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* *2009-2010 "What Are My Chances/Where Should I Apply/What Should I Do" * *
- Thread starter kj22
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You should do well in biochem and anatomy.
I think most schools (correct me if I'm wrong) require a C or higher in your pre-requisites. But that doesn't mean that the schools won't give a second look to your grades in the pre-requisites. They will definitely wonder why, even after a retake, you only managed to score Cs in pre-requisites. This is a HUGE red flag on your application.
You need to take some time and re-evaluate your study habits. Why are you doing so bad? I see that in labs you're doing fine. But what is it about the lecture that you're messing up? Find a tutor, go to your professor for help, buy additional books if you aren't understanding something, ask here at SDN, etc. anything. Figure out your weaknesses and work on them!
If I remember correctly, AACOMAS lets you enter more than 1 retake (I'm not sure how many maximum you can enter though) so you still have a chance. But before you think about applying, schedule to retake all of the classes that you got Cs in. That's right, every single one of those pre-requisites that you got Cs in. Obviously this means that you will not be applying for 2010 cycle.
I'd also suggest that you take Organic/Biochem/Anatomy and get As in them, and then apply. Your academic history suggests lack of work ethic which can be improved by retaking the pre-requisites in which you got Cs and by getting Bs/As in Organic/Biochem/Anatomy. Not to mention scoring around 30 on your MCAT.
You are not out of the game. I hope I've been thorough in my explanation on how to improve. By all means, seek out a pre-med advisor at your school or talk to admissions member at some of the medical schools you're thinking about and talk to them. But don't give up. We all make mistakes and screw up, but you are not out of the game.
Well be prepared to explain those Cs in upper division biochem classes. You should calculate your sci GPA (i think there is a spreadsheet in one of those stickies in this forum) and figure out what it is, and then figure out what it will be once you retake Gen Chem and Organic.
You should submit the AACOMAS the first day it opens (June 1) since it takes 4-6 weeks for verification and for the schools to receive it. Apply early and broadly. Work on your PS and make it stellar! There is a PS reader list in this forum where you can find people who will revise your PS (I'm one of those).
Some schools require a DO letter so I think you should get one. But for some reason, if you can't get one, then a MD letter will be fine.
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Hello everyone, can anyone give me an idea of what my chances might be or what schools I should apply? My top choice is Nova. I'm a biology major. Thanks! 🙂
cGPA: 3.53 (I have 3 W's)
sGPA: ~3.2 (got mostly B and B+, some A's, and one C+ in freshman bio)
-Work full-time at a deli with mom
-Shadowed both M.D. + D.O. = over 50+ hours.
-Volunteer in the E.R. = 50+ hours
-Founder and president of a student charity organization for wounded soldeirs and veterans
-Rescue neglected animals
-Church choir
-Volunteer to teach kids play piano
-My personal statement is full of great life experiences
-I'm Asian and came from underpriveleged families.
-And I'm going to get positive recommendation letters from two science professors, and a doctor.
cGPA: 3.53 (I have 3 W's)
sGPA: ~3.2 (got mostly B and B+, some A's, and one C+ in freshman bio)
-Work full-time at a deli with mom
-Shadowed both M.D. + D.O. = over 50+ hours.
-Volunteer in the E.R. = 50+ hours
-Founder and president of a student charity organization for wounded soldeirs and veterans
-Rescue neglected animals
-Church choir
-Volunteer to teach kids play piano
-My personal statement is full of great life experiences
-I'm Asian and came from underpriveleged families.
-And I'm going to get positive recommendation letters from two science professors, and a doctor.
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Your sciGPA is a bit low from the average (I don't know what Nova's average is but national average is 3.35 I believe). But you shouldn't start sweating yet because your ECs look great and clinical experience is great too.
Have you taken the MCAT yet? If not, then what are your practice scores? AAMC practice scores are generally a good indicator of what you might get on the real deal.
I think Nova requires a DO letter so make sure that you get a rec letter from a DO.
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So this is my second year applying for medical school, but first year applying to DO schools (I found out wayyy too late that I really like osteopathic medicine).
Stats:
28Q MCAT (8PS, 10VR, 10BS)
3.52 overall gpa
3.3 science gpa (Major weak point in my application, but I have an A in biochem right now, so hopefully it will be a bit higher)
Psych major, 3.7+ psych gpa
EC's:
Varsity Swimming, Research for Mayo (pharmacogenomics), Volunteer mentor for developmentally delayed high school students, leadership positions in sorority and psych honor society, Psych research (developmental/cognitive), Volunteer in ER (just one summer), Women's Advocate Intern at domestic violence shelter.
