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Congrats on the happy news! There have been people in your position on this forum, I would use the search function and see what they say, because
2023-2024 APPIC Internship Interview Invitation Thread
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I'm a little confused.
How are you going to be able to keep your job during internship or are you planning to get a new full-time job in your field during internship year? What if you have to go out of state for internship, wouldn't you have to go through all the work to get licensed in a new state before you could work there?
Are you going to geographically restrict your internship apps to your state to avoid having to get licensed again? Needing a two-year part-time internship and geographically restricting yourself seems like the perfect recipe to not match anywhere.
I don't have any insider scoop, but I am wishing you the best. <3 This is such an emotional and tough process. Figuring out financial obstacles and child care on top of it is a lot, even when others are in the same position it doesn't always make it feel less daunting/overwhelming. You making it this far in your program juggling all you have shows such strength/resilience. Congrats on your pregnancy 🙂 And I am wishing you the best of luck!
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My 2 cents so YMMV.
If your training is congruent to what you’d like to do in the future, that helps even if the setting is different. CBT is the same everywhere.
You’ll likely compete against people who could be considered better fits but getting and finishing an internship should be the first priority as career paths afterwards can vary widely afterwards and your early career experiences will become more and more relevant.
Things that are more specialized to hospital care (acute inpatient, rehab, certain health specialties) could be more challenging if these are high demand positions in that specific job market and you are also competing against people who already have that experience. But there are places around the country experiencing staff shortages and are happy to hire any competent and licensed individuals, even if they don’t have the most relevant background.
If you’d like your future career to include research, I can potentially see some postdocs questioning whether a community based internship is the best fit for their position. Good luck!
Thanks!
mindseye1210
New Member
Thank you so much for the congrats and encouraging words. Little things, such as kind words, go a very long way right now 🙂 I keep telling myself that others have done it and so can I. Everything always works out in the end, even if it doesn't go how I pictured it in my head. Just trusting the process and hoping for the best-- we can stick out anything for a year after we've made it this far, right? Good luck to everyone going through this wild process!!
psychoticpsyduck
Full Member
Hi all! I am curious to know if anyone has received any explicit feedback during their interview as to whether they are a good match/fit for the site. I was fortunate to get several interviews; however, I recall one site where right at the end of my interview, as we're wrapping up and exchanging pleasantries (i.e., thank you for your time and opportunity), one of the internship committee members said "I think you would be a great fit here". Has anyone had a similar experience?
I wouldn't read into it. Generally speaking, everyone incited to interview is thought to be a fit, or they would not have been interviewed, for the most part.
I decided I am not going to rank 3 out of 13 programs. I know I statistically still have a good shot ranking 10 programs, but at the same time, most only offer 1-2 slots per position. I am not sure if I am making the right choice. Peers are encouraging me to rank all sites "just to be safe" because phase 2 site availability is unpredictable. I get where they're coming from, but I honestly feel I would be miserable at the 3 sites I am not ranking. At one of the internship Q and A's, an intern was on the verge of tears telling us about the ways they are overworked/treated... What do people generally think of this? Do you believe is is better to risk unhappiness for a year but get a match? Or do you believe it is better to gamble a little with the possibility of going into phase 2 and prioritize mental health?
I would be fine at any of the 10 sites I am ranking. But my anxiety is telling me, "What if you don't get any of those 10 and regret ditching the 3?"
I am torn and have ranked and re-ranked my sites dozens of times lol.
I would be fine at any of the 10 sites I am ranking. But my anxiety is telling me, "What if you don't get any of those 10 and regret ditching the 3?"
I am torn and have ranked and re-ranked my sites dozens of times lol.
Still wouldn't read into it. Either way, it should not affect how you rank sites.
I think it depends on whether you can take the risk of applying again next year... But to be honest I think with ranking 10 sites you should not worry too much about it. If you did not get matched to any of those 10 sites, it might indicate that you were not ready yet and taking one extra year would be super helpful... This is just my personal perspective of it...
If an intern is nearly in tears during a formal Q&A style panel, that would be a major red flag for me (think what they might say over casual drinks/coffee).
