So was it pointless of me to volunteer and do research?

[cryhavoc]

So I have around a 3.8 GPA, and a 3.45 sGPA as a graduating senior. I have close to 400 hours of clinical and community volunteering. I have close to 500 hours of research experience. I was in a few clubs.

But I got a 27 on my MCAT, so I've been advised to only apply to DO schools. A lot of these DO schools I could have gotten into without the research or volunteering, I have friends who got it without it and a low MCAT score.

Was it pointless of me to do all this extra stuff? I apparently have very little chance at MD.

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[Psai]

retake the mcat

 

[cryhavoc]

I only have enough money to apply and barely enough at that. I had one shot at the MCAT. My parents make too much to qualify for reduced pricing.

Plus I studied for the old one, not the new one.

I would love to retake the MCAT if I could afford it.

 

[milk1993]

I only have enough money to apply and barely enough at that. I had one shot at the MCAT. My parents make too much to qualify for reduced pricing.

Plus I studied for the old one, not the new one.

I would love to retake the MCAT if I could afford it.

I'm not sure is the cost of the new MCAT is changing, but the old MCAT was round $300. Honestly, I would question your dedication to MD (of course, nothing wrong with going DO if it interests you) if $300 is essentially what bars you gaining entry to an MD school. $300 certainly isn't a small amount of money, but if you budget appropriately you can definitely make it work between now and the time that you would take the test.

 

[cryhavoc]

I only have enough money for food right now. I can't buy study aids for the new one. Or register.

I might be able to save up though for a month or two.

Can I apply early, like June 1st, and send in an updated MCAT score around August and still be considered as if I applied in June? Or will they throw it out right away?

 

[tantacles]

I only have enough money to apply and barely enough at that. I had one shot at the MCAT. My parents make too much to qualify for reduced pricing.

Plus I studied for the old one, not the new one.

I would love to retake the MCAT if I could afford it.

Then what do you want from us? If you want to get into MD schools, your best shot is to retake the MCAT. If you don't do that, we have little to offer you. Take a year off and work; if you do that, you'll have some more funds, and you'll have the time to study up for the new MCAT and do well on it. You're not on a strict schedule, and you should apply when you're most ready.

 

[Kelevra]

If your parents can't (or refuse to) help you, that sucks. Work, gain more money, and retake the MCAT.

And yes, you can take the MCAT around June, and send in the new score around August. Won't kill you. But your 3.45 isn't outstanding, so make sure the MCAT is good.

 

[tantacles]

I only have enough money for food right now. I can't buy study aids for the new one. Or register.

I might be able to save up though for a month or two.

Can I apply early, like June 1st, and send in an updated MCAT score around August and still be considered as if I applied in June? Or will they throw it out right away?

Yes, you can do this. Again, though, consider taking a year off; it might be a wiser decision if funding is an issue.

 

[cryhavoc]

I'm already taking a year off, I'm applying at the end of my senior year (I graduate in a few months and start working in May).

Are you guys sure though? Part of the reason I'm taking this gap year is so I could apply on the first day to be considered "early". I heard medical schools throw out apps if they don't have a high MCAT. Will they throw it out in the month or two it takes to send the updated score?

 

[tantacles]

I'm already taking a year off, I'm applying at the end of my senior year (I graduate in a few months and start working in May).

Are you guys sure though? Part of the reason I'm taking this gap year is so I could apply on the first day to be considered "early". I heard medical schools throw out apps if they don't have a high MCAT. Will they throw it out in the month or two it takes to send the updated score?

You can take TWO years off and apply early in two cycles as well. I took three years off, in fact, and I would recommend the time. Your time is your own, and it would be in your best interest to do whatever it takes to ensure that your first application cycle is also your last, particularly if you're aiming for MD schools.

Also, you can tell schools that you plan to retake the MCAT at a later date, but if you don't do well on that administration, you've shot yourself in the foot. The ideal situation would be to plan to take two years off.

