, but that doesn't mean people should accept those offers as fair.

 

[WisNeuro]

To be fair some of the regulars of this board are the Dr. Zoidbergs of Psychology and a sandwich a day seems just compensation

Hey! They worked very hard to finish all those containers of Ovaltine to send in enough proofs of purchase in addition to a **** ton of loans for the Little Orphan Annie Decoder ring and an authentic diploma from the "Give us $100+K Professional School of Psychology."

 

[experi_mental]

I don't get the inference…and I have watched a great deal of Futurama.

I like sandwiches though, so there is that.

--
Know your worth…wise words. Every psychologist needs to know their overhead and their gross/net revenue, these data will help you negotiate a proper salary. Don't get me wrong, I understand why places low-ball, but that doesn't mean people should accept those offers as fair.

If you don't get the joke, then it is surely on you

 

[WisNeuro]

I don't get the inference…and I have watched a great deal of Futurama.

I believe the inference was on poor or dubious training when it comes to human medicine. Remember, Zoidberg didn't have a real medical degree. Although, at some point in the show, I believe they revealed that he was actually very good at medicine for all other species except humans, despite his incompetent appearance. A better inference might be Dr. Nick from the Simpsons for this particular issue.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Ah, ok.

I guess the joke is on me. I shall now go back to my job so I can earn my sandwich of compensation.

 

[experi_mental]

I believe the inference was on poor or dubious training when it comes to human medicine. Remember, Zoidberg didn't have a real medical degree. Although, at some point in the show, I believe they revealed that he was actually very good at medicine for all other species except humans, despite his incompetent appearance. A better inference might be Dr. Nick from the Simpsons for this particular issue.

Well we are treating humans so I maintain Zoidberg is more appropriate than Dr. Nick. Anyway thx for the assist

 

[WisNeuro]

I don't know, I think the Dr. Nick exemplar works better if you're implying a fake degree vs. general frank incompetence as would be the case in the diploma mills. Vs Zoidberg lying about his medical credentials.

 

[experi_mental]

I don't know, I think the Dr. Nick exemplar works better if you're implying a fake degree vs. general frank incompetence as would be the case in the diploma mills. Vs Zoidberg lying about his medical credentials.

Honestly this was over thought and I really used Zoidberg because of the general goofiness and incompetence characteristic of Z found in even PhD posters, i.e. pragma, wisneuro etc. Mine is a prejudice-free spite. I just felt like going into this detail took the joy out for me

 

[WisNeuro]

Glad to be of service

 

[Pragma]

Honestly this was over thought and I really used Zoidberg because of the general goofiness and incompetence characteristic of Z found in even PhD posters, i.e. pragma, wisneuro etc. Mine is a prejudice-free spite. I just felt like going into this detail took the joy out for me

Ooooooh it burns! Meh.

Why'd you have to go and use "etc." after an "i.e."? Makes me feel especially outlandish and incompetent.

http://theoatmeal.com/comics/ie

 

[experi_mental]

Ooooooh it burns! Meh.

Why'd you have to go and use "etc." after an "i.e."? Makes me feel especially outlandish and incompetent.

And rightfully so. I.e. means "that is (to say)" in which one offers specificity to clarify, whereas et cetera means "and other things." I thought it was hilarious months ago when you called someone out for "incompetent" posting as though this were a skill, and despite your general lack of insight or knowledge. You have a soft spot in old Socrates' heart right here.

 

[Pragma]

And rightfully so. I.e. means "that is (to say)" in which one offers specificity to clarify, whereas et cetera means "and other things." I thought it was hilarious months ago when you called someone out for "incompetent" posting as though this were a skill, and despite your general lack of insight or knowledge. You have a soft spot in old Socrates' heart right here.

Exsqueeze me?

Your list is not finite!

 

[experi_mental]

Exsqueeze me?

Your list is not finite!

Um Earth to Pragma, it is in that there are a finite number of total posters to this board.


Edit: good protocol says you should identify your edits, i.e. your comic addition. Since I used etc, it negates the otherwise finite nature of i.e.

 

[WisNeuro]

That's it, only one way to settle this. It's a walk-off!

 

[Pragma]

Um Earth to Pragma, it is in that there are a finite number of total posters to this board.

Bahhh. My clinical supervisors would have given you 40 lashes with their pens.

Aren't there infinite potential posters?

Well, the Futurama part was fun but then the spite and unreasoned hate for actual clinical psychologists got unleashed for no reason, again.

 

[experi_mental]

Bahhh. My clinical supervisors would have given you 40 lashes with their pens.

Aren't there infinite potential posters?

Well, the Futurama part was fun but then the spite and unreasoned hate for actual clinical psychologists got unleashed for no reason, again.

I'm not discussing future posters, I personally hope most of you get fired and can't afford to install WiFi in your cardboard boxes

 

[Pragma]

I'm not discussing future posters, I personally hope most of you get fired and can't afford to install WiFi in your cardboard boxes

There's always Starbucks.

