New GI bill

I understand that it'll pay "up to the maximum tuition for the most expensive four year state university in the state you attend school." Does that mean that if I go to CSU to save money I get paid to go to Berkley or UCLA?

Salient said:

Does that mean that if I go to CSU to save money I get paid to go to Berkley or UCLA?

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Not quite. There are 3 components: tuition, living stipend, and book stipend. You get the same stipend amount but the tuition part of the payment goes down to reflect your actual tuition. The living stipend is determined by equivalent BAH for a single E-5 in your school's zip code. Also, the whole thing is prorated based on post-9/11/01 service. For instance, a portion of my contract was pre-9/11 so I will only be eligible for 70% of the maximum rate (which is still larger than the "old" GI Bill that I used for college).

Also noteworthy is the fact that the "new" GI Bill can be used for graduate programs like the old one. That means anyone with remaining entitlement can get some money to help out with med school. Unfortunately I think the tuition portion of the payment maxes out substantially below what a typical med school charges.

This new GI Bill won't take effect until 8/1/2009 but I wouldn't encourage you to delay your education because the opportunity cost of delaying a year is tremendous.

There is more info here: http://www.gibill.va.gov/

Having worked in a financial aid office for several years I would encourage anyone reading this to weigh all options carefully. The GI Bill affects your financial aid and your ability to collect on "free" government money. It's the biggest, steamiest pile of BS I've ever seen but such is life. Your cost of attendance (ie, total financial aid eligibility) goes down dollar for dollar based on what you accept from the GI Bill. I declined a portion of my GI Bill to accept grants and scholarships available only to undergrads at my institution. Nearly all of the free government grant money (pell & state matching grants eg) disappears after a first degree but the GI Bill sticks around for ten years post discharge.

I might as well wait a couple years to start using the GI bill, then. Tuition at CSU is cheap, so if my wife continues working to pay for post-bac I can use the GI bill during medical school to get more out of it.

Salient said:

I might as well wait a couple years to start using the GI bill, then. Tuition at CSU is cheap, so if my wife continues working to pay for post-bac I can use the GI bill during medical school to get more out of it.

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I would wait the one year until the rate goes up for sure if you have someone who can help you. You may not get the best financial aid though if your wife is working but it's rather nice of her to help. Wait longer as long as you're not taking any loans out.

The money in your pocket will be the same regardless of whether you go to Berkley, CSU Chico, or Foothill community college. The only variable is what they pay out for tuition. Your reimbursement when you go to med school will be pegged at the highest state UG rate. I don't know what the difference is between CSU and the faerie kingdom but that's what you're essentially looking at in terms of monetary savings.

I'm so incredibly stoked this got signed. This was the first piece of legislature I've written my congressmen about, and was really surprised when I got a unanimous response of support from each of them.
When this goes into effect, coupled with the increased cap on Stafford loans, it'll basically eliminate my need for private loans.

So how does this affect the Pell Grant, Cal Grant, and GI Bill kicker?

S-Mart said:

So how does this affect the Pell Grant, Cal Grant, and GI Bill kicker?

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It affects your Pell just like the previous GI Bill did: by lowering your financial need. As this is "supposed" to be a full scholarship, you would essentially no longer be eligible for a Pell if you took the whole thing. IE, you would have no remaining need.

Financial aid offices tally up your total cost of attendance based on tuition, fees, transportation, and living expenses for your location. Once they have that number they award out aid to satisfy it. They generally won't award beyond the COA. They have to take into account all sources of aid coming to a student (parental contribution, GI Bill, work income, etc) when they figure how much to give out.

For example, if your cost of attendance is estimated at $17,000 for an academic year, you're eligible for $4300 in Pell money because you made nothing in the prior year, and the GI Bill pays out $15,500 then you can only receive another $1,500 in need based aid. Your Pell award would be lowered to $1500. What I used to do here was ask the veterans office (which I conveniently worked in) to lower the amount of GI Bill money so I could take the full grant. They can lower your enrollment with the VA by 25% increments to free up need. I was a very needy guy in college. I don't know how this will work with the new GI Bill.