Shadow:
Ortho/neuro surgery (MD) and family medicine (DO). I am planning on shadowing more specialties (OB/GYN, internist, pathology) during the next year (I am graduating in May). I also will probably be working in a physical therapy office.
I visited DMU over spring break and LOVED it. I have a LOR from an alum, so that might help. However, I'm having trouble sorting through the rest of the schools based on their websites. I guess I just want to know if my stats/resume are competitive enough, and what other schools might be a good fit based on my stats, and any other suggestions for my gap year.
Good luck to everyone that is waiting to hear back from schools or taking the MCAT this spring!
Stats:
28Q MCAT (8PS, 10VR, 10BS)
3.52 overall gpa
3.3 science gpa (Major weak point in my application, but I have an A in biochem right now, so hopefully it will be a bit higher)
Psych major, 3.7+ psych gpa
EC's:
Varsity Swimming, Research for Mayo (pharmacogenomics), Volunteer mentor for developmentally delayed high school students, leadership positions in sorority and psych honor society, Psych research (developmental/cognitive), Volunteer in ER (just one summer), Women's Advocate Intern at domestic violence shelter.
Shadow:
Ortho/neuro surgery (MD) and family medicine (DO). I am planning on shadowing more specialties (OB/GYN, internist, pathology) during the next year (I am graduating in May). I also will probably be working in a physical therapy office.
I visited DMU over spring break and LOVED it. I have a LOR from an alum, so that might help. However, I'm having trouble sorting through the rest of the schools based on their websites. I guess I just want to know if my stats/resume are competitive enough, and what other schools might be a good fit based on my stats, and any other suggestions for my gap year.
Good luck to everyone that is waiting to hear back from schools or taking the MCAT this spring!
I'm a slightly non-traditional student (graduated non-science, then immediately began post bac science courses), with an undergrad in communication from a highly-ranked liberal arts school.
cGPA: 3.75
Post bac premed sciences were done in succession at a state university.
sGPA: 3.54
Clinical experience includes 2 summers working in surgery and med/surg ICU at a level 1 trauma hospital, 1 year working as an RA in an assisted living facility, and 3 years working as an office assistant in a medical office (if that counts at all...). I've also done about 250 hrs of shadowing both DOs and MDs (with LORs to boot), and my dad (a DO) is on the OUCOM faculty as a physician affiliated with the CORE.
So here's the question-- I'm scheduled to take the MCAT at the end of may, but with the stresses of end of the semester upon me, I really will only get about 2.5 weeks to focus on studying for it exclusively. I have taken a Kaplan course, and my practice tests have been in the mid 20s, but I think with some time to devote just to MCAT studying I could likely crack 30. Part of me wants to just study my ass off for those 2 weeks and hope for the best at the end of May knowing I can retake it in August if need be... and another part of me thinks I should just wait until August since I know for certain I'll be ready to kick ass by then. I'm most interested in osteopathic programs, and OUCOM is my top pick, but I'm applying to all of the schools in Ohio (the rest are allopathic), so would still like to be competitive there. Any thoughts?
cGPA: 3.75
Post bac premed sciences were done in succession at a state university.
sGPA: 3.54
Clinical experience includes 2 summers working in surgery and med/surg ICU at a level 1 trauma hospital, 1 year working as an RA in an assisted living facility, and 3 years working as an office assistant in a medical office (if that counts at all...). I've also done about 250 hrs of shadowing both DOs and MDs (with LORs to boot), and my dad (a DO) is on the OUCOM faculty as a physician affiliated with the CORE.
So here's the question-- I'm scheduled to take the MCAT at the end of may, but with the stresses of end of the semester upon me, I really will only get about 2.5 weeks to focus on studying for it exclusively. I have taken a Kaplan course, and my practice tests have been in the mid 20s, but I think with some time to devote just to MCAT studying I could likely crack 30. Part of me wants to just study my ass off for those 2 weeks and hope for the best at the end of May knowing I can retake it in August if need be... and another part of me thinks I should just wait until August since I know for certain I'll be ready to kick ass by then. I'm most interested in osteopathic programs, and OUCOM is my top pick, but I'm applying to all of the schools in Ohio (the rest are allopathic), so would still like to be competitive there. Any thoughts?