If you are competitive enough to get 13 interviews (which is a pretty great hit rate), you should also be super competitive in Phase 2, if it came to that. Statistically, it would be super rare for somebody who will likely be ranked by 10 sites to not match in Phase 1. It would also be statistically rare to match with your #11-13 ranks but that probability is likely still higher than not matching at all despite ranking 10 sites so ranking a place is a risk.
It's hard to draw conclusions year by year but there were a lot of great sites in Phase 2 last year. A caveat is that we don't know how many interns will ultimately submit ranks this year and whether spots increased or decreased compared to last year. Plus people looking for more specialized training or have geographic needs may feel more of a squeeze in Phase 2.
Ultimately, I would consider in advance how you might feel going into Phase 2 versus matching to one of these 3 sites you are considering not ranking at all.
For example, if you were to not match in Phase 1 and one of those 3 sites had a spot in Phase 2, would you apply again? If the answer if no, it might be good to make peace with crossing them off now. Good luck!
I received similar, and much more explicit feedback. Do. Not. Let. It. Affect. Your. Ranking.
TrackCPD
Full Member
I helped give a virtual tour today via WebEx to some intern prospects as part of the interview process and I have some advice.
Even if you’re not interviewing in person, show interest. A couple of the prospects were clearly doing other things on their computers, not paying full attention, and seemed like they couldn’t care less about being there. That’s not a good approach and not a good way to get matched.
Even if you’re not interviewing in person, show interest. A couple of the prospects were clearly doing other things on their computers, not paying full attention, and seemed like they couldn’t care less about being there. That’s not a good approach and not a good way to get matched.
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Thank you so much! It is a good reminder that even if I did rank those 3, it’s unlikely I would match at those sites. I’m thinking about your question, and I don’t believe I would reapply to them if they are available in phase 2. I have a feeling that the site with the emotional interns who spent the Q and A venting about the site/warning us about ranking will go to phase 2. It really did sound terrible from what they told us. I also appreciate the encouragement that if I got many interviews in phase 1, I’d likely get something phase 2! I think despite the statistics, I’ve been getting caught up in the individual stories I've heard from people who matched to a #11 or didn’t match with 7+ interviews. At the end of the day, I know those stories are statistically rare. Going to trust my judgment and hope for the best!
yes! the training director of a site said "I look forward to ranking you highly" accidentally (and swiftly acknowledged and apologized) but that was good to hear. I know you're not supposed to say it but some positive feedback (that was not my supervisor) was appreciated for me during this process.
Those are two very different things. Applicants who get interviews are all generally good-to-great fits for the site, that's why they were invited to interview. They could be a great fit and still be ranked 10th because there are nine other applicants who all better fits. They are overinterpreting what is just a pleasantry.
What you're talking about is the training director breaking the rules and revealing information about their rankings.
Only 1 TD told me he felt we would be a great fit for each other. Another TD told me he was ranking me but didn’t give specifics. A few sites gave general praise. Like telling me they were “impressed with x and y” about my app or validated/complimented my vignette responses. The only other explicit feedback was when an interviewer quoted my LOR and said that’s exactly what he’s looking for. He was not the TD, though so who knows! Some interviewers hyped me up while others attempted to keep a poker face. Hopefully we both get answers soon. 🙂 not overthinking it is tough while we wait!
psychoticpsyduck
Full Member
Yes, I appreciate the reminder! I will not be letting it impact my rankings as I know that would do me more harm than good. I was more so asking the thread to see how frequent of an occurrence hearing such things are. I only experienced this from one of 10 interviews, so I had a moment of curiosity.
Psychdoccandidate
Full Member
I was waitlisted at a site that said “we still match with a substantial number of applicants that don’t interview.”
What does this mean, am I reading into “substantial”?
Why would they not match as a amc?
Would placing them at the top of my list (because they really are my first choice) hurt me somehow?
What does this mean, am I reading into “substantial”?
Why would they not match as a amc?
Would placing them at the top of my list (because they really are my first choice) hurt me somehow?
Psychdoccandidate
Full Member
Does anyone have knowledge of inter mountain seiver valley clinic?