Subsidized loans are not subject to this cap if you're a vet due to special regulations. So, if the GI Bill was the reason you ran out of need they will still allow you to take a Stafford loan. This is a special circumstance and financial aid systems will not award this automatically, you have to be persistent and ask. The reason they don't like doing this even though it's legit is because you come up on something called an "overaward report." They audit every student who is getting too much aid frequently. If big brother comes a knockin then they have to justify why every single student on the list is allowed to have too much aid. I think the reasoning was that because the GI Bill comes in monthly installments you may need some up front money for other expenses.

I don't know much about the Cal grant as I've never gone to school here outside of a few CC classes, which I did not use any aid for. If it's need based, then yes it would be affected just like the pell. If it's not need based then you could theoretically collect on it with some finangling at the finaid office.

The enlistment kicker and the $600 buy up thingy--I have no idea. VA hasn't really published anything about these situations yet. You could call them, but they're pretty clueless whenever I've called so I wouldn't hold out for much there.

FYI about veteran financial aid: Always put "0" down as what you expect to receive from the GI Bill when you fill out the FAFSA. This allows you to at least see what aid your institution can provide you with before you collect on the GI Bill. You can go to the financial aid office and speak with a counselor at the beginning of the year to work things out. The reason I say put "0" is because the need based money (except for Pell) runs out pretty friggin fast. You get much less aid if you declare your GI Bill upfront despite the fact that you are eligible for more aid. They say "this guy is taking the GI Bill so we'll not offer him these institutional grants because he won't be able to take them with his GI Bill." Remember, you have the option to take the GI Bill, it's not mandatory.

Just some food for thought ...

You seem very knowledgable on this topic Scotty, so do you mind if I pick your brain for a couple questions?

I am currently using the GI Bill, but will end up falling 2 semesters short as far as a post-bacc is after I finish my UG if I continue to use it all the way through...would it be wiser to scrape up some money to pay for the next 2 semesters for my UG and then let the new terms kick in come Fall '09?

Well I just missed the 36th month mark by about 40 days so I will only be entitled to 90% of the new benefits....currently I am getting paid ~$4000.00 a semester for school while school is only costing me about 2400 a semester. It looks like the new bill isn't paying so much as a flat rate, as is currently used, but is paying EXACTLY what tuition and books cost plus the BAH. If this is the case than even with the extra BAH (depending on the answer to my next question), I may rake in all of another 100 dollars a semester than what I do now and doesn't seem like it may be worth the hassle of stopping and starting the GI Bill AGAIN.



Thanks for the info!

Edit: The website answered my third question

i am using the GI bill currently and have heard of the proposed bill... didn't think it was going to go through (well, not right away anyway--figured they would shift it around a bit). also, i didn't realize it would be retro-active. like, it will apply to those already using it now. if this is the case, you all on this thread have made me very happy. great news indeed!

i guess i should check their website more often!

scottyT said:

The living stipend is determined by equivalent BAH for a single E-5 in your school's zip code.

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Small correction. The stipend is actually based on E-5 WITH dependants.

And for the next year before this actually goes into effect, they have kicked the Montogmery GI Bill payments up to $1321, so MLT2MT2DO, it sounds like you'll be clearing even more than you have been. With that bump in entitlements, you're probably right - you'd likely end up with almost the same amount of in your pocket money, and less paperwork to do in the long run. I don't know if that answered your question, but I hope so!

Charles English said:

i am using the GI bill currently and have heard of the proposed bill... didn't think it was going to go through (well, not right away anyway--figured they would shift it around a bit). also, i didn't realize it would be retro-active. like, it will apply to those already using it now. if this is the case, you all on this thread have made me very happy. great news indeed!

i guess i should check their website more often!

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Sorry, I didn't read this one fully before I did my other post. I have heard the same rumors that the GI Bill is retroactive, but this is a direct quote from the VA website:

Post-9/11 GI Bill benefits are payable for training pursued on or after August 1, 2009. No payments can be made under this program for training pursued before that date.