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hello everyone ,
I was wondering if I could gain some insight into where I stand as a applicant in a year. I will be a fifth year senior next year in the fall. I currently have a 3.4 gpa and a bit higher regular gpa. I kno i need to get a great MCAT score and raise my gpa a little. I was told to get at least a 28 for allopathic schools. I was in the military for 3 years the infantry to be precise. Upon geting accepted to med school I want to reenter the military with a HPSP scholarship. here is my deliemma. I have changed my major a few times which has set me back. due to a few things, transfering schools once. major was exercise physiology/ pre med. got hurt in the army and switched to a school that only had biological sciences. Then said hey a nursing degree would put me into the medical feild already with some knowledge . After about of year of getting A's in all nursing classes realized that the thought process and generally some of the views of nursing did not fit the "Doctor " mentality at all. and realiZed I would still have to take all the pre reqs. Thus after talking to my advisor I withdrew from all nursing classes becasue she said they would not count towards graduation credits and went back to biological sciences/ excercise biology. extra curriculars.+ work 45 hours a week(non medical field), undergraduate teaching assistant for anatomy/ physiology, several missions in the army including Iraq and louisana for hurricane Katrina . Still going to get vol and research.
So my questions are:
1.)Are the 5 withdraws going to drastically hurt my chances of entering medical school.
2.) I am gong to apply to medical school at my school MD (wright state university) but also apply at several DO schools as well........thought and comments appreciated.
thank you everyone for comments / opinions
I was wondering if I could gain some insight into where I stand as a applicant in a year. I will be a fifth year senior next year in the fall. I currently have a 3.4 gpa and a bit higher regular gpa. I kno i need to get a great MCAT score and raise my gpa a little. I was told to get at least a 28 for allopathic schools. I was in the military for 3 years the infantry to be precise. Upon geting accepted to med school I want to reenter the military with a HPSP scholarship. here is my deliemma. I have changed my major a few times which has set me back. due to a few things, transfering schools once. major was exercise physiology/ pre med. got hurt in the army and switched to a school that only had biological sciences. Then said hey a nursing degree would put me into the medical feild already with some knowledge . After about of year of getting A's in all nursing classes realized that the thought process and generally some of the views of nursing did not fit the "Doctor " mentality at all. and realiZed I would still have to take all the pre reqs. Thus after talking to my advisor I withdrew from all nursing classes becasue she said they would not count towards graduation credits and went back to biological sciences/ excercise biology. extra curriculars.+ work 45 hours a week(non medical field), undergraduate teaching assistant for anatomy/ physiology, several missions in the army including Iraq and louisana for hurricane Katrina . Still going to get vol and research.
So my questions are:
1.)Are the 5 withdraws going to drastically hurt my chances of entering medical school.
2.) I am gong to apply to medical school at my school MD (wright state university) but also apply at several DO schools as well........thought and comments appreciated.
thank you everyone for comments / opinions
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Moving to the "What are my Chances" thread.
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Anita 817,
I'm a slightly non-traditional student (graduated non-science, then immediately began post bac science courses), with an undergrad in communication from a highly-ranked liberal arts school.
cGPA: 3.75
Post bac premed sciences were done in succession at a state university.
sGPA: 3.54
Clinical experience includes 2 summers working in surgery and med/surg ICU at a level 1 trauma hospital, 1 year working as an RA in an assisted living facility, and 3 years working as an office assistant in a medical office (if that counts at all...). I've also done about 250 hrs of shadowing both DOs and MDs (with LORs to boot), and my dad (a DO) is on the OUCOM faculty as a physician affiliated with the CORE.
So here's the question-- I'm scheduled to take the MCAT at the end of may, but with the stresses of end of the semester upon me, I really will only get about 2.5 weeks to focus on studying for it exclusively. I have taken a Kaplan course, and my practice tests have been in the mid 20s, but I think with some time to devote just to MCAT studying I could likely crack 30. Part of me wants to just study my ass off for those 2 weeks and hope for the best at the end of May knowing I can retake it in August if need be... and another part of me thinks I should just wait until August since I know for certain I'll be ready to kick ass by then. I'm most interested in osteopathic programs, and OUCOM is my top pick, but I'm applying to all of the schools in Ohio (the rest are allopathic), so would still like to be competitive there. Any thoughts?
In my opinion I think that if used wisely those two weeks have a decent chance of yielding a 29+ on the MCAT. That with your GPA's should be pretty good numbers wise. It sounds like you have decent clinical experience, but are they meaningful? Did you learn anything about yourself and medicine from them? These are things that you are going to need to expand upon during your secondaries and interviews. If you can then you should be fine. Good Luck.
