2021-2022 Pain Fellowship Application Thread

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dlusionz said:
Anyone know much about cedars-sinai pain program?
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I interviewed there a few years ago. The main thing I took away from the program was they made you take in house anesthesiology trauma/airway call a number of times every month. This was enough for me to rank the program very low. Number one, after completing an anesthesiology residency at a level 1 trauma center, I had had enough in house trauma call for a life time. Number two, I thought that this burden would take away from actually learning pain medicine. I haven't heard if they have changed this requirement or not.
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Gnarvin said:
I interviewed there a few years ago. The main thing I took away from the program was they made you take in house anesthesiology trauma/airway call a number of times every month. This was enough for me to rank the program very low. Number one, after completing an anesthesiology residency at a level 1 trauma center, I had had enough in house trauma call for a life time. Number two, I thought that this burden would take away from actually learning pain medicine. I haven't heard if they have changed this requirement or not.
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Anesthesia call does detract from the overall educational experience, which is concerning when you only have a year to learn Pain, which is a whole new set of skills.

With that said, Cedars-Sinai has taken FMGs/IMGs before, whereas other California programs are openly hostile to such applicants. so for IMG/FMG/DO applicants it’s important to include Cedars if they are planning on applying broadly.
 
Gnarvin said:
I interviewed there a few years ago. The main thing I took away from the program was they made you take in house anesthesiology trauma/airway call a number of times every month. This was enough for me to rank the program very low. Number one, after completing an anesthesiology residency at a level 1 trauma center, I had had enough in house trauma call for a life time. Number two, I thought that this burden would take away from actually learning pain medicine. I haven't heard if they have changed this requirement or not.
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Thank you for making me aware of this, definitely not ideal. Beyond that, any idea what their reputation is for pain management? I.e. top tier, middle tier, lower tier? Coming from the east coast, I have little to no knowledge of the program.
 
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I would say it has the reputation as a middle tier program. My takeaway was that it is a solid but not extraordinary program. That being said, there are different programs out there that are better fits for different applicants, so I don't totally buy into this whole reputation aspect. I know there are a number of "top tier" programs where the fellows don't get much advanced or even basic interventional experience but the program has a big name. Of course name recognition may play some part into getting a job, but probably mostly for academic positions. I would go to the program that you think is the best fit for you.
 
dlusionz said:
Thank you for making me aware of this, definitely not ideal. Beyond that, any idea what their reputation is for pain management? I.e. top tier, middle tier, lower tier? Coming from the east coast, I have little to no knowledge of the program.
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That’s another factor to consider...coming from the East Coast, many have no idea who or what a “cedars” sinai is. So consider this if you want to go back to the east coast. The reverse is true as well, people on the west coast think Mount Sinai is the name of a cemetery.
 
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What is the call like at Cedar's Sinai? Is it a week night call and post call day off or do you go in the next day to clinic?

Are you working as an attending and supervising residents and crnas?

How much does it pay?
 
gaspasser786 said:
It’s unfortunate but I don’t think any of the California programs are of particularly high caliber. Maybe UCSD is the best one.
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Isn’t UC irvine supposed to be good because they are one of the few programs with a strong Peds component?
 
I agree with Gnarvin from above. "Top tier" programs are variable to an individual depending on how they envision their career in pain medicine. (e.g. not everyone is looking to do SCS/pumps or be anywhere near peds pain)
 
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Slowpoke said:
I agree with Gnarvin from above. "Top tier" programs are variable to an individual depending on how they envision their career in pain medicine. (e.g. not everyone is looking to do SCS/pumps or be anywhere near peds pain)
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I warn people against going somewhere that is "top tier" as a lot of those rankings are not contingent on the pain program specifically.

Figure out where you want to work and what type of work you want to do. Look at the pain docs in that area and see where they trained. That'll give you an idea of where you should do residency.

A lot of academic programs push things that you won't do in real life or don't want to do. That's okay, but if inpatient pain is a quarter of your fellowship, then maybe it's not the best place for an aspiring private practice pain doc. If the fellowship only works in trainwreck cases with attendings that focus on risk mitigation, opioid de-prescribing, etc, then perhaps not the best place to learn about patient selection for SCS.

With that said, you'll come out as a pain physician regardless, and you will learn more in that first month or two of being solo than the year of fellowship. If you can't stomach the idea of learning on your own, then go to a place that'll drown you in volume. If you're happy figuring it out as you go, then perhaps you don't need that level of abuse.
 
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Anyone else getting nervous with the process? Based on the sheet there has apparently been 10 programs that have sent out invites. Some of these programs I'm very interested in :(. I just hope they come back to look at my application again.
 