That's why they increased the current monthly amount to $1321. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but the sooner you hear the better I guess.

I'm at a state univ taking the prereqs (not in a postbacc) and my GI Bill just got cut off because if you don't declare a major within 2 semesters then you are ineligible for the GI Bill. I only have one semester left and wrote VA a big letter last week explaining my story and all the prereqs I have to take and haven't heard back yet. Has anyone else run into this problem??

darmalee said:

...

That's why they increased the current monthly amount to $1321. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but the sooner you hear the better I guess.

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nah, that's cool. It actually makes more sense that way...besides, My GI bill is almost dried up and used. it was fun while it lasted
best deal in town really. and it looks like it will become a great deal for some.

Charles English said:

nah, that's cool. It actually makes more sense that way...besides, My GI bill is almost dried up and used. it was fun while it lasted
best deal in town really. and it looks like it will become a great deal for some.

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Yeah they really have made the GI Bill fantastic. I can't wait to kick mine into action Fall of 09!

Sun Dog said:

... my GI Bill just got cut off because if you don't declare a major within 2 semesters then you are ineligible for the GI Bill ... Has anyone else run into this problem??

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Absolutely, VA does not pay for "just some classes," they pay for a degree. They are pretty explicit about this in their literature. But, you should be able to just declare a major by filling out a 22-1995 with your certifying office. If you can't declare a major at the school (like, you're not officially matriculated) you can usually still declare a major with VA by filling out that form. You may have to speak with your certifying official to let them know how you plan to pursue your educational goals without a university-declared major. Also, VA doesn't care if you keep switching your major around, you just have to have something on the books for them to keep paying you. Pick something that is in line with the classes you're taking and there shouldn't be any problems.

MLT2MT2DO said:

... I may rake in all of another 100 dollars a semester than what I do now and doesn't seem like it may be worth the hassle of stopping and starting the GI Bill AGAIN.

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It looks like you got answers to your other questions before I could get to them but I wanted to address the pain of re-starting the GI Bill. It's really, really simple once you're already in the system. The initial startup takes months but to restart it is only like 2-4 weeks. Stopping it depends on how your local certifying official wants to do it but it should be simple. Don't call VA to stop your entitlement, just talk to your certifying official. When I worked in the financial aid office (as an assistant certifying official) we had vets proactively fill out a form to declare their intended course-load each semester. Stopping it is simply a matter of not filling out the form at the beginning of the semester or filing an amendment with VA mid-semester (done by the C/O, not you).

You'll have to add up the numbers yourself to figure out which is the more profitable option for you but it may be a wash. I added it up for myself and the 70% rate I would get winds up being more profitable than the old GI Bill if I collect on the most expensive state school in CA.

Does anyone know the new rate with the buy-up enabled? I can't find any info on how the kicker is affected by the new rates.

I don't believe the kicker is incorporated into the new system. With a new three-pronged system of 100% tuition/books/living expenses, what reason is there for a random extra lump of cash? I want my $600 back!

Vith said:

Does anyone know the new rate with the buy-up enabled? I can't find any info on how the kicker is affected by the new rates.

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I just read the complete text of HR 5740 (fascinating, FYI) and found this:

(5) TREATMENT OF CONTRIBUTIONS TOWARD
11 BASIC EDUCATIONAL ASSISTANCE.—
12 (A) REFUND OF CONTRIBUTIONS.—Except
13 as provided in subparagraph (B), the Secretary
14 of Veterans Affairs shall pay to each individual
15 making an election under paragraph (1) who is
16 described by clause (i), (iii), or (v) of subpara
17 graph (A) of that paragraph an amount equal
18 to the total amount of contributions made by
19 such individual under subchapter II of chapter
20 30 of title 38, United States Code, for basic
21 educational assistance under that chapter, in
22 cluding any contributions made under sub
23 section (b) or (e) of section 3011 of such title
24 or any contributions made under subsection (c)
25 or (f) of section 3012 of such title.