 

[Whale]

Yeah, best thing is to retake the MCAT, but don't rush it, take it when you score well on practice tests.
No one can stop you from applying MD. So apply away, even if your chances are small with 27.

If you apply without MCAT score, you can finish primary and secondary apps, send in your letters of rec, since those take processing time. But the adcom will not review your file until they received your MCAT score. Then again, if you paid for secondary app fees and got a bad MCAT score, might be waste of money.

On AMCAS you can indicate if you're taking a future MCAT. Likely the adcom will just set aside your app and review only when they receive your new mcat score.

Also be mindful it costs a lot to travel to interviews. If you can't afford 300 now, how can you travel to interviews?

 

[NonTrad16]

I have a MS degree and spent several years working. I don't consider myself to have "wasted" my time doing that, even if I do apply for DO.

Take the MCAT again if you're set on MD consideration, but I'd also take a second to realize what you may have gotten from the time you spent doing those activities. And realize that a higher MCAT won't guarantee a MD acceptance.

 

[cryhavoc]

I plan to apply to about 10 DO schools, and 5 MD schools (with the lowest average MCAT that accept apps from my state). All applied in June.

I will send my new MCAT to all of them in August.

If I get into a DO school and not an MD school, I'll go.

If I get into any MD school, I'll go. I heard MD makes it easier to get a residency.

 

[Kelevra]

If I get into a DO school and not an MD school, I'll go.

Here's the problem: do you have any idea how many threads are started by people who say, "I initially just wanted to go to medical school, so I totally applied DO, but now I have only DO acceptances. I realize now that in my heart, I really want MD, and I feel like I can do better next cycle. Can I drop my DO acceptances?"

Therefore, are you sure you'd personally be happy with DO?

 

[infinitessimal]

Have you calculated your total application cost? For AMCAS, it's $160 for the first school and $36 for each additional school. For DO, it seems like they use a graduated scale where the first school is $155, next school is $35, next one is $30, and so on. Secondaries run from $50 to $130 for MD schools (estimated). And this is only the cherry on top of the pie that is traveling for interviews, including flights and hotels. Consider if you apply blind and get another bad MCAT score, then all that money is out the window. On the other hand, since you already seem set on retaking the MCAT, if you apply next year knowing your score, you can tailor your applications much better...

If money is such an issue, I think your best bet is to take another year off, save up some funds, retake the new MCAT when you're ready, and apply next June. Personally, I took 2 years off and it was the best decision ever.

 

[Womb Raider]

Had a friend who had similar stats and a 27 MCAT, white male, and got into a good MD school in my state. Don't give up hope.

 

[Blue Blood]

If you are set on going MD then you need to retake the MCAT. No way around that.

And to answer your original question. I doubt many DO schools would have accepted you without any volunteering. Your remarks make it seem like DO schools will just flock to your 27 and that's just not true. That's about the average and many of the more established DO schools are higher.
Clubs are pretty worthless just by themselves.

 

[iniquus]

If you can't afford the MCAT, how can you afford application fees and the possible interview costs? Don't rush it. Retake the MCAT, go panhandle if necessary cause if you do well on it, you could probably get into some low-tier MDs.

 

[cryhavoc]

Had a friend who had similar stats and a 27 MCAT, white male, and got into a good MD school in my state. Don't give up hope.

See, I hear of people that have this happen. But my adviser acts like it is impossible.

 

[MrLogan13]

Don't rush, it's not a race. Take another gap year, work, save money, work on improving your application.

 

[Blue Blood]

See, I hear of people that have this happen. But my adviser acts like it is impossible.

Not imposible but it is the exception. New schools, urms, fitting unique missions of schools can help.

I just wouldn't bet on it. To be honest you have nothing exceptional in your app so you need to break 30. 32+ being ideal.

Edit: the score equivalent of 32+

 

[bea123]

I had a 28 Mcat and 3.8 gpa. No research at all and only 80 hours of volunteering and 3 years working as a medical assistant. I had around 10 interview invites from MD schools but I finally choose to go to my state DO. So i don't think is impossible that you get an MD acceptance

 

[cryhavoc]

I have $1800 dollars. $136 just to start applying.