I'm a slightly non-traditional student (graduated non-science, then immediately began post bac science courses), with an undergrad in communication from a highly-ranked liberal arts school.
cGPA: 3.75
Post bac premed sciences were done in succession at a state university.
sGPA: 3.54
Clinical experience includes 2 summers working in surgery and med/surg ICU at a level 1 trauma hospital, 1 year working as an RA in an assisted living facility, and 3 years working as an office assistant in a medical office (if that counts at all...). I've also done about 250 hrs of shadowing both DOs and MDs (with LORs to boot), and my dad (a DO) is on the OUCOM faculty as a physician affiliated with the CORE.
So here's the question-- I'm scheduled to take the MCAT at the end of may, but with the stresses of end of the semester upon me, I really will only get about 2.5 weeks to focus on studying for it exclusively. I have taken a Kaplan course, and my practice tests have been in the mid 20s, but I think with some time to devote just to MCAT studying I could likely crack 30. Part of me wants to just study my ass off for those 2 weeks and hope for the best at the end of May knowing I can retake it in August if need be... and another part of me thinks I should just wait until August since I know for certain I'll be ready to kick ass by then. I'm most interested in osteopathic programs, and OUCOM is my top pick, but I'm applying to all of the schools in Ohio (the rest are allopathic), so would still like to be competitive there. Any thoughts?
In my opinion I think that if used wisely those two weeks have a decent chance of yielding a 29+ on the MCAT. That with your GPA's should be pretty good numbers wise. It sounds like you have decent clinical experience, but are they meaningful? Did you learn anything about yourself and medicine from them? These are things that you are going to need to expand upon during your secondaries and interviews. If you can then you should be fine. Good Luck.
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I am obviously not an admissions committee member but I will try to answer your questions.
I would venture to say that since those W's were all in one semester because of changing majors it shouldn't be a big deal. I had four W's from the semester I went to Iraq and it only came up once. After explanation it was understood.
28 might be the minimum for MD schools, but I would think you should still shoot higher. Have you had any kind of clinical experiences besides the nursing major? Volunteering? Shadowing? These things seemed huge after the initial application stage. They helped me in many ways to exemplify my reasoning for being a physician.
I hope this helps, good luck.
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If you go to AACOM website, you can find a pdf file called "College Information Book" which lists all DO schools and includes a profile on the schools including what courses they require and the admission stats. That'd be a great place to start.
You need to be more well-rounded. Your ECs are great but I don't see a lot of non-clinical stuff. Look into doing non-clinical ECs along with doing some more shadowing for your year off. Once accpetances start rolling in, you'll probably want to just relax anyway.
Study your ass off for the May. If you don't do as well, then sign up for August. But make sure that on your re-take, you do better. Doing just the same or worse on re-take turns into a huge red flag.
Your stats look fine though for both OUCOM and MD schools. Plus having your father on the faculty at a med school is definite gold star on your application.
1) As long as you explain the withdrawals, you'll be fine.
2) Your stats are competitive for most DO schools but not for MD schools. I don't know how Wright State statistics are, but you need to get MCAT 32+ for a chance at MD schools. You should also do some shadowing to improve your application.
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Many people get into MD schools without a 32 MCAT. The average for accepted MD students is only a 30, which means that just as many people score under 30 as those who score over 30. And keep in mind that means for every 35, there's a 28 and then some.
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concur
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Hello, as a new member to this site (and the pre-medical studies), I have a few questions. 🙂
I have been attending a community college for one semester (to take care of my basic studies). So far, I have a 4.0 GPA. After completing two years there, I am going to transfer to a university where I will take all of my medical pre-requisites. Do you think this will hurt my chance at medical school acceptance?
I have really been looking at DO schools (nothing against anyone), primarily because my family physician is a DO and I have seen, first hand, the awesome results of OMM.
Last week, I had the pleasure of visiting the West Virginia School of Osteopathic Medicine in Lewisburg. It's really hard to describe the feeling, but that place just felt like a warm and inviting school (I have visited several medical schools so far). I really love their Problem Based Learning Track, and truly think that I would benefit from such an approach. Additionally, I was wanting to enter primary care/family practice, which is one of WVSOM's focal points!
That being said, I realize that I will have some challenges ahead of me.
1) My Dad was laid off from the Coal mine my senior year in HS. I quit HS that year to get a job (as an EMT) and help support my family.
2) Math isn't one of my strongest subjects. However, knowing that, I am reading as many "algebra for dummies" books as possible. 😛 Before I finish my degree at the CC, I am taking several increasingly difficult college level math courses.
Other than that, I think that as long as I continue to give it my best I will be fine. With some real effort, and a bit of dumb luck, I will hopefully make one hell of a doctor some day! 👍
I have been attending a community college for one semester (to take care of my basic studies). So far, I have a 4.0 GPA. After completing two years there, I am going to transfer to a university where I will take all of my medical pre-requisites. Do you think this will hurt my chance at medical school acceptance?