Seems like a pretty big red flag if they routinely match with multiple applicants whom they don't interview. Makes it seem like red flags come up during interviews that scare off interviewees but applicants on the waitlist don't get the benefit of that experience in making their rankings. There were a couple of sites where I interviewed that seemed very impressive on paper, but getting to speak with the current interns was very revealing. There could be other explanations for this, but personally I wouldn't rank a site at or near the top if I didn't get to interview there.
I would also interpret this as the site wanting waitlisted candidates to rank the site as they will be including waitlisted folks in their ranked list.
At my VA, we extend offers to approximately 10 applicants per intern slot but do not keep a waitlist, even though a few will ultimately decline.
Interviewing that many candidates takes a lot of time for clinical staff so one possibility is this site is not able to allot time to interview everybody they would like (which could potentially be a red flag in itself).
Ranking this site first will not hurt you because if that site matches all of their spots with candidates they interviewed, you will not be penalized per the match algorithm, which will 'remove' this as your #1, bump everything up a spot and then work accordingly.
However, the interview day should be skewed towards candidates interviewing the site to determine their preferences prior to rank and not the other way (on paper vs in reality) so IMO you're missing a lot by being waitlisted.
Unless you have some inside details to feel very confident this is a good site (like somebody you trust who did internship there within the last 1-4 years), perhaps you can ask to be put in touch with a current intern and get some questions asked. I would also consider it a likely red flag if the TD declines this reasonable request. Good luck!
So I'm pretty torn in terms of ranking. Ultimately I want a more balanced career doing both clinical work and community research/interventions at an AMC/AHC. My top three include two sites that require a research component (but would require relocation) and 1 site which is only clinical (but is close). My top choice is mostly clear (a combined clinical research site with good pay and name recognition) but my issue is which to rank as my 2nd and 3rd choices. One site has name recognition, higher pay, the rotations offered are interesting and its in my current city but is solely clinical work and 45 hrs/week of clinical work sounds rough though the interns say that its on par with other competitive sites. The other has not much name recognition and would require much farther relocation (same state though) but I got a much warmer vibe/investment in supervision, you can choose a research elective (some PI's have pretty good grants), interns and postdocs have done well obtaining positions they wanted after training, and site offers ADOS/autism assessment training (which I don't plan to specialize in but my focus in kids and adolescents and I have no training in this area). Any feedback would be appreciated!
How much time do these sites with research components set aside for research and what are interns' typical output for the year? How much face to face clinical time for the clinical only site? Where do you want to be for postdoc?
Thanks for responding! My number 1 site is about 50% intervention/research work and 50% clinical with potential for policy briefs. manuals, working on posters/publications (previous interns have stated that this had not impacted their ability to be licensed). The other site with the research option is 80% clinical/up to 20% research with potential for posters/publications. For the clinical only site, it seems like 20-25 hours of direct clinical services.
For postdoc I would like a combined clinical research postdoc medical center (preferable) doing community based research while getting any remaining hours needed for licensure Would prefer to do this in a big diverse city/my home city but have to compromise with the partner on location.
As best as you can tell, would both sites set you up equally well for postdocs that you’ll be interested in or do you think there will be a significant difference?
If you have a lot of relevant research experience already or have collaborations that you can keep actively working on and don’t need to rely on your internship site to get attached to new projects, whether your intern year has more or less clinical work may not matter as much.
One other thought: of these 2 sites, which one do you think could help you grow the most or provide the most unique career exposure?
You sound like you have some defined career plans which is great but I know many people who, based on exposure during internship or postdoc, made significant career changes that turned out positive, myself included. What you want now could very well shift as you move from grad school to your early career. Good luck!
A friend of mine interviewed at an AMC that seemed great on paper and is affiliated with a prestigious university, but the interview gave an entirely different impression than the brochure. In particular, the interns are routinely working 60-hour weeks and are completely burnt out after just 6 months.
Yes, and as you're intimating, there are other ways to grow towards the same goal(s) on internship besides protected research time. For example, if the clinical rotations at one site include the research population, presenting problem, treatment context, etc. in which you have done and would like to continue doing research, that would be a plus in the column of that site compared to the others that might not have the rotation. That might set you up for a post doc better than the protected research time, especially if you still have research collaborations from grad school that you can work on in your own time outside of internship hours.