1664 left. Application is 36, plus 25-100 for secondary application. Let's say 75 for secondary to be safe, with 36 on top of that. So 111 per school.

That is almost 15 applications. So I have about 15 applications to get in.

-I want to be an MD for one reason. It will give me a better chance of getting into an internal medicine residency if I decide to be an oncologist.

-If I decide to be a DO, I can still do the other two specialties I'm interested in, ER doc and psychiatrist. But what if I really get interested in becoming an oncologist? What if I find out I have a skilled hand at surgery? I'm severely limiting my future options by becoming a DO.

It would be worth another year if I was 100% dead set on becoming a surgeon, but is it worth another year of my life just to change the initials after my name?

 

[Blue Blood]

I had a 28 Mcat and 3.8 gpa. No research at all and only 80 hours of volunteering and 3 years working as a medical assistant. I had around 10 interview invites from MD schools but I finally choose to go to my state DO. So i don't think is impossible that you get an MD acceptance

Just curious, are you an urm?

 

[Kelevra]

I have $1800 dollars. $136 just to start applying.

1664 left. Application is 36, plus 25-100 for secondary application. Let's say 75 for secondary to be safe, with 36 on top of that. So 111 per school.

That is almost 15 applications. So I have about 15 applications to get in.

-I want to be an MD for one reasons. It will give me a better chance of getting into an internal medicine residency if I decide to be an oncologist.

-If I decide to be a DO, I can still do the other two specialties I'm interested in, ER doc and psychiatrist. But what if I really get interested in becoming an oncologist? What if I find out I have a skilled hand at surgery? I'm severely limiting my future options by becoming a DO.

It would be worth another year if I was 100% dead set on becoming a surgeon, but is it worth another year of my life just to change the initials after my name?

It's not one year of 'nothingness'. You're working, living, preparing, etc. It's not a waste, if you do something with it.

 

[cryhavoc]

The only job I want to do is being a doctor. I will sit for two years working a job I hate, and paying off loans which I could pay off a lot more efficiently as a doctor than a minimum wage employee. I see it as a huge waste.

 

[ERK123]

You would have no chance of getting into a top DO school with a 27 MCAT and no volunteering. The top DO schools also recommend that students have research experience.

 

[cryhavoc]

Is there really a difference between a top DO and a medium DO? Both get overruled for residencies that are handed to the bottom MD's, aren't they?

 

[bea123]

Just curious, are you an urm?

Yes, hispanic

 

[Kelevra]

The only job I want to do is being a doctor. I will sit for two years working a job I hate, and paying off loans which I could pay off a lot more efficiently as a doctor than a minimum wage employee. I see it as a huge waste.

Well, tough s***. You want to increase your chances of MD? Retake your MCAT. Take another year.

I understand that the only job you want to do is "being a doctor", but how is one extra year going to mean that you won't do that? We're not telling you to never go to medical school. Simply, if you work for another year and retake the MCAT (and score well), your chances of MD are significantly increased. You want MD. This is how you get it. Yes, you can apply as your are. But please understand that a 27 MCAT is not wonderful, and will push you out of the running at many schools. But yes, not all schools.

There is risk, of course. Job hate, financial risk, all of which add to frustration. But this is the situation you are in. You try to improve it, or you take it as is, and play to the best of the circumstances.

However, you can study for the new MCAT, and try to sink a spot in June/July if you can. However, do this only if you have access to resources at the moment, as well as time to devote to serious study. Taking it once with a 27 sucks. Taking it twice with about the same score, and you might as well ask the adcoms what type of would your application would like for its coffin.

 

[Blue Blood]

Is there really a difference between a top DO and a medium DO? Both get overruled for residencies that are handed to the bottom MD's, aren't they?

The bias against DOs is small to insignificant in all the specialties you listed. And nothing at this level is "handed." You need to earn everything at this point yourself.
I suggest you browse the forums here a little more. You have a lot of misconceptions OP.