I have really been looking at DO schools (nothing against anyone), primarily because my family physician is a DO and I have seen, first hand, the awesome results of OMM.
Last week, I had the pleasure of visiting the West Virginia School of Osteopathic Medicine in Lewisburg. It's really hard to describe the feeling, but that place just felt like a warm and inviting school (I have visited several medical schools so far). I really love their Problem Based Learning Track, and truly think that I would benefit from such an approach. Additionally, I was wanting to enter primary care/family practice, which is one of WVSOM's focal points!
That being said, I realize that I will have some challenges ahead of me.
1) My Dad was laid off from the Coal mine my senior year in HS. I quit HS that year to get a job (as an EMT) and help support my family.
2) Math isn't one of my strongest subjects. However, knowing that, I am reading as many "algebra for dummies" books as possible. 😛 Before I finish my degree at the CC, I am taking several increasingly difficult college level math courses.
Other than that, I think that as long as I continue to give it my best I will be fine. With some real effort, and a bit of dumb luck, I will hopefully make one hell of a doctor some day! 👍
So far i have been on a good upward trend and I was curious what you guys would think about the classes/load I have taken. I am a graduating senior and am a little concerned about one class. This semester(bieng my final one) I wanted to retake some classes that I got bad grades in and also take other upper level biology courses to show that i can handle the workload. The thing is, I have taken all of my chems and in chem 1 I received a C- I am retaking the class and now it looks like im not gonna pull an A just a B. which sucks because I wouldnt have taken it if i only increased my grade to a B. but here is how my semester is looking.
chem 1 first grade=C- after this semester probly a B( i have one exam if I ace it its gonna be B+, A- borderline)
Physics II = D after this semester def. an A. she drops the lowest test, i have one left and there all A's
Medical Botany(3000K)=A
preperation for tropical marine bio=B (1 credit seminar)
prep for research = B (another 1 credit seminar)
other nonscience classes
History of Rock Music=A
summary
Chem I=B
Physics II=A
Medical Botany=A
Prep for research B (1 credit)
prep for tropical marine bio=B (1 credit)
History of Rock Music=B
just worried that going from a C- to a B in chem 1 will not look good. even tho im going from a D to a A in physics II
chem 1 first grade=C- after this semester probly a B( i have one exam if I ace it its gonna be B+, A- borderline)
Physics II = D after this semester def. an A. she drops the lowest test, i have one left and there all A's
Medical Botany(3000K)=A
preperation for tropical marine bio=B (1 credit seminar)
prep for research = B (another 1 credit seminar)
other nonscience classes
History of Rock Music=A
summary
Chem I=B
Physics II=A
Medical Botany=A
Prep for research B (1 credit)
prep for tropical marine bio=B (1 credit)
History of Rock Music=B
just worried that going from a C- to a B in chem 1 will not look good. even tho im going from a D to a A in physics II
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Umm what was your question? The chemistry class? You brought it up over a letter grade, almost two which is good in my book. Even though you didn't get an A at least you didn't do worse. I don't know what else to say.
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Well, the point is you got the grade that you got, not a whole lot you can do about it. And no one here is going to be able to tell you how a B instead of an A there is going to effect you..... just too many factors to take into account. Kinda like asking if getting a 29 on the MCAT will hurt you instead of a 28. Of course 29 will always be better, so will the A, but it's pretty much impossible to say how it will impact you.
There is no magic formula or "recipe" to match when applying..... just do the best YOU can do in class, on the MCAT, and become involved in activities that you are interested in (volunteer activities, shadowing) that will help YOU determine if medicine is what you want. It's only getting more competitive with more people applying and there's a healthy portion of the process that's just "luck" with soo many people having very similar stats.
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I posted this in the DO section too, so forgive me if this is redundant. Just wanted to get feedback from a variety of groups.
Hey. I applied last year for MD. I applied to many schools, but I pretty much got rejected everywhere, got one waitlist. Still waiting to hear on that one... probably not looking good. I have a 3.4 GPA and a 30Q on my MCAT, so I'm pretty borderline. I was considering applying DO this year, because my goal was to become a doctor, not an MD. I hear there's not a whole lot of difference, and I want to do what I can to make it happen. I'd rather not leave the US. I know there are a ton of threads about this, but will I be missing out in any way by going DO instead of MD? As far as career opportunities?