Psychdoccandidate
Full Member
Hey yall, I saw someone post in the site tea about major concerns with Centerstone Consortium. I'm specifically wondering if this was Winter haven Hospital? If you could message me or we can start a thread here.
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BippityBoppityBoo
Full Member
Anyone curious about how the ranking meetings go? Do you think there are discussions or is it purely down to numbers based on application materials and interviews? Also understand that internships can only take two candidates from each doctoral program so that may play a role too. Haha oh to be a fly on some random wall…
My VA uses rubrics to rate paper applications and interviews that are averaged to try to account for inter-rater reliability. From the application rubric scores, we generated a list to invite for interviews (about 10 applicants per spot, no waitlist).
After interviews, we submit scores and then discuss specific people in a meeting where we discuss roughly via tiers (top tier = # of spots we have, upper tier, middle tier, lower tier, and do not rank tier). People can advocate for candidates if they feel especially compelled but otherwise, people share impressions and discuss in context of other applicants.
If somebody's application is a bit weaker but they had great interviews, they will bump up, maybe towards the top of their tier or possibly jump into the bottom part of the next tier but we are mindful of not making major leaps in either direction (e.g., great app, mediocre interview short of red flags).
We don't differentiate based on program alone since you can't predict match and a training program would IMO be shooting themselves in the foot to rank somebody lower just because they are from the same program as somebody they ranked higher, since there's no guarantee you'll get any of your higher ranks.
I'm sure there is a lot of variability to this process.
In my experience, you'd be a very bored fly on that wall. Our rankings were essentially the same as before interviews. If anything, some people got moved down because they couldn't conceptualize a simple case to save their lives. Rare for someone to move up in a significant manner. Some sites and specialties may favor interviews more, my sites never did for neuropsych applicants.
My supervisor who was a part of ranking meetings at a college counseling center said that they only ranked after interviews, so a little different! He said they do a rating of all application materials and then they rate you on maturity/having a good head on your shoulders/interpersonal skills and look if you’ve had past college counseling center experience. He said they all then discuss whether applicants should be placed in “must rank” “maybe rank” or “won’t rank” categories. Interviewers can then advocate for who they did or did not want. He said they rank 10 people ( which seemed low to me since this site has 4 slots).
Well, they had to do some ranking, at least in broad groups, to decide who to invite. Also, ranking 10 people for 4 slots sounds extremely odd. At many places, that would essentially assure that you would be going to Phase II most years, especially recently.
It seems like the ranking meeting is pretty similar for most sites I’ve heard about! Just whether or not it comes before and/or after interviews has been different. I heard VA’s tend to have similar protocols, though and do what was described by some people above. I don’t know which system I prefer haha. I feel I interviewed well, but I also feel that interpersonal skill ratings could be pretty subjective. I thought that was odd too that they’d rank so few people, especially since they interview 40
medititite_01
New Member
I know this has been asked before in prior years, but at the time it was a relatively new thing so I'm hoping there might be more information now.
A site that I am pretty interested in is accredited on contingency as of 2022. I applied because it seemed pretty simple to get full accreditation by just reporting intern outcome data, and at the time I wasn't super interested in them. Now that I'm considering ranking them higher (for a few major reasons), how much should I be concerned about them losing their accredited status during the time that I would be there? Is this common?
My understanding is that if they at least maintain the contingency status, then they are still considered accredited but I'm not sure how long this applies for. Additionally, would I be able to say that I attended an accredited internship if they lose the status prior to my * graduation * (in case I need to complete my dissertation post-internship), even if they still had this status when I attended? My grad program requires an accredited internship, so I'm trying to figure out how big of a risk this for my degree.
A site that I am pretty interested in is accredited on contingency as of 2022. I applied because it seemed pretty simple to get full accreditation by just reporting intern outcome data, and at the time I wasn't super interested in them. Now that I'm considering ranking them higher (for a few major reasons), how much should I be concerned about them losing their accredited status during the time that I would be there? Is this common?