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subsection (b) of section 3011 stipulates that you have to pay $1200 to opt-in to the GI Bill during your first year of service

subsection (e) is the $600 top-off/buy-up program. check it out: http://www.access.gpo.gov/uscode/title38/partiii_chapter30_subchapterii_.html

It looks like those of us who are enrolled under the Montgomery GI Bill will be getting some money back! It goes on to say that if you already collected on the "old" GI Bill then your refund will be pro-rated to reflect what you've used. EG, if you used 18 months of the 36 then you would get 1/2 of what you paid in return.

I could find nothing pertaining to enlistment incentives though. Anyone who finds something please post here.

I'm wondering more about 2008-2009. I *just* made the last payment on my kicker on this LES, so I'd like to either get something out of it for this upcoming year, or get my money back soon-ish.
Sorry if it's in that link, I'm on duty right now sneaking back to my desk for a min and can't really check it out.

Vith said:

... I'd like to either get something out of it for this upcoming year, or get my money back soon-ish.

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Well, that's a pretty straightforward situation. You will get the $1321 base rate and they'll throw on an extra $150 because of your contribution. When [if] you elect to get the "new" GI Bill in 2009 you'll get a prorated refund for the money you paid into the "old" GI Bill.

see here: http://www.gibill.va.gov/GI_Bill_Info/rates/CH30/ch30rates080108.htm
and here: http://www.gibill.va.gov/GI_Bill_Info/rates/600_buyup.html

Awesome, thanks for your help.

An important question that I think is still ambiguous is will it pay your entitled percentage of in-state medical school tuition. All of the examples in the S22 fact sheet on the VA site deal with undergraduate study, however the bill does allow for graduate and professional studies.

The actual wording in the bill is:
`Sec. 3313. Educational assistance: amount; payment

`(A) An amount equal to the established charges for the program of education, except that the amount payable under this subparagraph may not exceed the maximum amount of established charges regularly charged in-State students for full-time pursuit of programs of education by the public institution of higher education in the State in which the individual is enrolled that has the highest rate of regularly-charged established charges for programs of education among all public institutions of higher education in such State.


I am not a lawyer, but it seems like the phrase "program of education" could leave the bill open to pay up to the max of in-state medical program of education costs. Or at least I have my fingers crossed

I noticed the same glaring ambiguity when I reviewed the text of the legislation. I poked around a bit and noticed that VA said they will pay up to the highest undergraduate rate (sorry, don't remember source offhand).

With that though, it certainly is ambiguous. I read it to mean the same way you did ... "a program of education" at a public institution. Medical school should count. However, I don't think you'll be able to exploit this language very much unless you have a small army of lawyers in your backyard.

it's too bad it doesn't transfer to spouses unless you renew your contract

Sun Dog said:

I'm at a state univ taking the prereqs (not in a postbacc) and my GI Bill just got cut off because if you don't declare a major within 2 semesters then you are ineligible for the GI Bill. I only have one semester left and wrote VA a big letter last week explaining my story and all the prereqs I have to take and haven't heard back yet. Has anyone else run into this problem??

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I have a BS, I'm about to start my pre-reqs in the Fall, and I'm not in a post-bacc program either. My community college offers an Associates in Biology (pre-med emphasis). I'm going to go ahead and work towards that AS, since I have two years to kill on my GI Bill anyway.

But couldn't you just declare that you were a Bio major and only take your med-school pre-reqs, since they happen to be required for that major anyway?

darmalee said:

That's why they increased the current monthly amount to $1321. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but the sooner you hear the better I guess.

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Reading over the pdf they have at the VA's website, it says if you are eligible for Chapter 30 benefits (the current GI Bill), then you can elect to receive benefits under the new GI Bill, starting 8/1/09.

Doesn't that mean if you still have time left on your GI Bill, starting August '09, you can switch to the new deal?

pr33st said:

Reading over the pdf they have at the VA's website, it says if you are eligible for Chapter 30 benefits (the current GI Bill), then you can elect to receive benefits under the new GI Bill, starting 8/1/09.