Secondly, when do applications open for DO schools? Where can I look to learn about what I need to do, and where to apply? I am being hit with so much information, trying to look around, that I'm a bit overwhelmed, and am coming here for guidance. So, should I be thinking MD and DO for this year? I believe the MD applications have just began, so I should probably get on. And from what I hear, the off-short MD schools are a big problematic for the graduates in terms of getting residencies and stuff. But, set me straight if I'm wrong about any of this. I feel like I've forgotten anything I've learned about this stuff, and there's so much information out there, I almost don't even know where to look. Thanks guys and girls.
Sorry, meant off-shore. Hate making typos in thread titles =(
Hey. I applied last year for MD. I applied to many schools, but I pretty much got rejected everywhere, got one waitlist. Still waiting to hear on that one... probably not looking good. I have a 3.4 GPA and a 30Q on my MCAT, so I'm pretty borderline. I was considering applying DO this year, because my goal was to become a doctor, not an MD. I hear there's not a whole lot of difference, and I want to do what I can to make it happen. I'd rather not leave the US. I know there are a ton of threads about this, but will I be missing out in any way by going DO instead of MD? As far as career opportunities?
Secondly, when do applications open for DO schools? Where can I look to learn about what I need to do, and where to apply? I am being hit with so much information, trying to look around, that I'm a bit overwhelmed, and am coming here for guidance. So, should I be thinking MD and DO for this year? I believe the MD applications have just began, so I should probably get on. And from what I hear, the off-short MD schools are a big problematic for the graduates in terms of getting residencies and stuff. But, set me straight if I'm wrong about any of this. I feel like I've forgotten anything I've learned about this stuff, and there's so much information out there, I almost don't even know where to look. Thanks guys and girls.
Sorry, meant off-shore. Hate making typos in thread titles =(
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AACOMAS opens May 1st AFAIK.
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You'll have good success as a DO applicant. Our stats are nearly identical, so in my opinion you shouldn't have a problem at all. Apply early! My process was over by mid October... and that's a great feeling.
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It's inappropriate to ask about shortcomings of the DO route on the pre-allo board -- you really need to ask the applicable questions in different posts on different boards or you risk creating a flame war.
I do note that someone with a 3.4/30 should not be looking at offshore options so quickly. This should be your absolute last resort to becoming a doctor because the odds of practicing in the US are always best coming from a US school. You will face high attrition and other hurdles offshore that you wouldn't have to deal with going to school in the US, and as you correctly stated, your numbers are at least borderline for US schools -- so find out where you came up short and fix it.
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Sorry about anything that would possibly start a flame-war. I meant more along the lines of "Are DOs allowed to go into any specialty?" Not as far as which one gets more respect or has more prestige or anything like that. And it's hard to fix my GPA after I've already graduated. Would really like to avoid a post-bac, so I'm not sure how easy that would be to fix. Thank you all so far for your responses.
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You won't be missing out if you go to a DO. Of course, the curriculum is different for each school, but more or less, you'll be receiving the same education. I know that you learn OMM at DO schools ONLY, so that is one consideration.
You can go to aacom.org to learn more about DO schools, and like binko said, the applications opens in the beginnning of May, but won't be able to submit it until the beginning of June (similar to AMCAS).
You apply at aacomas.aacom.org
The application is not open yet, but you'll be visiting there frequently starting next month.
AMCAS (for MD schools) have not opened up yet. They will open on May 3rd. You can visit www.aamc.org/amcas for the application service when that opens up.
As far as residencies go, as long as you take the USMLE (for MD schools only) on top of the COMLEX (for DO schools), you can apply to both DO and MD residencies. I'm not quite there yet, so someone else can give you further details about that.
I'm planning to apply to both MD and DO schools because that just means more schools for me to apply where I want to be, not because any one is easier to get into.
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There is no requirement to take USMLE (in addition to COMLEX) to apply for MD residencies.
There are "many" (no hard numbers, but in general it's getting higher each year) allo programs that are just fine with accepting a COMLEX step 1 score and just comparing that to the USMLE. There are of course DO students (I happen to be one of them) who decide to take BOTH USMLE and COMLEX for many reasons. For me it's mostly that I don't want to regret NOT taking it since I'm not settled on a specialty and would rather take it now when I'm studying for the boards then to sit for it later.
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Again this is EXACTLY the kind of question that starts a flame war if you ask it in the wrong forum. Yes, there are definitely differences in opportunities between MD and DO, but you need to ask the osteos about DO and the pre-allos about MD. Or better yet just read the old posts on the issue -- there is no shortage.
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I think this would be better suited to Pre-Osteo. Moving.
