USMLE step 2 required for ACGME FM??

[dorothyntoto]

Hi All,
I'm new here, so thanks in advance for the assistance!

I'm planning on applying for FM. I really don't want to take the USMLE step 2, just for cost reasons, but I'm wondering if I need to take it if the program would require that I take USMLE step 3? Or will COMLEX level 2 and 3 be enough??? Anyone know or have thoughts??


Thanks!

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[hallowmann]

Taking Step 2-CK is really up to you. Look at the programs you're interested in, contact them and ask them. If you did well in Step 1, and can do well in Step 2-CK, it'll only help and give you more options.

That said, why would you have to take Step 3 (or even Step 2-CS for that matter)? Programs care that you can get a license. For that you'll have to do all of the COMLEX exams. There's pretty much no point in doing Step 3 as a DO, as far as I've heard.

 

[dorothyntoto]

That's what I'm wondering a couple programs have said something about passing step 3, and honestly, if I don't have to shell out a crapload more money, I'd rather not. I passed step 1 on my first try, but not with a stellar score by any means. My father in law came out just before the exam and got pneumonia and was hospitalized for ~10 days. I ended up rescheduling the test, and passed, but again, not a great score...

 

[hallowmann]

That's what I'm wondering a couple programs have said something about passing step 3, and honestly, if I don't have to shell out a crapload more money, I'd rather not. I passed step 1 on my first try, but not with a stellar score by any means. My father in law came out just before the exam and got pneumonia and was hospitalized for ~10 days. I ended up rescheduling the test, and passed, but again, not a great score...

Are you sure they meant USMLE Step 3 or just the "3rd" level/step of the exam? Its possible they just mean they will need you to take it in order to get licensed, which most places expect by PGY-2. I mean you need to take COMLEX Level 3 to get licensed, so you have to take and pass it, but I honestly don't see why any program would want or need you, as a DO, to take USMLE Step 3.

Honestly, its really up to you about Step 2. If you can show a good amount of improvement, and you weren't around average on Step 1, it would look good, but it really depends on the programs. Maybe they won't even care if you've taken Step 2 or not. Have you tried contacting them and getting a feel for what they recommend?

 

[dorothyntoto]

It said USMLE step 3. Not step 2 ck/cs...

 

[hallowmann]

It said USMLE step 3. Not step 2 ck/cs...

Are talking about a website or something? Honestly, I'd actually contact the program. A lot of places say things like USMLE when they mean "boards", because the vast majority of applicants are US MDs, US-IMGs, and non-US IMGs, who all have to take USMLE Step 3 to be licensed.

I mean if residencies were forcing DOs to take Step 3, a lot more than 25 DOs in the whole country would be taking it (http://www.usmle.org/performance-data/default.aspx#2013_step-3). I mean it's possible a program could require it, but something tells me that they could also get sued for it.

 

[dorothyntoto]

Fair enough... I guess haven't seen anything that says I'm at a disadvantage for only taking the COMLEX level 2 stuff versus both... Idk if anyone has any thoughts on that

 

[BinderClip]

Taking Step 2-CK is really up to you. Look at the programs you're interested in, contact them and ask them. If you did well in Step 1, and can do well in Step 2-CK, it'll only help and give you more options.

That said, why would you have to take Step 3 (or even Step 2-CS for that matter)? Programs care that you can get a license. For that you'll have to do all of the COMLEX exams. There's pretty much no point in doing Step 3 as a DO, as far as I've heard.

My understanding is that many ACGME accredited program do not require USMLE Step 3 as a requirement for graduation. However, some do, and it is up to you to do your homework. While not FM, I know of an Anesthesia program and an IM program that require passage of the USMLE Step 3 to graduate from the residency program. That is in addition to the COMLEX Level 3.

 

[hallowmann]

My understanding is that many ACGME accredited program do not require USMLE Step 3 as a requirement for graduation. However, some do, and it is up to you to do your homework. While not FM, I know of an Anesthesia program and an IM program that require passage of the USMLE Step 3 to graduate from the residency program. That is in addition to the COMLEX Level 3.

I wonder if this will be more or less common after the merger. Do they at least cover it with education/CME money?

You'd think if they make you take an extra board they'd allocate more money for you, but probably not... I guess if you take one a year, you could probably get it covered.

 

[doapplicant2015]

While not FM, I know of an Anesthesia program and an IM program that require passage of the USMLE Step 3 to graduate from the residency program. That is in addition to the COMLEX Level 3.

Warning-premed here but I know a DO FM resident at an ACGME program that requires Step 3 (in addition to Level 3) to graduate

 

[dorothyntoto]

The biggest question would then be, is step 2 required to take step 3...

 

[BinderClip]

I wonder if this will be more or less common after the merger. Do they at least cover it with education/CME money?

You'd think if they make you take an extra board they'd allocate more money for you, but probably not... I guess if you take one a year, you could probably get it covered.

The programs I have interviewed at choose to offer an "educational" stipend each year that you can use to spend on supplemental materials at your discretion. This can include board testing fees, books, qbanks or electronics such as iPads and laptops. The sum varies between programs.

While true that technically Step 3 isn't required until a certain point in your residency (dependent on state laws), I don't know how this would affect moonlighting opportunities.

To my understanding, there is no special stipend to help cover the additional costs to take the Step 3 on top of the Level 3 at these programs.

The biggest question would then be, is step 2 required to take step 3...

Yes. In order to take the USMLE Step 3, you are required to take USMLE Step 1, Step 2 CK and Step 2 CS. So, for a DO, you would have to take both series of exams and bear the cost of each.

 

[hallowmann]

Thanks for the info!

The programs I have interviewed at choose to offer an "educational" stipend each year that you can use to spend on supplemental materials at your discretion. This can include board testing fees, books, qbanks or electronics such as iPads and laptops. The sum varies between programs.

Yeah, this is what I meant. I guess first year you could take Level 3, then take Step 3 second year.

While true that technically Step 3 isn't required until a certain point in your residency (dependent on state laws), I don't know how this would affect moonlighting opportunities.

To my understanding, there is no special stipend to help cover the additional costs to take the Step 3 on top of the Level 3 at these programs.

It would probably vary based on program rules regarding moonlighting, but as long as you have a license and your program allows it, wouldn't you be able to moonlight? Every state accepts COMLEX for DOs to get licensed, so I guess you could take Level 3 in PGY-1, get licensed, then take Step 3 in PGY-2. That might be a pain though, and on top of that you'll be spending a good chunk of your education stipend.

 

[dorothyntoto]

Well, there's no way I could afford to take CK AND CS. We aren't given enough loan money to do so. So that ain't happening...

 

[hallowmann]

Well, there's no way I could afford to take CK AND CS. We aren't given enough loan money to do so. So that ain't happening...

Honestly though, if I were you, I'd still contact the programs you're interested in regardless. It would be terrible to eliminate a program you like just because you suspect they have this requirement. Worst case scenario, you contact them, they say they do require it, and you don't apply.