Doesn't that mean if you still have time left on your GI Bill, starting August '09, you can switch to the new deal?

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Absolutely. Starting August 09 you'll have the option to switch over, but you won't have to. For most people though, switching is going to be the better option.

4thelonghaul said:

They would match tuition at the grad/prof level for the highest in state rate of the state where I would be attending.

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Still ambiguous... Yes, but it leaves some hope that they will pay grad/prof level in state tuition, for a grad/prof level program. I am still crossing my fingers.

When the new GI Bill was still being debated, I somehow got the notion that it would remove the barrier of state residency for veterans. But I just read the FAQ on the official VA website and I read this line:
The Post-9/11 GI Bill will pay up to the most expensive in-state tuition and fees at a public institution of higher learning in the veteran's state, but you can still attend any approved school. In instances where the benefit level does not cover the cost of established charges, VA and the educational institution may enter into an agreement to cover the unmet expenses under the "Yellow Ribbon Program."

It makes it sound like I still have to attend a college in the state from which I enlisted if I want to be eligible for in-state tuition. Is that true?

marukome said:

...It makes it sound like I still have to attend a college in the state from which I enlisted if I want to be eligible for in-state tuition. Is that true?

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The new GI Bill will not affect your residency at all. You will have to pay out of state rates if you go somewhere you're not a resident of. This is not to say that you can't establish residency elsewhere while you are active duty; it all depends on the individual states rules. I had a friend who got a driver license and paid CO taxes for four years hoping to get residency there when he was discharged. Much to his dismay he found out that CO requires 365 days of physical presence to establish residency. Check with the state you are interested in, some are very difficult to become a resident for tuition. The GI Bill won't matter a whit with all states I'm familiar with.

Active servicemembers, BTW, are residents for tuition in any state where they are stationed regardless of how long they've been there or where they claim as home of record. This benefit usually disappears upon discharge.

pr33st said:

I have a BS, I'm about to start my pre-reqs in the Fall, and I'm not in a post-bacc program either. My community college offers an Associates in Biology (pre-med emphasis). I'm going to go ahead and work towards that AS, since I have two years to kill on my GI Bill anyway.

But couldn't you just declare that you were a Bio major and only take your med-school pre-reqs, since they happen to be required for that major anyway?

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I hate to be the one to break this to you but...

I called the VA office and they said that if you already have a B.S. you have to be seeking the next step in higher education (ie. a Masters degree). I had the same idea as you, I was going to shut off my GI Bill for my last year of UG so I could then reactive it during my one year Post-Bacc. I was told unless those classes go towards a specific Masters that I would be seeking then the GI Bill would not cover it.

I have debated whether to finish all classes except one for my B.S. then transfer over to declare my UG as BIO and take the required Post-Bacc. In the end I would be gambling a years worth of my current G.I. Bill, not to mention I don't really want to be "the guy who works the system". And unfortunately I don't have any I.S. SMP programs. In the end it is a nice change and I wish I could have benefitted from it, but I'm not too disappointed with my current G.I. Bill since public UG schools in my state are relatively cheap.

MLT2MT2DO said:

I hate to be the one to break this to you but...

I called the VA office and they said that if you already have a B.S. you have to be seeking the next step in higher education (ie. a Masters degree). I had the same idea as you, I was going to shut off my GI Bill for my last year of UG so I could then reactive it during my one year Post-Bacc. I was told unless those classes go towards a specific Masters that I would be seeking then the GI Bill would not cover it.

I have debated whether to finish all classes except one for my B.S. then transfer over to declare my UG as BIO and take the required Post-Bacc. In the end I would be gambling a years worth of my current G.I. Bill, not to mention I don't really want to be "the guy who works the system". And unfortunately I don't have any I.S. SMP programs. In the end it is a nice change and I wish I could have benefitted from it, but I'm not too disappointed with my current G.I. Bill since public UG schools in my state are relatively cheap.