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Wow 3.4/30 and absolutely no MD love .... crazy. Did you say you at least got 2 interviews (one waitlist, one nothing heard back)??
Yeah, I agree.
OP, are you from California?
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Its really not that surprising.
I was under the impression that it's not so much the speciality that might require a particular test, but rather the location. In many "DO-friendly" states, the COMLEX is just fine for both types of residencies. Other states' programs might be more selective. Once it's time to research residencies and apply for them, it should be clear whether taking both tests is necessary.
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I totally understand your situation. You just answered you question "my goal was to become a doctor, not an MD". If you are happy with DO then go ahead and apply. DO or MD is not matter, it's matter if you could make it through and become a good doctor. I had opportunities to intern at both MD and DO schools, I did not see any discrepancy between them. Once you are physician, you are too busy to notice that you are a DO or MD.
Wish you luck!
Hey. I'm new here, but I've been reading around and it's been pretty helpful. But I do have a few questions.
First off, I haven't been doing well academically. It's not because I can't handle the work, it's because of other factors like stress from financial issues, adjusting to living in another state, etc. But the biggest thing was not having any real direction. The counselors out here didn't give me any sort of idea of what I needed to do. Up until a few months ago, I still thought pre-med was an actual major. And I was never told about dropping courses and W's and how an F is pretty much a death sentence.
I'm nearing the end of my second year and I'll be finishing with about a 2.2 GPA, an F and a D in Chemistry, a C in Biology I, a D in History I and II, a D in Calculus, and a C in Health Sciences Philosophy. Everything is either an A or B. Plus, I'll have 45 credit hours making a a sophomore in my third year.
With my grades being the way that they are, I know now that allopathic med school is probably out of the picture. Before I continue, no I don't see osteopathic medicine as secondary or a "back up plan". I had never even heard of it until last year. But based on what I know about it, I could see myself doing it. And based on what I know about allopathic school requirements, it's probably out of my grasp anyway even if I wanted to go.
With all that said, I'm hoping I could get some answers to a few questions:
1. I know that gaps are when you can in a sense erase certain grades from your transcript and that you get three of them. When can you use them? Or when do you recommend using them?
2. Does it really not matter what major you pick? I have an interest in majoring in English. Reading and writing skills seem to come more naturally to me and I've always been told that I'm a good writer. Plus it allows room in the electives and minor to do the med school pre-reqs.
3. How much does the school I go to for undergrad affect my chances of med school admission? I have to transfer from my current school (Auburn)
to a slightly smaller school back home (Kennesaw) for financial reasons.
4. I know I've struggled, but if I know there's a chance to make it, I can work hard. The question is, is it even still possible considering how bad I've done. I have the knowledge and a somewhat better sense of direction than I once did, I just worry that it may be a too little too late. If it's not then believe me, I'll use this as a fresh start.
Thanks again for your help.
First off, I haven't been doing well academically. It's not because I can't handle the work, it's because of other factors like stress from financial issues, adjusting to living in another state, etc. But the biggest thing was not having any real direction. The counselors out here didn't give me any sort of idea of what I needed to do. Up until a few months ago, I still thought pre-med was an actual major. And I was never told about dropping courses and W's and how an F is pretty much a death sentence.
I'm nearing the end of my second year and I'll be finishing with about a 2.2 GPA, an F and a D in Chemistry, a C in Biology I, a D in History I and II, a D in Calculus, and a C in Health Sciences Philosophy. Everything is either an A or B. Plus, I'll have 45 credit hours making a a sophomore in my third year.
With my grades being the way that they are, I know now that allopathic med school is probably out of the picture. Before I continue, no I don't see osteopathic medicine as secondary or a "back up plan". I had never even heard of it until last year. But based on what I know about it, I could see myself doing it. And based on what I know about allopathic school requirements, it's probably out of my grasp anyway even if I wanted to go.
With all that said, I'm hoping I could get some answers to a few questions:
1. I know that gaps are when you can in a sense erase certain grades from your transcript and that you get three of them. When can you use them? Or when do you recommend using them?
2. Does it really not matter what major you pick? I have an interest in majoring in English. Reading and writing skills seem to come more naturally to me and I've always been told that I'm a good writer. Plus it allows room in the electives and minor to do the med school pre-reqs.
3. How much does the school I go to for undergrad affect my chances of med school admission? I have to transfer from my current school (Auburn)
to a slightly smaller school back home (Kennesaw) for financial reasons.
4. I know I've struggled, but if I know there's a chance to make it, I can work hard. The question is, is it even still possible considering how bad I've done. I have the knowledge and a somewhat better sense of direction than I once did, I just worry that it may be a too little too late. If it's not then believe me, I'll use this as a fresh start.