 

[cryhavoc]

But is shouldn't take me a whole year to save up, and retake the MCAT. I already have enough money to apply to 15 schools.

I need about 100 for the biochem and psych study aids, 300 to retake it, and maybe a month or two to study. I only really studied hardcore for two weeks for the old one and did okayish. 1-2 months hardcore studying and I should be fine. So I need $400 dollars and two months not in school. So I study May and June, Take it early July, send my score early August.

As long as I mark I'm going to send another MCAT score on app, I still won't get thrown out of the pile, and I'll still be considered early for starting to apply in May/June?

 

[Blue Blood]

Yes, hispanic

Okay makes sense then, although 10 iis with those stats and ECs is probably really rare. You must of had one hell of a PS!

 

[Law2Doc]

I have $1800 dollars. $136 just to start applying.

1664 left. Application is 36, plus 25-100 for secondary application. Let's say 75 for secondary to be safe, with 36 on top of that. So 111 per school.

That is almost 15 applications. So I have about 15 applications to get in.

-I want to be an MD for one reason. It will give me a better chance of getting into an internal medicine residency if I decide to be an oncologist.

-If I decide to be a DO, I can still do the other two specialties I'm interested in, ER doc and psychiatrist. But what if I really get interested in becoming an oncologist? What if I find out I have a skilled hand at surgery? I'm severely limiting my future options by becoming a DO.

It would be worth another year if I was 100% dead set on becoming a surgeon, but is it worth another year of my life just to change the initials after my name?

First, if you are that tight on funds, I think the right answer is to take a second gap year and save up. Things cost more than you expect, and if you are lucky enough to get interviews you'll be broke.

Second, the fact that you are raising all these MD/DO issues tells me you are likely to sulk if you end up DO. So spend the time needed to retake MCAT and give yourself a shot at where you feel you belong.

Third, I think you are better off not even applying now and risking either becoming a reapplicant, where you'd have to show substantial improvement to get the same consideration, or getting accepted to something you are going to turn down and lose as a Fallback in a subsequent year.

Fourth, I've seen DOs working in IM at the community hospitals around here, so I'm not sure why you think the IM door is closed to them.

 

[Kelevra]

But is shouldn't take me a whole year to save up, and retake the MCAT. I already have enough money to apply to 15 schools.

I need about 100 for the biochem and psych study aids, 300 to retake it, and maybe a month or two to study. I only really studied hardcore for two weeks for the old one and did okayish. 1-2 hardcore studying and I should be fine. So I need $400 dollars and two months not in school. So I study May and June, Take it early July, send my score early August.

As long as I mark I'm going to send another MCAT score on app, I still won't get thrown out of the pile, and I'll still be considered early for starting to apply in May/June?

I added more to my last point. Yeah, if you have the money for the resources, the time, and the scheduling ability to get your scores by August, you should be fine. It's not crazy early, but it's not game over. You can also apply to only a single school, and wait to see how your scores are when they come back.

 

[tiedyeddog]

Take another year off and retake.

 

[NonTrad16]

The only job I want to do is being a doctor. I will sit for two years working a job I hate, and paying off loans which I could pay off a lot more efficiently as a doctor than a minimum wage employee. I see it as a huge waste.

A gap year or two in order to make your app stronger is as much a waste as any in the 10 years to become an oncologist (4 year med school, 3 year IM, 3 year hem/onc fellowship). Which is to say: it's not. If you can't stop to smell the roses, you're going to have a dull journey. Many years you'll feel under appreciated, overworked, underpaid, etc. But you can't be a physician without those years, and you basically can't guarantee a MD acceptance with 15 apps and a 27 MCAT. Or a 31.

 

[cryhavoc]

Can I crazy early apply to the DO schools with my old scores ASAP, and then apply to my MD schools when I get my new score back?

Say I apply to 12 DO schools and like 3 MD schools in June, with my old score.

I study, I retake it, I work a job to save up money, maybe live at my parents house so I don't waste money on rent.