 

[WisNeuro]

Dude, I work for the government. The government doesn't fire people.

 

[experi_mental]

There's always Starbucks.

Welcome to being upper middle class and white. Try using them again when you're homeless and see how friendly they are in some districts
Edit: I seriously reread this to see where "hate" comes from. This is really what you call spite unleashed? I spite more than this with any one of my girlfriends daily.

 

[erg923]

I also work for the government, just wanted to throw that out there. I do have a "corporate" side job that I suppose I could be fired from, but so far so good. Sqweeee....

And this is just ridiculous. Since when do upper-middle class white ppl cut out of work early to buy bar stools at Haverty's (the most overpriced place ever!) for their home bar? Did I mention I work for the government?

 

[Pragma]

Well if they're going to password protect it in a discriminatory fashion then I'll just have to go to my local McDonalds.

 

[Pragma]

Edit: I seriously reread this to see where "hate" comes from. This is really what you call spite unleashed? I spite more than this with any one of my girlfriends daily.

Isn't that nice. A gentleman AND a scholar.

 

[experi_mental]

Isn't that nice. A gentleman AND a scholar.

Sorry I don't make room in my schedule for dinosaurs or babies. Erg seems lonely though, maybe you can both travel to the CE thing "incognito" as they say

 

[Pragma]

Sorry I don't make room in my schedule for dinosaurs or babies. Erg seems lonely though, maybe you can both travel to the CE thing "incognito" as they say

What? I am so confused. So now you've gone all "bro" discussing your multiple girlfriends AND made a subtle anti-homosexual slur in the same thread? Bright for this one, the future is.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

I'm not discussing future posters, I personally hope most of you get fired and can't afford to install WiFi in your cardboard boxes

lol..good luck w. that.

If all else fails...WiFi hotspot! Of course, I still have a stack of work to do tonight, so...back to the grindstone. Sandwich compensation is still there for the taking!

 

[experi_mental]

What? I am so confused. So now you've gone all "bro" discussing your multiple girlfriends AND made a subtle anti-homosexual slur in the same thread? Bright for this one, the future is.

Homosexual? What? Is my sexual identification either "baby" or "dinosaur"?
Edit: you're the one slut-shaming me for being poly. Which university employs you again?

 

[cara susanna]

To be fair some of the regulars of this board are the Dr. Zoidbergs of Psychology and a sandwich a day seems just compensation

Fry, it's been years since medical school, so remind me. Disemboweling in your species, fatal or non-fatal?

 

[Pragma]

Edit: you're the one slut-shaming me for being poly

I was referring to the spiting part.

 

[experi_mental]

I was referring to the spiting part.

I actually deleted that because it was a kink joke that I realized no one outside of my scene would get
Edit: you still didn't answer for your baseless accusation of homophobia

 

[Pragma]

This might have reached the threshold for derailed, methinks.

 

[experi_mental]

This might have reached the threshold for derailed, methinks.

I blame neuro, my Zoidberg joke stood on its own. Although far be it for me to pass up the opportunity to discuss sex
Edit: seriously how have I not been banned yet? When I retire this account momentarily it will probably be the most inappropriate of any among my illustrious career as a challenger of preconceived notions for the good of humanity (i.e. "troll" in the lineage of the great classical Greeks; read Socrates' Apology if you don't believe me).

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Why not Zoidberg?

This is why not Zoidberg.

 

[Pragma]

http://www.27bslash6.com/overdue.html

I prefer this troll. So does good protocol.

 

[cara susanna]

That spider drawing is adorable. I would have accepted it.

 

[futureapppsy2]

I believe the inference was on poor or dubious training when it comes to human medicine. Remember, Zoidberg didn't have a real medical degree. Although, at some point in the show, I believe they revealed that he was actually very good at medicine for all other species except humans, despite his incompetent appearance. A better inference might be Dr. Nick from the Simpsons for this particular issue.

Did you attend Hollywood Upstairs Medical College, too?

 

[bmedclinic]

Yeah, I'd only touch the 50k range if it were a 1/2 time job. Know your worth, people.

this is one of my beefs with psych- we spend tons of time advocating for people (nothing wrong with that) and very little time advocating for our worth (both in terms of compensation and others encroaching on our field).

 

[WisNeuro]

this is one of my beefs with psych- we spend tons of time advocating for people (nothing wrong with that) and very little time advocating for our worth (both in terms of compensation and others encroaching on our field).

Definitely, at least not in any unified way. I think Neuro has done a great advocacy job in recent years, but we're still a minority of the field overall. APAPO could be stronger, but they've suffered from membership decline from the APA

 

[smalltownpsych]

Definitely, at least not in any unified way. I think Neuro has done a great advocacy job in recent years, but we're still a minority of the field overall. APAPO could be stronger, but they've suffered from membership decline from the APA

The neuro folk probably does a better job cause they don't have as many "I wanna be a therapist and help people and I don't care how much money I make because that would be selfish and uncaring" types. I wonder if there is a correlation between research is icky and money is icky?