Thanks again for your help.
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Technically, no. In the scheme of real life, where working your ass off in a science major at a big university, doing a ton of ECs, studying for months for the MCAT to obtain a respectable score etc, it is. Getting into med school is unreal. I can't even describe how 99% of conversations I have with people who don't know about the process ask 'so where are you thinking about going?' Like it's a decision that is up to me. People NEVER believe me when I tell them where I go to school, my ECs, gpa, and that I'm paniced about not getting in anywhere. It's unreal. Plus, a 3.4/30 isn't really too much off the average. Especially getting that magical 30. I'd expect something.
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Yes I am from CA. I have one wait-list, that's it.
Also, an aside, where can I look to see what I can and can't do as a DO? Like some specialties that don't have DOs? Or what? Or is it really hard to get into some specialties as a DO? Certain countries you can't do work in? Any info, or links to any info, would be greatly appreciated.
Also, an aside, where can I look to see what I can and can't do as a DO? Like some specialties that don't have DOs? Or what? Or is it really hard to get into some specialties as a DO? Certain countries you can't do work in? Any info, or links to any info, would be greatly appreciated.
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CA is tough. Was the waitlist from an interview though??? You weren't put on an alternative interview list, were you??
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of course COMPLEX also have question about cranio OMM. Personally I feel it's inappropriate for an allopathic program to judge someone's ability by a test that features unscientific approaches to medicine.
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First off, no you are not going to be limited in what specialty you can go into just because you have DO. Not sure you can find a list anywhere of numbers in different specialty but I don't know of any specialty that doesn't have any DOs.
Now this would be the only "issue" you may come across. Yea, for some competitive allo residencies it may be harder for a DO to match. In those cases it's even hard for MD students to match, it's just competitive for everyone. Keep in mind there are separate osteopathic programs.
I think wiki still has a page about international practice rights for DOs, not sure how up to date is it but google osteopathic medicine and that should get you to the wiki page and you can find it there.
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Once again, L2D chimes in to give wrong information.
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Ok, here's how it works. During residency, there are some specialties which are highly competitive for both DOs and MDs. If you want to apply to an MD residency as a DO, you should know specialties like dermatology and neurosurgery are very competitive, so competitive that even MD students fight like hell to get them and many are shut out. HOWEVER, there are also DO residencies in just about every specialty and those are only for DO students. So if you want to be a derm or a neurosurg, you can apply to DO residencies and get the same board certification/license you'd get at an MD residency.
Now, if you want to do family practice, psychiatry, internal medicine, pediatrics, PM&R, neurology, or a variety of other specialties, you can get into an MD residency as a DO without much problem, assuming you pass the boards and do well on rotations during third year of med school.
If you're shooting for a residency at Harvard, it may be a little more tricky as a DO, but by and large, you can get into a good academic MD residency as a DO as long as you do well in school and on the boards.
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I'm not surprised. The GPA is a little to low. The mcat is just average. I've known people with 3.7/30's who only got into one school. the process sucks if you're the average applicant.
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Well, their are some program directors like you, but many that aren't. I'm sorry, I'm going to go crack some skulls now.
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Average what?? Average for applicants or average for accepted applicants?? Because being the average for accepted applicants isn't a bad place to be. I'd admitted he's a little low, but it still surprised me. Just as you've known 3.7/30s with one acceptance, I've known 3.2/30s with multiple interviews and acceptances from allo. It's all conjecture. The process sucks for everyone. You can never really be satisfied. I know a 4.0/39 student who got into multiple ivy leagues, top 10 etc, but is still pissed because he got waitlisted at the one school he really wanted to attend. Does that suck for him, yup. Is he the average applicant?? Nope.
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He's not purposely spreading false information or anything. Also, from the standpoint of a DO applying to competitive ACGME residencies, it can be harder for DOs. Are there less opportunities in general. Absolutely not. However, it does depend on where you are looking. I'd say the correct statement would be that there are far less opportunities for FMGs than there are American grads. Can a US Allo match ACGME derm if they are smart, dedicated, etc. Yup. Can a US DO match AOA derm if they are smart, dedicated, etc. Yup. Can a Caribbean student match ACGME derm if they are smart, dedicated, etc. NOPE. Sorry, to say, but I don't see data to make me believe otherwise.
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COMLEX. You also shouldn't make judgments unless you have sat for both tests. Also, I believe crainial is 1-2% (could be way off) of the test.
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EDITED, don't want to start off a flame war.
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