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That's odd, because I get the following from this link: http://www.gibill.va.gov/GI_Bill_Info/programs.htm#IHL

The GI Bill can pay you for more than one degree, for example: it will pay you for a degree in Business and then for a second degree in Computer Science, or for an AA, BA, MA in the same field. Once you have a degree, you could pursue another one provided you have remaining entitlement on your GI Bill.

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It doesn't explicitly say that you can't get two at the same academic level, but by leaving that out while comparing two different fields it seems to imply that it's not a problem.

I also just got the following replies to my questions about paying for graduate school (summary: stay tuned):

At this time we are only able to provide general information about the new GI Bill. The new Post-9/11 GI Bill will pay tuition to the school (for VA-approved programs) up to the amount of the most expensive in-state public institution. We do not yet have information specifying if this includes graduate programs. This information will be forthcoming.

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And refunds on the buy-in/kicker:

The $1,200.00 contribution and the $600 kickers were paid into chapter 30, the Montgomery GI Bill. The remaining months of entitlement you have remaining under chapter 30 on August 1, 2009 can be converted to the new chapter 33, Post 9/11 GI Bill on, or after, that date.

Any kickers and college funds a veteran has converted from chapter 30 to the new chapter 33 will be paid on the Basic Housing Allowance. Once the veterans education entitlement exhausts, and remaining funds in the $1,200 contribution, $600.00 buy-up, and/or college fund will be dispersed to the veteran on the last BAH payment.

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Salient said:

...It doesn't explicitly say that you can't get two at the same academic level, but by leaving that out while comparing two different fields it seems to imply that it's not a problem.

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That's good information, thanks Salient. I sure hope they wind up paying full tuition for med school ... but I'm not going to hold out for anything.

As far as going for 2nd bachelors, I used to certify vets all the time who were working on another degree at the same level. I think whoever you talked to may not have understood you correctly. Either that or we were doing it wrong all along at my university. You should be able to fill out the change of program form with the VA and declare that your goal is to get an MD/DO degree. You can talk with the certifying official and the VA if necessary but they absolutely should allow this as it's a "higher" degree. They may require you to show documentation that your classes are indeed prerequisites, which shouldn't be too hard to do.

It pisses me off that someone would have told you they won't pay for another degree in the first place. The goal of the GI Bill, your educational entitlement, is to help you get where you want to be professionally. Although you may have to talk to a certifying official and the VA, there is no reason I can possibly think of why they wouldn't allow a post-bacc as long as you declare your "goal" as MD/DO on the form (which you can amend at any time).

If they keep giving you the run around contact your congressman (or senator) and express the concerns I've outlined. You're a veteran, you want to become a doctor, and the VA is making you play "mommy please" with your entitlement. Legislators are amazingly responsive to veterans' issues; most even keep a veteran adviser/advocate on staff. Trust me, if a legislator starts breathing down their throat about why they are hindering your goals they'll buckle.

scottyT said:

That's good information, thanks Salient. I sure hope they wind up paying full tuition for med school ... but I'm not going to hold out for anything.

As far as going for 2nd bachelors, I used to certify vets all the time who were working on another degree at the same level. I think whoever you talked to may not have understood you correctly. Either that or we were doing it wrong all along at my university. You should be able to fill out the change of program form with the VA and declare that your goal is to get an MD/DO degree. You can talk with the certifying official and the VA if necessary but they absolutely should allow this as it's a "higher" degree. They may require you to show documentation that your classes are indeed prerequisites, which shouldn't be too hard to do.

It pisses me off that someone would have told you they won't pay for another degree in the first place. The goal of the GI Bill, your educational entitlement, is to help you get where you want to be professionally. Although you may have to talk to a certifying official and the VA, there is no reason I can possibly think of why they wouldn't allow a post-bacc as long as you declare your "goal" as MD/DO on the form (which you can amend at any time).