Then I retake the MCAT in July. If I do awesome, I apply to 5-8 more MD schools. If I do just okay, I don't spend anymore money on applications and just give that money over to my slave-masters, the bank I took loans from.

 

[Kelevra]

Can I crazy early apply to the DO schools with my old scores ASAP, and then apply to my MD schools when I get my score back?

I can use whatever money I save up before August to apply to extra MD schools.

I think I'd sulk a little more at two gap years than being a DO.

But here's what could happen: You apply to the DO schools, get a new MCAT (and it's about the same, or worse), you can't apply MD, you get DO acceptances, and you sulk.

There's nothing wrong with DO. But you seem keen on wanting MD, and complain about what you have to do. How do you know that you won't want a different speciality in medical school, one that is much easier to get as an MD? You have no idea.

It sucks looking at two years right now. But those two years aren't spent in purgatory. You're busy studying for the MCAT, polishing your applications, etc. If, at the end of them, you got what you wanted, would it have been a waste? It is difficult. It does suck working a job you hate, especially for two years. It also sucks being a reapplicant, or having regrets of not trying.

But haven't you noticed that you have a history of making not-so-great decisions (ie studying two weeks for the MCAT? Are you kidding?)

Maybe think about what you're hearing from people here, just a little bit more, without the whole, "But I want it now. I want it now."

 

[cryhavoc]

Well it is sort of hard to study for the MCAT when you are working a part-time job, taking 15 credits, working at a lab, attending clubs, and volunteering at three different places. I can't imagine studying a whole year, I don't want to get a perfect score. Two months should be way more than enough times if my only distraction is a part-time job.

 

[ortnakas]

A few things:

• Plenty of DOs are in internal medicine. And general surgery.
• We all know what it's like to be short on cash, but retaking the MCAT is truly a drop in the bucket compared to applying widely, traveling to interviews, and then of course med school debt. If you want to get in in the next year or two, and especially if you're dead set on being an MD, it's worth the opportunity cost.
• If you don't want to be a DO as much as it seems like in your posts, it'll come across at interviews. DO stats may be lower than MD stats, but don't assume you're a shoo-in for anything.
• You can apply to DO right away and MD schools later if you want, but what will you do if you're accepted to one of those DO schools and they ask you for a $1,500 deposit? You'll have to decide between holding a spot at a DO school and saving your money for MD interviews and deposits that may or may not be coming your way. Plan ahead.
• Did you learn something doing research and volunteering? Did you grow as a person? Then the experiences weren't wasted.

 

[NYCdude]

Not surprisingly, a 27 MCAT doesn't even guarantee you a spot at a top D.O. school.

I think Touro NY and NYCOM have MCAT averages around 30. Your research and volunteering gives you a leg up.

 

[cryhavoc]

Well, it should be highly motivating.

Do or die.

If I really want to be an MD, I'll kill this final attempt at taking an MCAT in July. If I get a mediocre score, I'll get over myself, and commit fully to becoming a DO.

And I will apply to some lower-ranked DO schools too, I'm not foolish enough to only apply to top schools. I want a safety net.

I work best under pressure.

 

[candbgirl]

Don't waste all of that money on apps without knowing what your new MCAT score is. Apply to AMCAS early June and apply to one school. That way you get verified. Then when you get your score back apply to more schools(or no more) based on your MCAT. Don't apply to DO schools. You'll be so unhappy. Try a cycle of MD and see if you are lucky. And if you do apply DO get rid of the negativity. Adcoms will feel it. You said you only studied for two weeks for a life impacting exam and you are surprised with your score? Some would think that showed poor judgement!

 

[Blue Blood]

Well it is sort of hard to study for the MCAT when you are working a part-time job, taking 15 credits, working at a lab, attending clubs, and volunteering at three different places. I can't imagine studying a whole year, I don't want to get a perfect score. Two months should be way more than enough times if my only distraction is a part-time job.