My understanding is that if they at least maintain the contingency status, then they are still considered accredited but I'm not sure how long this applies for. Additionally, would I be able to say that I attended an accredited internship if they lose the status prior to my * graduation * (in case I need to complete my dissertation post-internship), even if they still had this status when I attended? My grad program requires an accredited internship, so I'm trying to figure out how big of a risk this for my degree.
Your logic seems to make sense. Hopefully somebody else with experience of accreditation and programs on contingency can chime in.
My bigger question is whether you’ve talked to your training director about this?
First, they should be able to accurately confirm outcomes for the various scenarios that you listed above.
More importantly, their advice might be quite relevant so you don’t find yourself in a position where your program cannot confer you a PhD that you’ve worked a really long time ago.
My gut instinct says that if there’s any degree of risk, I would advise against ranking this program.
If I had a dollar for every time a ‘pretty simple’ task didn’t get completed and a negative outcome occurred, I’d be super rich so never underestimate human error. Your training director might also have some info on how simple or complex this final step might be.
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Essentially, if they are accredited on contingency, they have met the initial requirements and have a structure in place to meet the rest given time. I am not sure about the number of programs accredited on contingency who then lose that status and are not accredited, nut I believe it's low. If this is a newer site, especially if connected to an institution (VA, AMC, university), it's probably fairly safe. If it's a private practice/consortium or a site that used to be on probation or something, I'd be much more wary.
medititite_01
New Member
Thanks! I've reached out my DCT to see if they have any thoughts/recommendations about it. Waiting to hear back at this point and trying to gather as much info as possible to help me think it through.
Please don't spam/crosspost in multiple threads with the exact same thing.
GetPsyched!
New Member
I didn't see that post, but I did rank them.. I'm curious what was the tea?
Match Day!
Hope everyone was able to match!
Hope everyone was able to match!
Hey everyone! Is there a Phase II thread for those who did not match? Post here 🙂
For anyone moving through Phase II
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Congratulations to everyone who matched!
Hoping that lots of good news was received this morning.
I was really impressed by all of the candidates that I had the pleasure to interview for my site.
For those who received disappointing news, take some time for yourself and then hold your head up high.
There were some awesome sites in Phase 2 last year and I think that trend will continue based on some preliminary info that has been passed along by my program's TD from listservs/calls they have participated in.
And the key is to secure and complete an internship with no difference paid to whether you match in Phase 1, 2, or the post-match process.
I was really impressed by all of the candidates that I had the pleasure to interview for my site.
For those who received disappointing news, take some time for yourself and then hold your head up high.
There were some awesome sites in Phase 2 last year and I think that trend will continue based on some preliminary info that has been passed along by my program's TD from listservs/calls they have participated in.
And the key is to secure and complete an internship with no difference paid to whether you match in Phase 1, 2, or the post-match process.
Congrats to everyone who matched!
Lots of really excellent sites available in Phase 2: APPIC Match | Participating Internships
Lots of really excellent sites available in Phase 2: APPIC Match | Participating Internships
Thank you everyone on this thread who answered our questions. 💕 I appreciate this network, the doc, and discord for having others who understood what the process is like.
I matched to my 6th choice, and while I am happy with the site, it is tough to not personalize potential reasons my top 5 didn’t rank me higher. Would it be appropriate to eventually ask my #1 for feedback? I was explicitly told I would be a great fit, would be ranked, etc, so it just sucks feeling blindsided! I mentally planned the next year moving there. I’m grateful and excited to have gotten the site I did but a little sad to not have gotten my top choice at the same time.
I matched to my 6th choice, and while I am happy with the site, it is tough to not personalize potential reasons my top 5 didn’t rank me higher. Would it be appropriate to eventually ask my #1 for feedback? I was explicitly told I would be a great fit, would be ranked, etc, so it just sucks feeling blindsided! I mentally planned the next year moving there. I’m grateful and excited to have gotten the site I did but a little sad to not have gotten my top choice at the same time.
You can always ask, I wouldn't, personally. If you do just get ready for a fairly vague response. There are always the people who are a good fit and ranked highly, but just outside of that very top group.