If they keep giving you the run around contact your congressman (or senator) and express the concerns I've outlined. You're a veteran, you want to become a doctor, and the VA is making you play "mommy please" with your entitlement. Legislators are amazingly responsive to veterans' issues; most even keep a veteran adviser/advocate on staff. Trust me, if a legislator starts breathing down their throat about why they are hindering your goals they'll buckle.

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Thank you for the response and correcting the guy. He just said it so "matter of factly" I never bothered to question whether he knew what he was talking about. At the college I intend on taking the post-bacc for I am required to designate my field of study, which I have as "pre-med" (they do offer a pre-med degree), which is totally seperate from a CLS degree.
I believe I spoke very clearly, so I'm not sure how he would have misunderstood me. I will talk to the certifying official at the school I plan on taking my post-bacc. My journey with the G.I. Bill may not be over yet...

Thank you very much, both of you!

If one signed up for the previous version of the GI Bill, would this new one trump that or would I still be under the older one?

Also, could you transfer it to relatives? I heard you could.. DO you get any living expenses paid to you while using it?

According to the VA website, as long you served for 36 months following 9/11, you qualify to elect to receive benefits under the new Bill.

So, you can use your Ch. 30 benefits right now and then, in August of 2009, elect to use the new Bill. You don't have to, but you have the choice.

pr33st said:

According to the VA website, as long you served for 36 months following 9/11, you qualify to elect to receive benefits under the new Bill.

So, you can use your Ch. 30 benefits right now and then, in August of 2009, elect to use the new Bill. You don't have to, but you have the choice.

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hmm the previous Bill was 24 months... Not sure if I'll be doing 3yrs... So basically I could still do that one if I wanted then?

If you end up serving less than 36 months post-9/11, you get a pro-rated benefit amount.

If you want to use your previous benefit, you can.

pr33st said:

If you end up serving less than 36 months post-9/11, you get a pro-rated benefit amount.

If you want to use your previous benefit, you can.

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Thanks. This is probably the best piece of legislation to come out of Congress in years...

Does anyone know what the deal is if you had a ROTC scholarship? I wasn't eligible for the old GI Bill, but understand I am for the new one. However, I heard that I actually had to serve 4 + 3 years to get the full benefit, not just 3. I haven't been able to find that in writing, and I'm getting out right now at the 6 year mark.
Thanks!

mcclesm, our VA Rep told us that he had no answer to that question yet. Maybe your's would have a better answer.

mcclesm said:

Does anyone know what the deal is if you had a ROTC scholarship? I wasn't eligible for the old GI Bill, but understand I am for the new one. However, I heard that I actually had to serve 4 + 3 years to get the full benefit, not just 3. I haven't been able to find that in writing, and I'm getting out right now at the 6 year mark.
Thanks!

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According to this you can be eligible if you serve an extra 3 years on top of your ROTC commitment. Of course, that webpage isn't official so you may want to peruse the legislation text to find it in writing.

For instance, I have say 90 college units before entering the military almost four years ago. I will ETS (get out) just as immediately as possible, after this deployment in OIF 07-09, in January '09.

I want to maximize the benefits available. Would I only get two years out of the NEW GI Bill considering I would be attending full-time and have two years [give or take] to completion of Bachelor's? Or, would I be able to potentially pay for at least a year of graduate school or more? What if I don't get accepted into graduate school automatically, or go to work right away, and there is a break between using benefits? Do they exhaust at some point? Perhaps up until your entitlement is covered?

omnifutuant said:

For instance, I have say 90 college units before entering the military almost four years ago. I will ETS (get out) just as immediately as possible, after this deployment in OIF 07-09, in January '09.

I want to maximize the benefits available. Would I only get two years out of the NEW GI Bill considering I would be attending full-time and have two years [give or take] to completion of Bachelor's? Or, would I be able to potentially pay for at least a year of graduate school or more? What if I don't get accepted into graduate school automatically, or go to work right away, and there is a break between using benefits? Do they exhaust at some point? Perhaps up until your entitlement is covered?