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gaspasser786 said:
It’s unfortunate but I don’t think any of the California programs are of particularly high caliber. Maybe UCSD is the best one.
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:rofl: Maybe UCSD? UCSD is a very highly regarded program, nationally.
 
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cluelessmedstudent411 said:
Anyone else getting nervous with the process? Based on the sheet there has apparently been 10 programs that have sent out invites. Some of these programs I'm very interested in :(. I just hope they come back to look at my application again.
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I check these forums more often than I check the sheet. It'd be nice if people would post on here with any interview info, too.
 
Pittsburgh and OHSU sent out interviews today. Not sure if more places have (spreadsheet is probs filled in, just didn’t look)
 
dlusionz said:
Pittsburgh and OHSU sent out interviews today. Not sure if more places have (spreadsheet is probs filled in, just didn’t look)
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out of curiosity, when did you submit your app for OHSU?
 
For the people that have been offered interviews, are they on zoom? Wasn’t sure if interviews for this cycle will be online or in person considering most of us have been vaccinated. Sure would be convenient and save a lot of money if they were online.
 
dlusionz said:
All of mine have been zoom or Microsoft teams thus far.
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That’s great news. I’ve applied to some non accredited programs and one interview is in person. Not a huge deal but it could get really expensive paying for flights/hotels. Hoping the majority are on zoom. One benefit of the pandemic, cheaper app cycle!
 
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Does anyone know which programs might screen out by step 1?
 
Scottie Dog said:
That’s great news. I’ve applied to some non accredited programs and one interview is in person. Not a huge deal but it could get really expensive paying for flights/hotels. Hoping the majority are on zoom. One benefit of the pandemic, cheaper app cycle!
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Which non-accredited programs did you apply to (or know of) if you don't mind sharing?
 
brain_pain said:
Which non-accredited programs did you apply to (or know of) if you don't mind sharing?
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I applied ACGME pain as well as to NASS interventional spine programs. Spine.org has a list of them, they are through PM&R. Doesn't matter much to me if its a Nass program or ACGME, just want to match
 
cluelessmedstudent411 said:
No idea about specific programs but I have a feeling I'm getting screened out. Didn't do so hot on step 1.
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Step 1 is a factor, but in this application cycle, not the factor. A friend applied with all steps < 50th percentile, step 1 around 22nd percentile from a low tier anesthesia program. ITEs at 50th and 75th. Not much crazy as far as connections or research. Applied broadly coast to coast with the exception of a few places they absolutely couldn’t fathom living.

12 interviews, matched number two.

They didn’t get any huge name places, or the crazy interventional shops, but landed at a place with medium training that will get them ready for a career in the field.
 
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agolden1 said:
Step 1 is a factor, but in this application cycle, not the factor. A friend applied with all steps < 50th percentile, step 1 around 22nd percentile from a low tier anesthesia program. ITEs at 50th and 75th. Not much crazy as far as connections or research. Applied broadly coast to coast with the exception of a few places they absolutely couldn’t fathom living.

12 interviews, matched number two.

They didn’t get any huge name places, or the crazy interventional shops, but landed at a place with medium training that will get them ready for a career in the field.
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Was this last year?
 
U of Iowa with interview invites and rejections on the same day. I was part of the latter group :(
 
Wonder if this year will be more or less competitive with COVID
 
TheJuice said:
Yes I received it going to do it this weekend. Wonder if they just sent it to everyone?
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I’d find it hard to believe everyone got one. Imagine having to also watch a short video for every applicant.
 
I doubt its everyone but still sounds like a lot of people got it. I hope this doesn't become a common thing at programs.
 
cluelessmedstudent411 said:
I doubt its everyone but still sounds like a lot of people got it. I hope this doesn't become a common thing at programs.
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With everything virtual, it seems to be a way to interview the people most interested in the program.

After the Match last week, I talked to a residency PD and she said that with Zoom interviews (i.e. no flight / hotel / time off, just log on), that it was hard to know which applicants wanted to come there most.
 
For everyone freaking out: the majority of programs are just now starting to actually look at applications in earnest. And there are a TON of applicants this year because people feel less constrained by not having to travel. Put on a bathrobe and mellow down easy, you're still early in the actual season.
 
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Yeah, it's still relatively early. A majority of the 104 programs have not yet sent out interview invites (40% have sent out per the interview sheet).
I'm also under the belief that more interview invites will be extended this year to obtain an overall higher applicant:seat ratio given the accessibility of zoom. Some big name programs went unmatched last year and I suspect they're going to want to mitigate that risk by interviewing more people or atleast change how they approach selection for interview (eg UCD with video prompt)
 
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