Two months of part time studying is not "way more than enough" to get a competitive score, especially with an added section. Don't take this litely OP or you'll be a 3rd time test taker..

 

[cryhavoc]

Well, if it is true DO's can practice in the fields I'm interested in, I'm taking 2 gap years instead of one because of my pride. I'm spending an entire year of my life on initials. In that context, it looks dumb. Sure, maybe a part of me thinks MD's are looked at better. I'd probably be a better physician if I worried less about my pride and more about my patients.

 

[Lucca]

Well, it should be highly motivating.

Do or die.

If I really want to be an MD, I'll kill this final attempt at taking an MCAT in July. If I get a mediocre score, I'll get over myself, and commit fully to becoming a DO.

And I will apply to some lower-ranked DO schools too, I'm not foolish enough to only apply to top schools. I want a safety net.

I work best under pressure.

What you should have realized is that the pressure was on all along. Study very hard for your next MCAT.

 

[ridethecliche]

Had a friend who had similar stats and a 27 MCAT, white male, and got into a good MD school in my state. Don't give up hope.

See, I hear of people that have this happen. But my adviser acts like it is impossible.

The exceptions don't make the rule.

The only job I want to do is being a doctor. I will sit for two years working a job I hate, and paying off loans which I could pay off a lot more efficiently as a doctor than a minimum wage employee. I see it as a huge waste.

Find a better job after college. You have a degree and there are plenty of things you can do that aren't minimum wage. Go scribe or do something where you'll actually learn something.

Stop throwing yourself a pity party. If you want to do this you'll figure it out.

The only thing that will make all the effort you've made all this time totally pointless is if you refuse to do any more work because you feel what you've done is good enough. If it's good enough, then you should be happy with the results that you're probably going to get.

Well it is sort of hard to study for the MCAT when you are working a part-time job, taking 15 credits, working at a lab, attending clubs, and volunteering at three different places. I can't imagine studying a whole year, I don't want to get a perfect score. Two months should be way more than enough times if my only distraction is a part-time job.

This depends entirely on how well you know the material, how good of a test taker you are, and what you can handle. I took the MCAT twice and got a 30 the first time and a 34 the second time. I was working full time both of those times, I basically worked and studied for that period of time but it was worth it to me. You decide what's worth it to you.

PS: A cycle that doesn't yield an acceptance is much more expensive than destroying a retake.

 

[candbgirl]

Well it is sort of hard to study for the MCAT when you are working a part-time job, taking 15 credits, working at a lab, attending clubs, and volunteering at three different places. I can't imagine studying a whole year, I don't want to get a perfect score. Two months should be way more than enough times if my only distraction is a part-time job.

Do you think you are the only pre-med that has to do those things? Many people do it everyday and are far more successful than you seem to be. And probably have better attitudes.

Sent from my KFOT using Tapatalk 2

 

[MrLogan13]

I have $1800 dollars. $136 just to start applying.

1664 left. Application is 36, plus 25-100 for secondary application. Let's say 75 for secondary to be safe, with 36 on top of that. So 111 per school.

That is almost 15 applications. So I have about 15 applications to get in.

-I want to be an MD for one reason. It will give me a better chance of getting into an internal medicine residency if I decide to be an oncologist.

-If I decide to be a DO, I can still do the other two specialties I'm interested in, ER doc and psychiatrist. But what if I really get interested in becoming an oncologist? What if I find out I have a skilled hand at surgery? I'm severely limiting my future options by becoming a DO.

It would be worth another year if I was 100% dead set on becoming a surgeon, but is it worth another year of my life just to change the initials after my name?

If you only have $1800 set aside for applications, you are not ready to apply. You're not taking into account the cost of travel when interviewing. I've been on three interviews so far this cycle, and have spent around $2k for airfare, hotels, rental cars, and miscellaneous travel expenses.

If your desire is to become a physician then don't rush. Take the additional year, work, save money, and work on improving your application. Ideally, you only want to apply once. And I guarantee you that by the time you are through with everything and have a few years of perspective, a year or two is nothing. It's not a race.