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You will get 36 months of full-time training out of the GI Bill regardless of how many credits you had before. They won't pay for you to re-take classes over and over unless you failed them the first time around or need a higher grade for some reason (med school pre-req, eg). The GI Bill absolutely works for graduate and professional degrees so you can keep using it right through. They will pay for virtually anything that is accredited.

As a quick aside, R. Lee Ermey, the senior drill instructor from full metal jacket and the guy on mail call, used the GI Bill to attend acting school in the Phillipines after he was medically discharged from the Corps. I met him at my Marine Corps Birthday Ball when I was at MCRD and he's very, very cool. He'd probably be the saltiest SOB alive if he had stayed in until retirement.

You will be able to save your remaining entitlement for graduate/professional school when you finish your undergrad. So, for example, if you take 2 academic years (18 months of GI Bill) to finish your undergrad then you have 2 academic years (18 months) left for future endeavors.

The GI Bill allows you to break up your training however you like. I'm taking several years off between undergrad and med school and my GI Bill is just sitting there waiting for me. It's like an account with 36 months in it. You withdraw whatever you like and it doesn't dry up until you hit the 36 month limit. They measure everything in months instead of dollars so that you get the added benefit whenever congress increases the amount.

The old one used to have a time limit of 10 years post-discharge to use it. I believe there is no expiration on the new one (pretty sure, but not 100%).

scottyT said:

You will get 36 months of full-time training out of the GI Bill regardless of how many credits you had before. They won't pay for you to re-take classes over and over unless you failed them the first time around or need a higher grade for some reason (med school pre-req, eg). The GI Bill absolutely works for graduate and professional degrees so you can keep using it right through. They will pay for virtually anything that is accredited.

As a quick aside, R. Lee Ermey, the senior drill instructor from full metal jacket and the guy on mail call, used the GI Bill to attend acting school in the Phillipines after he was medically discharged from the Corps. I met him at my Marine Corps Birthday Ball when I was at MCRD and he's very, very cool. He'd probably be the saltiest SOB alive if he had stayed in until retirement.

You will be able to save your remaining entitlement for graduate/professional school when you finish your undergrad. So, for example, if you take 2 academic years (18 months of GI Bill) to finish your undergrad then you have 2 academic years (18 months) left for future endeavors.

The GI Bill allows you to break up your training however you like. I'm taking several years off between undergrad and med school and my GI Bill is just sitting there waiting for me. It's like an account with 36 months in it. You withdraw whatever you like and it doesn't dry up until you hit the 36 month limit. They measure everything in months instead of dollars so that you get the added benefit whenever congress increases the amount.

The old one used to have a time limit of 10 years post-discharge to use it. I believe there is no expiration on the new one (pretty sure, but not 100%).

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How much of a graduate degree is this new bill going to cover? Because if I could pay for medical school with the GI Bill I'd way rather get into debt paying for undergrad degree...or will it pay the same amount (cost of undergrad instate tuition) to graduate school and I would still have to cover the rest?

darmalee said:

How much of a graduate degree is this new bill going to cover? Because if I could pay for medical school with the GI Bill I'd way rather get into debt paying for undergrad degree...or will it pay the same amount (cost of undergrad instate tuition) to graduate school and I would still have to cover the rest?

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That's the $1,000,000 question. We just don't know. The VA website alludes to paying the whole cost of medical tuition, up to the in-state tuition rate, that is.

Here is the link:

Approved training under the Post-9/11 GI Bill includes graduate and undergraduate degrees...

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and again here:

What exactly will I receive?

You or your school will receive a percentage, as determined by length of active duty service, of the following:

* Amount of tuition and fees charged, not to exceed the most expensive in-State public institution of higher education...

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There is some more information above under post #24 from the legislation itself.

I read an internal document that stated the new GI Bill would only pay up to the highest "undergraduate" rate. The website is ambiguous and I've lost faith in the people that answer the phones many years ago. I think the ambiguity means it will be up to the VA to interpret the legislation. Although the program's funding is already approved, it will likely fall short of being able to cover our med school expenses so I'm betting on an "undergraduate rate" entitlement.